172 réponses à ce sujet

[ENolan]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

I don't want more voice actors. I was a silent PC.

It really helps when your Voice Acting techniques when you say it before you select it. Talk about Player-to-game Integration!

In retrospect to my first post, I love making a point that doesn't kill the thread.

[Lord Atlia]

DarthCaine wrote...

More sales =/= more budget
If DA2 sales more, they'll realize they can do things quick and easy and it'll still sell, and you'll see a new DA every year, making DA the new CoD

I agree with this, last I checked the CoD series are made by two studios with a two year time frame and yet they are still amazing games that dominate their genre.  If Bioware came out with a Game of the Year quality RPG every year I would be a happy camper.

I found the voiceless PC in DA:O to really ruin immersion for me.  In ME2 the character loyalty missions were emotional to me because of the cinematic quality to them and the back and forth between Shepard and the other characters. In DA:O it was all one sided conversation.  Sure people say you are supposed to use your imagination to fill in the gaps but what is the point of a voiced NPC then?

Edited: misread post

Modifié par Lord Atlia, 27 décembre 2010 - 08:41 .

[sevalaricgirl]

The reason why ME2 fails on the romance angle compared to DA:O is all the 'little' romance moments you have. A good example is Alistair & Goldanna, where a female PC gets to say the ''I care about you line''. ME1/2 just has no comparable situation.

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What about all the little bits that you get in DAO about the romance.  You certainly don't get that in ME.  Wynne talking to Alistair (since he and the fearless leader are intimate) about where babies actually come from.  Lelianna and Morrigan asking about the relationship, Ogren asking about legs and then there is the banter between the members of your party.  One that I found completely hilarious was Zev asking Lelianna about life in the chantry and her missing companionship or Zev telling Lelianna about his other tattoos that he could show her.  Then there's Alistair telling femWarden that he has a few interesting moles that he could show her later.  You get none of that in ME.  Face it, ME is an action adventure with some role playing in it.  DAO is a rpg with some action adventure in it.

Truthfully, I thought I was going to hate the voiceless PC but ended up loving it and all of the dialogue that was availalble.  I sure hope they give me good romances in DA2 because if not, I'll go elsewhere for my rpgs.  I liked the fact that once Alistair and femWarden were intimate, they could kiss anywhere and really have a romance.  ME, not.  In ME1 and ME2, it was a one night stand with the exception of not romancing anyone but staying true to Kaidan and Ashley. 

Modifié par sevalaricgirl, 27 décembre 2010 - 08:50 .

[upsettingshorts]

sevalaricgirl wrote...
You get none of that in ME.  Face it, ME is an action adventure with some role playing in it.  DAO is a rpg with some action adventure in it.

Your argument does not follow unless you are insisting that party banter is key to an RPG. 

Don't get me wrong, I'd like to have more party banter in ME, and I'm not going to get involved in an argument as to what an RPG is - it just seems your point doesn't match your evidence.

[sevalaricgirl]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

sevalaricgirl wrote...
You get none of that in ME.  Face it, ME is an action adventure with some role playing in it.  DAO is a rpg with some action adventure in it.

Your argument does not follow unless you are insisting that party banter is key to an RPG. 

Don't get me wrong, I'd like to have more party banter in ME, and I'm not going to get involved in an argument as to what an RPG is - it just seems your point doesn't match your evidence.

I think it does.  Party banter is an important part of an immersive experience which is what an rpg is supposed to be.  For instance, irl, you're out with your friends.  Do they just say nothing the entire time.  I swear, if the elevator was anymore silent in ME, I would have shot myself with my gun.

Modifié par sevalaricgirl, 27 décembre 2010 - 08:54 .

[upsettingshorts]

sevalaricgirl wrote...

I think it does.  Party banter is an important part of an immersive experience which is what an rpg is supposed to be.

*shrug*

I don't agree at all.  But I'm not going to tell you what is and isn't immersive to you.   It's subjective - personally a silent protagonist kills it for me, just to get back on the thread topic.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 27 décembre 2010 - 08:54 .

[sevalaricgirl]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

sevalaricgirl wrote...

I think it does.  Party banter is an important part of an immersive experience which is what an rpg is supposed to be.

*shrug*

I don't agree at all.  But I'm not going to tell you what is and isn't immersive to you.   It's subjective - personally a silent protagonist kills it for me, just to get back on the thread topic.

