There is quite a bit of post-game art for Dorian where he has long hair as well, and this was even before the Trespasser epilogue slides. But I'll admit that the recent ones posted by you are the first time I've seen it for Fenris.
Behold, fandom's thirst for Fenris with long hair!
About Varania, though, I did get the impression that she was naive - perhaps it was the voice-acting that made her sound young and naive. And when she said Fenris got the better deal, I thought she meant as the favourite slave of Danarius, which made me think perhaps she thought she was just returning him to his old life. Anyway, you're right, this isn't about Varania.
I don't think she was naive. exactly. It's more that she's a product of the system. A favoured slave would have had an 'easier' life than someone who had been cast out and left to fend for themselves (and it's not likely that she would have had experienced anything outside of Tevinter, so slavery would be 'normal'). The more I listen to her dialogue, the more I think she was the one who approached Danarius - 'She did what any good Imperial citizen should', and she stands to gain a whole lot out of it (I do think Danarius would have been manipulating her after that, and probably never would have followed through on their deal)
I don't usually kill her, though it's not because of their biological relationship. It's partly that she comes from the same f-ed up system, and partly along the lines of what Varric says - it won't help. Either way, though, i think there would be some kind of grieving process.
I don't think she was naive. exactly. It's more that she's a product of the system. A favoured slave would have had an 'easier' life than someone who had been cast out and left to fend for themselves (and it's not likely that she would have had experienced anything outside of Tevinter, so slavery would be 'normal'). The more I listen to her dialogue, the more I think she was the one who approached Danarius - 'She did what any good Imperial citizen should', and she stands to gain a whole lot out of it (I do think Danarius would have been manipulating her after that, and probably never would have followed through on their deal)
I don't usually kill her, though it's not because of their biological relationship. It's partly that she comes from the same f-ed up system, and partly along the lines of what Varric says - it won't help. Either way, though, i think there would be some kind of grieving process.
Yea how was she naive? Her voice was also very low and from movies, the husky types tend to be very mature and wise all that. Maybe it's better not to use the f word, even implicitly, because suddenly i got a warning on another section. I was like huh why can't i reply to anything, like I don't ustand how that moderator interpreted, coz I definitely didn't use profane language. :00 Better to be careful So how long have u joined?
Why do people pair Dorian with Fenris? I cringe at those who make him have mohawks or long hair, I like his normal hairdo! It's easier to wash off after sprayed with blood too 
The problem I have in that scene, and the reason I stop him, is that Fenris is not making the choice while in a rational state of mind. He is enraged, and rightly so, but that is not a good place in which to make a decision like killing the ONLY living member of your family. If he wants nothing to do with her after that, then that's fine, but if he kills her and regrets it later on, I think that would suck big time.
I think it can be interesting to explore certain avenues with fanfic. However, I'm not really into reading AU in general, although I have my own AU material that I play with.
Of course, no doubts about that. I like Fenris/OC Aus, and when i wrote my series one I didn't think of it as AU because its still kirkwall just that the events change. I guess yea he may regret it later, but everyone has freewill. Think ive said so before, i have a bug or prob the friendship bar not high enough.... he gets mad at me +10 and no extra talk with him when I stop him. V in fact hurts him further by rubbing in- you got the better end..... Damn so it makes him feel even worse and conflicted. There're some stories with him finding other lost relatives so it's not too bad at all 
Why do people pair Dorian with Fenris? I cringe at those who make him have mohawks or long hair, I like his normal hairdo! It's easier to wash off after sprayed with blood too
No idea. The same people who pair him with Anders? I really dislike slash ships. The only ships I'm okay with are those supported by, or hinted at, in the actual media: Fenris/Isabela, Bethany/Sebastian, Merrill/Carver, Dorian/Bull, Blackwall/Josephine, etc.
Morrigan/Alistair and Fenris/Anders? No. Those pairings truly despise each other. I suppose I don't mind it if people admit that they just want to look at a hot couple, which is fine, but don't try to come up with some BS excuse for your fantasy ship.
That said, it would be interesting to see those two interact. Unlike some people, I don't believe that Fenris "hates" all mages. He distrusts them until they prove they can be trusted, like Hawke and Bethany. Considering his experience and everything that goes on in DA2, especially with two of the mage party members, I think that viewpoint is warranted. So I don't think he would attack Dorian or anything of the sort, simply just be his chilly self until Dorian won him over, similar to how he wins over Blackwall. However, I think Dorian would have to actively resist asking Fenris questions about the lyrium, because I've no doubt he would be fascinated by the whole thing, mage nerd that he is. Don't forget, Fenris is more mellow in Act 3 and beyond, he makes friends with Donnic and socializes with him and Varric, so he is able to come out of his shell a bit as time goes on.
