465 réponses à ce sujet

[Cat Lance]

ReconTeam wrote...

Positive based on people who respond here? Of course. But the forums are a small section of the community, not representative of the hole, and not everybody has bothered voicing their opinion in here either.

I think it is a waste of time because myself and 90% won't bother with it and that time could be better spent on a shiny axe as a reward for killing something. I know the gay community is bound to disagree but I'm just being honest here. Great for you but it's meaningless to everybody else and I don't see a reason to pretend otherwise.

I hate to break this to you, but the wondrousness of the acheivements system means they DO know how many people run though what content. Which means they found it entirely worth it to expend zots on this. You're punting imaginary kittens.

[TJPags]

While I don't care that it's been added, it WOULD be nice to see some kind of reaction to some of your choices, such as this.

Example - elves are basically second class citizens in Thedas, right?  Yet, does anyone ask you what the hell you're doing running around with a dirty elf if you romance Zev? (never done it, so don't know).  Is anyone in Thedas bothered by a human romancing a dwarf?

These kinds of things, while very open-minded (and as I said, I don't have a problem with that option) should carry with them at least the occassional NPC who doesn't like it and acts that way.  It doesn't have to be everyone, but I'd like to see it.

[errant_knight]

Y'know, in a thread that asks for people's reactions, folks should probably allow them to have negative ones as long as they're polite about it. Otherwise the title should be 's/s romance:squee here-->'



Regarding the underwear, I hope they don't make it even remotely modern. I find the modded underwear utterly disconcerting, like there was a Victoria's secret in Denerim. Bad enough that Isabella is wearing something that doesn't seem very medieval at all, black underwear included. Don't want the rest of the costuming to go that way.

[Top Gun volleyball]

Cornholin' a-plenty on my playthroughs was my reaction.

[elearon1]

I expected it, but I was a little concerned ... so I'm happy to have it confirmed. I know some people could care less, but the vast majority of BW players seem to enjoy their LI storylines and it would have been a real shame to leave those who prefer the same sex interests out in the cold.

[The Edge]

My reaction isn't suprised or anything; DA:O had it, so s/s romance option would (and should) more than likely appear in the second one. I guess, to be honest, it doesn't really matter much to me (because I won't be accessing that content anyway), but that doesn't mean it doesn't matter to others.

[errant_knight]

elearon1 wrote...

I expected it, but I was a little concerned ... so I'm happy to have it confirmed. I know some people could care less, but the vast majority of BW players seem to enjoy their LI storylines and it would have been a real shame to leave those who prefer the same sex interests out in the cold.

Agreed. It was a popular option, and removing roleplaying options would have seemed regressive.

[ejoslin]

errant_knight wrote...

Y'know, in a thread that asks for people's reactions, folks should probably allow them to have negative ones as long as they're polite about it. Otherwise the title should be 's/s romance:squee here-->'

Regarding the underwear, I hope they don't make it even remotely modern. I find the modded underwear utterly disconcerting, like there was a Victoria's secret in Denerim. Bad enough that Isabella is wearing something that doesn't seem very medieval at all, black underwear included. Don't want the rest of the costuming to go that way.

Hmmm, how about braises for DA2 for the guys, though without the codpiece.  I don't support the corset, though, as it would be very hard to fight in one!

Gah, nvm, boxer briefs and pretty teddies are just far nicer looking!  

I support more support -- better underwear for DA2 (shamelessly stolen line here).

Edit: Really, the sad thing is is that s/s romance, ugly undies or no, have controversy attached at all.  

Modifié par ejoslin, 24 décembre 2010 - 05:17 .

[Ortaya Alevli]

Here's hoping for more Xzar-Montaron type romances in Dragon Age.

[soignee]

dgcatanisiri wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

ReconTeam wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
So homosexual relationships being accepted pulls you out of thoughts of darkness altogether? I think you overestimate how much better that makes a world by just a tad.

It seems cheesy and unrealistic to me, which conflicts with the general atmosphere.

Bisexually is totally unrealistic. I have bisexual friends and ex's, but I suspect they're all dragons.

Actually, that might explain a few things with some of the bisexuals I know...

I'M A DRAGON OROAR

[TeaCokeProphet]

This is news to me. Whatever. My interests are mutually exclusive as to whether they're in or not. I don't rightly give a damn.

[Manx II]

My reaction to Isabella being a bisexual love interest? "Yeah, so?"

I mean, when we met her in DAO she was willing to jump in bed with complete strangers of both sexes literally within minutes of meeting them. Frankly, I'd have been a lot more surprised if she hadn't swung both ways in DA2.

Also, bisexual companions have been included in pretty much every BioWare title since, what, Neverwinter Nights? There was little to no reason to believe they'd be cut out this time.

What I have observed, however, is that BioWare has never gone full-out "homosexual love". The characters in question have always (to my knowledge, at least) been bisexual. Until BioWare goes all the way, I'm not going to bat an eyebrow.

