55380 réponses à ce sujet

[Amirit]

Much appreciated, Coldy Biscuits, like lunch - make everything better!

[Ghost_Nappa]

I am probably the only person on this forum that is for the "Don't make all LI's bi" for the simple reason of focus on characterization. I rather focus on their personalities and personal agendas that intergrate into the main story, and their own personal quests, instead of having their sexuality be tha main reason I like them.

That and also I sorta like that hand in face moment when the character tells me they aren't interested my PC. Yes it alienates some players, but I see it as an oppertunity to bring out great writing so they dont fall flat after 1 or 2 acts.

[AbsoluteApril]

All bi-LIs? I could go either way.


new page! have some screenshots
lighting was nice on his armor here


Something strange is afoot at the Blooming Rose


"How much longer is this going to take Hawke?"
"Fenris, do you need to.. go?"
"Um sister.."
"You too Carver?"




 
 

Modifié par AbsoluteApril, 26 septembre 2012 - 01:42 .

[AbsoluteApril]

Faerunner wrote...
I might have been able to imagine a more satisfactory character had the camera not panned back to Hawke every two lines in every cutscene and showed BioWare's Hawke's facial expressions, reactions, body language, autodialogue, et cetera; completely overriding anything I would have imagined for mine.

I agree and I have hope that it won't be that bad in DA3:I especially after seeing Mr. Epler's statement here link

John Epler wrote...
Honestly, the less often a player ends up in a conversation or cutscene, the better. Not only from a purely player experience point of view (not wanting to feel like you're 'watching a movie' is a criticism that we see, and fair enough), but also from a designer standpoint - the more often you're pulled out of gameplay, the less impactful those moments become.

Modifié par AbsoluteApril, 26 septembre 2012 - 01:51 .

[aldien]

I believe one of the protagonists is Kossith, Fae. Well... according to what I saw. You can take that with a pinch of salt because I have the memory of a gnat. At least we will be getting some variation this time around. But you make me yearn for race options. Elf and Fenris... sighs. That would have been an intriguing relationship to explore. Missed opportunity

Don't get me wrong, DA2 was very enjoyable and introduced me to the DA universe, but for me, and I mean just for me, it's not roleplay. It's too defined and stringent, and like Fae, the cut scene panning drove me bonkers. The funny thing is, I was perfectly content with not complaining about DA2 until certain people bugged me to play DAO. Now I feel I can make an honest comparison. It's their fault. I'm flogging a dead horse here aren't I? Sorry. I LOVE FENRIS (*whispers* and alistair)! That's better

Coldy, I didn't make it through ME3 either. I... really did not like that game for various boring reasons. I'll spare everyone. I can't believe we had our first tiff I think we should make up

Who mentioned Morrigan and a female romance? That should have happened! It drives me nuts that it didn't. For that reason and others, I prefer they keep the characters bi. I don't like being excluded and I don't like knowing someone else is being excluded, especially those who feel awkward if they have to find a mod to change the LI's sexual orientation. Honestly, love is love regardless of what is between the legs. Besides, we are already forced into a specific protagonist. Why make it more stringent?

Free range LI's Fae? You are as bad as Coldy and her free range mages

LOL! April... the pee dance is priceless.

When you decide to retire Ren tell me. We can wobble in to it together. What are you talking about? Larius is a sexy **** He just needs some moisturizer and good as new.

Modifié par aldien, 26 septembre 2012 - 03:07 .

[Enkidu]

Aldien, kossith protag?! Where did you hear that? That would be just piles of greatness if real!

Yeah, this discussion was doomed from the start since role-playing is a very subjective and personal thing, you can't exactly make another person do it like you, as well you shouldn’t. I truly felt no more constrained in DA2 than in DAO. You and Fae did. I also enjoyed all the ME games (yes, the ending was poodle crap, but that's like 5%of the whole thing), while you and Coldy found the third tedious. There is no right or wrong way to enjoy something. I just hope more people can have fun with DA3 I get kinda sad when other people are not enjoying themselves. I prefer it when everyone is happy XDD That ain't happening for sure, but I hope everyone will at least find something to like and less things to be discouraged by.

