37007 réponses à ce sujet

[Yrkoon]

Sidney wrote...


My problem is that you  I can't function very well without the skills like you could without sneak or restoration because looting and buying simply don't give you access to quality upgrades.

Fixed.    Speak for yourself.

But I find it hilarious that you'd say  such a thing, even as you sit and  read what some others are saying here...  you know, about  freedom,  and about how they're doing fine with just the stuff they're looting and buying.

And by the way, you're not stating an opinion.   You're flat out making  factually erroneous claims about the game's mechanics.    Are you aware that there's an Armor rating cap in this game?    There's an Armor rating cap.   And you can reach it  with  nothing more than a  standard set of IRON armor and Heavy Armor perks.  In other words,   Using Nothing but what Bandits drop, you too can   have 80%  physical damage reduction, just like someone who slaved away creating Legendary Daedric Armor.

  But forget about armor.  You don't need to wear armor.   In fact, you don't even need to  fight.   There are  items in this game that allow you to summon creatures to fight for you, and some of them are at least as powerful as ANY enemy you face in ANY dungeon.  Some of them ARE the enemies you face in any dungeon.   Literally.   There are spells, items and shouts that  force  the enemies you face  to kill each other.    Lets think about that for a second....  You can make. enemies. kill. each. other.  And that raises the obvious question:    How can there be, as you say,  a  combat difficulty curve at all,  when you can make the enemies die without actually engaging in combat?

Modifié par Yrkoon, 29 novembre 2011 - 03:15 .

[happy_daiz]

virumor wrote...

Bah, companions. All they're good for is being sacrificed to Boethiah.

I'm a little late to the party, but...

I just recruited Ghorbash the Iron Hand as a follower last night. I'd forgotten how much I love Orcs.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Il Divo wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

That's called roleplay.  You are expected to work out such things for yourself, typically over several playthroughs.  I'm not finishing any guild in this run.

Actually, I'd say in this case it's a problem with the game. I love role-play, but what if I want to role-play a character who wants to become head of everything? In Skyrim, the game allows that with absolutely no problems. On the other hand, an interesting aspect of Morrowind was that the game would refuse to promote the player to a certain rank if they had not achieved a certain "level" in their respective skills, an aspect which was lost in Oblivion. I would have preferred to see this concept expanded rather than eliminated in TES.

This. While it's not inherently a bad thing, one would think that progression in rank in say the College, or the Companions would be tied to proficiency at the related skill through demonstration. Rather than just tying it to the plot, or completion of Radiant Quests. They already do this when introducing you to some of the guilds, but they don't run with the idea. Which is such a damn shame.

For example, I'd love for you as a College Mage to actually teach classes or demonstrate high level spells for the initiates. Had Spellmaking been made a feature, that would've been an excellent aspect to tie into the story too.

Bethesda's "go anywhere, do anything" motto would be infinitely better from an RPG standpoint IMO if it was "go anywhere, do anything within the confines of your character (build)".

That's been something really missing since Daggerfall and Morrowind. Skyrim moves in the right direction and is probably the best we can expect these days but it's still closer to Oblivion than Morrowind, or Daggerfall which was the best in the series in this area.

Unfortunately, it's an element of accessibility and streamlining. A lot of people want to be the Master of Everything and can't or don't want to restrict themselves in what they can accomplish.

To balance my criticism with gushing praise, I'm having a blast playing with certain mods that make magic more powerful. Adding more runes is a godsend. AOE in close quarters gave Lydia a very undignified end.

Which is something I'm loathe to repeat with Jordis, especially considering how much the manor in Solitude cost.

However, playing a War Cleric (1h + Des/Alt/Res), that didn't give me much option outside of engaging in Melee combat, which still isn't the best idea in dungeons and close quarters with Jordis. The runes (since I can use three of them now) however give me another option and allow me to exploit the linear corridors and place them strategically at chokepoints.

One "Throw Voice" later and I hide with Jordis behind a corner waiting for the inevitable explosions, it's fun watching the AI run the "gauntlet" so to speak... and seeing them fail. Of course, any survivors are promptly cut down.



Now, granted, it's hardly as tactically or strategically satisfying as say, my Eastern Roman Empire campaign (VH/VH) in the M2TW Broken Crescent mod, but it's still a lot of fun.

What's fun is that it's the first time in a long time in a WRPG that I've actually had my character evolve from a personality standpoint due to losing a companion and have that change reflected in how I approach combat which in turn influences on how I build my character.

