56 réponses à ce sujet

[Nivraym]

I'm pleased there is no PC voice actor.

Reading dialogues really is fun and I agree that no one can voice PC's better than the ones who created them.

[kansadoom]

I would only like voice over if it was all done by the person who plays minsc in BG and keeps on talking about minature giant space hamsters all the time

[JEBesh]

kansadoom wrote...

I would only like voice over if it was all done by the person who plays minsc in BG and keeps on talking about minature giant space hamsters all the time

Jim Cummings doing Thor in MUA2 was good enough for me.

[Adinos]

The big problem with a voiced PC is that having a voice that sounds totally different from what you imagined *your* character to sound like will totally ruin the immersion for many people.

Imagine you wanted a mage character to sound a bit timid, with, say, a French accent, but the the voice actor BioWare selected sounds like a British aristocrat - that would totally ruin it for me. Maybe if I had a selection of 20-30 different voice profiles to select from, yes....but that is just not going to happen.

Of course, in 10 years or so, all games may have realistic computer-created voices, where you just select the initial parameters until you are happy, and then you get your character sounding exactly like you want, but until then....no what we have is just fine.

Modifié par Adinos, 27 octobre 2009 - 04:19 .

[Hanik Arran]

Well as I already said. Make the voice optional and everybody is happy.

[JEBesh]

Hanik Arran wrote...

Well as I already said. Make the voice optional and everybody is happy.

..Yeah. Except the developers.

[Hanik Arran]

It would be even easier for the developers not to do the voices at all including the NPCs. So I don't see that as an argument here. The question is what the players want. mmh, I might even open a poll for this. ^^

[Veyt]

I actually didn't like playing Mass Effect with the accent they gave the female Shepard, it really made me lose connection with the character I had made.

[Hanik Arran]

*points 4 posts up*

[JEBesh]

Hanik Arran wrote...

It would be even easier for the developers not to do the voices at all including the NPCs. So I don't see that as an argument here. The question is what the players want. mmh, I might even open a poll for this. ^^

You're right. Time and resources are irrelevant. If we the people form an idea, the developers can make what ever the **** we want them to.

Modifié par JEBesh, 27 octobre 2009 - 04:51 .

[LdyShayna]

If you do a poll, make sure to include the fact that the developers have said that the game would be cut in half if the PC was voiced.

[JEBesh]

LdyShayna wrote...

If you do a poll, make sure to include the fact that the developers have said that the game would be cut in half if the PC was voiced.

You lie! That's not what the game in my head is like!

[Hanik Arran]

@JEBesh You're right. The developers give **** about the players because they don't want to sell any copies of their games. Also Bioware is known to never listen to their fans.

Okay honestly JEBesh, I am trying to discuss this here, and I believe I am doing so quite politely and friendly. I don't know why you keep posting sarcastic, mocking 2 liners. Maybe because that looks clever and funny but that doesn't help anybody. It certainly doesn't help the discussion. So could you please be more constructive? Please?



@LdyShayna Actually I'd like to know first where this statement can be found because if it would just be an issue with disc space that could be solved by making it a 2 DVD game. Do you have a link somewhere for me?

[LdyShayna]

Hanik Arran wrote...

@LdyShayna Actually I'd like to know first where this statement can be found because if it would just be an issue with disc space that could be solved by making it a 2 DVD game. Do you have a link somewhere for me?

It was discussed extensively on this thread on the old forums: http://daforums.biow...&forum=135&sp=0

The comment on the length was explicitly made on page 10.

If you read the thread, you'll note I personally vastly prefer an unvoiced protagonist, but the practical considerations are covered by the BioWarans, and is regardless of my personal preferences.

[Maria Caliban]

Hanik Arran wrote...

Well as I already said. Make the voice optional and everybody is happy.

Not only would that take from the resources of the game, thus shortening it, but then they'd have to create a way to display dialogue that worked both for text and spoken word.

[JEBesh]

Hanik Arran wrote...

