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[ReiSilver]

FieryDove wrote...

Heidenreich wrote...

Eh, there are waves of skellies, and guards, and demons.. and then there's no one left but Denarius, and a mage isn't very tough against a warrior that can PHAZE THROUGH YOUR ****ING CHEST and tear out your insides ;p


Damn you people for making me replay DA2..!

haha go play it moar.

Really tho, he is a lousy mage relying on his weaksauce minions to do us in. I horror him/petrify/CP him and he's dead usually before he can do his glowing ball trick.

I was really let down by how easy the Denarius fight was 'what that's it?' came to mind. Even compared to fights with mages in DAO, I remember the under ground base one was brutal, Denarius was a kitty cat


edit for top of page:



and this one because I caught Fenris looking at Hawke while the others are looking elsewhere >:3

Modifié par ReiSilver, 08 juin 2011 - 02:42 .

[UrsulaCousland]

Ser Bard wrote...

I'm considering my next playthrough. How is the Sebastian rivalmance?

We had better be able to romance that kid in ME3. http://social.biowar...icons/heart.png

I'm torn between Garrus and Kaidan but I'd throw them both over for Joker.

Hmm...I see a LOT of Fen fans seem to like Garrus too - so I'm torn, but from what I've seen, I'd romance Joker in a heartbeat.

Since ME and ME2 are my treat to myself for surviving the semester, I'll have to wait till August to find out. (And here's hoping some DA DLC progress has been announced b y then - I don't want them to rush it, but I hope we hear *something* by then. :innocent: )

Modifié par UrsulaCousland, 08 juin 2011 - 01:29 .

[tankgirly]

[offtopic]

From what I've heard so far there won't be any new LI in ME3 .

[/offtopic]

[Ryzaki]

tankgirly wrote...

[offtopic]

From what I've heard so far there won't be any new LI in ME3 .

[/offtopic]

That was debunked by Chud himself. 

[steph01423]

^I'm one of those Fenris fans that also loves Garrus. I wonder if there's some kind of correlation there? Hmm...

I do have to admit that I'm torn between Garrus and Kaidan for ME3 too, though. Never thought about romancing Joker, but I can definitely see why a lot of people want that. Joker is awesome. I'm actually sort of surprised that the option was never there.

[tankgirly]

Ryzaki wrote...

tankgirly wrote...

[offtopic]

From what I've heard so far there won't be any new LI in ME3 .

[/offtopic]

That was debunked by Chud himself. 

[offtopic]

Is that mean I can keep my hope high on Joker, then?

[/offtopic]

[Arquen]

About Danarius' fight: None of the personal quest villains are particularly "epic." Honestly the hardest one was probably Merrill's "keeper" fight.

I found the actual battle with Danarius underwhelming, but the cutscene of Fenris ripping through his body just *makes* it epic, lol. Fenris knew it was a trap from the beginning. Hence he asked Hawke to join him at the Hanged Man. If he had gone alone it might have been a different story. Danarius and his minions could possibly even over-power Fenris. He did bring an entourage of people. As for Varania not fighting, I wonder if she was perhaps having second thoughts about .. you know.. attempting to kill her own brother for profit. I think she just didn't want to get involved in the fight honestly. Fenris would probably have died fighting before going back into slavery though. He says as much beforehand. Yet by taking Hawke the "trap" becomes Fenris' trap for Danarius. I think that is why Danarius tries to deal with Hawke as if Hawke owned Fenris. Like if he could make some kind of business deal it wouldn't go down so bad.

To bad for him he's a scum-bag slaver and no good magister, and Hawke is usually most inclined to kill him unless you take the "option we do not speak of." So, I think the fight is less epic because Danarius, despite all his plotting, planning, and chasing didn't expect Fenris to show up with a posse of powerful friends.

Edit: back on topic everyone . hee, I kid I kid.. I'm looking forward to ME3 too actually. 

Modifié par Arquen, 08 juin 2011 - 02:24 .

[ReiSilver]

steph01423 wrote...

^I'm one of those Fenris fans that also loves Garrus. I wonder if there's some kind of correlation there? Hmm...

