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[bsbcaer]

buggirl wrote...

bsbcaer wrote...

fighterchicks wrote...

*snip of Sten and Leliana dialogue*

I think that Fenris would probably react in the same way. Irritated with funny dialogue.

Well, this again brings up the question as to the character of Fenris' Stoicism.  Are we talking modern (eg. Vulcan's from Star Trek) stoicism or more classical stoicism?

Im not really schooled in philosophy (been a long while since I've done anything w/philosophy or Greek History to be honest), and, admittedly, the scholar in me isn't happy using the following as a source, but when doing some researching on Stoicism, came across this on wiki:

The Stoic ethic espouses a deterministic perspective; in regards to those who lack Stoic virtue, Cleanthes once opined that the wicked man is "like a dog tied to a cart, and compelled to go wherever it goes." A Stoic of virtue, by contrast, would amend his will to suit the world and remain, in the words of Epictetus, "sick and yet happy, in peril and yet happy, dying and yet happy, in exile and happy, in disgrace and happy," thus positing a "completely autonomous" individual will, and at the same time a universe that is "a rigidly deterministic single whole."

Being a stoic doesn't mean cutting oneself off from all emotions, but rather destructive ones.  A stoic isn't an android, but a person who strives to be free of emotions such as envy, jealousy, and anger.  So, if the devs have decided to go away from the old "Spock" stereotype (ie. there are emotions in there, but you need to really fight to draw anything out, such as the relationship between Spock and Bones), it could mean that Fenris, while not exactly happy-go-lucky, can have a positive outlook on life and easily express "positive" emotions...

Thanks to Shorts for getting me to start thinking of this question of stoicism

What I am wondering is the process that Fenris would have to go through to fit the phylosphycal view of stoic and what would be his motivation. I would presume it would take time to master and in view of his lack of memory would there be some trigger to decide to approach life in this particular way or was it part of who he is.

Well, basing it on the premise that Fenris lost his memory with the lyrium branding rather than having a constant memory loss (a la Memento), it's certainly possible that Fen choose to not so much purge negative emotions but rather focus on positve ones (or limit negative ones) as a way of surviving his enslavement.  We don't know how/when he got away from his master, but it seems a safe assumption that he did not "pull a Wolverine" and kill everyone the second after he got branded, but rather spent some time acting as a weapon for his master.  Limiting or attempting to be free of negative emotions could be a way for him to deal with what he was forced to endure and then forced to carry out his master's will. 

I think of it in a similar way as the question of whether or not Fenris has religion.  Religion is certainly one method of dealing with a highly damaging situation (either fully embracing it or fully distancing oneself away.

On the question of a "trigger", it does bring to mind the question as to whether the magister has/had a way of mentally controlling Fenris (whether or not it has to do with the branding is another question).  It would certainly be a bit of a downer (especially for this thread) if Fenris' master is part of the main plot, forcing the PC/rest of party to fight and kill Fenris and the magister...

[Kitterkat100]

ceruleancrescent wrote...

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

littlenikki wrote...

Uh...we have obsessions with walls here too, I think. Well, at least some of us do

*Guilty look*


**New idea**

Hmmm... I've had a wonder...

I wonder if the lyrium causes Fenris to have problems controlling himself (E.G. He goes into combat, and it's probably best to give him some space afterwards so he can calm down otherwise you might get mauled).

....
........or....umm....he'd have trouble....restraining himself in other ways?
...........:happy:......

(snicker)(snickers some more)(falls off bed laughing)(hits head on nightstand)I ment to do that:whistle:

[fighterchick]

Dr. Doctor wrote...

I sort of see Fenris being rather awkward about the whole love scene thing. Poor guy's been a slave and a living weapon for as long as he can remember, and as I read his little blurb on the character page he's not much of a people person.

I sometimes think that Fenris isn't going to be an LI because of this.  I mean, if someone had gone through all that, would they really even be interested in romance/love?  Anyways, LI or not, I'm still really excited for this character!

Modifié par fighterchicks, 23 janvier 2011 - 04:59 .

[Madame Rose Crimsynn]

ceruleancrescent wrote...

