37007 réponses à ce sujet

[Lazengan]

simfamSP wrote...

funny thing bethesda forums and skyrim nexus regard skyrim as complete trash and consider new vegas to be the superior game

strange how I find skyrim supporters on Bioware forums of all places

The BioWare community is much better than the TES one, that I can confirm with past experiences. Even when TALKING about their respective titles, the BSN beats the TES. Thing is, we've had a lot of press and media on us with DA2/ME3, so the spot-light usually hits us more than them.

That said, anybody know when the last official patch is out? I know they've stopped their DLC, but I'd like to know about their patches. I want to get into Skyrim again and mod the **** out of it.

they stopped supporting Skyrim

they are making fallout 4

[blaidfiste]

simfamSP wrote...

Lazengan wrote...

simfamSP wrote...

funny thing bethesda forums and skyrim nexus regard skyrim as complete trash and consider new vegas to be the superior game

strange how I find skyrim supporters on Bioware forums of all places

The BioWare community is much better than the TES one, that I can confirm with past experiences. Even when TALKING about their respective titles, the BSN beats the TES. Thing is, we've had a lot of press and media on us with DA2/ME3, so the spot-light usually hits us more than them.

That said, anybody know when the last official patch is out? I know they've stopped their DLC, but I'd like to know about their patches. I want to get into Skyrim again and mod the **** out of it.

they stopped supporting Skyrim

they are making fallout 4

So, no more ninja patches...

I can mod it?

thank you.

Celebrate Gangnam Style 

[Addai]

Lazengan wrote...

funny thing bethesda forums and skyrim nexus regard skyrim as complete trash and consider new vegas to be the superior game

strange how I find skyrim supporters on Bioware forums of all places

You're talking about a small minority.  Albeit a dedicated one, especially the FNV evangelists.

[Splinter Cell 108]

Lazengan wrote...


funny thing bethesda forums and skyrim nexus regard skyrim as complete trash and consider new vegas to be the superior game

strange how I find skyrim supporters on Bioware forums of all places

Irrelevant, the place to complain about Skyrim is still the Bethesda forums since they are the ones who made it but keep dodging my questions, it only keeps proving that you don't give a damn. Honestly, where do you think the majority of the complaints about Skyrim are going to be found?

Bethesda made the game, its logical that there would be more people complaining over there and don't get me started on Nexus which has a whole site dedicated to modding for Skyrim. Once again it proves that you are not here for constructive criticism, you're here because you want the attention and as a result your opinion means nothing to anyone around here, especially when you force it on everyone.  Why stick around here? What purpose does it serve to go around the same thing for years if it will convince no one? I doubt I'll get an answer, you'll either dodge everything or deflect the argument. 

Oh yeah and just so you don't go assuming anything, I like FNV better than FO3 and won't get Fallout 4 unless it's an Obsidian title. 

Modifié par Splinter Cell 108, 07 mai 2013 - 11:51 .

[Yrkoon]

Couple things here.

Lazengan wrote...
Skyrim combat is spamming the left click button with zero choices

Actually, there's a massive element of choice  here that is absent in many other games:  The choice to not engage in combat in the first place.  Skyrim is unique in that  it does not lock the player in a "combat mode" once an encounter is triggered.  This leaves the player with the freedom to do all sorts of things, including *hiding*, retreating, disengaging,  luring enemies to civilization where guards and citizens can  do the fighting instead.  And, of course  summons.

Remember:  Skyrim is a sandbox first and foremost, it's important to understand the developers' need to not stray too far from the sandbox philosophy lest they remove that  wonderful freedom in favor of forcing a  combat simulator upon an unwilling player.
 

and spamming potions because there are no cooldowns.

Aaah, the  "C" word.  No offense, but anyone who advocates cooldowns for anything in my RPGs loses huge incriments of respect from me every time they do.  Nothing kills immersion faster than a mechanic that forces you to  watch   a  ticking clock.  Cooldowns have no business in a single player RPG.   A much better alternative is to have a round/turn based system where you can only drink one potion or do one action per round.  But for reasons not worth getting into on this thread, Bethesda has decided that Skyrim   will be a real-time game  without 'combat rounds'.  But that doesn't necessitate that they force coodowns on our actions.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 08 mai 2013 - 12:58 .

[Lazengan]

Yrkoon wrote...

Couple things here.