@JEBesh You're right. The developers give **** about the players because they don't want to sell any copies of their games. Also Bioware is known to never listen to their fans.
Okay honestly JEBesh, I am trying to discuss this here, and I believe I am doing so quite politely and friendly. I don't know why you keep posting sarcastic, mocking 2 liners. Maybe because that looks clever and funny but that doesn't help anybody. It certainly doesn't help the discussion. So could you please be more constructive? Please?

You'll have to forgive me. This is a discussion that has been cycled time and time again. I've developed a calloused way of dealing with these things. Yes, I mocked you for suggesting that time and resources are irrelevant in game development. Yes, I'm an ****. Yes, you are still wrong.

[Hanik Arran]

JEBesh wrote...

You'll have to forgive me. This is a discussion that has been cycled time and time again. I've developed a calloused way of dealing with these things. Yes, I mocked you for suggesting that time and resources are irrelevant in game development. Yes, I'm an ****. Yes, you are still wrong.

Sure I forgive you. That is if you start reading my posts more carefully. Never have I said that time and resources are irrelvant. But I believe that I haven't made myself clear enough in my previous post, and I might have sounded as though I would suggest something like that which is my fault. But let me just clarify things by quoting myself.

Hanik Arran wrote...
It isn't that impropable that something like that will be done soon (and it is very likely that it will be Bioware who does it first). And of course it is feasible. Just have a look at Star Wars - The old Republic. They are doing the voices all the characters there. Which means player characters and NPCs. They say it's propably the biggest voiceover project ever (including games and movies). And this also means that with every expansion, every big addon or patch (if the latter contains new quests) they will need to do new voices again. And with a MMORPG there will be a much bigger amount of dialogue than in a single player RPG. So I think it's only a matter of time until something like that is done for games like DA:O.

If I had said that NPCs will be voiced in future games some years ago people like yourself would have told me just the same as you are telling me now. That I am wrong, because it takes ressources and time and look at what todays games are like. This will happen. I don't know when. Could be in a year, could be in a couple of years. Nonetheless, it will happen. If voicing the PCs in DA:O really would shorten the game by any amount I would strongly oppose it.

But the question still remains why it would shorten the game. Is it because voicing would be too expensive or because it would take too much diskspace? And until now noone could answer that. The answer in the Biowareforum didn't help much either as they closed the thread just after stating that the game would be 50% shorter. Thanks anyway for the link Shayna. :-)

Which brings me to the next question. Would there be enough people who would like the PC to be voiced? If only 10% of the players who would approve it and 90% would be against it, it wouldn't make any sense to do it. Hence the poll. If I would include the condition that the game would be shortened then I wouldn't even have to open a poll as most people including me wouldn't want that. I'm only interested if there are enough people who would want a voice for the PC at all. But please don't think I'm totally intolerant. I see your point and I can perfectly understand why you wouldn't like  your PC to talk. In the end it's not a matter of what is better but just a matter of personal taste. Some will be more comfortable with the old system from BG2 and some will prefer a more cineastic experience like in ME. So again, I think it should be a question of how many people would want the voice for the PC. And if we are talking about ressources and time then we could also question if there are many people who will for example play as a dwarf. Because if there was no dwarf origin, they could make the stories for the remaining origins longer. Not that I want that. But I believe you get what I mean. It's about what makes sense to make us, the players happy with the game.

Maria Caliban wrote...
Not only would that take from the resources of the game, thus shortening it, but then they'd have to create a way to display dialogue that worked both for text and spoken word.

I know it takes resources and time. It was already said a few times by the way. About creating a way to display dialogue that worked both ways, that would be the easiest part. You would have to chose the whole sentences (not like in ME) and if your PC has a voice you get a scene where he actually talks and if you don't it will be like it is now in DA:O.

[JEBesh]

Hanik Arran wrote...

Sure I forgive you. That is if you start reading my posts more carefully. Never have I said that time and resources are irrelvant. But I believe that I haven't made myself clear enough in my previous post, and I might have sounded as though I would suggest something like that which is my fault. But let me just clarify things by quoting myself.