Tashash wrote...

ceruleancrescent wrote...

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

littlenikki wrote...

Uh...we have obsessions with walls here too, I think. Well, at least some of us do

*Guilty look*


**New idea**

Hmmm... I've had a wonder...

I wonder if the lyrium causes Fenris to have problems controlling himself (E.G. He goes into combat, and it's probably best to give him some space afterwards so he can calm down otherwise you might get mauled).

....
........or....umm....he'd have trouble....restraining himself in other ways?
...........:happy:......

Oh, I LIKE you CCres.

And thats actually a good idea Nikki.

YAY! 

Hee Hee....great minds think alike 

My god, what did I just create?

[Kitterkat100]

Akako13shi wrote...

Dr. Doctor wrote...

I sort of see Fenris being rather awkward about the whole love scene thing. Poor guy's been a slave and a living weapon for as long as he can remember, and as I read his little blurb on the character page he's not much of a people person.

We're going to need Mordin to give poor Fen "the talk"

I can just imagine this.  it would be my favourite cross over scene ever (and im usually not a supporter of cross overs).... i think i cracked a rib from laughing!

( laughs some more remerbing mordins "talks")(falls off bed again  with laughter)(does not hit head on nightstand) come on people stop making me laugh so much i might end up with brain damge

[Tashash]

fighterchicks wrote...

Dr. Doctor wrote...

I sort of see Fenris being rather awkward about the whole love scene thing. Poor guy's been a slave and a living weapon for as long as he can remember, and as I read his little blurb on the character page he's not much of a people person.

I sometimes think that Fenris isn't going to be an LI because of this.  I mean, if someone had bone through all that, would they really even be interested in romance/love?  Anyways, LI or not, I'm still really excited for this character!

But....But.........All you need is LOVE!

I dunno though, it seems to me that if you're afraid of getting hurt it still dosen't stop you from wanting to be close to someone - in fact it can make you all the more desperate for it.

Edit: Not your fault, MCR - I've always been slightly perverted.

Modifié par Tashash, 23 janvier 2011 - 05:03 .

[Kitterkat100]

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

ceruleancrescent wrote...

Tashash wrote...

ceruleancrescent wrote...

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

littlenikki wrote...

Uh...we have obsessions with walls here too, I think. Well, at least some of us do

*Guilty look*


**New idea**

Hmmm... I've had a wonder...

I wonder if the lyrium causes Fenris to have problems controlling himself (E.G. He goes into combat, and it's probably best to give him some space afterwards so he can calm down otherwise you might get mauled).

....
........or....umm....he'd have trouble....restraining himself in other ways?
...........:happy:......

Oh, I LIKE you CCres.

And thats actually a good idea Nikki.

YAY! 

Hee Hee....great minds think alike 

My god, what did I just create?

something that at this rate will end up with more the a few people with cracked ribs and brain damage from falling off beds and chairs.

[ceruleancrescent]

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

ceruleancrescent wrote...

Tashash wrote...

ceruleancrescent wrote...

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

littlenikki wrote...

Uh...we have obsessions with walls here too, I think. Well, at least some of us do

*Guilty look*


**New idea**

Hmmm... I've had a wonder...

I wonder if the lyrium causes Fenris to have problems controlling himself (E.G. He goes into combat, and it's probably best to give him some space afterwards so he can calm down otherwise you might get mauled).

....
........or....umm....he'd have trouble....restraining himself in other ways?
...........:happy:......

Oh, I LIKE you CCres.

And thats actually a good idea Nikki.

YAY! 

Hee Hee....great minds think alike 

My god, what did I just create?

A wonderful, wonderful thing....really <3

[Deliciously-Demonic]

Trouble restraining himself?

-remembers a Valen fanfic-

-smiles and sighs like the crazed fan-girl she is-

Demon approves +100

[littlenikki]

fighterchicks wrote...

Dr. Doctor wrote...

I sort of see Fenris being rather awkward about the whole love scene thing. Poor guy's been a slave and a living weapon for as long as he can remember, and as I read his little blurb on the character page he's not much of a people person.

