549 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryzaki]

soteria wrote...

And you can learn their max HP by looking at the character sheet.
How exactly does it help knowing how much HP is left in numerical value rather than percentage wise-? Eh pointless I'll just chalk it up to different styles of play.

Again, I don't care to look at the character sheet or mouse over a portrait in the middle of a battle to find information I feel should be available at a glance. I don't care about the percentages because I don't have healing spells that heal, say, 33% of max health, and enemies don't have damage spells that deal a % of damage or change in effectiveness based on percent.

/shrug

I just wish there was a toggle. Those bars look like they'd get unwieldy if they got much bigger.

[tmp7704]

soteria wrote...

I don't care about the percentages because I don't have healing spells that heal, say, 33% of max health, and enemies don't have damage spells that deal a % of damage or change in effectiveness based on percent.

Well, you have one instant heal spell, one heal over time and another that heals the party. Each of them being largely situational and selection isn't really dependant on knowing if character has 33% of max health left, or 100 hp left.

[In Exile]

soteria wrote...
I didn't think we were talking about what was necessary.  I, at least, am talking about what is expedient.  The percentage isn't very useful information to me unless I know how their max HP, and that's not information I bother to memorize as the value changes frequently.

It just seems like if they removed the bars and gave us numerical displays, this would be much better. We would have more space and have better information. The bars might work for the console given the display difference for a TV, but on the PC you can just eyeball the numbers directly.

[In Exile]

People talk about mods like they are magic. Are there really UI mods available?

[soteria]

tmp7704 wrote...

Well, you have one instant heal spell, one heal over time and another that heals the party. Each of them being largely situational and selection isn't really dependant on knowing if character has 33% of max health left, or 100 hp left.

I'd prefer to know the hp amount. I might see that Morrigan is at 50% health and think, "Didn't I give her the blood-gorged amulet? She's probably fine for a few more seconds." If my memory were bad, that would be a problem, since I can't use a combat log to see that 4 archers were pelting her. Part of that ambiguity is gone in the new UI. It's not about healing; it's about responding to the situation with accurate information.

In Exile wrote...

It just seems like if they removed the bars and gave us numerical displays, this would be much better. We would have more space and have better information. The bars might work for the console given the display difference for a TV, but on the PC you can just eyeball the numbers directly.

But they wouldn't be quite as pretty. I may be a style-blind fiend that likes the new UI AND the old UI, but I do care about pretty.

[soteria]

People talk about mods like they are magic. Are there really UI mods available?

I thought the UI was the part of the game that *couldn't* be modded in DA:O.

[In Exile]

scyphozoa wrote...
Um, mods aren't magic, but even games that aren't released with toolkits, ie, Mass Effect, have some modability. so while I can't speak to how moddable DA2 will be, I do think it is within reason to think a UI mod will be possible and given the reaction to the footage of the UI, if DA2 does launch with what we've seen (plz god no) then I expect those mods will exist pretty shortly after launch. Again, my real concern is for my couch+tv gaming experience.

Well, no, I know they aren't actually magic, but every time I follow a PC release, all I hear is ''feature x sucks but I'll just mod it so it's cool.'' It just makes me feel like there is this entire underground game design community that rebuilds a game from stratch I'm missing out on.

[Sylvius the Mad]

soteria wrote...

People talk about mods like they are magic. Are there really UI mods available?

I thought the UI was the part of the game that *couldn't* be modded in DA:O.

The only UI mods I know about for DAO don't actually change how anything looks - just how it works.

Like the extra hotbar mods.

[Ladybright]

In Exile wrote...

It just makes me feel like there is this entire underground game design community that rebuilds a game from stratch I'm missing out on.

Well, depending on the game, sort of. Some games with huge modding fanbases (i.e. TES:IV) would certainly fit that description. NWN probably would, too.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Ms. Lovey Dovey wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...
In the DA:O screen shot, which character has the most amount of HP? During combat, if one character has 60% of their HP and another has 45%, who has the larger number of hit points?

You can talk about how pretty the circles are but they lack when it comes to a basic function.

Wasn't too hard to deal with. Still not worth the cheap UI in my opinon.

Sure, you could pause the game and mouse over the character to get a pop up in the lower corner that gave you that information in numeric form. If you moused over all the companions, you'd then know much they each had.

However, in a game that's 80% combat, I think the UI ought to tell me at a glance who has the most amount of health to the least. I agree the circles look better but the health bars are more informative.

For the love of all that's holy, please stop encouraging them to dumb the game down and strip any sort of complexity from it. Please.

[Maria Caliban]

I saw that Sarah had posted and thought. "I wonder if she's responding to me? I mean, it's a 12 page thread and I only posted three times. I am sure she dislikes the change but there are tons of... Oh look. She quoted me!"

This might sound strange but as Sarah continues to accuse me of ruining vast portions of the game, I find myself liking her more and looking forward to her posts.

[Dave of Canada]

Here's a ****ty and rushed photoshop of how I'd handle the health / stamina / mana bars.



Same thing beside the in-game version:



I'm personally not a fan of healthbars big enough to obscure enemies and allies.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 18 décembre 2010 - 07:12 .

[DragonRageGT]

Actually, the best way to check anyone's life in Origins is just hitting the "Highlight Usable Objects" key. It shows the name of all characters in sight and an elegant thin green bar over the head. (red for enemies) I'm sure every PC player is familiar with that. My question is, does the console ports have such key?