Also... You think Larius is sexy? My-my, since when are you into tainted crazy people? *ba-dum-tish Anders joke*

Modifié par MrFlipFlops, 26 septembre 2012 - 03:14 .

[AbsoluteApril]

lol - huge tracks of land!

aldien wrote...
What are you talking about? Larius is a sexy **** He just needs some moisturizer and good as new.

ok, so it's late and this comment got the ol' brain a working. Silly photoshop job, but I present to you, un-tainted Larius, sort of:

(did it really fast, I know contrast and such is off in a bunch o' spots, don't care) : )

Modifié par AbsoluteApril, 26 septembre 2012 - 04:31 .

[Dutchess]

LOL, April, that does look a lot better! Although I can't stop staring at his eyes... creepy alien eyes.


As for the roleplaying discussion: I found the dialogue wheel pretty restricting. I especially disliked that going for a romance was so predictable. You just choose the heart everytime you see it appear. With friendship/rivalry there are two ways the relationship can develop, but the heart lines remain pretty much the same. Often the flirt lines were a bit too bold for my liking. In DAO you could take a more subtle and friendly approach (although telling Alistair you have dreams about you and him having sex is pretty hilarious).


I'll join the rest of the group and yell KOSSITH PROTAGONIST? WHERE???
Seriously aldy, where have you read that? I don't think anything of the like has been announced yet. Or even hinted at.

[Enkidu]

Ren, the one thing that always puzzled me was the complaint that romance lines are obvious with the wheel and you just pick them to get things going. Aside from the fact that people also constantly complain of ninjamances, which happen when they chose a romance-starter unwittingly and that complaint always rang hollow for me because... Were they subtle in DAO? I remember that I had a problem with one Zev-mance where the character was really shy and the romance starter lines were all very sexual in nature, so I was hesitant to pick them. And I don't remember any other lines being somehow more subversive, you just always say various dirty things. Although, it has been a while for me, so I can be remembering things wrong, so if this diatribe is just full of ignorance - please tell me, I really want to know if there were more "stealthy" romance-lines that I missed, being busy going for that "HOW BOUT YOU DROP YOUR PANTS" line.

[Enkidu]

Fae, you're right, I just started remembering these other things. Brain's too full of fluff and nothing lately XDD And I think moto said something a page ago about more heart options, which I fully endorsed. More heart options! I love being blunt and pervy, but variety is the spice of life.
This is actually a pretty good suggestion, seeing as asking to just do away with the wheel is futile. We sould look for more valid ways to improve it for those that had problems.

[Dutchess]

Yes, MOAR heart options. ALWAYS MOAR. Did you hear that, Bioware? Heh, I'm all for more, but I won't keep my hopes up. More races, more origins, more flirt options, more chances to talk with companions... I want it all, but my wishes will probably not be granted.

I once read a post by David Gaider that there was actually the same amount of interaction with each companion as in DAO. I... can you believe that? Because I certainly don't. There is no way I could talk as much to Fenris as I could to Alistair. Hell, the first time you're in camp you can spend more than half an hour talking to everybody before you've used up all currently available questions. Poor Alistair must have a dry mouth by the time I'm done nagging him. And that is only the beginning! In DA2 you have a talk at the beginning of each act, two QB's, and two talks triggered when you've given a gift. Oh, and one romance scene. Those are 5, maybe 10 minutes each. That's got to be less than what DAO had.

About the ninjamancing: there are some more subtle reactions that still trigger the romance. Most often they are very nice reactions, which indicate that you care about the character. I know I've been too nice to Alistair and Zevran more than once. And when I watched my ex play DAO and nagged him to talk to Zevran, Zevran gave his lurid stare. My ex wondered why I started laughing so hard, and when I told him he had flirted with Zev he vehemently denied.

