37007 réponses à ce sujet

[Giggles_Manically]

People can we just ignore Mr Troll over here please?
He cant do anything if we stop responding to him.

[Addai]

Skyrim's combat mechanics are very simple, that's obvious, but the game is really built for roleplayers and not powergamers or mechanics nerds. "There's no point in taking restoration if you have potions"- well I have certain characters who use restoration because they are *mages*, not because the mechanic exists in the game for me to exploit.

Enemies do evade attacks, they have special attacks themselves, so there's no use comparing Skyrim to Dishonored and saying "look, this game does it differently." So what? Every game has a set of rules it uses and certain conventions it adopts, and those are always going to be artificial and arbitrary to an extent. There are people who complain that Dishonored doesn't have AI just like Thief or Deus Ex. If it did have the exact same AI as one of those games, then people would complain that it wasn't just like Bioshock.

As for attributes being streamlined, I can see why people think it takes away from their ability to define their character. It doesn't bother me because as I said, I define my character in my head, and Skyrim's skill and perk system is responsive enough that I feel I can express different character styles pretty well. No, not pretty well- *very* well. So it works for me.

[Splinter Cell 108]

Just a question here. Has anyone heard of anything that involves the words "Dragonborn DLC" and "PC release"? It'd be interesting to know if anything has been said about that.

[billy the squid]

Lazengan wrote...

It never had anything to do with being complicated

and if you call mechanics like attributes and other old school RPG characterization "complex" then this genre has really gone downhill. To begin with, nothing in a video game is complex for the sake of insulting people who don't understand details and specifics. Complexity and choice has always been a trademark in video games where you are allowed ultimate freedom such as fallout and the elder scrolls. Dumbing customization and attributes down to "health, mana, stamina" is really restrictive. 

Melee combat in skyrim. is hitting the left mouse button until things die, and using potions with no cooldowns. I mean look at what dishonored did, the combat is simple but enemies block,dodge, and react to different parts of the body hit. That adds a level of mechanical depth that is far more entertaining than Skyrim's linearity 
Magic is selecting the highest DPS spell and using it until a target dies. There is no point in using healing as you can easily pop a potion, and no point in any alteration spells because the frustration and mana cost of using those buggy things can easily be overried by throwing a simple fireball. 
I have to download mods to make combat remotely interesting- but they do an excellent job. 

And not exactly calling mods a bad thing, it's just that if players need to do the developpers job for them, that reflects off poor performance from the developpers. 

The game itself is boring and repetitive after 3 hours. People like it because its a fun "do what you want" simulator with waifu and dress mods released every week (which I personally download and enjoy myself hehe), but it's not a video game. 

That isn't complex for any measurable benefit. It's complexity for the sake of complexity, it's fluff, it's pointless and serves little purpose other than to strictly deliniate characters into a set class via attribute selection. Everyone piled everything into certain charcteristics for Warriors, other characteristics for Rogues and another set for Mages. It served very little purpose as it was functionally the same as putting points into health, stamina and magika.

It's an added layer of fluff, there may have been a minor benefit here and there when I was selecting a minor trait or major trait such as in Oblivion, but if you changed your mind at any point or selected the wrong one, congratulations you just fouled up your build and 20 odd hours of game play.

If I want to go with a Warrior wearing light armour and close combat I can, I can change to archery, I can change from bladed to blunt weapons for a couple of perk points what if I want to play as a battle mage style but I was a warrior up until half way through? I still can! The point is I do not completely mess up my character for changing a style mid game. But it's more restrictive than the old style where I was locked into strict builds by attribute dumps? I think you better take off those rose tinted glasses.

Melee combat, hit the left button until it dies... so like everyother RPG that's existed to some degree or another then. I'm glad you agreed with me on that. 