I do have to admit that I'm torn between Garrus and Kaidan for ME3 too, though. Never thought about romancing Joker, but I can definitely see why a lot of people want that. Joker is awesome. I'm actually sort of surprised that the option was never there.

hmm well add me to the tally of fans of both Garrus and Fenris. Kaidan's kind of in the meh category but if Joker is the much fabled bisexual LI I may just have to role up a new male shepard for him~

I wonder what it is that Garrus and Fenris have in common? ... both are bad-ass and have voices that will make you melt, that's for sure. It's weird for me because Fenris is aesthetically what I normally go for when I fan over a character; lanky/pretty/elf and DEM LEGS, while Garrus is... a dinosaur/bird alien... he was pretty lanky, especially in his ME1 armor, though....

[Ryzaki]

tankgirly wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

tankgirly wrote...

[offtopic]

From what I've heard so far there won't be any new LI in ME3 .

[/offtopic]

That was debunked by Chud himself. 

[offtopic]

Is that mean I can keep my hope high on Joker, then?

[/offtopic]

 

Yup. My fingers are crossed as well.  

[ReiSilver]

Arquen wrote...
 As for Varania not fighting, I wonder if she was perhaps having second thoughts about .. you know.. attempting to kill her own brother for profit. I think she just didn't want to get involved in the fight honestly. Fenris would probably have died fighting before going back into slavery though. He says as much beforehand.

I actually think Varania knew Denarius didn't want to kill Fenris, just recapture him. She doesn't seem proud of what she's doing, she never looks at Fenris until Denarius shows up. I don't know what she expected to happen though, there's so little we know about her it makes guessing her motivations hard.

[Arquen]

ReiSilver wrote...

hmm well add me to the tally of fans of both Garrus and Fenris. Kaidan's kind of in the meh category but if Joker is the much fabled bisexual LI I may just have to role up a new male shepard for him~

I wonder what it is that Garrus and Fenris have in common? ... both are bad-ass and have voices that will make you melt, that's for sure. It's weird for me because Fenris is aesthetically what I normally go for when I fan over a character; lanky/pretty/elf and DEM LEGS, while Garrus is... a dinosaur/bird alien... he was pretty lanky, especially in his ME1 armor, though....

Say no more!... See.... one of my fav sites, muahahaha.... 

Garrus

Fenris

They are very much alike in many ways it seems! Also, the Anti-Hero thing. If you like Anti-Heroes then you would be drawn to these types of characters.

Plus, tvtropes.. I spend WaaaaAAAyy to much time there <_<

I actually think Varania knew Denarius didn't want to kill Fenris, just recapture him. She doesn't seem proud of what she's doing, she never looks at Fenris until Denarius shows up. I don't know what she expected to happen though, there's so little we know about her it makes guessing her motivations hard

I agree, I think whatever Varania's motives she just didn't want to get involved in the fight. It is hard to tell what her motives are, but I don't believe she was forced into the decision she made. Fenris spent time, coin and effort for a long time after Hadrianna trying to find her and bring her to Kirkwall. She did not have to betray him, but she chose to for power. That says a lot about her, and her cowardice in the face of what she has done just makes her more unlikable and non-redeemable to me. I usually let Fenris killl her. What a horrible betrayal. Fenris risked so much in just getting a letter to her, and yet she just guts him like that. Whether she knew Danarius was going to kill him or not, it's still sickening to me to betray someone like that.

Modifié par Arquen, 08 juin 2011 - 02:54 .

[ReiSilver]

Arquen wrote...
Plus, tvtropes.. I spend WaaaaAAAyy to much time there <_<

 you and me both XD

Arquen wrote...

