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[LukaCrosszeria]

Ryzaki wrote...

LukaCrosszeria wrote...

I want the next party of the smexy Fenris/M!Hawke comic.

Switching to a non-LI topic...I hope as a two-handed warrior Fenris will be more effective as Sten. I dono why, but he kept dying really fast in my party and it took him forever to swing that damn hammer.

Well with the combat animations he should be faster. I'm not sure about durability though. Carver was always the first one  to die in my battles with the ogre. *sighs* Damn it Carver. 

I hope some of his sustained abilities will help with that. 

And is Indomitable still in? 

I should watch the video again. I haven't seen indomitable yet. Let's see there was war cry and mighty blow...

[Habassi]

@Minxie18 - I also can't see MaleHawke/Fenris together. And that's not from lack of imagination. His character would just be dwarfed by MaleHake's macho-ness. Or owesomeness. Depends on how one roleplays.

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Habassi wrote...
Somehow if he was bi, it would kill all the tough/mysterious guy innuendo he now has

Why?

Female intuition.

RinjiRenee wrote...

Funny, I didn't really pick up the bi
vibe when he was talking about having a pretty girl at his side and all
that.  And you are being horribly stereotypical.  I know plenty of
straight guys that like cats.

Plenty of guys love cats, yes. And sorry if anyone was offended by me being stereotypical, but Anders, unlike Fenris, is the type of guy who would pull off m/m realtionship perfectly. He's capable to find a common language with everyone in the group (even Velanna), or at least ease up warring situations with humor.
However, yes, this is not the Anders thread.

Modifié par Habassi, 27 février 2011 - 05:05 .

[catabuca]

stephen1493 wrote...

Gosh know, Have you played Enchanted Arms?

I'm just saying that it can hurt the mysterius inclanations of a romance figure.  Not because being gay is wrong, but because not everyone can be understanding of that.

Irregarddless I don't plan on romancing him one way or the other, so this doesn't pertain to me.

Then are you suggesting we should pander to the people who find gay icky? What about the people who look at Anders and see him as a mysterious, troubled man, but then find out he's bi and their impression is shattered? Perhaps we should therefore just stick to stereotypes of strong, straight, macho tough guys in future, so we don't upset anyone's delicate sensibilities?

I apologise if I'm coming across as combative, but your reasoning simply makes no sense, no matter how many times you try to explain yourself. You're essentially repeating over and over that being bisexual would mean Fenris couldn't also be mysterious. His status as Hawke's lover would be no different whether Hawke was male or female. He would still open up to him/her in the same way, still fall in love in the same way, still have the same background plot and missions, he would still have been a Tevinter slave, he would still be able to phase punch someone's brain to pieces. Your argument is nonsensical.

[LukaCrosszeria]

Oghren did last longer than Sten. Let's hope Fenris' lyrium tattoos help him stay on his feet too.

Edit:l I just saw him use Rally too.

Modifié par LukaCrosszeria, 27 février 2011 - 05:06 .

[Girl in the Box]

Yum, yum. Thank you much. The Fenside has the best cookies.

[Minxie]

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

 I really would like to see this thread survive to page 1000, and I would be ecstatic to see it go past March 8th.

*Goes back to writing page 1000 prompt*

I think we'll definitely reach 1000 before release.  I was thinking, though, that it could possibly be a good idea to have this one closed and start a brand new Fenris thread after March 8 to invite fresh discussions (and not intimidate all the new people who could be arriving after playing the game ). 

Ryzaki wrote...

Well with the combat animations he should be faster. I'm not sure about durability though. Carver was always the first one  to die in my battles with the ogre. *sighs* Damn it Carver. 

I hope some of his sustained abilities will help with that. 

When Carver died in my ogre battle it was because he wouldn't take a health potion, no matter how many times I told him to! Arggh, I even pulled him away from the fight so he wasn't even in the middle of any attacks, but no matter how many times I clicked the health potion (of which there were several available) he ignored me. And then he died. <_< I hope it was just a demo glitch and won't be in the game (everyone else in my party was perfectly capable of taking a health potion when I told them to, though).

Modifié par Minxie18, 27 février 2011 - 05:08 .

[catabuca]

Anyway, I'm out.

Here's to a swift next few days so I can get to play the freaking game.

[Madame Rose Crimsynn]

*Ignore me*

Modifié par Madame Rose Crimsynn, 27 février 2011 - 05:08 .

