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Mass Effect 3 PC - $59.99, no thanks.


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#226
headphones

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Bourne Endeavor wrote...

...do not expect console gamers to offer much sympathy, hence the backlash you have received primarily from them.


Again with the "consolve vs PC" mentality. How are you all so naive into thinking that an unjustified price increase on our end won't result in an inevitable unjustified price increase on your end as well? This goes beyond "getting sympathy" from console players; we couldn't care less about "their sympathy". What they SHOULD have is sympathy for ALL gamers, WORLDWIDE who are being suckered into paying seemingly innocuous increases in prices (e.g. the "it's just 10 bucks" mentality).

And once again sinosleep, props for holding out this long.

#227
PlasticVenom43

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sinosleep wrote...

If porting to the PC had anything to do with costs PC games and console games would have been the same price AGES ago.


No, they wouldn't. Because games were not as advanced as they are today and don't hold that much data.

The only explanation I can give you was Assassin's Creed, the first one.  It came out on the PC at a much higher price and yet the controls sucked so much and compatibility was terrible. 

#228
sinosleep

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The majority of PC games still retail at 49.99 NOW. Technology is not the issue here. Once again, if it was, the prices would have gone up across the board with the launch of the 360/PS3. They didn't because that's not the issue.

This is a greedy company charging more where they feel they can get away with it. Hell, even EA is selective in what games they charge 59.99 for.

Sims 3 was 49.99
Need for Speed Hot Pursuit (A PORT) was 49.99

but they charged 59.99 for

Medal of Honor and Activision did the same for Call of Duty.

Porting Medal of Honor was no more technologically impressive than porting Need for Speed and yet they charged 10 more dollars for it. Why? Cause they're greedy bastards and know the FPS market is bigger than the racing market and the majority of people would eat it up like the lemmings that they are. 

Modifié par sinosleep, 26 décembre 2010 - 07:21 .


#229
PlasticVenom43

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I'm sorry you feel that way then.



Well, I guess I'll have fun playing my Mass Effect 3.

#230
sinosleep

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I'll have fun playing it as well, as soon as I find an outlet that's selling it at a discount.

#231
Kai Hohiro

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sinosleep wrote...
Porting Medal of Honor was no more technologically impressive than porting Need for Speed and yet they charged 10 more dollars for it. Why? Cause they're greedy bastards and know the FPS market is bigger than the racing market and the majority of people would eat it up like the lemmings that they are. 

Everything you say is correct, the publisher is making more money off of one PC game sale than one console sale.

However from a marketing perspective it makes absolutely sense to charge the same for every plattform. 
If one plattform got preferred pricing, you would see a much bigger uproar from console players who have to pay a higher price, since most have no idea about the hidden licensing fees.
And considering consoles are where the majority of sales are made for Mass Effect (and many other big franchises like CoD, MoH etc) it doesn't make sense to possibly upset that audience just in order to be "fair" to PC players.
It's simpler and more straightforward to say "everybody pays the same on launch day".

Modifié par Kai Hohiro, 26 décembre 2010 - 07:31 .


#232
Bourne Endeavor

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sinosleep wrote...

How does it have any relevance when you already conceded what we're actually complaining about is a valid point? It has no relevance whatsoever. You are paying 10 dollars for LICENSING, we are paying 10 dollars FOR NOTHING, not close to the same thing.


It can also be looked at as. Console gamer pays $10 to Sony/Microsoft. PC Gamer pays $10 to EA. Not an ideal world but consider this. Pretend Mass Effect had remained a console only series. Would you have been willing to pay $60 for each installment assuming they meant your standards? If so, then why stop now? If not and that $10 is a deal breaker, then by all means. Hold off and wait until the price drops.

headphones wrote...

Bourne Endeavor wrote...

...do not expect console gamers to offer much sympathy, hence the backlash you have received primarily from them.


Again
with the "consolve vs PC" mentality. How are you all so naive into
thinking that an unjustified price increase on our end won't result in
an inevitable unjustified price increase on your end as well? This goes
beyond "getting sympathy" from console players; we couldn't care less
about "their sympathy". What they SHOULD have is sympathy for
ALL gamers, WORLDWIDE who are being suckered into paying seemingly
innocuous increases in prices (e.g. the "it's just 10 bucks" mentality).

And once again sinosleep, props for holding out this long.