My video comparison was captured and compressed at 1680x1050. (EDIT: correction, my DA:O vid used in that was captured at 1366x768 WS, before I had the 1680x1050 monitor). It's best view at 1080p and full screen. And if the song is not good, there is a mute button on every YouTube video. Still Pictures really can't show it. (In the comparison video, the first Origins scene has absolutely no UI whatsoever. Thanks to the "Hide Interface" key. I hope DA2 has it too but.. did Origins for the console have it?)

At least in my monitor, there is nothing wrong with DA2 UI as far as blocking the view is concerned. It is just an ugly as hell theme for a game like Dragon Age, given the very artistic and cared for one they gave us in Origins. Smells production cost reduction to me.

If the same philosophy is applied to the soundtrack, instead of a beautiful orchestra, we'll have a guy with sinthesizers faking it. Might even be inspired and beautiful but it will sound fake, cheap and done in a rush.

@The Exile: I just reproduced the comment although it's been said by Mike, "that's the way of the market" and we all know that teenagers are the market. Despite the M18+ rating, teenagers have no problem getting Origins and other rated M games like Witcher or Risen.

P.S.: TES4-Oblivion is a much better game with teh BT Mod Customization Package!

Modifié par RageGT, 18 décembre 2010 - 07:40 .

[Ju13es]

the new UI is functional but looks like crap to me. If it was zazzed up quite a lot it would be better to me. I do like the translucent minimap though. All in all though, the UI isnt a big deal for me, but it would be nice for there to be a consistant design throughout the game that would carry on to the UI. Having a lot of strongly designed parts of a game and than a weak one is just a shame.

[Piecake]

scyphozoa wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Here's a ****ty and rushed photoshop of how I'd handle the health / stamina / mana bars.

WANT.

What about having those arranged horizontally instead of vertically?  I think that might be a bit better, though I'd have to actually see it before making that determination

[tmp7704]

soteria wrote...

I'd prefer to know the hp amount. I might see that Morrigan is at 50% health and think, "Didn't I give her the blood-gorged amulet? She's probably fine for a few more seconds." If my memory were bad, that would be a problem, since I can't use a combat log to see that 4 archers were pelting her. Part of that ambiguity is gone in the new UI. It's not about healing; it's about responding to the situation with accurate information.

Hmm i normally eyeball the rate at which the hp bar changes, that gives me a decent idea how long someone is going to last. I don't think i'd be able to estimate it beyond that, since it's not exactly known what amount of damage is going to come the character's way -- someone can crit, an ability can be used, evade may work or not, etc. As such, knowing whether character has exactly 40 or maybe 60 hp left feels rather meaningless.

In addition, the DA2 UI doesn't actually show these exact hp amounts, just a scaled estimate that still requires you to know how much hp the character had in the first place. Or how big chunk of the bar equals say, 50 hp (which keeps changing as it keeps scaling based on the hp of the fattest character in the party)

If the transparency is important they could have just borrowed a page from MMOs here, and paste the actual numbers right next to character's portrait..

[Dave of Canada]

Piecake wrote...

What about having those arranged horizontally instead of vertically?  I think that might be a bit better, though I'd have to actually see it before making that determination

I personally think it looks worse.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 18 décembre 2010 - 08:18 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

For the love of all that's holy, please stop encouraging them to dumb the game down and strip any sort of complexity from it. Please.

Your position is absurd, Sarah.  The relative size of characters' health bars doesn't hide any information from you that was visible in DAO.  There's no aspect of them that is obfuscatory.

Simply wanting the game to have barriers to entry for the sake of excluding others is the worst kind of elitism (I maintain there are good kinds of elitism, but this is not one of them - and I'll concede that if excluding others lead to some other benefit then you'd have a much stronger case, but if there is such a benefit you need to point it out).

I dislike the new bars (I think they're too big - they should cover less of the screen), and I still think UI elements belong in a frame, but your specific complaint adds nothing to the debate and serves only to make you look petty.

[Sylvius the Mad]

tmp7704 wrote...

Hmm i normally eyeball the rate at which
the hp bar changes, that gives me a decent idea how long someone is
going to last.

And if the game is paused when you notice the HP bar, what then?

I think soteria just made a very strong argument for a combat log.

[ankuu]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Here's a ****ty and rushed photoshop of how I'd handle the health / stamina / mana bars.



Same thing beside the in-game version:



I'm personally not a fan of healthbars big enough to obscure enemies and allies.

That's exactly what i had in mind some pages ago! But i was too darn lazy to do this xD Wouldn't it look even better if they were side by side? I mean:

PORTRAIT - HEALTH - MANA

Instead of:

HEALTH - PORTRAIT - MANA

Otherwise you might get distracted by the pictures.

Modifié par ankuu, 18 décembre 2010 - 09:49 .

[DragonRageGT]

ankuu wrote...
That's exactly what i had in mind some pages ago! But i was too darn lazy to do this xD Wouldn't it look even better if they were side by side? I mean:

PORTRAIT - HEALTH - MANA

Instead of:

HEALTH - PORTRAIT - MANA

Otherwise you might get distracted by the pictures.

Well, it is the same in DA:O but indeed it is H-P-M/S. Only, it looks a lot better! I never read anyone complaining about getting distracted by the pictures though.

Will someone please answer me if the console Origins has Hide Interface and Highlight Usable Objects keys, buttons, whatever? The reason I asked is that, since DA2 is a console game ported to the PC, I wouldn't expect features in the PC controls that are non existent in the console original. Like the Mouse Scroll and Double Click in ME2, among other stuff there that are some huge waste of PC's capabilities.

Modifié par RageGT, 18 décembre 2010 - 10:46 .