85 réponses à ce sujet

[arafinwe_ingalaure]

I liked Tali in ME2 but I would understand if Garrus and her have a shorter screentime, But I think that Tali could still be important part of the story to rally the Quarians to Shepard, Vakarian could do the same for his species, I'm not a fan of Ashley and Kaidan, If I must cut something it would be them since the only thing they would bring to the story is romance, I would carry on Wrex over Grunt too,

[-Skorpious-]

I hate being the last post of a page (those posts barely get noticed). Anyways, I forgot to include my two cents on the topic in my previous post.

It isn't Tali and Garrus' fault for being in ME2 - its Bioware's fault for pushing for a "suicide mission" that completely derailed ME's excellent ending. While I thoroughly enjoyed ME2 as a game, it still remains one of the biggest disappointments in gaming for me.

Modifié par -Skorpious-, 28 décembre 2010 - 07:50 .

[jwalker]

Aeowyn wrote...

[..]


But with this logic Shepard will end up alone in ME3 having to gather an entire new squad. I just feel that Shepard won't really have time to run around and gather an entirely new squad in ME3 when the Reapers are attacking and more important things are in focus.

[...]

I don't believe that's a problem. In ME1, except Liara, you have a full squad prepped and ready for everything at the beggining of the game.
Recruiting people seems important in ME2 because well, ME2 doesn't have a much of a story other than recruiting itself

[jlb524]

I think this is all that can be said atm.

Will Tali and Garrus be in Mass Effect 3? Yes, if they survived.
Will they be squad mates or have a major role? Dunno.
Does the fact that they were killable in ME2 decrease their chances of being squad mates in ME3 or of having a large role? Yes.
Does the fact that they were killable in ME2 absolutely preclude  that they can be squad mates in ME3 or have a large role? No.

The same can be said for any ME2 squad mate, I guess.

Modifié par jlb524, 28 décembre 2010 - 08:00 .

[Aeowyn]

But then the same can be said for Ashley, Kaiden and Wrex as well. They can die in ME1, so then by the logic a lot of people in this thread seem to have, they cannot come back as squaddies in ME3.

I hope that Garrus at least will be back as a squad member (only because he really doesn't have anything to lose or anywhere else to go). I don't know if he will be, but if he's not I hope the writers at least give him a large role and don't reduce him to some cameo (because he's been fighting the Reapers with Shepard over two games now, why all of a sudden just leave?).
Considering the story of ME2 and the suicide mission, I really do hope that the writers for ME3 handles this well and don't rush it.

Modifié par Aeowyn, 28 décembre 2010 - 08:10 .

[Fiery Phoenix]

Aeowyn wrote...

But then the same can be said for Ashley, Kaiden and Wrex as well. They can die in ME1, so then by the logic a lot of people in this thread seem to have, they cannot come back as squaddies in ME3.

(...)

Ashley and Kaidan are one in the same as far as roles go. One of them being dead does not nullify the significance of the other. This is further proven by the fact that the Virmire survivor cannot join your squad in ME2 (and can't die as a result). Their status as a fully-fledged squadmate is pretty much guaranteed for ME3.

Wrex, on the other hand, probably ever will be back as a squadmate one way or the other. By uniting the krogan he's doing a lot more than he ever will by being Shepard's gun-for-hire.

Modifié par FieryPhoenix7, 28 décembre 2010 - 08:31 .

[jlb524]

Aeowyn wrote...

But then the same can be said for Ashley, Kaiden and Wrex as well. They can die in ME1, so then by the logic a lot of people in this thread seem to have, they cannot come back as squaddies in ME3.

The difference is that they fill the same role.  Either one or the other fit in the 'surviving Alliance soldier' niche.

The ME2 squad mates are one of 12 and any given combination of them could be present in ME3...this makes dealing with them a bit more difficult.

[Aeowyn]

Yeah true, hadn't thought of it that way. Oh well

[Shadow_Soul]

jlb524 wrote...