I sometimes think that Fenris isn't going to be an LI because of this.  I mean, if someone had bone through all that, would they really even be interested in romance/love?  Anyways, LI or not, I'm still really excited for this character!

*gasp* Blasphemy!!! (lol)

I think Fenris will be open to love, but only with an individual that he really trusts...like Hawkette! Or even MaleHawke for that matter (but that's a whole different discussion) Just b/c someone has gone through a traumatic experience, does not necessairily mean that person is totally cut off from human (or elven) emotions.

Of course, I could just be suffering under extreme fangirl dilusions and refusing to accept that my Hawkette will not get any Fenris action

[Madame Rose Crimsynn]

Deliciously-Demonic wrote...

Trouble restraining himself?
-remembers a Valen fanfic-
-smiles and sighs like the crazed fan-girl she is-
Demon approves +100

*Clicks the X button on one of my numerous open tabs. One that was conviently on Fanfiction.net*

Modifié par Madame Rose Crimsynn, 23 janvier 2011 - 05:06 .

[CuzImShort]

Deliciously-Demonic wrote...
-tries to think of a fenris-related topic we haven't talked to death- OOH, what type of drunk do you think he'd be?

This reminds me of a quote Sheryl Chee said about Morrigin:

Found on the DA wiki
If the party was going out for a drink, writer Sheryl Chee has said, Morrigan would "refuse to partake in any such foolishness.

I think Fenris would probably be the same. I can't see him drunk. Perhaps... I can see him as just a quite drunk. Obviously had a lil too much fine ale and just slumping off in the corner to sleep it off. I can't see him acting outrageous. 

How do you think the lyrium helps him in battle?

I'm very curious about that and would love to learn Gaider's response to this. Alas, it sounds too spoileriffic. So I can understand if he doesn't. The only thing I can think of is that it enhances strength and speed, but it has to be more than that. He's a living weapon, after all. What constitutes as a living weapon in a world with mages, wardens, and other warriors? What sets Fen apart from the rest?

Would kissing him for too long make you lyrium-addled?

I thought of Thane too. lol Maybe he's helpful with a mage! Hawke...

*team surrounded by darkspawn*
Varric: Hey Hawke, we could use your magic. *loads Bianca*
Hawke: *panting* I-I can't... too much of these bastards... I need lyrium...
Aveline: Curses! We're out... *pant* We can only hold out for so long. *bashes a few of them*
Fenris: Aveline... Varric... hold them off.
Varric: Are you mad, Elf? We're barely holding them off now!
Fenris: This will only take a second. *stares at Hawke and grabs her*
Hawke: W-what are you-
Fenris: *kisses Hawke*
Hawke: *taken by utter surprise and shock, but soon feels an sensation similar to lyrium recharging her*
Fenris: *Cuts kiss*
Varric: *Launches a series of arrows that hit several Hurlocks* Seriously? Elf, you pick a good time to make your move. *a genlock comes out of nowhere ready to strike at Varric*
Hawke: *Uses several spells to disable, kill, buff team,etc. After the battle, the group is surrounded by dead bodies of darkspawn. Hawke smirks at Fenris* Well, looks like we can save some coin from buying lyrium potions.
Fenris: *sighs*

 Okay, in all seriousness, I can't see the above happening, but hey... I couldn't resist.

Is his hair really white, or just 'clear' that appears white when light reflects off of it?

lol Me thinks it's just white.

[ceruleancrescent]

fighterchicks wrote...

Dr. Doctor wrote...

I sort of see Fenris being rather awkward about the whole love scene thing. Poor guy's been a slave and a living weapon for as long as he can remember, and as I read his little blurb on the character page he's not much of a people person.

I sometimes think that Fenris isn't going to be an LI because of this.  I mean, if someone had gone through all that, would they really even be interested in romance/love?  Anyways, LI or not, I'm still really excited for this character!

Oh no!   You must believe! BELIEVE! 

[Kitterkat100]

Akako13shi wrote...

kitterkat wrote...

Akako13shi wrote...

Dr. Doctor wrote...

I sort of see Fenris being rather awkward about the whole love scene thing. Poor guy's been a slave and a living weapon for as long as he can remember, and as I read his little blurb on the character page he's not much of a people person.

