549 réponses à ce sujet

[StingingVelvet]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

And some, like me, don't really mind the style but just don't like how big and intrusive it seems - especially the status bars next to the portraits.

Agreed.

Well, I am not a huge fan of the look either, but it doesn't really bother me.  The size of the bars though... terrible.  Just terrible.

[DragonRageGT]

Still pictures cannot really give the feeling a video comparsion can. Link on page 3 or at the sig bellow.

Seriously now, DA:O has a level of finesse in everything about it. From Client Menu to the item/skill/talent description box. It has beautiful fonts and lots of small details that give a sense of caring and a proper fantasy art style. It sets atmosphere in the right mood.

Check the Character Icon style and how they present the character's actions in both games, assuming that DA2's UI is final. In DA:O it is a lot less flashy, has a translucent background, if the action is a skill/talent it will show the proper icon in a way that fits the game. DA:O has class, style, the name of the char is right there at the quickbar in a classy way. You don't need a huge coloured ugly font to display it. Ugly for a game like Dragon Age, because of the standard set in the first game. Enemies health bars are thin and yet very noticeable and even there one can notice the round and classy design that is present in everything on the game. DA2 has them big, angled, and ugly like everything else in the UI.

And the bars... urgh... the bars... are they really needed in that way? They worked very well integrated with the char icon in Origins. I've never read any complains about them whatsoever. I know my character and the companions from the character screen. I know who has more HP, who can do what and how. And in combat DA:O half circle bars worked very well too.

Of course there are people that like plain, angled, fonts, boxes, etc., in big flashy colours with huge icons around it. I'm sure that it would fit well in Kotor3. I feel that the gameplay is also somewhat Kotorized. You can use the pause button but you don't really have or need to. I'm playing them for the first time these past couple of weeks and all I really need to do to attack is press 1 and tab to switch characters and 1 again.

But the top mouse accessible translucent menu in DA:O is exactly like Kotor's, with the DA art style. The quickbar has no need to be transparent because really, nothing happens in that area of the screen. If and when it does, I'm sure everyone will pan the camera a bit and center the action to where it fits best.

Perhaps a game UI cannot affect how immersive it is but they definitely contribute in creating an atmosphere. Origins has an art style that suits the type of game it is very well. The one I see in the OP video has an art style that is cold, unpersonal, has no passion about it and probably works very well in a game like Kotor, i.e. sci-fi, tech, futuristic or in a distant past in a galaxy far far away.

[Itkovian]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...

TeenZombie wrote...

The lack of an unlock icon, the lack of visible slots beyond the abilities we currently have, and the addition of potion slots (which to me, indicates that we can't place items or abilities wherever we want on the action bar), are what worry me.  But like I said, I'd be happy to be proven wrong about this point.

You can move icons around. Why else would there be that large stretch of bar past the icons?

Guys, when I say "It works pretty much like Origins," I say it so that you can guess that if you could do it in Origins, you can do it in DA II.

Thank you, glad to have this laid to rest. There's no reason to take out a useful and convenient feature, after all.

Itkovian

[tmp7704]

crimzontearz wrote...

it's obvious WHY they used linear bars and not the all-identical wrap around bars for health and mana/stamina

linear bars will show you which one of your characters has more complexive hit points...same for mana/stamina. Damage will reflect directly on it so a 20-points damage blow will cut off the same amount of health from ALL your party memebers. I can see the reasoning behind it, it is more direct.

However if the million MMOs out there and their UIs -- and that includes UIs made by players themselves -- are anything to go by, this sort of information seems purely superfluous.

Plus, it's not like there's really need for longer bar to tell that a warrior may have more hp than a mage. Maybe if it was 50-people large raid, but when you have 4 characters in the party...

[biomag]

...the biggest question that arose from this video (at least for me): Is BioWare now forced to bring videos about all the stuff people here on boards are panicking about? I thought it was funny to listen to interviews and notice how their script changed from "We changed that to be so much more fun and entertaining" to "yes we made the game really amazing, but really its all like in the old" or "there is this amazing new feat!!" to "you won't notice the new feature if you don't really want to".