I have read your posts carefully. Perhaps you should do the same for mine and see that I clearly said you suggested it. Completely disregarding my point that "not everybody would be happy" including the developers and saying that it isn't an argument that applies certainly implies that it is irrelevant, at the very least.

If I had said that NPCs will be voiced in future games some years ago people like yourself would have told me just the same as you are telling me now. That I am wrong, because it takes ressources and time and look at what todays games are like.

Considering that we are talking about DA:O and the resources that were available for its production; i.e not in the future, I fail to see what your point is.

Modifié par JEBesh, 27 octobre 2009 - 07:14 .

[lionsfan208]

Jab0r wrote...

If you want it to sound as though the PC is voiced, you can say each line of dialogue out loud to yourself before you click on it

The image of that is hilarious!

[OldMan91]

I love voicing the lines myself. I feel like an idiot, but I like pretending I can sound professional. Teehee.

That's what I do. In fact, while watching the trailers I would pause for a moment right when the dialogue choices appeared and i'd say them out as if I was the voice actor.

[Hanik Arran]

As you picked out only some parts of my post to dispute I'd assume that I had a point regarding the rest of it. If not, please comment on those parts you find still "wrong". 

JEBesh wrote...

I have read your posts carefully. Perhaps you should do the same for mine and see that I clearly said you suggested it. Completely disregarding my point that "not everybody would be happy" including the developers and saying that it isn't an argument that applies certainly implies that it is irrelevant, at the very least.

If you are keen on hairsplitting, so be it. I said before: "But I believe that I haven't made myself clear enough in my previous post, and I might have sounded as though I would suggest something like that which is my fault." So much for reading my posts carefully. So you think that you can make everybody happy when you release a game? Didn't think so. So if you can't make everybody happy no matter what you do then yes, that makes your argument pointless.

JEBesh wrote...Considering that we are talking about DA:O and the resources that were available for its production; i.e not in the future, I fail to see what your point is.

Still not reading carefully, eh? "This will happen. I don't know when. Could be in a year, could be in a couple of years. Nonetheless, it will happen." DA:O has gone gold. So it's pretty obvious I'm not talking about the first part here but maybe a sequel. Or even another one of Bioware's games. Or maybe a game from a different company. So either you are telling me were I stated that I was talking about DA:O specifically or stop suggesting things here. At least I admit when I have said something that could be taken the wrong way. Which is not the case here. And yes, it will take time and ressources in the future as well. But regarding that I have already given my point of view in my previous post so either you read that one from the start to the end and not just the points which you can quote to try to take them apart. If that's how you want to do it, then there is no need for me to waste any more time repliying to you.

[JEBesh]

Hanik Arran wrote...

As you picked out only some parts of my post to dispute I'd assume that I had a point regarding the rest of it. If not, please comment on those parts you find still "wrong".

I picked out the first half of your post because it seemed to be the only part that directly addressed me. I didn't answer your question of "why" it would shorten the game, because I don't know. I'm not a developer. All I know is that the developers have stated that it would. I cut out the second half of the "future" quote because I felt that the rest was just reiterating the piece that I had quoted.

If you are keen on hairsplitting, so be it. I said before: "But I believe that I haven't made myself clear enough in my previous post, and I might have sounded as though I would suggest something like that which is my fault." So much for reading my posts carefully. So you think that you can make everybody happy when you release a game? Didn't think so. So if you can't make everybody happy no matter what you do then yes, that makes your argument pointless.

Um, yes. I saw the piece of your post where you clearly said it was your fault if you suggested something like that through an error in communication. This contradicts your assertion that it was my fault for "not reading carefully." You accused me of doing something, and then contradicted this in the second half of the paragraph. Since you for some reason chose to leave the assertion in your post even after typing out the second half, I addressed it.