Enemies do block and they do move out the way to place themselves out of your line of sight in Skyrim. Are we playing the same game here? And Dishonoured is a different game which has a different emphasis. You're creating a false equivelancy. Skyrim's enemies don't behave the same way as Dishonoured therefore it lacks any kind of mechanical depth. In addition complaints of boredom lack weight when you've already conceeded that you don't bother to use more than one spell. You just torpedoed your entire argument. Thanks for saving me the trouble.

It's boring and repetative, but people like it because it's a fun "do what you want" simulator? I'm seeing a contradiction in terms here. So which is it boring and repetative or fun and flexible world. Best get off the fence, as you're losing credibility. without me doing much to help you along with that.

As to mods, well Yrkoon already illustrated that point better than I could have done so I'll just refer you to his post.

Edit: Never downloaded any dress mods, which makes me wonder just how many times you have played the game. And makes me think you need to get out more.

Modifié par billy the squid, 20 novembre 2012 - 10:24 .

[goofyomnivore]

Damn. Dawnguard has been pretty impressive so far. I know I'm a few months late, but it has been well worth the price. Looking forward to making another character to try out the vampire stuff/quest line.

As for the Skyrim quality discussion. I think it is an excellent RPG, but I personally find its combat very simple and boring after a while. But I think it is great for roleplaying and exploring, which is why I bought it in the first place.

Modifié par strive, 20 novembre 2012 - 10:15 .

[naughty99]

Lazengan wrote...

People like it because its a fun "do what you want" simulator 

Exactly, people like it because it has a great framework for role playing, which is an important feature of any role playing game.

[Splinter Cell 108]

Addai67 wrote...

Skyrim's combat mechanics are very simple, that's obvious, but the game is really built for roleplayers and not powergamers or mechanics nerds. "There's no point in taking restoration if you have potions"- well I have certain characters who use restoration because they are *mages*, not because the mechanic exists in the game for me to exploit.

Enemies do evade attacks, they have special attacks themselves, so there's no use comparing Skyrim to Dishonored and saying "look, this game does it differently." So what? Every game has a set of rules it uses and certain conventions it adopts, and those are always going to be artificial and arbitrary to an extent. There are people who complain that Dishonored doesn't have AI just like Thief or Deus Ex. If it did have the exact same AI as one of those games, then people would complain that it wasn't just like Bioshock.

As for attributes being streamlined, I can see why people think it takes away from their ability to define their character. It doesn't bother me because as I said, I define my character in my head, and Skyrim's skill and perk system is responsive enough that I feel I can express different character styles pretty well. No, not pretty well- *very* well. So it works for me.

 

Even if combat isn't all that great to some people, there are mods to make it harder. I'm fine with it to be frank but I did get a few mods to make enemies much more dangerous, especially stormcloaks and imperials who suck against every other humanoid enemy out there. Now they can fight Forsworn and Thalmor without getting owned. 

[billy the squid]

Splinter Cell 108 wrote...

Just a question here. Has anyone heard of anything that involves the words "Dragonborn DLC" and "PC release"? It'd be interesting to know if anything has been said about that.

It's the exclusivity deal Bethesda has with Microsoft regarding DLC. You'll have to wait 30 days until it's released on PC if there are no technical hiccups. Xbox it's out on the 4th of December. So it everything  goes smoothly you should have it on PC a couple of days after the new year.

[Splinter Cell 108]

billy the squid wrote...

Splinter Cell 108 wrote...

Just a question here. Has anyone heard of anything that involves the words "Dragonborn DLC" and "PC release"? It'd be interesting to know if anything has been said about that.

It's the exclusivity deal Bethesda has with Microsoft regarding DLC. You'll have to wait 30 days until it's released on PC if there are no technical hiccups. Xbox it's out on the 4th of December. So it everything  goes smoothly you should have it on PC a couple of days after the new year.

Thought as much, well at least other games can fill that time I'll have to wait. They shouldn't have any issue releasing anything on PC though, I hope. 

[Shadow Fox]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

People can we just ignore Mr Troll over here please?
He cant do anything if we stop responding to him.

But it's so fun to see wannabe trolls pwned by the entire thread still try to troll.