New Vegas attempted something similar, with perm death on companions for HC but it never really got me like Skyrim did. Because when a companion died, it was always a tactical or execution or a luck issue. I knew I could just reload and do it "right". With Lydia, it was an inherent strategic flaw in my approach.

To begin with, I had just assumed Lydia would be essential, didn't realise my attacks could kill. But most RPGs nowadays keep companions permanently non-killable outside of cutscene choices and the idea that losing a companion normally in combat (consequences to choices) and changing your character (personality, tactics and build) because of it is a really cool feeling, because it's not one that I've had in a WRPG for a very long time.

So kudos to Bethesda and modders for giving me that experience.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 29 novembre 2011 - 03:23 .

[Dominus]

For example, I'd love for you as a College Mage to actually teach classes or demonstrate high level spells for the initiates. Had Spellmaking been made a feature, that would've been an excellent aspect to tie into the story too.

You and Todd Howard need to have a sitdown, Mister.

To begin with, I had just assumed Lydia would be essential, didn't realise my attacks could kill. But most RPGs nowadays keep companions permanently non-killable outside of cutscene choices and the idea that losing a companion normally in combat (consequences to choices) and changing your character (personality, tactics and build) because of it is a really cool feeling, because it's not one that I've had in a WRPG for a very long time.

True, most rely on the idea of them being "wounded" or "fainted". I found it near laughable that in Skyrim, my companion would ask for the enemy to yield, and they'd just turn to me instead. I find that very unrealistic...

[Yrkoon]

RageGT wrote...
And the Ebony Greatsword is even better. Mine does 376 dmg (with my +% Two Handed gear) against 330 dmg of the Daedric Greatsword.

Then you did something wrong.  If you're using the same perks, the same  gear,   and you crafted the two with the exact same levels  of crafting skill,  then an ebony greatsword cannot  do more damage than a Daedric greatsword..    Daedric  Greatswords have a higher base damage from the start, so equal improvements to both will  keep them  at  that difference.

Btw,  I'm in the 400s with my Daedric Greatsword.  (and double that when I activate  my Orc Berserker rage, but that's a different subject, tee-hee)   And there's a guy in the Bethesda boards that shows you (step by step) how to  get up to 605 damage with a Daedric Greatsword without using any + damage% potions.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 29 novembre 2011 - 05:00 .

[happy_daiz]

Hey, do you guys know how many peeps you can recruit to the Blades? I seem to be stuck at three for now. Delphine doesn't have a dialogue option for me to add any more.

Also, I can't seem to buy Hjerim in Windhelm. I thought the Steward gave me the option to buy it at one point, but now there are no dialogue options for that, or for upgrading. Am I just S.O.L.? I'm on XBox, so I can't use any mods.

Modifié par happy_daiz, 29 novembre 2011 - 04:13 .

[Addai]

mrcrusty wrote...
This. While it's not inherently a bad thing, one would think that progression in rank in say the College, or the Companions would be tied to proficiency at the related skill through demonstration. Rather than just tying it to the plot, or completion of Radiant Quests. They already do this when introducing you to some of the guilds, but they don't run with the idea. Which is such a damn shame.

Why?  As if every university administrator is better at teaching X than the professors at the school?

I simply can't feel sympathetic to complaints about the game letting you do things that you think it ought to forbid you.  Craft your own story or quit complaining.

Unfortunately, it's an element of accessibility and streamlining. A lot of people want to be the Master of Everything and can't or don't want to restrict themselves in what they can accomplish.

That is their problem.

[Veex]

Are housecarls always female? I've only purchased the estates in Whiterun and Solitude thus far, but was curious if that is a female only position.

[LobselVith8]

happy_daiz wrote...

Hey, do you guys know how many peeps you can recruit to the Blades? I seem to be stuck at three for now. Delphine doesn't have a dialogue option for me to add any more.

Also, I can't seem to buy Hjerim in Windhelm. I thought the Steward gave me the option to buy it at one point, but now there are no dialogue options for that, or for upgrading. Am I just S.O.L.? I'm on XBox, so I can't use any mods.

You need to bring a follower to Delphine and tell her this person should be in the Blades - most companions can become members of the Blades (up to three, if I recall correctly).