[ReiSilver]

Minxie18 wrote...
But for now all I can see when I picture M!Hawke and Fenris is a tall, strapping fellow with his pretty boy toy, and when I picture M!Hawke and Anders I can more easily see just two guys who are in love. 

great, now I'm reminded how sad I am I can't play a male elf.... *sad face*

[Ryzaki]

Minxie18 wrote...
When Carver died in my ogre battle it was because he wouldn't take a health potion, no matter how many times I told him to! Arggh, I even pulled him away from the fight so he wasn't even in the middle of any attacks, but no matter how many times I clicked the health potion (of which there were several available) he ignored me. And then he died. <_< I hope it was just a demo glitch and won't be in the game (everyone else in my party was perfectly capable of taking a health potion when I told them to, though).

Agreed. And Carver's stupid self wouldn't obey orders at times or would stand there like an idiot. 

[elirian_19]

Argh! I had the same problem with Carver. I literally had to beg him to take the damn potion.

He still died.

[happy-emu]

Ryzaki wrote...

happy-emu wrote...
The very first thing a friend of mine said when they saw Fenris was to ask if he was the gay one. There IS a perceived stereotype to the male bisexuals of the game. A lot of people expect Fenris to be gay based on the fact that he's an elf, yes. I am not championing these people (and I'm not sure why you seem so eager to pick a fight) but I am saying that if Fenris IS bi, it feeds that kind of expectation. People would be, in general, more surprised to find out Anders is bisexual, and surprises (as long as they are in character with a solid story) make for good writing.

And who is this friend of yours? Male female? Age group? Though I'm not picking a fight. I'm getting sick of the "oh Fenris would be so much like Zev if he was bi." thing. It's irritating. 

You're coming off with the whole "race is all that matters" like I am the one who is spouting that all elves ARE bi, when I'm not. I am only (and repeatedly) saying it is what a LOT of people think, and it would be nice (in my opinion) to prove that wrong with Fenris.

No I was just saying it's not a BW sterotype. The bisexual rogue is closer to aBW sterotype. Though I do see where you are coming from. I don't agree with it. Anders in my case would be a much worse option. 

The friend was female, and 30. I had male friends who said the same thing, but as a statement instead of a question. And speaking of unfair stereotypes, every one of my male friends expected me to be squeeing over romancing another elf with a male character. Clearly, that's not my thing, but it's become the general assumption that most girls who play DA do it for the m/m romance. It's depressing, really, and another view I'd like to prove wrong.

I never said he would be like Zevran (his personality is totally different). I'm not sure how Anders would be a worse option except from a point of character dislike (personally I liked him and could more easily do a male romance with him, though it's not my first-playthrough choice) but either way, it won't affect my game overall.

[EighmyLupin]

I see Fenris being bi alot easier then I see Anders being bi. Not because he's an elf, not because he looks "girly" or that I think he's less of a man. It comes down to the fact we don't really know alot about him and Anders all but screamed from the roof tops in Awakening that he was straight.
I would be perfectly happy with a bi Anders if they make him believable, if they don't then people will say "The demon did it, because he wasn't bi before." and nobody wants that.

Modifié par EighmyLupin, 27 février 2011 - 05:13 .

[plumededragop]

elirian_19 wrote...

Argh! I had the same problem with Carver. I literally had to beg him to take the damn potion.

He still died.

Yeah, I've the same problem. In the end, he ended drinking almost all the potions alone. Don't know if it was bad luck or anything, but still...
Anyhow, I won't have to worry about that since my Hawke will be a rogue... poor little Carver.

[Madame Rose Crimsynn]

@ Everyone still debating the bi-situation.

Drop it. Please.

Or else I'm holding out on my 1000 prompt and that will not make me happy because I've worked hard on it and there are others who actually want to read it.

[upsettingshorts]

catabuca wrote...

I apologise if I'm coming across as combative, but your reasoning simply makes no sense, no matter how many times you try to explain yourself. ... Your argument is nonsensical.

It's predictable, honestly.  In general no-one ever wants to say "I'm prejudiced" because even when it's ultimately a benign and harmless form of it - like personal sexual preference - doing so makes them uncomfortable.  So they resort to circular logic to protect themselves from having to expose themselves in that way.

Again, generally speaking.

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

@ Everyone still debating the bi-situation.

Drop it. Please.

Or else... 

*reads follow up "threat"*

Nah.  This is what I want to talk about.  It's on-topic.   