[Addai]

strive wrote...

Damn. Dawnguard has been pretty impressive so far. I know I'm a few months late, but it has been well worth the price. Looking forward to making another character to try out the vampire stuff/quest line.

As for the Skyrim quality discussion. I think it is an excellent RPG, but I personally find its combat very simple and boring after a while. But I think it is great for roleplaying and exploring, which is why I bought it in the first place.

Well said.

Dawnguard has a lot to it, more than meets the eye.  Lots of side quests and new locations.  I wouldn't say it has the wow factor of Shivering Isles, but it was pretty fun even if I find vampires boring.

No word on Dragonborn for PC and PS3.  Still waiting...

[Lazengan]

greengoron89 wrote...

Lazengan wrote...

I said nothing about people who like skyrim are "ignorant" . I like skyrim as a waifu simulator and dress up engine, but I don't like it as a game. 

and "if you don't like X, don't play it" isn't an arguement. It's scrub logic, and something to say when you can't argue the point. Imagine if every business had that attitude to their customers for anything concerning their product. "hurr don't like our food? go to walmart"

You like Skyrim... as a "waifu simulator" and "dress up engine"? What the hell are you, some weird basement-dwelling otaku? Go outside and get some fresh air, kid.

haha no

but the majority of the nexus mods are like that. So might as well

I really only play skyrim once every week when someone has released a new quest mod. I play that, play skyrim for a few hours, then get bored

[Lazengan]

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

People can we just ignore Mr Troll over here please?
He cant do anything if we stop responding to him.

But it's so fun to see wannabe trolls pwned by the entire thread still try to troll.

Yea...

apparently I'm trolling because I don't like skyrim.

well you people have been posting in this thread for a year now, I guess if I say anything negative about it, I will get mauled apart, like the old Tali threads

[naughty99]

You don't like Skyrim, but you are still playing it for a few hours every week, more than a year after release?

Modifié par naughty99, 20 novembre 2012 - 10:27 .

[happy_daiz]

This thread could use some of this...

[Yrkoon]

Lazengan wrote...
It never had anything to do with being complicated

and if you call mechanics like attributes and other old school RPG characterization "complex" then this genre has really gone downhill. To begin with, nothing in a video game is complex for the sake of insulting people who don't understand details and specifics. Complexity and choice has always been a trademark in video games where you are allowed ultimate freedom such as fallout and the elder scrolls. Dumbing customization and attributes down to "health, mana, stamina" is really restrictive. 

Customization in Skyrim is hardly  limited to just Health, Mana and Stamina.   First, each of the 10  playable races begins the game with  different point allotments in the 17 advanceable skills.  Second,   these 17 skills each  contain  their own tree consisting of  between 10-15  perks per tree, and the trees themselves are not even totally linear. (you could, for example, choose to advance in one branch of a given skill tree and your character will have a totally different set of  combat abilities than another character who decided to advance in a different branch of that same tree) So in terms of character customization, the combinations are  virtually unlimited, given all of the above.  

The game itself is boring and repetitive after 3 hours.

LOL you're stating an opinion as fact.  The record-breaking steam numbers beg to differ.

 People like it because its a fun "do what you want" simulator with waifu and dress mods released every week (which I personally download and enjoy myself hehe), but it's not a video game. 

  Ok, I admit, it's been a long time since I've looked at a menu at a  Chinese restaurant, so indulge me here.  What is this "waifu" term you keep mentioning?

Modifié par Yrkoon, 20 novembre 2012 - 10:39 .

[happy_daiz]

^ Le sigh. I already looked it up, because I had no idea, either. 

Modifié par happy_daiz, 20 novembre 2012 - 10:38 .

[Splinter Cell 108]

Lazengan wrote...

greengoron89 wrote...

Lazengan wrote...