Each to his/her own.  I write novels.  If my characters did not speak to each other, no one would read it and it's the little things they say that make the novels more interesting for instance the wives chatting over coffee in the coffee shop.  It's not a major part of the plot, but it makes the novel more enjoyable to the reader.  And to get back to the subject, I love the silent pc because there are a lot more dialogue lines and I have a very vivid imagination.

Modifié par sevalaricgirl, 27 décembre 2010 - 08:57 .

[Maria Caliban]

sevalaricgirl wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

sevalaricgirl wrote...
You get none of that in ME.  Face it, ME is an action adventure with some role playing in it.  DAO is a rpg with some action adventure in it.

Your argument does not follow unless you are insisting that party banter is key to an RPG. 

Don't get me wrong, I'd like to have more party banter in ME, and I'm not going to get involved in an argument as to what an RPG is - it just seems your point doesn't match your evidence.

I think it does.  Party banter is an important part of an immersive experience which is what an rpg is supposed to be.  For instance, irl, you're out with your friends.  Do they just say nothing the entire time.  I swear, if the elevator was anymore silent in ME, I would have shot myself with my gun.

I'm not sure 'immersive experience' is any more or less part of RPGs as they are action-adventure games or FPS.

I mean, by that reasoning, "ME 2 is a better RPG than Planescape: Torment or BG 2 because it has better graphics and I find better graphics more immersive," is a sound argument.

[sevalaricgirl]

Maria Caliban wrote...

sevalaricgirl wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

sevalaricgirl wrote...
You get none of that in ME.  Face it, ME is an action adventure with some role playing in it.  DAO is a rpg with some action adventure in it.

Your argument does not follow unless you are insisting that party banter is key to an RPG. 

Don't get me wrong, I'd like to have more party banter in ME, and I'm not going to get involved in an argument as to what an RPG is - it just seems your point doesn't match your evidence.

I think it does.  Party banter is an important part of an immersive experience which is what an rpg is supposed to be.  For instance, irl, you're out with your friends.  Do they just say nothing the entire time.  I swear, if the elevator was anymore silent in ME, I would have shot myself with my gun.

I'm not sure 'immersive experience' is any more or less part of RPGs as they are action-adventure games or FPS.

I mean, by that reasoning, "ME 2 is a better RPG than Planescape: Torment or BG 2 because it has better graphics and I find better graphics more immersive," is a sound argument.

Actually it was better, but that is just my opinion.

[upsettingshorts]

sevalaricgirl wrote...

And to get back to the subject, I love the silent pc because there are a lot more dialogue lines and I have a very vivid imagination.

That's why it's a subjective thing - it's not a question of having an imagination or even wanting to use it.  To me, the difference between fully text, fully voiced, and a silent protagonist comes down to consistency.  I prefer a fully voiced game to a fully text game, but I prefer both to a silent protagonist because the latter is jarring to me.

I've explained it before, but its like switching between watching a movie and reading a book - I'm fine with one or the other, switching between both feels... weird.  That kind of consistency is a big deal for me.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 27 décembre 2010 - 09:03 .

[Heretical]

Honestly, I prefer a silent PC simply because there tends to be more dialogue options, and I get to imagine a voice for my character, rather than be stuck with a voice whether I like it or not. Voiced PC doesn't bother me though.

[In Exile]

sevalaricgirl wrote...

What about all the little bits that you get in DAO about the romance.  You certainly don't get that in ME.  Wynne talking to Alistair (since he and the fearless leader are intimate) about where babies actually come from.  Lelianna and Morrigan asking about the relationship, Ogren asking about legs and then there is the banter between the members of your party.  One that I found completely hilarious was Zev asking Lelianna about life in the chantry and her missing companionship or Zev telling Lelianna about his other tattoos that he could show her.  Then there's Alistair telling femWarden that he has a few interesting moles that he could show her later.  You get none of that in ME.  Face it, ME is an action adventure with some role playing in it.  DAO is a rpg with some action adventure in it.

ME has Liara and Ashley confront you. Confrontation in romance is as old as Jade Empire in a Bioware RPG. That's nothing new in Dragon Age, but party banter about the Warden getting it on was a nice touch. If you think that's the only thing that adds depth to the romance, though, I really don't think we can ever understand each other.

Truthfully, I thought I was going to hate the voiceless PC but ended up loving it and all of the dialogue that was availalble.  I sure hope they give me good romances in DA2 because if not, I'll go elsewhere for my rpgs.  I liked the fact that once Alistair and femWarden were intimate, they could kiss anywhere and really have a romance.  ME, not.  In ME1 and ME2, it was a one night stand with the exception of not romancing anyone but staying true to Kaidan and Ashley. 