Lazengan wrote...
Skyrim combat is spamming the left click button with zero choices

Actually, there's a massive element of choice  here that is absent in many other games:  The choice to not engage in combat in the first place.  Skyrim is unique in that  it does not lock the player in a "combat mode" once an encounter is triggered.  This leaves the player with the freedom to do all sorts of things, including *hiding*, retreating, disengaging,  luring enemies to civilization where guards and citizens can  do the fighting instead.  And, of course  summons.

Remember:  Skyrim is a sandbox first and foremost, it's important to understand the developers' need to not stray too far from the sandbox philosophy lest they remove that  wonderful freedom in favor of forcing a  combat simulator upon an unwilling player.
 

and spamming potions because there are no cooldowns.

Aaah, the  "C" word.  No offense, but anyone who advocates cooldowns for anything in my RPGs loses huge incriments of respect from me every time they do.  Nothing kills immersion faster than a mechanic that forces you to  watch   a  ticking clock.  Cooldowns have no business in a single player RPG.   A much better alternative is to have a round/turn based system where you can only drink one potion or do one action per round.  But for reasons not worth getting into on this thread, Bethesda has decided that Skyrim   will be a real-time game  without 'combat rounds'.  But that doesn't necessitate that they force coodowns on our actions.

you can stop time, use as many potions as you want with 0 consequences. I'm not all big on immersion if this ruins game balance. Where is the immersion in eating 4 mammoth steaks, regaining health, in the middle of a mage duel?

and no, unfortunately combat cannot be avoided at all. You have to partake in combat to get any quest done. I do agree that Skyrim did try a more open ended approach to combat, but overall those areas were poorly developped. I see it as a possible modding experience though

Modifié par Lazengan, 08 mai 2013 - 01:45 .

[Joy Divison]

Lazengan wrote...

Joy Divison wrote...

Lazengan wrote...

My only hard on for dishonored is the combat.

So while you are allowed to hold nuanced opinions and reject any simplistic claim that we may throw out you, you have no problem labeling us as "Skyrim fanboys" who are "butthurt" rather than recognize the diverging views we hold about the game?

Nice...

what actual views do you have about the game?

I see no one actually talking about gameplay in this thread for entire months

The game has enough flaws that I could write an entire dissertation and still forget to mention half of them.  I've never played a RPG that had as uninspired and unimaginative magic system as Skyrim.  The fact the different weapon and armor material do not have distictive qualities and are so close mechanically renders the entire purpose of having different materials moot.  The linear two-handed scaling system is a joke because one-handed does proportionally far more damage at higher-levels.  Dragons are too easily neutered by the PC.  That Jaree-Ra and hundreds of other insignficant NPCs are deemed essential is moronic.  That I can go to some random blacksmith in a hick town and purchase cheap equipment superior to Daedric artifacts is lunacy.  The Civil War quest is overly repetitous.  That you can drink 30 potions in an instant is ridiculous.  There are so many basic and obvious fundamental flaws with the game it is utterly mind-boggling that they are there after five years of development time.  It makes me wonder if anybody actually played the game before it was released?

Whoa, imagine that!  You are not unique amongst the human community for your ability to see beyond your own biases and predelictions.  But despite your assertions to the contrary, you do have you head in the sand.  Everyone knows the dragon encounters are too easy...that precisely why the mod that addresses this concern is one of the most popular.  If I had a dollar for every time someone on this thread complained that Maven was essential, or that we could not screw over her (or the Thieves Guild) I'd have more money than Bill Gates.  Since the first day the game has been released, thousands of people in hundreds of places have complained about Skyrim's magic system.  Are you really so thick-headed that you somehow missed this?

We like Skyrim for the things it ALLOWS us to do IN SPITE OF its flaws.

Modifié par Joy Divison, 08 mai 2013 - 01:59 .

[Lazengan]

Joy Divison wrote...

Lazengan wrote...

Joy Divison wrote...

Lazengan wrote...

My only hard on for dishonored is the combat.

So while you are allowed to hold nuanced opinions and reject any simplistic claim that we may throw out you, you have no problem labeling us as "Skyrim fanboys" who are "butthurt" rather than recognize the diverging views we hold about the game?

Nice...

what actual views do you have about the game?