I think this is all that can be said atm.

Will Tali and Garrus be in Mass Effect 3? Yes, if they survived.
Will they be squad mates or have a major role? Dunno.
Does the fact that they were killable in ME2 decrease their chances of being squad mates in ME3 or of having a large role? Yes.
Does the fact that they were killable in ME2 absolutely preclude  that they can be squad mates in ME3 or have a large role? No.

The same can be said for any ME2 squad mate, I guess.

This. I think something else can be done too. Let's say Mordin died in your SM, well he's just gone, right? If you import that save into ME3, Mordin is dead, and there is just an empty space on the Normandy. And then lets say ME3 could be a couple years away so some others could be gone or dead, it depends. Well you get new people, but not to replace the dead/gone ones. You just have less people. Unless you got everybody out alive.
This still doesn't change the fact that I want Tali and Garrus in Shep's squad in ME3. I would like to finish the trilogy with them by Shep's side.

[PrinceLionheart]

jlb524 wrote...

Aeowyn wrote...

But then the same can be said for Ashley, Kaiden and Wrex as well. They can die in ME1, so then by the logic a lot of people in this thread seem to have, they cannot come back as squaddies in ME3.

The difference is that they fill the same role.  Either one or the other fit in the 'surviving Alliance soldier' niche.

The ME2 squad mates are one of 12 and any given combination of them could be present in ME3...this makes dealing with them a bit more difficult.

And I hate to sound like a broken record, but Wrex has also found his substitute in Wreav as the Krogan leader.

[Mr.BlazenGlazen]

PrinceLionheart wrote...

Mr.BlazenGlazen wrote...

Nice. Its another Tali/Garrus bashing, Ashley/Kaiden/Wrex/liara love thread. Gotta love those.

Hardly anyone is bashing Tali or Garrus. 

Read the rest of these posts. I echo my statement. Some of the logic here is absolutely hilarious, because if Liara/Ashley/Kaiden were squadmates they probably won't say all this other crap about the ME2 squadmates.

Like shooting ourselves in the foot for asking bioware to make tali and garrus squadmates? Now...thats funny. Because if I recall, (I'm not necessarily pointing fingers at any individual in general), but many Liara fans were demanding that bioware makes a Liara DLC so they can finally get her as a squadmate back. And for months several of her fans were trolling and bashing the ME2 squadmates, ME2 in general, and sometimes even Bioware itself. Guess what? They got what they wanted. But now that Liara became the shadow broker she most likely won't be a squadmate for ME3, and would most likely be sidelined again. She may have a couple of scenes that relate to the plot like ME2, and a continuation of the romance, but thats about it. 

As for the topic. No, not at all. I have no idea why you would ask this unless your troll baiting.

Modifié par Mr.BlazenGlazen, 28 décembre 2010 - 08:59 .

[Barquiel]

Mr.BlazenGlazen wrote...

Like shooting ourselves in the foot for asking bioware to make tali and garrus squadmates? Now...thats funny. Because if I recall, (I'm not necessarily pointing fingers at any individual in general), but many Liara fans were demanding that bioware makes a Liara DLC so they can finally get her as a squadmate back. And for months several of her fans were trolling and bashing the ME2 squadmates, ME2 in general, and sometimes even Bioware itself. Guess what? They got what they wanted. But now that Liara became the shadow broker she most likely won't be a squadmate for ME3, and would most likely be sidelined again. She may have a couple of scenes that relate to the plot like ME2, and a continuation of the romance, but thats about it. 

Your point, exactly?