I guess the next video will be about companion outfits? Or would it be revealing too much of what is still to come and so being a too big spoiler?



Anyhow, I really feel pity for the devs. They have so many ideas, they are working so hard on improvement and we here just keep ripping them apart. No matter what they show, no matter how much they comfort us, we just keep yelling at them as if they are totally nuts...

[slimgrin]

biomag wrote...

...the biggest question that arose from this video (at least for me): Is BioWare now forced to bring videos about all the stuff people here on boards are panicking about? I thought it was funny to listen to interviews and notice how their script changed from "We changed that to be so much more fun and entertaining" to "yes we made the game really amazing, but really its all like in the old" or "there is this amazing new feat!!" to "you won't notice the new feature if you don't really want to".

I guess the next video will be about companion outfits? Or would it be revealing too much of what is still to come and so being a too big spoiler?

Anyhow, I really feel pity for the devs. They have so many ideas, they are working so hard on improvement and we here just keep ripping them apart. No matter what they show, no matter how much they comfort us, we just keep yelling at them as if they are totally nuts...

This brought a tear to my eye.

[Qset]

crimzontearz wrote...

Qset wrote...


I hate the new interface GUI, the player icons, the toolbar and icons, spell AOE markers, enemy info bars etc - it all looks very cartoonish and "cheap" - the DAO style was much more imersive and "dark fantasy style", with the scrolling style etc.

The interface looks to be lifted from "my first Video Game" - at least this is the PC version so maybe someone will do a GUI mod if there is a toolset of course and its not buried in the engine

-coughs-.......no UI altogether would be more immersive actually....Dead space was one of the most immersive games I've ever played because it had NO UI whatsoever

UI in and of itself is always not immersive because it is a constant reminder you are playing a game. That said, whether it is created in a way that pleases you and suits your tastes (or not) has nothing to do with how good/bad/functional the UI is because your trastes are.....well.....as subjective as anything can be.

de gustibus non desputandum est

ok, maybe imersive wasn't the best choice of word - what I meant to say is there is a mismatch of styles between the GUI and the game for me personally. The DAO GUI matches the world for me, this one doesn't. 

If I was playing a SiFi type of game then yes I can see it fitting in.

My view of a great GI is not just that it is clean, functional and clear - for me it also has to work within the game setting. Thats my personal opinion of course, you can disagree with me but that doesn't change how I feel , that is just your opinion doesn't match mine

[crimzontearz]

tmp7704 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

it's obvious WHY they used linear bars and not the all-identical wrap around bars for health and mana/stamina

linear bars will show you which one of your characters has more complexive hit points...same for mana/stamina. Damage will reflect directly on it so a 20-points damage blow will cut off the same amount of health from ALL your party memebers. I can see the reasoning behind it, it is more direct.

However if the million MMOs out there and their UIs -- and that includes UIs made by players themselves -- are anything to go by, this sort of information seems purely superfluous.

Plus, it's not like there's really need for longer bar to tell that a warrior may have more hp than a mage. Maybe if it was 50-people large raid, but when you have 4 characters in the party...

this is not an MMO, your party is formed by 4 characters not 1

4 characters which may very well end up with totally different totals of HP. Looking at the wrap-arounds of DAO you really cannot tell which one of your characters is left with more health unoless you remember exactly how many HP they have to begin with. 1/2 wrap around for oghren might be some 200 XP....1/2 wrap around for morrigan may be 75 because they start with different totals BUT merely looking at their bars there is no difference. Morrigan may  be able to take only 2 more hits before being knocked out while Oghren will be able to sustain 3 times as much before being out but again visually you cannot tell that unless you recall XP totals (which some of us recall at all times but this is not the point). The linear bars give you a more detailed information

[Ramante]

filaminstrel wrote...

Small question, what are those images in the bottom right corner?
Looks like the, how do you call it, that thing that was in the top center in Origins...

Pretty smart to do that there, I like it. =3

[crimzontearz]

Brockololly wrote...

crimzontearz wrote..
-coughs-.......no UI altogether would be more immersive actually....Dead space was one of the most immersive games I've ever played because it had NO UI whatsoever

UI in and of itself is always not immersive because it is a constant reminder you are playing a game. That said, whether it is created in a way that pleases you and suits your tastes (or not) has nothing to do with how good/bad/functional the UI is because your trastes are.....well.....as subjective as anything can be.