[Addai]

Sidney wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

But that is a roleplay choice, then.  If you're relying on scrounged armor, you're going to look a bit piecemeal.  I think that's a decent RP path and there's nothing wrong with it.  You have to accept its limitations, however.  I've been wearing enchanted steel armor for 35 levels, and only now just am starting to find ebony armor pieces.  I'll probably keep wearing my steel for a while because I'm doing other things besides smithing.

That's a nice theory but given the way the game scales it isn't a terribly realistic one. The curve on difficulty starts to leave you behind until you start working the crafting in some way. I could, again, make the same claim if you wanted to be a warrior and say "Well sucks to be you for chosing to be a two handed warrior. Sure the scaling causes the difficultly curve to spike but hey, that's your choice." Choices in game have consequences (joing the stormcloaks) but choices about character development that are not part of the game world per se should be a lot more neutral if you want to allow and encourage freedom.

I think character development should also result in consequences.  There's a reason most townspeople don't go into caves.  Are you taking all the Juggernaut perks on Heavy Armor?  I have found that being careful to build up my primary weapon and armor classes, that the game has continued to remain challenging but not too challenging.

Modifié par Addai67, 29 novembre 2011 - 04:20 .

[Addai]

Veex wrote...

Are housecarls always female? I've only purchased the estates in Whiterun and Solitude thus far, but was curious if that is a female only position.

No, the carls in Windhelm and Markarth are male.

[GodWood]

Veex wrote...
Are housecarls always female? I've only purchased the estates in Whiterun and Solitude thus far, but was curious if that is a female only position.

The Markarth one is male.

EDIT: ninja'd

Modifié par GodWood, 29 novembre 2011 - 04:25 .

[LobselVith8]

MrDizaztar wrote...

I currently playing Skyrim right now and I love the game, but I have one major problem with it. My problem stems from the fact that you can literally join all the guilds in the game and there doesn't seem to be any repercussion for doing so. I mean does it make any sense that my Dovahkiin is Harbinger of the Companions, Archmage of the College, memeber of the Thieves Guild, Dark Brotherhood, and member of the Bard's College?

You could do the same in prior Elder Scroll games, where the respective protagonist could become a member of many organizations - although there were sometimes conflicts between some factions (like the Morrowind Thieves Guild and Fighters Guild). The protagonist only becomes a 'Bard' at the Bard's College, and is never in a position of leadership for the people there. It's explained in the respective factions why the protagonist can become a leader to the Thieves Guild (since the other two senior members refuse leadership, and the protagonist still needs to prove himself to actually earn the title) and how the protagonist can become the uncontested leader of the Dark Brotherhood (since he is "chosen"). Considering that the Thieves Guild and the Dark Brotherhood are clandestine organizations, and the Harbinger is more of an "advisor" to the Companions than an actual leader, I don't see the issue, especially considering that the protagonist is a hero of Nordic legend (and the only one who can stop Alduin, the World-Eater). Since the mages at the College have suffered greatly (in terms of enrollment and publicity) since the Great Collapse, I'd imagine that having the Dovahkiin as the Arch-Mage could help their reputation (given how Nords feel about mages and magic), especially if the protagonist is a proficient mage.

[happy_daiz]

LobselVith8 wrote...

happy_daiz wrote...

Hey, do you guys know how many peeps you can recruit to the Blades? I seem to be stuck at three for now. Delphine doesn't have a dialogue option for me to add any more.

Also, I can't seem to buy Hjerim in Windhelm. I thought the Steward gave me the option to buy it at one point, but now there are no dialogue options for that, or for upgrading. Am I just S.O.L.? I'm on XBox, so I can't use any mods.

You need to bring a follower to Delphine and tell her this person should be in the Blades - most companions can become members of the Blades (up to three, if I recall correctly).

That stinks. Like I said, I'm already at the limit, then. How can they expect to get back on their feet if i can only recruit 3 people? That's silly.

Anyone know about Hjerim?

[LobselVith8]

Mr.House wrote...

It still sucks I had to kill Saul, I felt bad.

I sided with the Stormcloaks and killed General Tullius when I originally played as a Dunmer assassin, and while I agreed with the idea that the Nords should be allowed to emancipate themselves from the Empire, it was odd (as a Dunmer) siding with people who kept making disparaging remarks about elves. When I made a second run as a Dunmer mage, I sided with the Legion, and I was surprised to see the change in leadership for people who seemed better than the allies who sided with Ulfric, especially Brunwulf Free-Winter, who makes strives to help the Dunmer in the Gray Quarter, and the presence of prominent elves with the Legion controlling formerly Stormcloak cities. It doesn't change the problem of the Thalmor having free reign over people in the Empire, especially given how one of the Thalmor tried to kill me for saying that "I" was free to worship who I wished (which should have been clear from the Tribunal warpaint my Dunmer had).