I actually think Varania knew Denarius didn't want to kill Fenris, just recapture him. She doesn't seem proud of what she's doing, she never looks at Fenris until Denarius shows up. I don't know what she expected to happen though, there's so little we know about her it makes guessing her motivations hard

I agree, I think whatever Varania's motives she just didn't want to get involved in the fight. It is hard to tell what her motives are, but I don't believe she was forced into the decision she made. Fenris spent time, coin and effort for a long time after Hadrianna trying to find her and bring her to Kirkwall. She did not have to betray him, but she chose to for power. That says a lot about her, and her cowardice in the face of what she has done just makes her more unlikable and non-redeemable to me. I usually let Fenris killl her. What a horrible betrayal. Fenris risked so much in just getting a letter to her, and yet she just guts him like that. Whether she knew Danarius was going to kill him or not, it's still sickening to me to betray someone like that.

I've only played through once, Marric let her live because he didn't want Fenris to have to live with having killed his own sister, even if she was a terrible person who betrayed her brother for power/better life for herself, whatever her motivation was, as Marric was very family oriented himself (and a hopeless idealist *sigh*) and had Varric back him up who had killed his brother.
Varania's last statement always gets to me "I look on you now and think you got the better end of the bargin." WTF does that mean Varania??? Just what happened to you to make you think that??? So many ways that could be read into gah!

[Dr. Doctor]

ReiSilver wrote...
Varania's last statement always gets to me "I look on you now and think you got the better end of the bargin." WTF does that mean Varania??? Just what happened to you to make you think that??? So many ways that could be read into gah!

To be an elf living in a city is hard enough as-is. Imagine being thrust from a life where you have known the stable, predictable life of a slave. (You have been, are now, and always will be doing your duties as a slave until the day you die) Imagine now being thrown out into the chaos of life as a free elf. Thanks to a lifetime of servitude you don't really have much of a grasp for how to get by in society.

Add in the fact that Tevinter is a crapsack world Fenris did sort of get the better end of the bargain.

[FieryDove]

Dr. Doctor wrote...

To be an elf living in a city is hard enough as-is. Imagine being thrust from a life where you have known the stable, predictable life of a slave. (You have been, are now, and always will be doing your duties as a slave until the day you die) Imagine now being thrown out into the chaos of life as a free elf. Thanks to a lifetime of servitude you don't really have much of a grasp for how to get by in society.

Add in the fact that Tevinter is a crapsack world Fenris did sort of get the better end of the bargain.

The problem is Varania does not have a brain.

If she stopped at "I had no choice Leto" Fen might not have hated her as badly or maybe let her go without coaxing from Hawke and co. . As it was she had to go on about becoming Danarius's apprentice at the cost of Fenris.

As to Tevinter, if it truly is that bad she could stay in the free marches, she was already there. But again she probably won't *think* of that.

As to Kaidan vs Garrus, after K's rant/letter , no....Garrus, Thane or Jacob.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

ReiSilver wrote...

Varania's last statement always gets to me "I look on you now and think you got the better end of the bargin." WTF does that mean Varania??? Just what happened to you to make you think that??? So many ways that could be read into gah!

To add to what others have said here... in a society where slavery exists (or has existed until recently) often a freed slave's life will suck significantly more than a slave's life.

If you're a slave, your master has motivation to keep you decently fed, functional, and healthy, because you're an investment. If you die or become unable to function, your master loses his investment. If you're a free man in a world like that, there's no reason for anyone to pay you a living wage, or care about your health and welfare. They can work you to death or let you starve and it's no skin off their nose, no money out of their pocket. It's like the difference between how people treat a car they own versus a car they're just renting, only even worse, because nobody in Tevinter cares if the elf you're renting comes back with a few dents.

Fenris, on the other hand, got promoted from normal slave to treasured possession. For all Hadriana may have messed with him, his master would try to avoid having him damaged or weakened to the point where he could not function. Other than the pain and memory loss, Fenris probably had it better than the vast majority of non-Magisters living in Tevinter. I can completely understand Varania feeling that he got the better part of the bargain - the stability of slavery and special recognition as a valuable person.

The more I see of Thedas, the more I think that the only truly free people are pirates and the Dalish... maybe the Rivaini. If you're a free elf you're pretty much screwed unless you can make it to one of those societies.

[Patchwork]

^ What she said.