We're going to need Mordin to give poor Fen "the talk"

I can just imagine this.  it would be my favourite cross over scene ever (and im usually not a supporter of cross overs).... i think i cracked a rib from laughing!

( laughs some more remerbing mordins "talks")(falls off bed again  with laughter)(does not hit head on nightstand) come on people stop making me laugh so much i might end up with brain damge

I can just imagine what would happen if Hawke walked in on them having the "talk"

Hawke: hey Fenri..... am interupting something? *seeing mordin in the middle of explaining about female body parts too fen (use your imaginations ladies and gents)*

Fenris: i... uh.... *red faced*

Mordin: no nothing at all what did you require?

Hawke:... never mind *blushes and walks away*

thank you my dad came to see what was going on after i fall off the bed for a thrid time . i expailed blushing all through that and he just laughed and said "don't get a cocasn you have school on monday" (sigh) he laughed at me my own father

[buggirl]

bsbcaer wrote...

Well, basing it on the premise that Fenris lost his memory with the lyrium branding rather than having a constant memory loss (a la Memento), it's certainly possible that Fen choose to not so much purge negative emotions but rather focus on positve ones (or limit negative ones) as a way of surviving his enslavement.  We don't know how/when he got away from his master, but it seems a safe assumption that he did not "pull a Wolverine" and kill everyone the second after he got branded, but rather spent some time acting as a weapon for his master.  Limiting or attempting to be free of negative emotions could be a way for him to deal with what he was forced to endure and then forced to carry out his master's will. 

I think of it in a similar way as the question of whether or not Fenris has religion.  Religion is certainly one method of dealing with a highly damaging situation (either fully embracing it or fully distancing oneself away.

On the question of a "trigger", it does bring to mind the question as to whether the magister has/had a way of mentally controlling Fenris (whether or not it has to do with the branding is another question).  It would certainly be a bit of a downer (especially for this thread) if Fenris' master is part of the main plot, forcing the PC/rest of party to fight and kill Fenris and the magister...

This is where it gets interesting because his stoicism then would become more of a coping mechanism than the adaptation of a particular phylosophy to his behavior (to use your previous example - I chose to be happy because it is something I believe in vs I chose to be happy because the alternative would destroy me).

I will write more in a short time - pup needs walk.

[Dr. Doctor]

fighterchicks wrote...
I sometimes think that Fenris isn't going to be an LI because of this.  I mean, if someone had bone through all that, would they really even be interested in romance/love?  Anyways, LI or not, I'm still really excited for this character!

Most people before ME2 came out wouldn't have considered Garrus as an LI and we saw how that went. Besides, having awkward Fenris could be entertaining.

Isabela: So I hear that your new at steering your ship into port Fenris.

Fenris: I don't quite get what your talking about.

Isabela: Lowering the dingy? Dropping trow? (notices Fenris' confused expression) Here, this should sort everything out for you. (hands Fenris a little black book) Arm yourself with knowlege my elven friend, you're going to need it.

Fenris: (watches Isabela walk away) Knowlege? What knowlege could I possibly need from...(opens book) Dear sweet Maker! How..how can anyone even bend that way? Who would even want to do that?

Modifié par Dr. Doctor, 23 janvier 2011 - 05:09 .

[Most Definitely Sane]

CuzImShort wrote...

Deliciously-Demonic wrote...
-tries to think of a fenris-related topic we haven't talked to death- OOH, what type of drunk do you think he'd be?

This reminds me of a quote Sheryl Chee said about Morrigin:

Found on the DA wiki
If the party was going out for a drink, writer Sheryl Chee has said, Morrigan would "refuse to partake in any such foolishness.

I think Fenris would probably be the same. I can't see him drunk. Perhaps... I can see him as just a quite drunk. Obviously had a lil too much fine ale and just slumping off in the corner to sleep it off. I can't see him acting outrageous. 

How do you think the lyrium helps him in battle?