I like that there's good and bad with both factions; neither side is perfect.

[Il Divo]

Addai67 wrote...

Why?  As if every university administrator is better at teaching X than the professors at the school?

This is a school for magic. Shouldn't we actually have some Mage role-play which revolves around casting spells and doing Mage-esque activities? Tolfdir's wards lesson was a great start. They should have capitalized on that even more.  

I simply can't feel sympathetic to complaints about the game letting you do things that you think it ought to forbid you.  Craft your own story or quit complaining.

That's a strawman. It's not primarily about the game allowing restriction or freedom. It's about carving a more effective role-playing experience. I actually want to role-play a Wizard, which requires Wizard-esque activities/abilities. If I'm going to be Arch-Mage, I should have some capability in spell-casting, to preserve the internal consistency of the world. The current TES method revolves around sending the player into dungeons, which any character concept can complete quite handily. That doesn't  promote Mage role-play, or story crafting.

That is their problem.

I'd say it's the developer's problem, as they built the game in that manner.

Modifié par Il Divo, 29 novembre 2011 - 05:02 .

[LobselVith8]

happy_daiz wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

happy_daiz wrote...

Hey, do you guys know how many peeps you can recruit to the Blades? I seem to be stuck at three for now. Delphine doesn't have a dialogue option for me to add any more.

Also, I can't seem to buy Hjerim in Windhelm. I thought the Steward gave me the option to buy it at one point, but now there are no dialogue options for that, or for upgrading. Am I just S.O.L.? I'm on XBox, so I can't use any mods.

You need to bring a follower to Delphine and tell her this person should be in the Blades - most companions can become members of the Blades (up to three, if I recall correctly).

That stinks. Like I said, I'm already at the limit, then. How can they expect to get back on their feet if i can only recruit 3 people? That's silly.

Anyone know about Hjerim?

I don't know why the limit is three, either, or why they ask me to kill someone I specifically have no interest in killing. I usually get Mjoll the Lioness as a member, and I'm considering Erandur and Jenassa.

Hjerim - the home in Windhelm? I recommend you complete "Blood on Ice" beforehand, if you have any interest in completing that quest. You can purchase it once you've dealt with certain missions as a member of either the Legion or the Stormcloaks.

[happy_daiz]

LobselVith8 wrote...

I don't know why the limit is three, either, or why they ask me to kill someone I specifically have no interest in killing. I usually get Mjoll the Lioness as a member, and I'm considering Erandur and Jenassa.

Hjerim - the home in Windhelm? I recommend you complete "Blood on Ice" beforehand, if you have any interest in completing that quest. You can purchase it once you've dealt with certain missions as a member of either the Legion or the Stormcloaks.

I recruited Jenassa, Erandur, and that one guy from the bar in Markarth...the one Addai married, with the face tattoo. Vorstag? Something like that. They're a good team, with a warrior, mage, and Jenassa is good with a bow, and dual wielding.

I already completed both parts 1 and 2 of Blood on the Ice. I already had the option from the steward to buy the house, but didn't buy it right then, and it doesn't come up as an option anymore. I guess it could be a bug on XBox, but if it isn't...why would you only have one chance to buy a house? Again, silly.

...Although maybe the option to buy showing up was a fluke. Do you have to do the Legion or Stormcloak mission to buy it?

Modifié par happy_daiz, 29 novembre 2011 - 05:10 .

[Addai]

Il Divo wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Why?  As if every university administrator is better at teaching X than the professors at the school?

This is a school for magic. Shouldn't we actually have some Mage role-play which revolves around casting spells and doing Mage-esque activities? Tolfdir's wards lesson was a great start. They should have capitalized on that even more.  

I simply can't feel sympathetic to complaints about the game letting you do things that you think it ought to forbid you.  Craft your own story or quit complaining.

That's a strawman. It's not about the game allowing restriction or freedom. It's about carving a more effective role-playing experience. I actually want to role-play a Wizard, which requires Wizard-esque activities/abilities. If I'm going to be Arch-Mage, I should have some capability in spell-casting, to preserve the internal consistency of the world. The current TES method revolves around sending the player into dungeons, which any character concept can complete quite handily. That doesn't  promote Mage role-play, or story crafting.