Slavery is a way of thinking as much as being a possession. People who don't learn to think like a slave rebel, they run away, are killed for being more trouble than they're worth. It's twisted version of survival of the fittest.

Which is why I find Fenris' romance outfit curious. The shield with the Amell coat of arms and a red band around his wrist. Essentially he's been Hawke claimed.

[Xewaka]

Source:
http://thepunchlinei...om/archives/824

You know that's the truth.

[Cawti35]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

ReiSilver wrote...

Varania's last statement always gets to me "I look on you now and think you got the better end of the bargin." WTF does that mean Varania??? Just what happened to you to make you think that??? So many ways that could be read into gah!

To add to what others have said here... in a society where slavery exists (or has existed until recently) often a freed slave's life will suck significantly more than a slave's life.

If you're a slave, your master has motivation to keep you decently fed, functional, and healthy, because you're an investment. If you die or become unable to function, your master loses his investment. If you're a free man in a world like that, there's no reason for anyone to pay you a living wage, or care about your health and welfare. They can work you to death or let you starve and it's no skin off their nose, no money out of their pocket. It's like the difference between how people treat a car they own versus a car they're just renting, only even worse, because nobody in Tevinter cares if the elf you're renting comes back with a few dents.

Fenris, on the other hand, got promoted from normal slave to treasured possession. For all Hadriana may have messed with him, his master would try to avoid having him damaged or weakened to the point where he could not function. Other than the pain and memory loss, Fenris probably had it better than the vast majority of non-Magisters living in Tevinter. I can completely understand Varania feeling that he got the better part of the bargain - the stability of slavery and special recognition as a valuable person.

The more I see of Thedas, the more I think that the only truly free people are pirates and the Dalish... maybe the Rivaini. If you're a free elf you're pretty much screwed unless you can make it to one of those societies.

I agree that the freed slaves probably have it the worst in Tevinter.  We also have no idea what sorts of terrible events Fenris has forgotten that Varania still remembers.  She may envy his memory loss as well as his escape.

[Heidenreich]

Cawti35 wrote...

I agree that the freed slaves probably have it the worst in Tevinter.  We also have no idea what sorts of terrible events Fenris has forgotten that Varania still remembers.  She may envy his memory loss as well as his escape.

Actually she pretty planly states that it's exactly how she feels. She envies his time under servitude (three square meals, a free roof over your head) with the line "Freedom was no boon." It leaves the player feeling as if she's saying "We were free, but we had to work three times harder to get to aford the things you had with out even trying. Then, you ran away and threw everything away, and STILL are doing better then Mother and I have been! Haet haet haet!  "

[Meeszy Alexy]

Heidenreich wrote...

Cawti35 wrote...

I agree that the freed slaves probably have it the worst in Tevinter.  We also have no idea what sorts of terrible events Fenris has forgotten that Varania still remembers.  She may envy his memory loss as well as his escape.

Actually she pretty planly states that it's exactly how she feels. She envies his time under servitude (three square meals, a free roof over your head) with the line "Freedom was no boon." It leaves the player feeling as if she's saying "We were free, but we had to work three times harder to get to aford the things you had with out even trying. Then, you ran away and threw everything away, and STILL are doing better then Mother and I have been! Haet haet haet!  "

And despite that, I still would have not betrayed Fenris in her shoes, despite any jealousy regarding his priviledged life as a slave. He may have lost his memories of her, but he's still her brother. It's sad that - from my interpretation of her - that she thought that money and power were more important than family. The only way I would've betrayed Fenris is if he was an abusive jerk back when he was "Leto", but a) That doesn't really match up with what we are told of him and He isn't "Leto" anymore. Chances are that Fenris would be a very good brother to her, giving him a second chance he didn't know he had.

To sum it all up, Varania's a cow. Moo.

[Patchwork]

Depends on what was in the letter imo. If he went on about the evils of magic and how it poisons everything. Which is logical as he would have to explain his lack of memory. Varania as a mage wouldn't have had a lot of reason to trust him.

I'm not trying to defend her, much anyway, what she did was selfish. She probably contacted Denarias rather than the other way around but since being freed looking out for herself would have been the only way to survive. I find it a tragic for both of them rather than a black and white issue.