I see no one actually talking about gameplay in this thread for entire months

The game has enough flaws that I could write an entire dissertation and still forget to mention half of them.  I've never played a RPG that had as uninspired and unimaginative magic system as Skyrim.  The fact the different weapon and armor material do not have distictive qualities and are so close mechanically renders the entire purpose of having different materials moot.  The linear two-handed scaling system is a joke because one-handed does proportionally far more damage at higher-levels.  Dragons are too easily neutered by the PC.  That Jaree-Ra and hundreds of other insignficant NPCs are deemed essential is moronic.  That I can go to some random blacksmith in a hick town and purchase cheap equipment superior to Daedric artifacts is lunacy.  The Civil War quest is overly repetitous.  That you can drink 30 potions in an instant is ridiculous.  There are so many basic and obvious fundamental flaws with the game it is utterly mind-boggling that they are there after five years of development time.  It makes me wonder if anybody actually played the game before it was released?

Whoa, imagine that!  You are not unique amongst the human community for your ability to see beyond your own biases and predelictions.  But despite your assertions to the contrary, you do have you head in the sand.  Everyone knows the dragon encounters are too easy...that precisely why the mod that addresses this concern is one of the most popular.  If I had a dollar for every time someone on this thread complained that Maven was essential, or that we could not screw over her (or the Thieves Guild) I'd have more money than Bill Gates.  Since the first day the game has been released, thousands of people in hundreds of places have complained about Skyrim's magic system.  Are you really so thick-headed that you somehow missed this?

We like Skyrim for the things it ALLOWS us to do IN SPITE OF its flaws.

You like skyrim for what?

clearly not the waifus, like I do

and I do see your point

I guess my head IS up my ass. 

Modifié par Lazengan, 08 mai 2013 - 02:46 .

[Joy Divison]

That I have the complete and utter freedom to play EXACTLY the type of character I want to. I don't have to put up with subjective DM opinions of what a fighter or mage "really" is or what races exist in "their" world. I don't have to put up with nonsensical and arbitrary game designer decisions what a "class" can and can't do. Skyrim has the most logical and best level progression system bar none...you do something, you get better at it - well, duh, how hard is that? (ironic as Oblivion has the worst I've ever seen).

The attention to detail put into every environment. I've actually seen otherwise intelligent posters actually defend DA2's recycled and mundane environment's with the line "it's just a cave." Yeah, it's just a cave. Or it's an opportunity for a game designer to show their customers who spent $60 an modicum of respect and make "just a cave" a memorable experience, either with an interesting backstory, a memorable vista, or whatever.

If you're just spamming the same spell, that's more an issue with your play-style than the game. You can stealth entire dungeons. Or you can exclusively use illusions. Or brute-force. Or sneak-attack. Or turn into a werewolf. Or rely on summons. Or sucker the bad guys into a trap. Or use a greatsword AND a summon AND a bow AND heal yourself AND stealth to escape if things go wrong.

But the best part of the game is the huge and interesting world the game gives us the freedom to basically do whatever the hell we want when we want to. NPCs actually have distinct personalities. They interact with you. Just about every nook and cranny has a story. Even the bandits I still find amusing and actually somewhat realistic. I laugh when they scream "Can't wait to count out your coin!" and find it refreshing when they warn me to leave them alone rather than mindlessly attacking. Oh yeah, it actually looks good.

Meanwhile the folks making DA3 are going to force me to play a human *yawn*, have given no indication that they will remove nonsensical restrictions such as barring warriors from using ranged weapons, and believe that putting words in MY character's mouth is good game design.

All this boils down to a reoccurring theme. Skyrim let's me play the game how I want to play whereas most RPGs make me play the game the way the developers see fit.

Modifié par Joy Divison, 08 mai 2013 - 04:11 .

[Lazengan]

Joy Divison wrote...

That I have the complete and utter freedom to play EXACTLY the type of character I want to. I don't have to put up with subjective DM opinions of what a fighter or mage "really" is or what races exist in "their" world. I don't have to put up with nonsensical and arbitrary game designer decisions what a "class" can and can't do. Skyrim has the most logical and best level progression system bar none...you do something, you get better at it - well, duh, how hard is that? (ironic as Oblivion has the worst I've ever seen).

The attention to detail put into every environment. I've actually seen otherwise intelligent posters actually defend DA2's recycled and mundane environment's with the line "it's just a cave." Yeah, it's just a cave. Or it's an opportunity for a game designer to show their customers who spent $60 an modicum of respect and make "just a cave" a memorable experience, either with an interesting backstory, a memorable vista, or whatever.