I never let Fenris kill his sister.
Dude had regrets killing the I can't remember her name magister woman after the fact...if he can regret that , killing a woman who just butcher a bunch of slaves and made his life a living hell , he will regret his sister murder after a while.
Besides Fenris himself killed his friends the Fog Warrior , when he was still on the full slave mentality trip , he didn't know any better.
If Varania can believe Danarius is going to make her a magister (newsflash: not possible , there's no elf magister...Liberati aren't even official citizen of the Imperium either ...) she's clearly desperate , uneducated to a fault , and probably just as lost as Fenris used to be.
Yea how was she naive? Her voice was also very low and from movies, the husky types tend to be very mature and wise all that. Maybe it's better not to use the f word, even implicitly, because suddenly i got a warning on another section. I was like huh why can't i reply to anything, like I don't ustand how that moderator interpreted, coz I definitely didn't use profane language. :00 Better to be careful So how long have u joined?
Hmm, she sounded young to me, maybe she didn't to others. Of course, she can't have been too much younger than Fenris since he remembered playing with her.
Anyway, when I used questionable language, it was more to express alarm (you know, like, Fenris, what the hell are you doing), not to insult anyone, of course, not even Fenris, who I adore (so apologies to those who thought I was ranting on Fenris). But just because I like him doesn't mean I have to like it when he kills someone out of rage. I didn't let Justice to it to Ella, and I didn't let Varric do it to Bartrand. The reason why I posted all that was because it was disturbing me, and I wanted to see how Fenris fans saw the situation.
That said, it would be interesting to see those two interact. Unlike some people, I don't believe that Fenris "hates" all mages. He distrusts them until they prove they can be trusted, like Hawke and Bethany. Considering his experience and everything that goes on in DA2, especially with two of the mage party members, I think that viewpoint is warranted. So I don't think he would attack Dorian or anything of the sort, simply just be his chilly self until Dorian won him over, similar to how he wins over Blackwall. However, I think Dorian would have to actively resist asking Fenris questions about the lyrium, because I've no doubt he would be fascinated by the whole thing, mage nerd that he is. Don't forget, Fenris is more mellow in Act 3 and beyond, he makes friends with Donnic and socializes with him and Varric, so he is able to come out of his shell a bit as time goes on.
Do you think it might even be beneficial on some level for Fenris to befriend Dorian? After all, Dorian seems to me to represent a possible progressive future for Tevinter - he dislikes the current political system in Tevinter, as well as the use of blood magic - viewpoints which Fenris would probably approve of. On Dorian's side, he would finally meet a former slave who is now more or less an equal, and might benefit from seeing things from Fenris' perspective.
Damn, now I'm wishing we would see Fenris in DA4...
That said, it would be interesting to see those two interact. Unlike some people, I don't believe that Fenris "hates" all mages. He distrusts them until they prove they can be trusted, like Hawke and Bethany. Considering his experience and everything that goes on in DA2, especially with two of the mage party members, I think that viewpoint is warranted. So I don't think he would attack Dorian or anything of the sort, simply just be his chilly self until Dorian won him over, similar to how he wins over Blackwall. However, I think Dorian would have to actively resist asking Fenris questions about the lyrium, because I've no doubt he would be fascinated by the whole thing, mage nerd that he is. Don't forget, Fenris is more mellow in Act 3 and beyond, he makes friends with Donnic and socializes with him and Varric, so he is able to come out of his shell a bit as time goes on.
And how exactly is Dorian going to "win him over"? By stating that slavery is surely preferable to living in an Alienage in the South while never even having known poverty or slavery himself? By pointing out that negative stories about slavery in Tevinter are examples of excess and not the norm, as if that somehow diminishes the weight of those cases of mistreatment, abuse and blood sacrifice? By arguing that most slaves do not mind their position at all (remember that Fenris did not see anything wrong with his situation until Danarius ordered him to murder the people who helped him and he obeyed!)? By reassuring Fenris that he and his family were always oh so nice to their slaves? Or maybe he should claim that he knows what it's like to be in Fenris' shoes (well, you know what I mean 
) just because his father expected him to fulfill the role about every noble has to fulfill and marry someone to carry on the family name?
People seem to forget, or ignore, that for all Dorian's talk about changing Tevinter, he actually defends his country's practice of slavery to the Inquisitor when asked about it. If he has a line referencing intent to include abolishing slavery in his vague claims about reform, please direct me to it, because I have not heard it. The only things Dorian explicitly criticizes of the Imperium are the use of blood magic, and the practice of arranged marriage. The latter is not restricted to Tevinter at all and occurs for a lot of people in Thedas, from nobles to city elves, and while it is of course much nicer to be allowed to fall in love and marry that person, it seems about one of the least unappealing faiths you can be assigned to in Thedas (or another Medieval setting). I daresay it definitely beats slavery. Beyond that I only recall Dorian complaining about the magisters' and nobles' sense of superiority over the common people, which, again, does not have to point towards plans to put an end to slavery at all.