That is their problem.

I'd say it's the developer's problem, as they built the game in that manner.

If you want to be a wizard, be a wizard.  What's stopping you?  If you're working towards being arch-mage and your PC has no interest in magic or reason to be at the college, WTH are you even there for?

I'm roleplaying a Stormcloak officer.  She learned a bit of magic, visits the college occasionally, but she's mostly involved in the civil war.  Didn't want to be a werewolf.  Didn't give the Thieves' Guild the time of day.  I won't finish any of the guild quest lines on this character.  If people are just blindly going after this guild and that guild without thinking about their character's story and if it makes sense, then that IS their problem.

[Il Divo]

mrcrusty wrote...

This. While it's not inherently a bad thing, one would think that progression in rank in say the College, or the Companions would be tied to proficiency at the related skill through demonstration. Rather than just tying it to the plot, or completion of Radiant Quests. They already do this when introducing you to some of the guilds, but they don't run with the idea. Which is such a damn shame.

For example, I'd love for you as a College Mage to actually teach classes or demonstrate high level spells for the initiates. Had Spellmaking been made a feature, that would've been an excellent aspect to tie into the story too.

Bethesda's "go anywhere, do anything" motto would be infinitely better from an RPG standpoint IMO if it was "go anywhere, do anything within the confines of your character (build)". 

I would have loved the opportunity to teach a class. Hell, even incorporating formal spell duels in the College would have been interesting to see. Any kind of magical competition, really. Hell, give me a formal apprentice to teach! So many options and I think Bethesda could pull it off fairly well, too if given the inclination.

[happy_daiz]

Well, you do have to join the college to get Morokei's mask...

[Addai]

happy_daiz wrote...
I recruited Jenassa, Erandur, and that one guy from the bar in Markarth...the one Addai married, with the face tattoo. Volstag? Something like that. They're a good team, with a warrior, mage, and Jenassa is good with a bow, and dual wielding.

Vorstag- he's been my principal follower, but this PC won't marry him.  He's too much of a milk drinker.    It's kind of a bummer that I don't think any of the marriage possibilities are Stormcloaks.  Ah well, she's meant for Ulfric anyway.  He will see the light!

...Although maybe the option to buy showing up was a fluke. Do you have to do the Legion or Stormcloak mission to buy it?

I thought you had to do Stormcloak stuff to get it, but not sure on that.  I bought the house in Solitude even though my PC is against the Legion.

The houses are a bit buggy.  I'm not getting a Well Rested bonus at any of them- at least no notification pops up, and I'm not sure how to see effects??  Also in Solitude I was locked out of my house when I went out onto the balcony.  Dude!  I paid so much gold for that sea view!!

Modifié par Addai67, 29 novembre 2011 - 05:14 .

[Il Divo]

Addai67 wrote...

If you want to be a wizard, be a wizard.  What's stopping you?  If you're working towards being arch-mage and your PC has no interest in magic or reason to be at the college, WTH are you even there for?

The current game's format. I'm not doing Wizard activities. I'm exploring dungeons as an adventurer who happens to be a Wizard. In joining the College of Winterhold, a guild for magic, I want much greater emphasis placed on magic proficiency. I want to feel like a student at a University College, for a specific purpose. If I become Arch-Mage, I want an opportunity to demonstrate why I am the Arch-Mage, as opposed to Tolfdir or any other capable Wizard.

Let me compete with Tolfdir to show why I'm superior to him at Alteration, an activity only a Wizard could do. Let me demonstrate for the Apprenticies how to summon a Storm Atronach, an activity only a Wizard could do. So on and so forth. I want the other guilds to function in a similar manner as well.

The problem is that the College of Winterhold is a Mage School in name only, since there are few (if any) Mage activities required or expected of the player.

Modifié par Il Divo, 29 novembre 2011 - 05:16 .

[happy_daiz]

Addai67 wrote...
Vorstag- he's been my principal follower, but this PC won't marry him.  He's too much of a milk drinker.    It's kind of a bummer that I don't think any of the marriage possibilities are Stormcloaks.  Ah well, she's meant for Ulfric anyway.  He will see the light!

Whoops, sorry, I thought your PC married Vorstag. LOL Good luck with Ulfric!

Modifié par happy_daiz, 29 novembre 2011 - 05:19 .