[Cawti35]

Meeszy Alexy wrote...

Heidenreich wrote...

Cawti35 wrote...

I agree that the freed slaves probably have it the worst in Tevinter.  We also have no idea what sorts of terrible events Fenris has forgotten that Varania still remembers.  She may envy his memory loss as well as his escape.

Actually she pretty planly states that it's exactly how she feels. She envies his time under servitude (three square meals, a free roof over your head) with the line "Freedom was no boon." It leaves the player feeling as if she's saying "We were free, but we had to work three times harder to get to aford the things you had with out even trying. Then, you ran away and threw everything away, and STILL are doing better then Mother and I have been! Haet haet haet!  "

And despite that, I still would have not betrayed Fenris in her shoes, despite any jealousy regarding his priviledged life as a slave. He may have lost his memories of her, but he's still her brother. It's sad that - from my interpretation of her - that she thought that money and power were more important than family. The only way I would've betrayed Fenris is if he was an abusive jerk back when he was "Leto", but a) That doesn't really match up with what we are told of him and He isn't "Leto" anymore. Chances are that Fenris would be a very good brother to her, giving him a second chance he didn't know he had.

To sum it all up, Varania's a cow. Moo.

I agree that I cannot justify her betrayal of Fenris.  All their family probably had was each other and she was willing to sell that out.  It would be interesting to get a DA set in Tevinter.  It might be too depressing though.

[Arquen]

I assume varania lived a crappy life as a free elf, but I can't buy into the idea that she had it better than Fenris because she was akin to an urchin in darktown or elves in the alienage. Fenris was a pet, but I don't think danarius really cared about his wellbeing much. Hadrianna could do whatever to him including starve him of food and sleep and danarius wouldn't exactly step in to protect his investment. Even when Fenris was injured and therefore left behind it wasn't like danarius was making sure he was ok or even that he was allowed on the boat. Sure he was upset after but if he coveted Fenris he would have made sure he wasn't left behind. I see Fenris in danarius' eyes like a pet, valuable because of his skills, but not pampered by any means.

Varania of course would know none of this and has been talking to danarius. Im sure it sas easy to manipulate her into thinking Fenris had the better deal. To me though it seems she always had choices as a free elf even though she says she didn't. She saw a chance to become a magister at any cost even her brother. She had a choice, but in the end she is simply selfish and self gratifying thinking only of how hard her life has been and screw Fenris because he left us for a better life. Better life as a slave does not compute to me.

[ReiSilver]

More shameless self promotion from me, some more of my MarricHakwe and Fenris, a bit more steamy this time so I'll put it behind a link for those who don't like m/m
link to deviantart

[Caoilfhionn]

Ser Bard wrote...

Depends on what was in the letter imo. If he went on about the evils of magic and how it poisons everything. Which is logical as he would have to explain his lack of memory. Varania as a mage wouldn't have had a lot of reason to trust him.

 

I've actually assumed that Fenris would have had to have arranged the deal to free his mother and sister before undergoing the process of receiving the markings, as he no longer remembers doing so, or their existence. That she's aware that it was this deal that freed them means I doubt Fenris would need have told her anything she didn't already know about his current state. Not to say that he didn't talk about it in the letter, of course, since he doesn't even remember her, much less what she knows.

My major beef with Varania is just her complete lack of gratitude for what Fenris was trying to do. It's obvious that he gave himself over to torture and loss of his individuality and everything he held dear (because what else would a slave possess than his memories?) in order to free his family from slavery. Being thrust into the world after spending your entire life as a slave would of course be hard, but that doesn't make his intent and his self-sacrifice any less kind. For her to turn around and try to make her life better by once again taking away all that Fenris has is inexcusable, and her little parting jab about him getting the better end of the bargain is just petty.

Edit: ReiSilver- Once again I find your Hawke and Fenris entrancing together. Just the little after sexytime cuddles is just so so d'awww. Fen looks so content.

Modifié par Caoilfhionn, 08 juin 2011 - 05:17 .