Still not reading carefully, eh? "This will happen. I don't know when. Could be in a year, could be in a couple of years. Nonetheless, it will happen." DA:O has gone gold. So it's pretty obvious I'm not talking about the first part here but maybe a sequel. Or even another one of Bioware's games. Or maybe a game from a different company. So either you are telling me were I stated that I was talking about DA:O specifically or stop suggesting things here. At least I admit when I have said something that could be taken the wrong way. Which is not the case here. And yes, it will take time and ressources in the future as well. But regarding that I have already given my point of view in my previous post so either you read that one from the start to the end and not just the points which you can quote to try to take them apart. If that's how you want to do it, then there is no need for me to waste any more time repliying to you.

Still making these strange accusations, eh? I read that part, chief. I did not put it past you to make a moot point for the sake of the argument, which is why I didn't find it strange that you were speaking of the future. Since you are asking for an explanation of how full PC voice would shorten DA:O, yes, it seems we are talking about DA:O. If you aren't, then the resources they had available for this project are irrelevant, so I don't know why you're bothering. It seemed that you were putting forth the idea that it would have been the better thing to do with DA:O. It isn't uncommon for people on the forums to not like a feature of DA:O and impose their own ideas for the sake of discussion.

Modifié par JEBesh, 27 octobre 2009 - 08:02 .

[Hanik Arran]

JEBesh wrote...

I picked out the first half of your post because it seemed to be the only part that directly addressed me. I didn't answer your question of "why" it would shorten the game, because I don't know. I'm not a developer. All I know is that the developers have stated that it would. I cut out the second half of the "future" quote because I felt that the rest was just reiterating the piece that I had quoted.

See? And that is were you were mistaken. Because if you would read carefully as you said you would you would have seen that I was not specifically talking about the current DA:O.

Um, yes. I saw the piece of your post where you clearly said it was your fault if you suggested something like that through an error in communication. This contradicts your assertion that it was my fault for "not reading carefully." You accused me of doing something, and then contradicted this in the second half of the paragraph. Since you for some reason chose to leave the assertion in your post even after typing out the second half, I addressed it.

Yes, I apologized because I might have sounded like suggesting it even though I believe it wasn't too hard to get what I meant. But if it helps you to get over it, I take saying that you didn't read carefully back for that post. Unfortunately you proved me right with your following posts.

Still making these strange accusations, eh? I read that part, chief. I did not put it past you to make a moot point for the sake of the argument, which is why I didn't find it strange that you were speaking of the future. Since you are asking for an explanation of how full PC voice would shorten DA:O, yes, it seems we are talking about DA:O. If you aren't, then the resources they had available for this project are irrelevant, so I don't know why you're bothering. It seemed that you were putting forth the idea that it would have been the better thing to do with DA:O. It isn't uncommon for people on the forums to not like a feature of DA:O and impose their own ideas for the sake of discussion.

Strange? You told me we are talking about DA:O here. And I'm still waiting for you to tell me were I said that. So I wouldn't call that strange, chief. A moot point? Are you saying that games will not evolve and feature voices for all the PCs in the future? Please don't ridicule yourself just for the sake of the argument. I strongly doubt that this is a moot point. Yes, I did ask about the reason behind the shorter game. Okay, it seems that I have to explain it to you. Because it would give me a clue where the difficulties are, hence what the difficulties would be concerning the developing of a future game. Because (again you should know that as you have read my posts so carefully) it might be a problem with diskspace. If it was then a 2 DVD version of DA:O 2 for example would fix that. So, no we are not talking about DA:O here. As I clearly stated a few times I am talking about future games. Of course I would appreciate a full voiceover for DA:O but as I was saying again and again I was talking about future generations of games. I hope this finally reached you know so we can get past this point as well.

To make things as simple as possible for you and to prevent any future misunderstandings I will try to shorten the lengthy part (which as you assumed just reiterated the first part, which is obviously wrong):

In the future including a voice for differnt classes/races in a game like (!!!) DA:O will happen (I think you won't argue that). Whatever the reason it would have shortened DA:O it will happen. Nonetheless the controversial point is if people would want their PC to have a voice at all. If most wouldn't want that their would be no use for companies to focus on that. If most would want that companies would try to make it happen. That's why I wanted to create a poll. I hope this was easy enough for you now.