Dorian was already criticizing several of his countrymen's practices before he traveled/fled South. Practices which are the norm and expected. Yet he admits to never even thinking about slavery before he saw that things were different than in the Imperium. What does that say about Dorian as a person? He hates that his father was willing to remove the choice to marry from his hands and wanted to force him into agreeing, and yet he never considered slavery, the complete lack of autonomy, to be bad and still outright defends it after he has seen that slavery is not normal. Fenris mentions how Danarius once sacrificed a slave boy to entertain his guests at a party. Dorian was part of the elite and has attended social gatherings. Even if the parties he was present at did not feature murder as part of the entertainment, he must have borne witness to slaves being treated less than stellar. Did he disapprove? Did he step in to help a poorly treated slave? He certainly makes no mention of it and his line about Tevinter excess when it comes to slavery not being the norm definitely doesn't suggest it either.
The codex about sexuality in Thedas states that same-sex relationships are seen as shameful in Tevinter when practiced between nobles/equals(?) but is actually encouraged with favored slaves. The abuse Danarius inflected on Fenris is actively encouraged in Tevinter society. That means it is the norm. Dorian defends the norm of slavery. Given Dorian's own sexual orientation, he must be familiar with this treatment of slaves. I'm not saying he himself ever had sex with slaves. I don't think he did, because it is abundantly clear that David Gaider aimed to portray Dorian as a good guy and sexual abuse does not fit a "good" character. But he must have known about it, was likely encouraged by family and/or friends to jut get married and occasionally have sex with a slave to fulfill his needs. And still Dorian did not think about the issues of slavery until after he came South, and even then he defends it.
So how is any of that going to win Fenris over? I agree with you that Fenris does not blindly and irrationally hate mages. Dorian being a mage he would be able to overlook. A Tevinter noble, one who has considered living with slaves normal for all his life and still can't bring himself to declare it as wrong? No chance.
Do you think it might even be beneficial on some level for Fenris to befriend Dorian? After all, Dorian seems to me to represent a possible progressive future for Tevinter - he dislikes the current political system in Tevinter, as well as the use of blood magic - viewpoints which Fenris would probably approve of. On Dorian's side, he would finally meet a former slave who is now more or less an equal, and might benefit from seeing things from Fenris' perspective.
Befriending Dorian would go against Fenris' character and damage it significantly. Dorian disapproving of blood magic and the 100% magical elite of Tevinter could score him points, sure. But it's the practice of slavery that made Fenris suffer the most, and for all his talk about magic, that is what has done the most damage.
^ I'm not really going to address all that. I'll just say that I am not blind to the slavery issue, and disagree with some of your characterization of Dorian.
Damn, now I'm wishing we would see Fenris in DA4...
Eh, I hope not. I don't want any carryovers other than those who are absolutely necessary given the plot and location, which are probably Solas, Dorian, and possibly Harding, Charter, or both.
Besides, they will probably change the look of elves again, and it would just be annoying. However, I wouldn't mind seeing how his markings would look, Frostbite-style.
Yeah I always kill betrand. It's a mercy kill at that point. And since I have Hawke's sibling a warden or dead most of the time it's a bit of revenge too.
Yeah I killed him out of mercy as well, it seemed as if there would be no coming back from that for him so I thought it'd be better to end it. In Fenris' case it's a bit more grey though for sure.
^ I'm not really going to address all that. I'll just say that I am not blind to the slavery issue, and disagree with some of your characterization of Dorian.
Eh, I hope not. I don't want any carryovers other than those who are absolutely necessary given the plot and location, which are probably Solas, Dorian, and possibly Harding, Charter, or both.
Besides, they will probably change the look of elves again, and it would just be annoying. However, I wouldn't mind seeing how his markings would look, Frostbite-style.
I dunno though, assuming DA4 does take place in Tevinter and is obviously going to feature elves heavily...it would make sense for Fenris to have something going on there, even if just in passing. I am not saying he'd be a companion or anything, but some involvement.
Regarding Dorian, he is an intelligent and fairly reasonable character, I don't think it's impossible for his views on slavery to change, especially after having spent 3 or 4 years in the south.