I'm very curious about that and would love to learn Gaider's response to this. Alas, it sounds too spoileriffic. So I can understand if he doesn't. The only thing I can think of is that it enhances strength and speed, but it has to be more than that. He's a living weapon, after all. What constitutes as a living weapon in a world with mages, wardens, and other warriors? What sets Fen apart from the rest?

Would kissing him for too long make you lyrium-addled?

I thought of Thane too. lol Maybe he's helpful with a mage! Hawke...

*team surrounded by darkspawn*
Varric: Hey Hawke, we could use your magic. *loads Bianca*
Hawke: *panting* I-I can't... too much of these bastards... I need lyrium...
Aveline: Curses! We're out... *pant* We can only hold out for so long. *bashes a few of them*
Fenris: Aveline... Varric... hold them off.
Varric: Are you mad, Elf? We're barely holding them off now!
Fenris: This will only take a second. *stares at Hawke and grabs her*
Hawke: W-what are you-
Fenris: *kisses Hawke*
Hawke: *taken by utter surprise and shock, but soon feels an sensation similar to lyrium recharging her*
Fenris: *Cuts kiss*
Varric: *Launches a series of arrows that hit several Hurlocks* Seriously? Elf, you pick a good time to make your move. *a genlock comes out of nowhere ready to strike at Varric*
Hawke: *Uses several spells to disable, kill, buff team,etc. After the battle, the group is surrounded by dead bodies of darkspawn. Hawke smirks at Fenris* Well, looks like we can save some coin from buying lyrium potions.
Fenris: *sighs*

 Okay, in all seriousness, I can't see the above happening, but hey... I couldn't resist.

It will happen. As long as we believe.

[fighterchick]

littlenikki wrote...

fighterchicks wrote...

Dr. Doctor wrote...

I sort of see Fenris being rather awkward about the whole love scene thing. Poor guy's been a slave and a living weapon for as long as he can remember, and as I read his little blurb on the character page he's not much of a people person.

I sometimes think that Fenris isn't going to be an LI because of this.  I mean, if someone had bone through all that, would they really even be interested in romance/love?  Anyways, LI or not, I'm still really excited for this character!

*gasp* Blasphemy!!! (lol)

I think Fenris will be open to love, but only with an individual that he really trusts...like Hawkette! Or even MaleHawke for that matter (but that's a whole different discussion) Just b/c someone has gone through a traumatic experience, does not necessairily mean that person is totally cut off from human (or elven) emotions.

Of course, I could just be suffering under extreme fangirl dilusions and refusing to accept that my Hawkette will not get any Fenris action

If he's not an LI, I shall just get my fix at ff.net.  

Anyway, now I'm half hoping for a Fenris as a mage battery.  If so, I'll need to make my Hawkette a mage and bring him with her everywhere.  Fenris can charge her mana any time!  >_>

[Tashash]

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

Deliciously-Demonic wrote...

Trouble restraining himself?
-remembers a Valen fanfic-
-smiles and sighs like the crazed fan-girl she is-
Demon approves +100

*Clicks the X button on one of my numerous open tabs. One that was conviently on Fanfiction.net*

*Is already checking out the Toorchwood fics*

Janto shipper

[Madame Rose Crimsynn]

@ Doctor



*Trying to keep a straight face*



*Twitches*



*Bursts out laughing*

[littlenikki]

Dr. Doctor wrote...

fighterchicks wrote...
I sometimes think that Fenris isn't going to be an LI because of this.  I mean, if someone had bone through all that, would they really even be interested in romance/love?  Anyways, LI or not, I'm still really excited for this character!

Most people before ME2 came out wouldn't have considered Garrus as an LI and we saw how that went. Besides, having awkward Fenris could be entertaining.

Isabela: So I hear that your new at steering your ship into port Fenris.

Fenris: I don't quite get what your talking about.

Isabela: Lowering the dingy? Dropping trow? (notices Fenris' confused expression) Here, this should sort everything out for you. (hands Fenris a little black book) Arm yourself with knowlege my elven friend, your going to need it.

Fenris: (watches Isabela walk away) Knowlege? What knowlege could I possibly need from...(opens book) Dear sweet Maker! How..how can anyone even bend that way? Who would even want to do that?

Ha!

Izzy and Oghren should team up...