I said nothing about people who like skyrim are "ignorant" . I like skyrim as a waifu simulator and dress up engine, but I don't like it as a game. 

and "if you don't like X, don't play it" isn't an arguement. It's scrub logic, and something to say when you can't argue the point. Imagine if every business had that attitude to their customers for anything concerning their product. "hurr don't like our food? go to walmart"

You like Skyrim... as a "waifu simulator" and "dress up engine"? What the hell are you, some weird basement-dwelling otaku? Go outside and get some fresh air, kid.

haha no

but the majority of the nexus mods are like that. So might as well

I really only play skyrim once every week when someone has released a new quest mod. I play that, play skyrim for a few hours, then get bored

If you're going to Nexus to download mods you should expect that type of garbage, that is the reality of that place, unfortunately. There are a lot of good mods that add things to the game but they are all buried underneath all the crap that can be found in that place.  I know there are because I have a long list of mods to prove it and none of them are none of that stupid skimpy/nude crap. 

[Shadow Fox]

Lazengan wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

People can we just ignore Mr Troll over here please?
He cant do anything if we stop responding to him.

But it's so fun to see wannabe trolls pwned by the entire thread still try to troll.

Yea...

apparently I'm trolling because I don't like skyrim.

well you people have been posting in this thread for a year now, I guess if I say anything negative about it, I will get mauled apart, like the old Tali threads

Oh please you know that's bull**** You didn't just say "I don't like Skyrim" you also insulted the people that do by insinuating they don't like "true rpgs" and are somehow less intelligent then you,saying that Skyrim isn't a "true rpg" because appearently if something lacks a D&D stat sheet and restictive classes it aint a "true RPG" and calling people who didn't agree with you scrubs.*which my friend is a sure sign that one is an elitest idiot*

So want some Perspiration H to help soothe that butthurt?

Modifié par Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke, 20 novembre 2012 - 10:49 .

[Fast Jimmy]

happy_daiz wrote...

This thread could use some of this...

Thank you. I needed that.

[Lazengan]

greengoron89 wrote...

People might be a little more receptive of your criticisms if you didn't act like a pompous ass while expressing them.

Also, talking about how terrible the game is then mentioning how you play it every week doesn't do your credibility any favors.

Just sayin'.

It's a terrible game

but it's a good "do what you want" simulator, and I enjoy that for what it is

please note the definition of a "game" in my opinion is very superflous 

[Lazengan]

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Lazengan wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

People can we just ignore Mr Troll over here please?
He cant do anything if we stop responding to him.

But it's so fun to see wannabe trolls pwned by the entire thread still try to troll.

Yea...

apparently I'm trolling because I don't like skyrim.

well you people have been posting in this thread for a year now, I guess if I say anything negative about it, I will get mauled apart, like the old Tali threads

Oh please you know that's bull**** You didn't just say "I don't like Skyrim" you also insulted the people that do by insinuating they don't like "true rpgs" and are somehow less intelligent then you,saying that Skyrim isn't a "true rpg" because appearently if something lacks a D&D stat sheet and restictive classes it aint a "true RPG" and calling people who didn't agree with you scrubs.*which my friend is a sure sign that one is an elitest idiot*

So want some Perspiration H to help soothe that buthurt?

you seem very frustrated  

[Shadow Fox]

Lazengan wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Lazengan wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

People can we just ignore Mr Troll over here please?
He cant do anything if we stop responding to him.

But it's so fun to see wannabe trolls pwned by the entire thread still try to troll.

Yea...

apparently I'm trolling because I don't like skyrim.

well you people have been posting in this thread for a year now, I guess if I say anything negative about it, I will get mauled apart, like the old Tali threads

Oh please you know that's bull**** You didn't just say "I don't like Skyrim" you also insulted the people that do by insinuating they don't like "true rpgs" and are somehow less intelligent then you,saying that Skyrim isn't a "true rpg" because appearently if something lacks a D&D stat sheet and restictive classes it aint a "true RPG" and calling people who didn't agree with you scrubs.*which my friend is a sure sign that one is an elitest idiot*

So want some Perspiration H to help soothe that buthurt?

you seem very frustrated  

Nope just amused.