Not necessarily. We have had unjustified price increases in the past and games sold less because of this. I pay less for my games today than I did five years prior. This could very well be a simple attempt by EA to set a universal price they know will be accepted in the long haul. The "hey, we can charge PC gamers the same as console gamers and it will work!" approach. If in the future games see a sudden spike to $70-$80 per, then we will raise complaints.

As of this moment. I believe Mass Effect 3 wil be worth $60 and will probably purchase it on the PC for that precise price.

Kai made the essential point I should have earlier.

Modifié par Bourne Endeavor, 26 décembre 2010 - 08:45 .


#233
sinosleep

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Kai Hohiro wrote...
Everything you say is correct, the publisher is making more money off of one PC game sale than one console sale.

However from a marketing perspective it makes absolutely sense to charge the same for every plattform. 
If one plattform got preferred pricing, you would see a much bigger uproar from console players who have to pay a higher price, since most have no idea about the hidden licensing fees.
And considering consoles are where the majority of sales are made for Mass Effect (and many other big franchises like CoD, MoH etc) it doesn't make sense to possibly upset that audience just in order to be "fair" to PC players.
It's simpler and more straightforward to say "everybody pays the same on launch day".


I can see where you are coming from but the problem with that is that they've been possibly upsetting that exact segment of gamers for the better part of 20 years. I can't speak for the NES, but I know for a fact PC games were cheaper than their SNES/Genesis counterparts for the entiretly of those console's life spans. Cartridge games of the era regularly went for 69.99 and saw a drop when all the platforms switched to disc based media. They then saw a bump with the release of the 360/ps3 to the standard 59.99 price point where again PC games have traditionally been cheaper.

#234
sinosleep

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Bourne Endeavor wrote...

It can also be looked at as. Console gamer pays $10 to Sony/Microsoft. PC Gamer pays $10 to EA. Not an ideal world but consider this. Pretend Mass Effect had remained a console only series. Would you have been willing to pay $60 for each installment assuming they meant your standards? If so, then why stop now? If not and that $10 is a deal breaker, then by all means. Hold off and wait until the price drops.


Here's the difference. Console manufacturers, for the most part, lose money on consoles and make it back through licensing and software. Hell the only company that made any profit on console sales this time around was Nintendo since they made an underpowered machine they could sell on the cheap. I understand why they charge 3rd parties a fee, they have to recoup their losses for making the console in the first place. It's been that way for YEARS since console are absurdly expensive to produce. I'm not against anyone making a profit, without that they all go out of business and we get no games.

What I am against is unecessarily chasing profit at a cost to the consumer. EA isn't losing money in order to provide PC gamers with games, as has been pointed out several times, they actually stand to pocket more money from PC gamers per sale AS IS. Which is why them getting yet more money from me rubs me the wrong way whereas it doesn't really bother me that I have to fork out more cash for a console game. There's a tangible reason for the price increase for one and not on the other.

I will do exactly what you suggested and not purchase the game until I can find it for 49.99. Doesn't mean I'm not going to let them know I think they are full of it.

Modifié par sinosleep, 26 décembre 2010 - 09:11 .


#235
The Masked Rog

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They'll charge as much as they want because it is their right. The customer has no right to demand lower prices, if he doesn't like it, then he shouldn't buy them. If enough people think the price is unfair, it will eventually drop. Welcome to capitalism.

#236
sinosleep

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Modifié par sinosleep, 26 décembre 2010 - 09:30 .


#237
adam_grif

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The Masked Rog wrote...

They'll charge as much as they want because it is their right. The customer has no right to demand lower prices, if he doesn't like it, then he shouldn't buy them. If enough people think the price is unfair, it will eventually drop. Welcome to capitalism.


 Wtf is the point of this post? There are two camps of people complaining in this thread:

- Group 1 is saying they will not purchase it until it comes down in price.
- Group 2 is saying they will still purchase it, but that it's a **** of a thing to do and people should recognize it for the price gouging that it is.

Neither group cares whether EA "can" do this legally, it's about whether they should, which is not a question you can just dismiss like that.

#238
The Masked Rog

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adam_grif wrote...

The Masked Rog wrote...

They'll charge as much as they want because it is their right. The customer has no right to demand lower prices, if he doesn't like it, then he shouldn't buy them. If enough people think the price is unfair, it will eventually drop. Welcome to capitalism.