I also suspect they've included a bisexual female compainon for reasons other than for the sake of diversity. Let's face it, homosexual behavior is far more tolerable to the average gamer if it's between two hot chicks. And seeing how hard they've been marketing DA2 to the casual crowd, well...

Shadow Raziel wrote...

ReconTeam wrote...
I don't want Thedas to be the land of politically correct. What happened to dark fantasy?

I
tend to agree with you, but at the same time. I could care less. it's
not an option I will explore, so no issue. like TV, if you don't like
what's on? turn the channel. However I understand your overall point.

Seconded. I have little interest to explore certain aspects of the game, same-sex relationships included, but at the same time I doubt BioWare have dedicated much of the game to it. Kind of interesting to see how strongly some people feel about it, though.

And yes, It is a bit strange how a gritty, medieval world like Thedas seems to embrace such modern notions of enlightenment. Frankly, though, I found that the armored female knights and the gender-neutral "ser" made me go to a far greater degree.

Yeah, I know. "It's a world full of dragons and magic, what does believability got to do with it?" Still, when it comes the human elements I find it takes a lot more for me to suspend my sense of disbelief. After all, humans and their cultures actually exist in the real world.

Cat Lance wrote...
I hate to break this to you, but the wondrousness of the acheivements system means they DO know how many people run though what content. Which means they found it entirely worth it to expend zots on this. You're punting imaginary kittens.

Actually, this is something I've been wondering about. Have they ever given an actual number on how many players pursued homosexual relationships? Other than an ambiguous "more than you'd expect", I haven't heard anything concrete. For all we know, that might still be a tiny minority. (Kind of like when the ME forums, where the female Shepard is adored, where agast when BioWare revealed how like 80% of all Shepards created had been male.)

It would also be very interesting to know how many went girl-girl and how many went guy-guy in DAO. I suspect the numbers would be in favor of the former, if only because of the "hawt lesbian secks lol" factor that seemed so popular among players in the original Mass Effect.

[Addai]

I didn't think how women warriors are treated in Thedas was ahistorical. They are still considered a rarity, for instance Howe comments that femCousland warrior is the way she is because Bryce chose to train her as a warrior, "an unusual choice." Many European cultures have prominent female warrior figures in their history. So the kernel is there, even if the game runs with that idea a little further.

[Cat Lance]

Manx II wrote...

Shadow Raziel wrote...

ReconTeam wrote...
I don't want Thedas to be the land of politically correct. What happened to dark fantasy?

I
tend to agree with you, but at the same time. I could care less. it's
not an option I will explore, so no issue. like TV, if you don't like
what's on? turn the channel. However I understand your overall point.

Seconded. I have little interest to explore certain aspects of the game, same-sex relationships included, but at the same time I doubt BioWare have dedicated much of the game to it. Kind of interesting to see how strongly some people feel about it, though.

And yes, It is a bit strange how a gritty, medieval world like Thedas seems to embrace such modern notions of enlightenment. Frankly, though, I found that the armored female knights and the gender-neutral "ser" made me go to a far greater degree.

Yeah, I know. "It's a world full of dragons and magic, what does believability got to do with it?" Still, when it comes the human elements I find it takes a lot more for me to suspend my sense of disbelief. After all, humans and their cultures actually exist in the real world.

The reason it works is because it works within the world. There is no predomenant religion in Fereldon that says women are supposed to sit at home making babies and not be out fighting wars. In our own world the cultures with inclusive religions had their share of female warriors. Like the Celts. *shrugs* This is one of those times when people don't need to think of dragons, but of the cultures of the world they are discussing, as Mr. Gaider has said over and over, this is not a medievil Europe simulator, it's it's own world and cultures, etc.

Manx II wrote...

Cat Lance wrote...
I hate to break this to you, but the wondrousness of the acheivements system means they DO know how many people run though what content. Which means they found it entirely worth it to expend zots on this. You're punting imaginary kittens.

Actually, this is something I've been wondering about. Have they ever given an actual number on how many players pursued homosexual relationships? Other than an ambiguous "more than you'd expect", I haven't heard anything concrete. For all we know, that might still be a tiny minority. (Kind of like when the ME forums, where the female Shepard is adored, where agast when BioWare revealed how like 80% of all Shepards created had been male.)

It would also be very interesting to know how many went girl-girl and how many went guy-guy in DAO. I suspect the numbers would be in favor of the former, if only because of the "hawt lesbian secks lol" factor that seemed so popular among players in the original Mass Effect.