Well, in Origins you can turn the UI off if you want.

As for Dead Space, yeah it works in a more futuristic game like that, integrating things into Isaac's suit. But not every game needs to be like that or else you end up with the over simplified mess of Fable, where they try to streamline away everything and instead make a much less intuitive experience.

I was not suggesting it for DA2

tho for ME3 it might just work......it would be cool I have to say...............GOD now I want more ME3 info

[AlanC9]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

RageGT wrote...

Ok, not 4x.. just double!

Good job this is an objective, noise free poll that accurately represents overall opinion. Otherwise making statements about how many people like or dislike would be pretty silly.

Even if we had that poll, we'd still need a standard for evaluating the results. Let's say we magically got the complete opinions of every single PC player -- eliminating console players for the moment because they have different screen constraints. A sizable majority of players probably don't care one way or the other. Of those who do have an opinion, let's say 30% are passionately against it like RageGT, and 70% are lukewarm supporters of it like me (Greatly simplified, of course, but I'm assuming we've got the usual oppositional bias on a topic).

Which system is best? We can't get Pareto efficiency because someone has to lose. I guess we could determine Kaldor-Hicks efficiency if we could really quantify the utility here. Note that this would work against me, since RageGT & Co. are acting all butthurt and I wouldn't really be bothered much even if they did reinstate the DAO interface.

Good thing we don't evaluate things that way, though, since it would provide big incentives for being dishonest on the boards.

(Did I really just use "butthurt" and "Kaldor-Hicks efficiency" in the same paragraph? Yikes)

Modifié par AlanC9, 17 décembre 2010 - 06:27 .

[AlanC9]

RageGT wrote...
 I feel that the gameplay is also somewhat Kotorized. You can use the pause button but you don't really have or need to. I

And this is different from DAO.... how?

[tmp7704]

crimzontearz wrote...

this is not an MMO, your party is formed by 4 characters not 1

And what i was getting at is, MMOs routinely group 5+ people together. And they use fixed length bars to indicate health/mana of people while in these groups. Without noticeable drawbacks. If there actually were drawbacks and the varied length bars were providing considerably extra functionality, you'd expect to see that functionality in the UI made by the players in WoW -- again, for the group content where the healers can have quite a bit less of wiggle room than DA allows. And yet, they don't do that.

[tmp7704]

Ramante wrote...

Small question, what are those images in the bottom right corner?

Available health and mana/stamina pots, by the looks of it. Smaller icons above it are active buff/debuffs and then on right edge it's icons for the inventory etc.

Modifié par tmp7704, 17 décembre 2010 - 06:45 .

[Brockololly]

tmp7704 wrote...
 Smaller icons above it are active buff/debuffs and then on right edge it's icons for the inventory etc.

The active buff/debuffs sitting there all alone is really bizarre looking- in Origins, they were all nicely nestled on the left with the XP meter, but now its like they're just sort of hanging out on their own? Reminds me of ME2's floating head icons plopped in the middle of the screen.

[Qset]

ok, I had another long look at the new GUI after downloading the video and there are things I do like, some for the transparent features are good, its certainly cleaner and and more "functional" than the DAO version.

However, I am still left with the feeling it doesn't feel quite right within the DA2 game setting. Maybe I am in the minority here by I see part of the role of a GUI to act as a frame for the game in much the same way as a picture frame on a painting or photograph. A GUI is more than just a user interface for me.

I don't feel that this GUI frame fits in with the DA2 setting in the same way as the wrong choice of frame can detract from a picture and the right choice can enhance it. 

Now, I will still buy the game because many of the other features that I enjoy in these types of games are there and will be done well I am sure. I am also sure that over time I will get used to the new GUI. Right now though it grates.

Modifié par Qset, 17 décembre 2010 - 06:56 .