If you're just spamming the same spell, that's more an issue with your play-style than the game. You can stealth entire dungeons. Or you can exclusively use illusions. Or brute-force. Or sneak-attack. Or turn into a werewolf. Or rely on summons. Or sucker the bad guys into a trap. Or use a greatsword AND a summon AND a bow AND heal yourself AND stealth to escape if things go wrong.

But the best part of the game is the huge and interesting world the game gives us the freedom to basically do whatever the hell we want when we want to. NPCs actually have distinct personalities. They interact with you. Just about every nook and cranny has a story. Even the bandits I still find amusing and actually somewhat realistic. I laugh when they scream "Can't wait to count out your coin!" and find it refreshing when they warn me to leave them alone rather than mindlessly attacking. Oh yeah, it actually looks good.

Meanwhile the folks making DA3 are going to force me to play a human *yawn*, have given no indication that they will remove nonsensical restrictions such as barring warriors from using ranged weapons, and believe that putting words in MY character's mouth is good game design.

All this boils down to a reoccurring theme. Skyrim let's me play the game how I want to play whereas most RPGs make me play the game the way the developers see fit.

I spam the same spells because there is no choice to do otherwise

you don't just do X for ****s and giggles, a good game forces you to make ambigious descisions because there is a reason to do something. Throwing fireballs in Skyrim is a non-choice because there is no other good reason to do otherwise other than "Oh I just won't throw fireballs because I just want to play a warrior and I don't FEEL LIKE THROWING FIREBALLS". Why would you do this? You perform poorer in combat. The most common excuse I hear is "Hurr because it's fun" which just gives me a headache. Mindless fun for the sake of mindless fun is not the point of games. Fun comes from good gameplay, and the experience, it's not the product

Other games have distinct reasons and choices to make in being a warrior, open ended, mindless master of everything leads to boring, stale and gameplay with very few choices

Leftover A.I from Skyrim's advertised Features includes dropping a gem in front of two bandits and watching them kill each other for it. Try it, it actually works in game, albeit a bit buggy

also I think you will like this mod http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/8429

Modifié par Lazengan, 08 mai 2013 - 04:47 .

[Sajuro]

If people to run a pure warrior or a nord who abhors offensive magic, then they should have the right to do so as a way of roleplaying their character instead of having a predetermined one like Corvo or Ezio to use the skills of.
My Main, Kal-Mudi, takes whatever power she can get so she won't be helpless again and that leads her to making a lot less then stellar life choices like helping all of the Daedric Lords and going into tombs to stab Dragon Priests until they stop moving again (she also ended up killing Ysolde after the ebony blade compelled her to), she is also brash so she joined the Stormcloaks after the Empire attacked and killed her favorite member of it (the Argonian) and realized that siding with the Nord Supremacist faction might not have been the best idea after the battle of White Run.

If someone wanted to not throw fireballs cause they don't throw fireballs, that is a choice on the part of the player to be a roleplayer and not just to get as much power and damage out of their character as possible

[Haplose]

Joy Divison wrote...
The game has enough flaws that I could write an entire dissertation and still forget to mention half of them.  I've never played a RPG that had as uninspired and unimaginative magic system as Skyrim. 

Heh, try Risen...

But it's bad, I agree. At least there is SLIGHTLY more diversity to the offensive magic (side) effects then in the earlier 
ES titles. Then again, some awesome magic effects are gone (levitate, fortify speed for example).
But the no-skill-scaling and repetiveness of effects within schools are indeed just BAD.

The fact the different weapon and armor material do not have distictive qualities and are so close mechanically renders the entire purpose of having different materials moot.

Would be pretty awesome, indeed. But actually very few games implement this. Most notable DnD titles, I think. And really important differences are only for the rarest material, such as mithral or adamantium, perhaps [good] silver.

The linear two-handed scaling system is a joke because one-handed does proportionally far more damage at higher-levels.

Seriously disagree here. There's way more to two-handed combat then raw damage. It can't beat dual weapons in that, true. But you still CAN block and bash enemies. You still get the timeslow when an enemy tries to power attack you, if you picked the relevant perk. Has a great balance of offence and defence. Sword and Shield feels very weak, when compared to two-handed combat. It is a bit slow, true, but you can change this with the Elemental Fury shout.

And most importantly, two-handed has the best force modifiers, by far. If you want to overpower enemies in combat and brutally slay then as they helplessly lay on their knees after failing to withstand the power of your blows, then two-handed is for you!
Also if you eventually want to end most duels with one charge power-attack. And then the weapon swing speed is no longer relevant...
 