Modifié par Hanik Arran, 27 octobre 2009 - 08:41 .

[JEBesh]

Hanik Arran wrote...

Yes, I apologized because I might have sounded like suggesting it even though I believe it wasn't too hard to get what I meant. But if it helps you to get over it, I take saying that you didn't read carefully back for that post. Unfortunately you proved me right with your following posts.

Gee, cool deal. I guess we can say you didn't read your own post carefully to need to back track on your original assertion like that. Neener neener, see the clever shot?

Strange? You told me we are talking about DA:O here. And I'm still waiting for you to tell me were I said that. So I wouldn't call that strange, chief. A moot point? Are you saying that games will not evolve and feature voices for all the PCs in the future? Please don't ridicule yourself just for the sake of the argument. I strongly doubt that this is a moot point. Yes, I did ask about the reason behind the shorter game. Because (again you should know that as you have read my posts so carefully) it might be a problem with diskspace. If it was then a 2 DVD version of DA:O 2 for example would fix that. So, no we are not talking about DA:O here. As I clearly stated a few times I am talking about future games. Of course I would appreciate a full voiceover for DA:O but as I was saying again and again I was talking about future generations of games. I hope this finally reached you know so we can get past this point as well.

Once again, I didn't say you explicitly said that. I said it seems that way, given that you are asking for an explanation on DA:O's limitations, regarding full VO. If we are talking about a sequel down the road, DA:O's limitations are irrelevant. Even the disc space limitations (I doubt this is the issue, though). Read carefully! (har-har, I did it again)

EDIT: Oh, I forgot to specifically address the first part! Silly me. No, I'm sure we will come to that point. I was calling it a moot point in the context of the discussion at hand (which again was implied to me that we were talking about DA:O) .

To make things as simple as possible for you and to prevent any future misunderstandings I will try to shorten the lengthy part (which as you assumed just reiterated the first part, which is obviously wrong):

In the future including a voice for differnt classes/races in a game like (!!!) DA:O will happen (I think you won't argue that). Whatever the reason it would have shortened DA:O it will happen. Nonetheless the controversial point is if people would want their PC to have a voice at all. If most wouldn't want that their would be no use for companies to focus on that. If most would want that companies would try to make it happen. That's why I wanted to create a poll. I hope this was easy enough for you now.

Ohh, you want a fully voiced sequel?! Well, shucks. Why didn't you say so? If I knew we weren't discussing DA:O on the DA:O forums, this would have been so much easier.

Modifié par JEBesh, 27 octobre 2009 - 09:05 .

[Hanik Arran]

JEBesh wrote...Once again, I didn't say you explicitly said that. I said it seems that way, given that you are asking for an explanation on DA:O's limitations, regarding full VO. If we are talking about a sequel down the road, DA:O's limitations are irrelevant. Even the disc space limitations (I doubt this is the issue, though). Read carefully! (har-har, I did it again)

Yes, you ridiculed yourself again. Congratulations.

JEBesh wrote...

Considering that we are talking about DA:O and the resources that were available for its production; i.e not in the future, I fail to see what your point is.

Can't admit when you are wrong, now can you? You didn't say it seemed that way. You stated it as a fact.
How did you put it? "I guess we can say you didn't read your own post carefully to need to back track on your original assertion like that. Neener neener, see the clever shot?" 

Ohh, you want a fully voiced sequel?! Well, shucks. Why didn't you say so? If I knew we weren't discussing DA:O on the DA:O forums, this would have been so much easier.

Yes, stated that a long time ago oh careful reader of other peoples posts. And trying to be sarcastic again won't strengthen your point here though I doubt you even have one.

Okay, listen. I'm tired of talking to you as you don't seem to be interested in the discussion itself but just in arguing specific sentences so you can have that warm fake feeling of being right. If you have something to say about the last sentence in my previous post (something constructive for a change would be nice) out with it! If not then this "discussion" is over.