In ME2 you can call up your LI to your cabin and cuddle after the suicide mission, i.e. after you are properly in a relationship. If that adds lots of romance depth to you, I suppose.

[Ortaya Alevli]

In Exile wrote...

Confrontation in romance is as old as Jade Empire Baldur's Gate 2 in a Bioware RPG.

Fixed.

[Altima Darkspells]

Hmmm, I wonder if DA3 will have a voiced PC and silent everything else...

[sevalaricgirl]

If you think that's the only thing that adds depth to the romance, though, I really don't think we can ever understand each other.

**********************************************
No that isn't all there is to romance, but there was nothing in ME both 1 and 2 and I certainly don't think this......


********************************************************

In ME2 you can call up your LI to your cabin and cuddle after the suicide mission, i.e. after you are properly in a relationship. If that adds lots of romance depth to you, I suppose.

*********************************************************
is anything close to what you get in Dragon Age.  Now granted, we don't know anything about ME3 but I am hazarding to guess that Shep wasn't in a proper relationship because that would last for more than a romp and a hug.

[In Exile]

Ortaya Alevli wrote...
Fixed.

Between the women? I only recall Haer Daelis and Aerie as an NPC romance re: conflict.

[In Exile]

sevalaricgirl wrote...
No that isn't all there is to romance, but there was nothing in ME both 1 and 2 and I certainly don't think this......

Right, but I think it's largely meaningless flavour. So this is the departure between ME and DA:O, and it has such a big impact on you, I'm just wondering how much you value the feature.

is anything close to what you get in Dragon Age.  Now granted, we don't know anything about ME3 but I am hazarding to guess that Shep wasn't in a proper relationship because that would last for more than a romp and a hug.

I don't think we have that deep of a romance in DA:O. You have really nice flavour content ME2 is missing, and since sex is the midpoint (unless you're talking Alistair/Leliana) you get more "in a romance" content, but I don't think DA:O did such a great job.

Don't get me wrong - DA:O handled romances much better than ME or ME2. It's just that, they weren't great, if you get what I mean.

[Maria Caliban]

In Exile wrote...

Ortaya Alevli wrote...
Fixed.

Between the women? I only recall Haer Daelis and Aerie as an NPC romance re: conflict.

The women in BG 2 hated one another. Of course, the women in most BioWare games hate one another.

But yes, there were specific arguments between Viconia, Jaheria, and Aerie in regards to your attention. There was never a scene where both of them confronted you and demanded you pick, if that what you're getting at.

[In Exile]

Maria Caliban wrote...
But yes, there were specific arguments between Viconia, Jaheria, and Aerie in regards to your attention. There was never a scene where both of them confronted you and demanded you pick, if that what you're getting at.

That's what I meant. I was thinking of the banter.

[AlanC9]

Maria Caliban wrote...

But yes, there were specific arguments between Viconia, Jaheria, and Aerie in regards to your attention. There was never a scene where both of them confronted you and demanded you pick, if that what you're getting at.

Not a scene, no, but sooner or later they get into a fight where you have to pick one, right?

That was some amazingly ****y dialog, IIRC.

[In Exile]

AlanC9 wrote...
Not a scene, no, but sooner or later they get into a fight where you have to pick one, right?

That was some amazingly ****y dialog, IIRC.

I never got that. But then again, I played BG - BGII once, and that was it.

[Heretical]

If paying voice actors is a problem, I'll do it for free. I'm sure high school drama class is a sufficient prerequisite.

[Atakuma]

Heretical wrote...

If paying voice actors is a problem, I'll do it for free. I'm sure high school drama class is a sufficient prerequisite.

Only if you're working for Bethesda.

[Heretical]

Of course, I'm well known for my enthralling role as Unnamed Super Mutant.

[Ortaya Alevli]

In Exile wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...
But yes, there were specific arguments between Viconia, Jaheria, and Aerie in regards to your attention. There was never a scene where both of them confronted you and demanded you pick, if that what you're getting at.

That's what I meant. I was thinking of the banter.

If you're leading on two love interests at the same time, eventually one of them interjects in a lovetalk with the other. It quckly degenerates into a "her or me?" moment. They're not as blunt as those in ME, but they still force you to choose. So, yeah, there's the banter as well.