That you can drink 30 potions in an instant is ridiculous.

Yes, this I agree with. You should be limited to just one at a time... reached for, opened, drank and thrown away in real time... as the enemies slash at the defensless practice dummy you've just became. 

Modifié par Haplose, 08 mai 2013 - 07:04 .

[Bfler]

SirLysander wrote...

I'll see your Sabretooth and raise you a Charr:

Is that Skyrim? I like the armor.

[SirLysander]

Bfler wrote...

SirLysander wrote...

I'll see your Sabretooth and raise you a Charr:

Is that Skyrim? I like the armor.

Unfortunately, no.  (I did put above the pic that it wasn't  ) That's a Charr (race, not abbreviation for "character") Warrior from Guild Wars 2 in (mostly) Vigil Armor. wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vigil_armor/Heavy

I'm not sure what format ArenaNet uses for its character and item models, maily because as a MMORPG modding is severely frowned upon (as an understatement).  There are enough images of the armors online that someone might be able to build it from scratch as a NIF, though.

[Joy Divison]

Lazengan wrote...

Joy Divison wrote...

That I have the complete and utter freedom to play EXACTLY the type of character I want to. I don't have to put up with subjective DM opinions of what a fighter or mage "really" is or what races exist in "their" world. I don't have to put up with nonsensical and arbitrary game designer decisions what a "class" can and can't do. Skyrim has the most logical and best level progression system bar none...you do something, you get better at it - well, duh, how hard is that? (ironic as Oblivion has the worst I've ever seen).

The attention to detail put into every environment. I've actually seen otherwise intelligent posters actually defend DA2's recycled and mundane environment's with the line "it's just a cave." Yeah, it's just a cave. Or it's an opportunity for a game designer to show their customers who spent $60 an modicum of respect and make "just a cave" a memorable experience, either with an interesting backstory, a memorable vista, or whatever.

If you're just spamming the same spell, that's more an issue with your play-style than the game. You can stealth entire dungeons. Or you can exclusively use illusions. Or brute-force. Or sneak-attack. Or turn into a werewolf. Or rely on summons. Or sucker the bad guys into a trap. Or use a greatsword AND a summon AND a bow AND heal yourself AND stealth to escape if things go wrong.

But the best part of the game is the huge and interesting world the game gives us the freedom to basically do whatever the hell we want when we want to. NPCs actually have distinct personalities. They interact with you. Just about every nook and cranny has a story. Even the bandits I still find amusing and actually somewhat realistic. I laugh when they scream "Can't wait to count out your coin!" and find it refreshing when they warn me to leave them alone rather than mindlessly attacking. Oh yeah, it actually looks good.

Meanwhile the folks making DA3 are going to force me to play a human *yawn*, have given no indication that they will remove nonsensical restrictions such as barring warriors from using ranged weapons, and believe that putting words in MY character's mouth is good game design.

All this boils down to a reoccurring theme. Skyrim let's me play the game how I want to play whereas most RPGs make me play the game the way the developers see fit.

I spam the same spells because there is no choice to do otherwise

you don't just do X for ****s and giggles, a good game forces you to make ambigious descisions because there is a reason to do something. Throwing fireballs in Skyrim is a non-choice because there is no other good reason to do otherwise other than "Oh I just won't throw fireballs because I just want to play a warrior and I don't FEEL LIKE THROWING FIREBALLS". Why would you do this? You perform poorer in combat. The most common excuse I hear is "Hurr because it's fun" which just gives me a headache. Mindless fun for the sake of mindless fun is not the point of games. Fun comes from good gameplay, and the experience, it's not the product

Other games have distinct reasons and choices to make in being a warrior, open ended, mindless master of everything leads to boring, stale and gameplay with very few choices

Leftover A.I from Skyrim's advertised Features includes dropping a gem in front of two bandits and watching them kill each other for it. Try it, it actually works in game, albeit a bit buggy

also I think you will like this mod http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/8429

This is why "discussing" things with you is pointless.

You asked me what I liked about the game.  I told you. You did not acknowledge a single thing I said.  All you did was repeat something that is you're opinion.