1.) The Liara DLC was planned from before ME2 was released.
2.) It seems that I missed the Liara death scene in LOTSB

[mineralica]

I think that most favourite by fandom chars were treated first and that's why they're in vanilla ME2, LIs were saved for DLCs maybe for keeping an intrigue (or maybe more time for development - will anybody say that Liara have less screen time or her role is letter developed than Garrus'es?) and Wrex... well, complains about his role and absense in squad are far less loud than about VS or Liara. So one way or another all ME1 chars have (or will have) their piece of fun until ME3

[Brass_Buckles]

Right. I'm going to say here what I said in the Garrus thread. This may be senseless optimism by a fan, but to me, while I'm replaying ME1, it seems pretty obvious that the dev team meant to bring Garrus back in ME2, even if they didn't mean to bring Tali back. And now that they are potential romances in ME2, in order to conclude their romances the same as Kaidan's or Ashley's, as long as you kept them alive they will return in some form. They will most likely be squadmates, because this would be the easiest scenario to continue said romance. If you don't like romance/the characters/romance with those specific two characters, then you can have them killed off.

As to an important role... Even Wrex could die in ME1, but if you kept him alive, he has an important role. If not, someone else takes that role. I've read an interview (and I don't remember where) that either was referring to Wrex's substitute or strongly hinting that we'd see substitute cast members in ME3. So if you didn't keep your squad alive, you may do a bit of recruiting and get some replacements. Remember, this is the last game in the series and we've already been told that they're going to do their best to make it the best. They no longer have to worry about what happens in ME4 because there will not be an ME4. So two voice actors with similar lines? Entirely possible.

While I'm aware popularity does not cement anything in terms of who comes back, who lives, who has a cameo, etc., it will have a bearing on what Bioware elects to do with said characters. The more people who left a specific character alive in their playthrough, the more likely that character is to get more development for ME3.

Again, I wasn't around to demand the return of these characters. I honestly think that the original plan was to have them for all three games; however, if you kill them, this isn't possible. Not being around, I couldn't "shoot myself in the foot." And I also agree with Mr.BlazenGlazen that to put it that way does seem a bit provocative in tone. If you're annoyed your favorite didn't get in ME2, I'm sorry but I can't help you. If you don't like Garrus and Tali, I can't help you there, either. I'm not a huge fan of Tali, either--I don't like or dislike her. And I can see why some people would genuinely dislike Garrus as a character, even though I think he's awesome and needs more dialogue (not all my Shepards are inclined to romance a turian, and even those who are may enjoy just having a conversation with him...). But there are already hints that the squad from ME2 will be at least your starter squad in ME3, assuming none of them die or ditch you between the time frame of the two games. If not, then I'd like to know why I wasted all that time getting the best team in the galaxy together. And if they are in the squad as I strongly suspect they will be (if you didn't kill them), I'm sure Bioware already knows how much we all wanted more Garrus and Tali dialogue. They may not become great leaders unless they survive all the way through ME3, but I don't think that Bioware is going to stint its fans at the very end of the trilogy, unless a given character simply doesn't have enough of a following to put as much effort into him/her.



That said, it's just a pair of fictional characters. No one's life is going to be over if they barely appear or don't appear at all in ME3. I'm going to play ME3 regardless just because I want to know what happens to Shepard at the end of the trilogy. I understand there will be hints at what's to come after Shepard's story.

[GodWood]

Do not want Tali.

Indifferent about Garrus.

[Alamar2078]

I'm perfectly fine with both Tali && Garrus in ME2. They played their roles and were welcome from a continuity standpoint.

If they aren't squadmates but at least are handled in an important manner [maybe they'll be important in various Acts but not others] then I'm fine with that.

On the other hand if all I get from them is a single Email then it's "Torch & Pitchfork" time

Edit: I believe that Garrus & Tali can play "important" roles in a similar way to Wrex & Wreav.  I do think B/W can do better than that but this level would be the minimum that I would consider satisfactory.

Modifié par Alamar2078, 28 décembre 2010 - 11:44 .

[RiotLaFontaine]

PrinceLionheart wrote...

And I hate to sound like a broken record, but Wrex has also found his substitute in Wreav as the Krogan leader.

But this was when they were concerned with too many branching variables in a middle act.  Now that they've reached the endpoint, variables can branch and it won't matter because there's no concern with continuity post-ME3, assuming this remains a Shepard-trilogy.