 Wtf is the point of this post? There are two camps of people complaining in this thread:

- Group 1 is saying they will not purchase it until it comes down in price.
- Group 2 is saying they will still purchase it, but that it's a **** of a thing to do and people should recognize it for the price gouging that it is.

Neither group cares whether EA "can" do this legally, it's about whether they should, which is not a question you can just dismiss like that.

I guess they do it because their previous mrket studies show that they can make more money this way. They're in for the money. What did you expect, that they act as a charity? They should do wathever is more profitable to them, and if customers make the price rise mean it is less profitable, they'll have to lower the prices. As I said, that's capitalism.

#239
Mage One

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<potentially boring economic talk>

Actually the customer has every right to complain about prices they perceive as too high.  While the generally accepted role of a company is to maximize profit, the generally accepted role of a consumer is to maximize utility, getting the best possible products for the least cost.  It's this push and pull that creates capitalism, not one-sided profit maximization.  In fact, consumers complaining about imminent prices can actually be beneficial to a company if it saves them from having to suffer lower profitability from decreased sales by warning them ahead of time of insufficient price elasticity of demand.  (or PED.  If demand for something stays strong in the face of increasing prices, it's considered elastic,  If it doesn't, it's considered inelastic.)

That's really the crux of this debate.  EA is testing the waters with a higher PC price to see if the PC market is elastic enough to increase profitability in the face of an exclusive price increase.  That's generally the sort of things companies do.  Here, part of the PC market is letting it be known that no, it's not; though, were the circumstances different (such as the price increase being reflective of an increase on cost on the company's side)  it might be.  Also, others are saying the increased price is acceptable/desired/admirable.  The difference between the two sides isn't that one side (largely) doesn't understand the increased price isn't reflective of increased cost on the companies side.  It that one side does not care, part of that side going as far as to say, "Until your prices reach or exceed parity with mine, regardless of circumstances, I do not care what you pay."  Some, however, are simply saying, "It doesn't matter to me that the increase is exclusive to the PC.  My demand is elastic enough to absorb the increased price regardless of circumstaces."

While they're entitled to their opinions welcome to express their own view of ME3's PED, too many of them are either not customers in the market in question and are responding more in response to the prices in their market or throwing out bits of occasionally misunderstood/misused economic principles as an explanation why consumers pushing back against a potential increased price are being irrational.  They are not.  They are, in fact, doing exactly what rational consumers in an economic model are expected to do.  Please stop insisting otherwise.  Also, while no, a final price has not been set, that doesn't mean input on potential prices can't be given.  i.e.  We may not know for certain whether or not the final price will be $60, but some of us are certain we would not be willing to pay $60.

</potentially boring economic talk>

As for myself, I generally agree.  Honestly, I find the increase a bit disappointing.  I was all set to pre-order ME3 for $50.  At an aribitrary-seeming $60 I'll probably wait for a price drop, which will probably coincide with the first wave of DLC anyway, before picking it up unless whatever uber edition they release is irresistably snazzy.  Given the amount of reasonably-priced games being released for the PC on a regular basis, I have a hard time accepting a $60 price tag without a good reason, and no, reasons extrapolated by players don't count.

#240
Xeranx

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Bourne Endeavor wrote...
Not necessarily. We have had unjustified price increases in the past and games sold less because of this. I pay less for my games today than I did five years prior. This could very well be a simple attempt by EA to set a universal price they know will be accepted in the long haul. The "hey, we can charge PC gamers the same as console gamers and it will work!" approach. If in the future games see a sudden spike to $70-$80 per, then we will raise complaints.

As of this moment. I believe Mass Effect 3 wil be worth $60 and will probably purchase it on the PC for that precise price.

Kai made the essential point I should have earlier.


The bold part is highly indicative of what Sino posted earlier in the thread:

sinosleep wrote...

"First they came for the Communists, but I was not a Communist so I did not speak out.

Then they came for the Socialists and the Trade Unionists, but I was neither, so I did not speak out.

Then they came for the Jews, but I was not a Jew so I did not speak out.

And when they came for me, there was no one left to speak out for me."


The latter part of your statement in bold brings the following to mind:



If you need another example, what you'll be doing in raising complaints once changes have been made is tantamount to trying to stop a train going at max speed when you had the ability to stop the train before it started moving.

Modifié par Xeranx, 27 décembre 2010 - 02:37 .