You find yourself "spamming" fireballs?  Well, no sh*t.  EVERY RPG the character you are going to play is going to be good at something...and that will be the default combat procedure.  In your beloved Dishonered game, I saw the video you posted and most of it's is the same thing...teleport and then knife the bad guy.  In D&D my paladin spams their holy avenger.  In DA:O my rogue spams momemtum and backstabs.  In Baldur's Gate my fighter/magic user did the same damn routine every combat.  Could Besthesda been more imaginative in their magic system and offered different "I blow you up spells"?  YES.  I and other posters have *already acknowlegded* this.  But your irritating repeition of the same "spam" line is totally disingenuous.  You COULD sneak around them.  You COULD summon a dremora lord.  You COULD shield bash them off a cliff.  You COULD turn into a werewolf and eat them.  You COULD use illusion to simply bypass them without fighting at all.  You COULD download a mod to find a more interesting spell because Bethesda at least allows the community to easily mod core aspects of the game unlike certain other companies that shall go nameless.  And you are NOT poorer in combat for doing something else.  I am a mage but I am also the greatest thief in the world because the gameplay ALLOWS me to be better at stealth than blowing things up.

You also seem to be under the impression that I and the other posters here are mindless drones, "Hurr because it's fun," think Skyrim is a perfect game and do not recongize the things that it could do better or believe certain features that were in previous games or on the drawing table would not make for a better game.  Again, are you dense or just like being annoying argumentative guy?  Let me repeat for you once again:

LIKE ALL GAMES WE PUT UP WITH THE FLAWS BECAUSE THE ASPECTS THE GAME DOES WELL ARE
COMPELLING / FUN / INTERESTING / NOVEL / THOUGHTFUL / WHATEVER AND OUTWEIGH THE CONS.

Skyrim is no different from all the best games I've every played in this regard.  Civ4, Total Annihilation, DA:O, Baldur's Gate, Doom, etc., all of these had irritating gameplay mechanics and flaws that make me wonder if the desginers actually bothered to play them beyond the first 15 minutes.  But they all had a special quality that elevated them to an elite level despite the ******-poor aspects about them.

Modifié par Joy Divison, 08 mai 2013 - 06:54 .

[Joy Divison]

Haplose wrote...

Joy Divison wrote...

The linear two-handed scaling system is a joke because one-handed does proportionally far more damage at higher-levels.

Seriously disagree here. There's way more to two-handed combat then raw damage. It can't beat dual weapons in that, true. But you still CAN block and bash enemies. You still get the timeslow when an enemy tries to power attack you, if you picked the relevant perk. Has a great balance of offence and defence. Sword and Shield feels very weak, when compared to two-handed combat. It is a bit slow, true, but you can change this with the Elemental Fury shout.

And most importantly, two-handed has the best force modifiers, by far. If you want to overpower enemies in combat and brutally slay then as they helplessly lay on their knees after failing to withstand the power of your blows, then two-handed is for you!
Also if you eventually want to end most duels with one charge power-attack. And then the weapon swing speed is no longer relevant...
 

For much of the game, I'd agree with you.  But like most RPGs, the balance falls apart at high levels. 

Your basic iron greatsword does 15 damge per hit.  At 0.7 attacks per second its 10.5 DPS
Your basic iron sword does 7 damage per hit.  At 1 attack per second its 7 DPS.

That's a healthy +50% damage increase for the two-hander.  Pretty resepctable.

Take a daedric greatsword.  It does 24 damage a hit.  At 0.7 attacks per second that's 16.8 DPS..
Take a daedric sword.  it does 14 damage a hit.  At 1 attack per second that's 14 DPS.

Now we're down to 20%.

But at that high level, you'll have: the armsmens/barbarian perks maxed out, 100 skill, and legendary upgrades.

Now the daedric greatsword does 102 damage a hit for 71.4 DPS
The daedric sword does 72 damage a hit for 72 DPS.

I could also have a shield .  But you're right, sword & shield is kind of weak so instead I'll carry another sword and those perks which increase my attack rate by 35% and my power attack damage by 50%, perks which are unavilable in the two-handed tree.

If the boost in raw damage was balanced by the lack of defense at low levels then the same cannot be true at high levels because I have suffered no additional defensive handicaps and my damage output has increased far more than the two-hander.

I *like* and would prefer to use two-handed so I'm not biased or anything.  It's just the the numbers I think speak for themselves.

Edit: Oh, look at that.  A Skyrim fanboy pointing out a fundmantal flaw in the game. I bet all those suckers in Hell are happier now that is has frozen over.