[Enkidu]

ren, oh, the ninjamances. They just can't seem to happen to me and I'm a big lover of inappropriate amounts of easily misinterpreted affection on my first blind playthroughs. Never got ninjamanced. Not once. Neither in DA nor in ME. It's really hard for me to think of the things other people do for that to happen. I've written all the character types (as far as you can type such things) - nice, too nice, rude, passive-aggressive, brattish, out-of-the-loop and no ninjamances. Baw, what's wrong with me?

[AbsoluteApril]

renjility wrote...
I once read a post by David Gaider that there was actually the same amount of interaction with each companion as in DAO. I... can you believe that? Because I certainly don't.

it never seemed like it to me either, although like Fae said, it's been 'timed' and found similar, I found it wanting. Perhaps it's because there is so little romance specific dialogue in the talks in DA2, it's mostly 'here's my problem, please help' 'ok, sure, how should we fix it, by the way you're kinda cute'. Oh actually, it was more 'by the way, let's snog cause you've got a sexy bod'. I wonder if they include the party banter where Hawke responds as part of the 'dialogue'? I always felt like I had a lot more chances to talk to my DAO companions and much more varied things to talk about.

I am so not a fan of the '' icon. Howvever, never had a ninja mance either, it always seemed fairly clear to me which was a flirt line or not. I did pick a line that I realized by Zev's reaction was a flirt but it's always easy to 'end' it later or play coy and avoid it in DAO and still complete the intended romance. Not so much in DA2 since it tends to bug and lock out other romances once you've started one. 

Suppose I'm not a fan of the wheel/icons in general but I know we're stuck with some form of the wheel. Getting hit on by people or having them take what you say wrong, happens in real life so it made sense that the reactions from DAO NPCs/companions were not always what you expected. The icon just makes it so 'in your face' what to expect... and even then some of the things Hawke says are... not expected based on the 'prompt'.  I believe someone had come up with an idea of a dual wheel or something, where one is choosing the paraphrase and the other is choosing the tone, so the same line or intent could be done in multiple ways. Of course.. that's just more VA work and probably less overall dialogue then if they have to read the same line 10 times instead of just 3.

gosh I'm rambling. sorry for the train-of-thought power post. Off to go meet by Aussie friend to do some shopping and imbibe a little Absinthe. Fair journeys all.

Modifié par AbsoluteApril, 26 septembre 2012 - 04:42 .

[CuriousArtemis]

MrFlipFlops wrote...

I remember that I had a problem with one Zev-mance where the character was really shy and the romance starter lines were all very sexual in nature, so I was hesitant to pick them.

I always have this problem with Zev. My Warden is always a fairly shy elf who is curious about the world around him but a little intimidated. Maybe one or two partners before meeting Zev. IMO a much better fit for him would be Alistair, but that option isn't there, so ... I have to play him ooc at the beginning of the Zev romance, and it's annoying. 

Faerunner wrote...

Over-all, I think the DA:O romances were more varied than DA2. You could be subtle, romantic, charming, snarky, blunt, seductive, etc. With DA2 you just had the one heart button and you had to click on it and pray it's the type of thing your character would say.

 

I think I'm at a disadvantage agian because I've only romanced Zevran, and without the ability to hear my Warden's voice, I have no idea HOW he was saying what he was saying, so no idea if he was being charming or what. Conversations in DAO are so mechanical and, well, unromantic lol But again, only played Zev. I have a feeling Alistair is better. Not to denigrate Zevran, but he never really clicked with me as a romance option. Great character, not my favorite romance.

And although it's true the single <3 option is severely limited, it's also true that SOMETIMES what you asked/said after clicking it differred according to personality. More of that perhaps?