#241
Guest_Guest12345_*

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Hmm, I don't think you can say that because PC games are increased to 60$ that the industry will respond by continuing to increase prices. I think the increase to 60$ for PC is possible because the market will bear it, and the market will bear it because of the 60$ console precedent. If the console precedent didn't exist, I think the increase would be met with more resistance, but because it does exist, its just increasing the price to par with the rest of the industry.

I don't expect to see game prices increasing, at least not for years to come, just imo. If the market was so eager and willing to bear price increases, why did it take so many years for PC gaming to catch up to console prices? It had to be a very slow change over time, and that is what I expect to see over the years to come.

Modifié par scyphozoa, 27 décembre 2010 - 03:07 .


#242
Shadesofsiknas

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Xeranx wrote...

Bourne Endeavor wrote...
Not necessarily. We have had unjustified price increases in the past and games sold less because of this. I pay less for my games today than I did five years prior. This could very well be a simple attempt by EA to set a universal price they know will be accepted in the long haul. The "hey, we can charge PC gamers the same as console gamers and it will work!" approach. If in the future games see a sudden spike to $70-$80 per, then we will raise complaints.

As of this moment. I believe Mass Effect 3 wil be worth $60 and will probably purchase it on the PC for that precise price.

Kai made the essential point I should have earlier.


The bold part is highly indicative of what Sino posted earlier in the thread:

sinosleep wrote...

"First they came for the Communists, but I was not a Communist so I did not speak out.

Then they came for the Socialists and the Trade Unionists, but I was neither, so I did not speak out.

Then they came for the Jews, but I was not a Jew so I did not speak out.

And when they came for me, there was no one left to speak out for me."


The latter part of your statement in bold brings the following to mind:



If you need another example, what you'll be doing in raising complaints once changes have been made is tantamount to trying to stop a train going at max speed when you had the ability to stop the train before it started moving.


Excellent video that sums it all up perfectly.

Modifié par Shadesofsiknas, 27 décembre 2010 - 10:14 .


#243
The Masked Rog

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Mage One wrote...
<snip>

That's more or less what I've been saying except I don't think there is actually a point in complaining here. The pricing managers or wathever do not come here or at least aren't influenced by what is posted here. Only way to show them customers aren't willing to pay 60$ for this is not to buy the product. That's the strength of the customers.

#244
sympathy4saren

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It's 60 because it is supply and demand. If you owned a good product you sell, would you sell it at 50 when you could easily get 60? No way. That's why they're doing it.

That doesn't mean, though, that you should pay it if YOU feel that it isn't worth it. In that case, you're having an impact on the demand margin. I personally will try to find everything as low as possible. Sinosleep hit that on the head.

But I see it this way...they are producers and I'm a consumer. I am the one that actually makes out the best. Sure, they get my money...but I get a product I enjoy I wouldn't receive unless they make it. I'm the winner.

Modifié par sympathy4saren, 27 décembre 2010 - 06:52 .


#245
The Smoking Man

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sympathy4saren wrote...

I'm the winner.

No, the cash cow milkers win. Kind of like Bethesda and their horse armor DLC for Oblivion that made them at least $200k (for something that is at least as useless and pointless as the Alternate Appearance Pack) shortly after its release.

#246
iggy4566

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The Smoking Man wrote...

sympathy4saren wrote...

I'm the winner.

No, the cash cow milkers win. Kind of like Bethesda and their horse armor DLC for Oblivion that made them at least $200k (for something that is at least as useless and pointless as the Alternate Appearance Pack) shortly after its release.


Bethesda thanks for making fallout NV suck.

#247
Praetor Knight

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iggy4566 wrote...

Bethesda thanks for making fallout NV suck.


I thought Obsidian was the developer.

It is fun, aside from the bugs in the quests, hated starting over cuz of some strange goof in the code. :(

#248
Burningwolf

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Interesting fun facts.

Dead space 2,Bulletstorm,Dragonage 2,Crysis 2,Mass Effect 3 Pre-order price 59.95

Shift 2,Sims Midievil,Darkspore Preorder price 49.95

(USD in USA)

All the pre-orders I could find on the EAstore.

#249
Mister Mida

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Let me get this straigt: You guys are making a fuzz about the current price (that can still change) of a game that is still far away from being released?

#250
Steve236

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60 bucks for a download?!