Modifié par Joy Divison, 08 mai 2013 - 03:54 .

[Barbarossa2010]

You guys pay far more attention to the actual numbers than I do, but I find dual wielding and sword and shield pretty damn capable at higher levels.

With a maxed out block tree, you are outright killing enemies with a Shield Bash, and with a properly perked one-hand tree (maxed Armsman with axe perks topped), enchants, and a properly smith-ed war axe; it is doing (what?) 330-350 DAM per strike? So, sword and board in effect becomes a dual wielding mechanic...with the not insignificant defensive bonus of the shield, plus the ability to stagger even giants and dragons.

BTW, never got to that point in my games, can you kill with a bash when using a two-handed weapon?

EDIT: the other bonus is that Shield Charge puts everyone on the ground--and even multiple targets in the fan-to include your companions (oops)--(of course minus Dragons, Giants and specific bosses), helpless, just left to be finished off.

EDIT 2: forgot about bashing to disarm as well.

Modifié par Barbarossa2010, 08 mai 2013 - 04:40 .

[legion999]

Lazengan wrote...
funny thing bethesda forums and skyrim nexus regard skyrim as complete trash and consider new vegas to be the superior game

strange how I find skyrim supporters on Bioware forums of all places

Then why are they on the Skyrim Nexus if they think it's awful?

[Splinter Cell 108]

legion999 wrote...

Lazengan wrote...
funny thing bethesda forums and skyrim nexus regard skyrim as complete trash and consider new vegas to be the superior game

strange how I find skyrim supporters on Bioware forums of all places

Then why are they on the Skyrim Nexus if they think it's awful?

If we were to use his reasoning I'd guess they are there because "mods make their game better" even though I've rarely seen anything like that over there but then again I don't spend much time there. I do know that if he were complaining the way he's complaining here he would have been banned long ago from Nexus since they really don't tolerate stupid crap like this. There's no reasoning with his logic, everything anyone says is wrong if it doesn't match with his opinion. 

Modifié par Splinter Cell 108, 08 mai 2013 - 04:50 .

[Addai]

Joy Divison wrote...
LIKE ALL GAMES WE PUT UP WITH THE FLAWS BECAUSE THE ASPECTS THE GAME DOES WELL ARE
COMPELLING / FUN / INTERESTING / NOVEL / THOUGHTFUL / WHATEVER AND OUTWEIGH THE CONS.

The bottom line.

And if dude thinks that Skyrim gets trashed on its own boards, he should visit the Dishonored section.

[Elhanan]

I simply prefer the look and Kill-Cams of 2H over 1H; more visceral and less repetative. When using 1H, I can get the feeling like I am sweeping; watching the same swinging motions. This is lessened in 3rd person, but the 2H still looks better for me.

Plus, DPS still requires hitting the target, and like with Archery, I am better with a heavy hitter than trying to hit more often with a lesser bow. I am still limited by my own RL restrictions, and that first hit is important to me.

OTOH, 1H are some of the better looking weapons in the game. That Daedric Artifact Orc Hammer is so ugly it goes on the shelf; cannot stand to see it across my back.

[legion999]

Splinter Cell 108 wrote...

legion999 wrote..

Then why are they on the Skyrim Nexus if they think it's awful?

If we were to use his reasoning I'd guess they are there because "mods make their game better" even though I've rarely seen anything like that over there but then again I don't spend much time there. I do know that if he were complaining the way he's complaining here he would have been banned long ago from Nexus since they really don't tolerate stupid crap like this. There's no reasoning with his logic, everything anyone says is wrong if it doesn't match with his opinion. 

But getting mods for a game they hate doesn't make sense either. Why bother with it?

[blaidfiste]

legion999 wrote...

Splinter Cell 108 wrote...

legion999 wrote..

Then why are they on the Skyrim Nexus if they think it's awful?

If we were to use his reasoning I'd guess they are there because "mods make their game better" even though I've rarely seen anything like that over there but then again I don't spend much time there. I do know that if he were complaining the way he's complaining here he would have been banned long ago from Nexus since they really don't tolerate stupid crap like this. There's no reasoning with his logic, everything anyone says is wrong if it doesn't match with his opinion. 

But getting mods for a game they hate doesn't make sense either. Why bother with it?

Because the rest of us need to be told what a good game is.  Get down on your knees and thank them for their sacrifice.

[happy_daiz]

^ I thought it had something to do with Skyrim being his waifu simulator?