I fail to see where they need to offer up exact numbers to us. They feel that the numbers warrant continued inclusion. *shrugs*

[elearon1]

History Grad Student here,



Actually, historically, homosexuality as this huge taboo has only been a big issue the last couple hundred years - prior to that it was not uncommon for men to have male and female lovers in many European cultures. (not a lot of thought was given to what women were doing most of the time, but typically when anyone thought about it, women having relations with women was only seen as an issue if it got in the way of the men pursuing them ... so "female crushes" were quaint, so long as they made way for a man when it was time)



So, Thedas seeming less "dark" because it is accepting of homosexuality is a very modern outlook and not particularly "politically correct" at all. Sure there were movements in different cultures and different religions throughout the centuries to discourage homosexuality - but it was hardly the universal norm many nay sayers here seem to imagine. Indeed, it would be more of a concession to contemporary mores to pretend those things were less acceptable.

[Selene Moonsong]

ReconTeam wrote...

I understand that the LIs will probably be the same if DA1 is any indicator, but the dialogue, animations, etc. is still the work and time of some guy at computer somewhere. If DA2 had a better battle or more variety in loot, however slight it may be, I would rather have that instead because I'm not interested in S/S options. It may be selfish but that's the truth. I have other reasons I don't want such content but talk beyond the game itself doesn't have a place in the forums.

We're just not going to come to any agreement, but the point of the topic to state our reactions and you have mine. "ReconTeam disapproves -50"

I take it you completely missed David Gaider's post earlier in this topic where he stated the following:

David Gaider wrote...

... Advocating that nobody should be able to have content you don't intend to personally use is largely pointless-- outside of a vague notion that such efforts should go towards other things, instead. Personally, it's not a lot of effort to include them. The resources we can devote to a minority of players isn't great, but I imagine to those players it's quite worth it... and I would hope that some folks could be sensitive enough to be happy for those players, at the very least out of the selfish notion that they may one day end up in the minority of some content issue and receive the same consideration if nothing else.

You are welcome to your opinions, just as anyone else in these forums is entitled to theirs, but your constant argument with others while making false assertions and stating them as fact comes off a bit trollish in nature.

[slimgrin]

TeaCokeProphet wrote...

This is news to me. Whatever. My interests are mutually exclusive as to whether they're in or not. I don't rightly give a damn.

I do. It shows Bioware is willing to tackle subject matter other game devs won't even touch. I think that's important as the medium evolves and continues to expand. It's not just kids stuff anymore. Games for adults should reflect adult issues. 

Modifié par slimgrin, 24 décembre 2010 - 07:04 .

[elearon1]

>>That's an awfully broad brush you're using, history grad student.<<

And still a lot more accurate than the people making the opposite argument. Obviously I'm not going to sit down and write a 10 page discussion on the subject of sexuality over the last 5000 years of recorded history, but the point is still valid - this broad denouncement of the social acceptance of homosexuality in the middle ages (the term "dark ages" has been debunked) and declaration that the inclusion of such is nothing but politically correct pandering to a vocal minority is simply ignorant and wrong headed. If one has personal objections with the content, that is their own business, but basing it on a non existent historical standard does not hold water.

Modifié par elearon1, 24 décembre 2010 - 07:06 .

[Cuddlezarro]

im happy as long as the gay romance is not another elf

[Atakuma]

slimgrin wrote...

TeaCokeProphet wrote...

This is news to me. Whatever. My interests are mutually exclusive as to whether they're in or not. I don't rightly give a damn.

I do. It shows Bioware is willing to tackle subject matter other game devs won't even touch. I think that's important as the medium evolves and continues to expand. It's not just kids stuff anymore. Games for adults should reflect adult issues. 

Well said.

[CaisLaochach]

Cuddlezarro wrote...

im happy as long as the gay romance is not another elf

Dwarven bear ftw?

I don't mind people being gay in real life or in game. Doesn't offend me, live and let live.

[Cuddlezarro]

ClaomhScathach wrote...

Cuddlezarro wrote...

im happy as long as the gay romance is not another elf

Dwarven bear ftw?

I don't mind people being gay in real life or in game. Doesn't offend me, live and let live.

id rather have a human warrior that isnt anything like Zevran and Alistair =3

not saying I dont like Dwarves (I do)

[Dave of Canada]

I don't see how Thedas accepting homosexuality is an insult to history, we're not exactly dealing with the medieval ages here.

[B3taMaxxx]

elearon1 wrote...

History Grad Student here,

Actually, historically, homosexuality as this huge taboo has only been a big issue the last couple hundred years - prior to that it was not uncommon for men to have male and female lovers in many European cultures. (not a lot of thought was given to what women were doing most of the time, but typically when anyone thought about it, women having relations with women was only seen as an issue if it got in the way of the men pursuing them ... so "female crushes" were quaint, so long as they made way for a man when it was time)

 Well, actually, several hundred years (give or take a thousand), not a "couple". Remeber Christianity, or perhaps Islam and their quams with boy on boy. In the last 1,500 years or so its only been a mainstream practice in the southern hemisphere, in very few places.

 Regardless, I think it's great that boys can be girls and girls can be boys.................................

Modifié par B3taMaxxx, 24 décembre 2010 - 07:30 .