[crimzontearz]

tmp7704 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

this is not an MMO, your party is formed by 4 characters not 1

And what i was getting at is, MMOs routinely group 5+ people together. And they use fixed length bars to indicate health/mana of people while in these groups. Without noticeable drawbacks. If there actually were drawbacks and the varied length bars were providing considerably extra functionality, you'd expect to see that functionality in the UI made by the players in WoW -- again, for the group content where the healers can have quite a bit less of wiggle room than DA allows. And yet, they don't do that.

yes but in THOSE games you do not control all 5 character, only one...which is the basic difference and why straight bars give you a more detailed and straightforward information. That particular truth you cannot deny

[SpockLives]

The new UI is absolutely hideous. I mean, I might like it if we were talking about TOR, not DA2. DA:O's UI was artistic and looked like it belonged in a fantasy game. This new travesty looks like it belongs on the bridge of the Starship Enterprise. (Note from my name that I am a fan of Star Trek; just don't put it in my fantasy games.)

[1varangian]

filaminstrel wrote...

Hm, for comparison's sake, this seems to be the same resolution screenshot in Origins:



vs.

Yeah.. wow.

Origins looks cool and polished while the DA2 GUI just screams placeholder.

Not a fan of the bars that obscure the lower left of the screen.

Considering the overall new artistic style of DA2, I was expecting edgy metal frames. The current DA2 GUI doesn't even have a style, save for the talent icons.

[AlanC9]

Anyone else notice that folks who feel the same way about whether a fantasy game UI should be "fantasy-styled" also seem to agree with each other on other gameplay and design issues?



I get the feeling there's some sort of common variable here.

[crimzontearz]

AlanC9 wrote...

Anyone else notice that folks who feel the same way about whether a fantasy game UI should be "fantasy-styled" also seem to agree with each other on other gameplay and design issues?

I get the feeling there's some sort of common variable here.

you are sitting atop a slippery slide my friend

[Brockololly]

I knew I had read how the UI and menus and such were supposed to be all tapestry like but hadn't found the quote. Here it is though from Game Informer and Matt Goldman:

One main thing that the framed narrative story device has let us do was modify the UI stylistically in constructing a more coherent and consistent look. In Origins you had quite a few things – the leather  book, the tribal thingies, the blood and parchment and so on and so  forth. There were five or six different elements.  For DA2 we use the  tapestry elements in a lot of different ways – in the world map, load  screens – and the actual presentation of the UI then becomes kind of  like an illustrated manuscript that ties into the main story device.

I don't know, but I'm not seeing much of any distinct tapestry style in the UI beyond the reworked icons. Same goes for the now ME style character screens and inventory screens. Maybe it'll look more interesting as we see more, but I vastly preferred the journal/parchment look of Origins to DA2's Windows 7 look.

Modifié par Brockololly, 17 décembre 2010 - 08:55 .

[Amyntas]

I agree that the health and mana/energy bars take up too much space on the screen. I would suggest aligning them vertically to the portraits, similar to the DA:O interface. And is there a specific reason why the portaits are now at the bottom of the screen? I would prefer them in the top left corner, like in most other games. The minimalistic style is probably a question of taste, but I found the "wooden" style of the original interface to be much more fitting.

[StingingVelvet]

Amyntas wrote...

I agree that the health and mana/energy bars take up too much space on the screen. I would suggest aligning them vertically to the portraits, similar to the DA:O interface. And is there a specific reason why the portaits are now at the bottom of the screen? I would prefer them in the top left corner, like in most other games. The minimalistic style is probably a question of taste, but I found the "wooden" style of the original interface to be much more fitting.

Good post.  I think making the bars smaller and under the portraits would make the UI about 1,030,204,293 times better.

[ejoslin]

I'm curious about the potions -- on my hotbar I had several different strengths of potions; this looks like you lose that element of choice. Are there no longer varying strengths of potions or is there a default chosen when you click the icon?

I have to agree I prefer the character/health icons to be on the top left screen rather than the bottom -- the way they're set up in at least these screenshots takes up way too much room and will potentially block action.  DAO had handled that in a really good way -- at least for pc users.  making those health bars smaller would be a big improvement.

Modifié par ejoslin, 17 décembre 2010 - 09:50 .