They can play with a default set of returning ME2 characters and bonus characters for those who had additional survivors.

Previous concerns are not necessarily current concerns.

[Mr.BlazenGlazen]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

Brass_Buckles wrote...
Not being around, I couldn't "shoot myself in the foot." And I also agree with Mr.BlazenGlazen that to put it that way does seem a bit provocative in tone.

Also, the fact that certain participants in this thread's discussion are Ashley/Kaidan/Liara/Wrex fans is irrelevant, and I see no hint of bitterness or vindictiveness coming from myself or anyone else in this thread. Just because I believe that these characters will have a drastically reduced story role and screentime in ME3 does not mean that I actively desire it, nor does it mean that I seek it out of some form of petty revenge. The potential deaths of these ME2 characters will severely undermine the hypothetical role they may have enjoyed in ME3 had they maintained their plot armour.

Enough with the straw men, please. I do not believe this will be the case due to bitterness.

Well its nice. Because I'm sure that more than half of you actively desire the thought of taking out Garrus/ Tali and give all the important roles to Liara/Kaidan/Ashley. Several of you actually said so yourselves in the past.

[Pacifien]

Fandom bickering is not pretty.

[Badpie]

I was happy to see Tali and Garrus back in ME2. I really liked them in ME1. I was kind of disappointed with the direction they took their characters in ME2. Garrus turned all cowboy and Tali got kind of hero-worshippy. Not deal breakers for me liking them, but it altered my opinion of them slightly.

[Alphia]

I could never regret having Tali and Garrus in ME2. I took them with me to the final battle with the human reaper, and there are no other beings in the universe I would have rather had at my side.



I'm a firm believer that surviving team members in ME2 will be team members in ME3, and none of the arguments I've heard thus far could convince me otherwise.

[Cra5y Pineapple]

tonnactus wrote...

Both got completely ruined in the second game.Garrus,not matter what the player did in the first game,became the stupid vigilante on omega and tali became a fangirl who adores shepardt so much so she even mentioned him/her in audio logs.Disgusting.

"Stupid Vigilante"? So you'd just sit there and let Omega burn and let the man keep you down? No, Garrus believes in JUSTICE. He is TURIAN BATMAN for God's sake!

As for Tali, she's become badass in case you haven't noticed. And...you know...an interesting character that talks about more than just the Flotilla.

Modifié par Cra5y Pineapple, 31 décembre 2010 - 12:04 .

[Bourne Endeavor]

Absolutely not. Tali went from a largely irrelevant character to having arguably the most in-depth growth in the series. Her loyalty mission was again arguably the best in the game for the innumerable angles explored in proper fashion, despite a constrained timeslot. Garrus is my favorite of the crew, so his return was appreciated but unfortunately his horrid lack of dialogue was frustrating.

People have a misguided belief that plot armor for Ash/Kaidan, Wrex and Liara translate into assured and lengthened content and neglect a fundamental flaw. Ash/Kaidan and Wrex have interchangeable characters and therefore must have their de facto shadow mimick whatever role they are provided. This would entail double the work required to allot them plentiful substance to the plot. If Wrex is recruitable, Wreav may have to be. The alternative could be killing Wrex leaves you less a squad mate but in that scenario, Bioware must explain why Wreav would turn you down and subsequent create a plausible purpose for him.

Suffice it to say, they suffer almost an identical problem which may plague Garrus and Tali. Whatever Bioware does will have the potential to be lost content. If this is not a qualm for Bioware than Garrus has as much likelihood to return as Wrex. Unless Bioware is practicularly daring, none of the squads of either game will have a large involvement with the plot.

Liara is almost certainly removed from an active role after LotSB.

Modifié par Bourne Endeavor, 31 décembre 2010 - 01:36 .

[silver_sparrow]

no, I thought they were a nice addition to the squad. now there special.