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 27 février 2011 - 05:16 .

[stephen1493]

catabuca wrote...

stephen1493 wrote...

Gosh know, Have you played Enchanted Arms?

I'm just saying that it can hurt the mysterius inclanations of a romance figure.  Not because being gay is wrong, but because not everyone can be understanding of that.

Irregarddless I don't plan on romancing him one way or the other, so this doesn't pertain to me.

Then are you suggesting we should pander to the people who find gay icky? What about the people who look at Anders and see him as a mysterious, troubled man, but then find out he's bi and their impression is shattered? Perhaps we should therefore just stick to stereotypes of strong, straight, macho tough guys in future, so we don't upset anyone's delicate sensibilities?

I apologise if I'm coming across as combative, but your reasoning simply makes no sense, no matter how many times you try to explain yourself. You're essentially repeating over and over that being bisexual would mean Fenris couldn't also be mysterious. His status as Hawke's lover would be no different whether Hawke was male or female. He would still open up to him/her in the same way, still fall in love in the same way, still have the same background plot and missions, he would still have been a Tevinter slave, he would still be able to phase punch someone's brain to pieces. Your argument is nonsensical.

no I'm not saying they should pander to anyone, I'm just saying that this is just the way it is for some.

My point is that as much as logic can tell us that being gay isn't a big deal over and over. That some people just can't accept it even if they say they can.

Fenris could still be mysterious if he's gay. If you've played Enchanted arms it'd be impossible not to think so, but It can just hurt some people's romantization of  his aura as a dark and mysterious romantic figure.

There is no absolute in my sentence and I recognize that I'm limited in my view as a straigt man (If you call that limitation ignorance I'm going to drop this right now) My point is that not everyone who's going to play the game is going to feel no different  knowing that the LI they love so much is BI.

[stephen1493]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

catabuca wrote...

I apologise if I'm coming across as combative, but your reasoning simply makes no sense, no matter how many times you try to explain yourself. ... Your argument is nonsensical.

It's predictable, honestly.  No-one ever wants to say "I'm prejudiced" because even when it's ultimately a benign and harmless form of it - like personal sexual preference - doing so makes them uncomfortable.  So they resort to circular logic to protect themselves from having to expose themselves in that way.

I have gay friends and bi Friends.

Please don't turn this into a witch hunt just because I'm saying that not everyone can completly accept a gay/bi romance figure.

Edit: and also how many times did I say I know I am limited? Must have been 2 or three times.

Modifié par stephen1493, 27 février 2011 - 05:17 .

[LukaCrosszeria]

Minxie18 wrote...

Madame Rose Crimsynn wrote...

 I really would like to see this thread survive to page 1000, and I would be ecstatic to see it go past March 8th.

*Goes back to writing page 1000 prompt*

I think we'll definitely reach 1000 before release.  I was thinking, though, that it could possibly be a good idea to have this one closed and start a brand new Fenris thread after March 8 to invite fresh discussions (and not intimidate all the new people who could be arriving after playing the game ). 

Ryzaki wrote...

Well with the combat animations he should be faster. I'm not sure about durability though. Carver was always the first one  to die in my battles with the ogre. *sighs* Damn it Carver. 

I hope some of his sustained abilities will help with that. 

When Carver died in my ogre battle it was because he wouldn't take a health potion, no matter how many times I told him to! Arggh, I even pulled him away from the fight so he wasn't even in the middle of any attacks, but no matter how many times I clicked the health potion (of which there were several available) he ignored me. And then he died. <_< I hope it was just a demo glitch and won't be in the game (everyone else in my party was perfectly capable of taking a health potion when I told them to, though).

I noticed that too, there seems to be a cooldown for the health potion? I've had both Carver and Aveline die on me in the demo because they didn't take the health potion.

<_< *vows to pour health potion down Fenris' throat at signs of obstinance*

Whirlwind is also a 2H skill. I haven't seen any kind of indomitable-type skill for Fenris yet.

[Ryzaki]

happy-emu wrote...
The friend was female, and 30. I had male friends who said the same thing, but as a statement instead of a question. And speaking of unfair stereotypes, every one of my male friends expected me to be squeeing over romancing another elf with a male character. Clearly, that's not my thing, but it's become the general assumption that most girls who play DA do it for the m/m romance. It's depressing, really, and another view I'd like to prove wrong.