About the romances being the same time-wise, keep in mind that Hawke speaks and Warden doesn't, and I'm assuming they're not counting the amount of time it takes you to stop waffling over which response to click in DAO xDDDD

[coldwetn0se]

Have totally been ninja-manced by Zevran. My favorite HN was a snarky female rogue, who fell for Alistair. However, she had a "kindred" spirit with Zev, and considered him her best pal. She was a bit of a jokester/prankster, so you can imagine many of the lines she chose to respond with in dialogue. Problem was, some of the lines she used (that I saw as more sarcastic, or was using ironically), were flirt lines...DOH! I ended up getting the jealousy talk.....TWICE in that play through....oops. >.< XD
I still had a great time with it, but man....Zev's puppy face when you tell him "no"......*wubble* It all worked out in the end; even convinced Zev to stick around the kingdom for a bit. I imagined her and Zev getting silly drunk and dressing the Armor stands around the castle, in frilly bows and lacy aprons.

Need to post new Fenris shots....will load a few up in a bit.

[Amirit]

Faerunner wrote...

To be fair, I've looked at the complete companion interaction for each DA2 companion on Youtube, and they stretch out to be about 40 minutes each. I think that's about the same amount of time you spend with DA:O companions in camp. It still seems short though, probably because you only talk about small, narrow facets of their lives and/or their personal quests, whereas in DA:O the time spend had more quality. (You could learn about their childhoods, most important past relationships, their turning points in life, common interests, etc.) Maybe it's just me.

Did you count with or without Hawkes monologs? (ok, they are not monologs, but Hawkes remarks and answers do take screentime too, while reading lines does not count) Cinematic (all these moving around, throwing bottles at the walls and so on) also takes time. So, the scenes can be as long as if you use all the dialog options in DAO mindlessly clicking just to hear response in _camp only_, but amount of pure talking can not be compared. Oh, and in DAO you get additional dialogs here and there all the time.No way it is the same amount of interaction. Neither in time nor in debts. 

And this is why I keep saying - do not listen writers after they are done with the novel/story/whatever. For them it's always "work in progress" and they never remember what is actually there, what they wanted to be their and what they just made up right this second.

Modifié par Amirit, 26 septembre 2012 - 10:57 .

[CuriousArtemis]

A blip of a memory is returning to me, and I think what DG actually said was that the SCRIPT was comparable in both games. So no cut scenes, cinematics, voiced Hawke versus silent Warden, etc. I think he was merely referring to the words on paper.

[Enkidu]

Afraid I can't contribute anything more to the wheel discussion, aside from "more options!" since that's always good. We'll never be able to get all the options, that's silly, but squeezing out as many as possible is good enough.
I'll jump in on the interactions topic, though. I agree with y'all on that one - the conversations seem a lot less personal than in DAO. They're usually somehow tied to the current goings-on or the character’s angst bone if it acts up (and when doesn't it?). More casual and unrelated topics as well as private stories that aren’t “I saw my entire family get brutalized by the risen spirit of my grandfather, I hate all of you”.

April, I think I read that same thing about the dual wheel. I think it was written by Yahtzee, but it's been a while, I may be confused...

And a slightly (well, very) unrelated topic... You heard about that N7 day thing? I do wonder what they got under their sleeves. Especially since it's my birthday I hope it's something nice or interesting.

Modifié par MrFlipFlops, 26 septembre 2012 - 11:52 .

[MissRedZelda]

@ Ghost Napper: Don't worry, I didn't like the whole 'Let's make everyone bi' thing either. I personally found it a cheap and half-assed way out of the same sex relationship issue.

Now, as for Fenris and the attracted to human women thing . . . I'm so sorry if this has been addressed and put to rest already, but I want to add in my own two cents. I personally have never seen Fenris judge someone based on their race (I mean, whether they are human, elf or dwarf). So, by that logic, I don't think it matter to him whether a person is one of those races. When you get right down to it, he is a guy. And guys (straight or bi) are attracted to things that they find attractive. In this case, it's breasts. And last time I checked, all women in the game (including elf and dwarf) have breasts. So in my personal opinion, Fenris' attraction is race-blind. He sees them as women (or men) and not humans, elves, or dwarves.

Uuuuuunless that persona is a mage, then he spits on the ground they walk on. Eh, you can't please everyone, I guess.