I don't think she was naive. exactly. It's more that she's a product of the system. A favoured slave would have had an 'easier' life than someone who had been cast out and left to fend for themselves (and it's not likely that she would have had experienced anything outside of Tevinter, so slavery would be 'normal'). The more I listen to her dialogue, the more I think she was the one who approached Danarius - 'She did what any good Imperial citizen should', and she stands to gain a whole lot out of it (I do think Danarius would have been manipulating her after that, and probably never would have followed through on their deal)
I don't usually kill her, though it's not because of their biological relationship. It's partly that she comes from the same f-ed up system, and partly along the lines of what Varric says - it won't help. Either way, though, i think there would be some kind of grieving process.
I think, as I believe I mentioned earlier, that Danarius was using her to get Fenris back. I don't know what would have happened to her had that happened, but I have to agree that Danarius would probably never have followed through on their deal. (Why should he, when he's just recaptured two of his former slaves with one stone?)
Besides, they will probably change the look of elves again, and it would just be annoying. However, I wouldn't mind seeing how his markings would look, Frostbite-style.
)
No idea. The same people who pair him with Anders? I really dislike slash ships. The only ships I'm okay with are those supported by, or hinted at, in the actual media: Fenris/Isabela, Bethany/Sebastian, Merrill/Carver, Dorian/Bull, Blackwall/Josephine, etc.
Morrigan/Alistair and Fenris/Anders? No. Those pairings truly despise each other. I suppose I don't mind it if people admit that they just want to look at a hot couple, which is fine, but don't try to come up with some BS excuse for your fantasy ship.
That said, it would be interesting to see those two interact. Unlike some people, I don't believe that Fenris "hates" all mages. He distrusts them until they prove they can be trusted, like Hawke and Bethany. Considering his experience and everything that goes on in DA2, especially with two of the mage party members, I think that viewpoint is warranted. So I don't think he would attack Dorian or anything of the sort, simply just be his chilly self until Dorian won him over, similar to how he wins over Blackwall. However, I think Dorian would have to actively resist asking Fenris questions about the lyrium, because I've no doubt he would be fascinated by the whole thing, mage nerd that he is. Don't forget, Fenris is more mellow in Act 3 and beyond, he makes friends with Donnic and socializes with him and Varric, so he is able to come out of his shell a bit as time goes on.
I assume when you said "slash ships" you meant "crack ships", nightscrawl? (I'm against crack ships, but slash ships are OK by me if they fit the canon.) Otherwise ^this. So much this. I think there are hints in MotA banter that Fenris has a bit of a crush on Bethany, and Bethany seems to have a bit of a crush on Isabela from some of their banter in Act 1 (but the Bethany/Isabela thing could just be me misinterpreting the "So you've been with women?" banter)
What is Frostbite, the solas look? Me too i wanna see zev and fen cameos! I was a bit like aww when that din happen when varric talked abt romances
Frostbite is the graphics engine Bioware used for DAI. And I would pay very good money for Zev and Fen cameos with that engine.
Modifié par springacres, 06 avril 2016 - 10:23 .
Sometimes it bothers me when a character loses the argument in party banter though s/he could easily say something.
"Fenris: Did I hear correctly? You are an... abomination?
Anders: Why don't you shout? I don't think everyone heard you.
Fenris: Do you see yourself as harmless, then? An abomination who would never harm someone?
Anders: Like ripping someone's heart out of his chest?
Fenris: I did that at the behest of no demon.
Anders: So we agree that it doesn't take a demon for someone to be a vicious killer? Good."
Except that Fenris can control himself. There isn't some entity that could make him slaughter children when it's least expected.
Not always...
Sometimes it bothers me when a character loses the argument in party banter though s/he could easily say something.
"Fenris: Did I hear correctly? You are an... abomination?
Anders: Why don't you shout? I don't think everyone heard you.
Fenris: Do you see yourself as harmless, then? An abomination who would never harm someone?
Anders: Like ripping someone's heart out of his chest?
Fenris: I did that at the behest of no demon.
Anders: So we agree that it doesn't take a demon for someone to be a vicious killer? Good."
Except that Fenris can control himself. There isn't some entity that could make him slaughter children when it's least expected.
There isn't some entity except his own rage. What does it matter what takes hold of you, if it leads to the same result (Ella vs Varania)?
I just had to kill him because apparently I didn't earn enough friendship points with him. I stood by and defended him all through the game and killed Danarius for him and he still turns on me. I was close to having him at 100% friendship but not quite so he turned on me?! Maybe I'll just give him to Danarius next time!!! 
Edit.....Okay so now that I've calmed down I take back that I would give him to Danarius. He was the only one in my party not 100% friendship and being a mage didn't help me. Didn't realize even after doing all his quests but not 100% friend would cause him to turn. I guess the same can happen with other party members and now I wonder if you don't have max friendship/rivalry with all party members if they would all leave?
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