You have friends that know you play DAO and expect you to do it for the m/m romance? They assume you're a yaoi fangirl then?

And it's a general assumption where I am that girls play BW games for the romance period. Gay straight doesn't matter. They just play it because it's a romance novel that's interactive and they can play their mary sue fantasies to the fullest. 

I never said he would be like Zevran (his personality is totally different). I'm not sure how Anders would be a worse option except from a point of character dislike (personally I liked him and could more easily do a male romance with him, though it's not my first-playthrough choice) but either way, it won't affect my game overall. 

I didn't mean you specifically. I was talking about the people that keep calling him Zevran 2.0. Anders showed no bisexual tendances in Awakening. He know shows them in DA2 after he's been possessed by a demon? There is a view held by certain people that being gay/bisexual means you are demonic. And yeah personally I disliked Anders. He wasn't my cup of tea. 

I will probably end up romancing everyone. But FemHawke seems to be giving me FemShep syndrome and I don't know if I'll be able to play her. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 février 2011 - 05:16 .

[ThatDancingTurian]

I see so many fangirls on every side of the spectrum saying "Oh, I hope he's not bi, just because he doesn't 'feel' bi." I've seen it as far back as when ME2 came out. And that's usually the opinion they have about an LI they intend to pursue. And I've done it too. I can't even explain why it would affect me at all, which makes it even sillier. And I've tried to justify it, used arguments for why they're straight, used the line, 'and I really don't care if he were bi, that's cool, I just don't see it'. But in all honesty, I'm just full of it. For some reason I just don't want my preferred LI to be 'the bi one'.

I'm not saying everyone or even anyone here is doing that, but I just get that feeling from time to time on these forums.

Which is why I really hope they're all bi. Then it wouldn't be a situation where one LI seems 'straighter' or 'less straight' than the other. Maybe they were bi before or maybe Hawke is an exception because it's Hawke and Hawke is sexy. Maybe they don't have to talk about their preferences (otherwise we might get another Zevran situation which would be unfair). This is preferable to me, at least.

[LukaCrosszeria]

Video spoiler-y

Fenris' companion quest is called "Bait and Switch". "Go to the magister's warehouse in Hightown at night to meet with Fenris."

This guy is wealthy back home, as Fenris said, but he's left that all behind and came to Kirkwall, putting himself in a vulnerable position in order to get Fenris back. He must really have invested a great deal of time, effort and mebbe money in him.

Edit: damn that hard to read video.

Modifié par LukaCrosszeria, 27 février 2011 - 05:19 .

[stephen1493]

LukaCrosszeria wrote...

Video spoiler-y

Fenris' companion quest is called "Rail and Switch". "Go to the magister's warehouse in Hightown at night to meet with Fenris."

This guy is wealthy back home, as Fenris said, but he's left that all behind and came to Kirkwall, putting himself in a vulnerable position in order to get Fenris back. He must really have invested a great deal of time, effort and mebbe money in him.

As if Fenris wasn't wanted enough.

[upsettingshorts]

stephen1493 wrote...

I have gay friends and bi Friends.

Please don't turn this into a witch hunt just because I'm saying that not everyone can completly accept a gay romance figure.

It's not and I'm not.   I'm a straight male who doesn't play S/S romances in these games because I can't identify with either of the participants and I need to in order to enjoy it. That being said, I wouldn't use such arguments against it - like "oh he's smaller so he must be the effeminate one" - and even reading them bothers me.  I support their inclusion because people with the same qualifications as me - needing to identify with the characters - should be able to do so regardless of their sexual preference/identity.  

I'm not attacking people.  I'm attacking arguments.  There is a difference, no matter how many times people try to tell me - often in fanthreads - there isn't.  

Finally, I added enough qualifiers in my post to make it clear - at least in my estimation - that I was talking about several people across several threads and not just you.  I'll make it even clearer:  That post was not directed straight at you.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 27 février 2011 - 05:22 .

[happy-emu]

LukaCrosszeria wrote...

Oghren did last longer than Sten. Let's hope Fenris' lyrium tattoos help him stay on his feet too.

Edit:l I just saw him use Rally too.

He was pretty damn fast in that video (the demo in the mansion) and he seemed a lot better at NOT getting knocked on his ass. I'm worried about the aggro mechanics though, if he indeed does high damage.

Two-handed weapons were one thing I was definitely hoping might be improved, and at least at a glance Fenris looks capable. Not sure of him tanking, though...