927 réponses à ce sujet

[Phaedon]

evil-pineapples wrote...
Anything is possible with sufficient time and money. The problem is that the good men and women at BioWare may or may not have those things at their disposal. We just don't know.

We do know. Take a look at the consequences of actions so far. The minimum of effort (just removing squaddies) is extremely easy.

[evil-pineapples]

BioWare has gone on record as saying that ME3 will be easier to develop than ME2 because they don't have to worry about carrying your actions over into another sequel. Hopefully, that also means they'll put more effort into showing you the consequences of your actions in the first two games.

Modifié par evil-pineapples, 03 janvier 2011 - 11:42 .

[Evelinessa]

evil-pineapples wrote...

lazuli wrote...

Phaedon wrote...

To make a short pause, do we all agree that it is possible ?

I confess ignorance on the specifics of game development, but I should think that it would be possible to bring back the ME2 squadmates in a significant way, given the appropriate amount of resources and time.

Anything is possible with sufficient time and money. The problem is that the good men and women at BioWare may or may not have those things at their disposal. We just don't know.

Two things that many of you aren't considering:
*New players. Anyone who picks up ME3 without having played the two previous games needs to have some kind of connection to their squad. BioWare needs to spend time and resources fleshing out the squad for these players. It's not all about the uber-fans. (It should be, but it's not.)
*The suicide mission. No, I'm not talking about squad deaths. I'm talking about Shepard. It's possible to kill Shepard on the suicide mission. What the hell is BioWare going to do about that?

Here's hoping for a 3 or 4 disc epic conclusion to the trilogy with all variables taken into account!

1) All they have to do is at the beginning of the game the new player can meet the old squadmates and talk to them. I don't know how to do it but make the player know that this is a squadmate that knows Shepard well and tell some background. But it can't be too obvious to the returning players that the old squadmate is explaining itself even though the returning player already knows who he/she is.

2) If Shepard dies in the suicide mission then that playthrough can't be imported to ME3. So BioWare doesn't even have to worry about that. The trilogy is about Shepard's story so if Shepard isn't there then the story can't continue.

Yeah, I'm hoping we get at least 3 discs. And I don't see why a lot of people have a problem(I'm not directing this at you, I'm talking about other people) with changing discs. It just takes 5 seconds.

[Ghost Warrior]

I hope and believe ME2 squadmates will be back in ME3.Wanna know why?Because Bioware knows that the fans of this game(millions) won't finish it just once,and especially not with half of the team dead.Nobody I know finished first two games just once,so...

[ScotOfClanDonald]

darth_lopez wrote...

My god. What irks me is that i'm willing to bet half the people who say importing squadies is implausible or impossible support Multiplayer in ME 3 >.< something that has no grounds in the game series at all and would take sooo much effort to fix and would probably be screwed over by DICE influence. Apparenlty making a network for thousands of fans to play on is far easier than importing upto 12 characters My Bad.

What?  I have no concern for multiplayer whatsoever, and I don't even see how the issues are related.  It's almost certainly different teams working on those issues, if ME3 even has multiplayer.

EDIT:
Also they wouldn't need to sub characters Morinth/samara style. Character = dead simply leave them red greyed out. done. 3-4 new squdies to acount for dead ones Done. Perhaps even cut like 4 potentially surviving squadies because they have other priorities. the only ones that really need to be with shepard for consistency/story sake are:
Mordin, tali, garrus, miranda, jacob, legion. all else are expendable. especially thane, being terminally ill and all him and zaeed would be the easiest to kick out, followed by samarra and kasumi then grunt

See, this is the problem.  You are making judgment calls based on who you think is important or expendable.  Believe me, there are folks out there who think that Garrus and Tali are completely expendable and wouldn't shed a tear if they weren't in the third game.  Almost everyone I talk to can barely even remember Jacob, much less note his relevance to the plot.

On top of that, you're still considering it okay to have dead characters just remain as wasted resources.  Yes, creating new characters is just as much work as importing the old ones, but at least with new characters, we're guaranteed not to completely miss out on them.  There are gameplay balance issues.  Completely aside from fanservice, Bioware needs to make sure that the characters are balanced so that you can face all the challenges no matter what your character build is.  It's possible, for example, for you to get all the characters from previous games capable of AI Hacking killed.  Some missions may be balanced specifically for AI Hacking to be necessary.  Do you tell the person who this has happened to that they're SOL?

No.  A responsible developer makes sure that the previous games' variables don't interfere with the gameplay in the current game.  The plot will demand new characters, I'm guessing.

Listen, there's no chance that Bioware is going to hang us out to dry with no resolution for our favorite characters.  I'm just saying that bringing everybody back into the squad is a lot more complicated than some folks are letting on. 

[lazuli]

ScotOfClanDonald wrote...

There are gameplay balance issues.  Completely aside from fanservice, Bioware needs to make sure that the characters are balanced so that you can face all the challenges no matter what your character build is.  It's possible, for example, for you to get all the characters from previous games capable of AI Hacking killed.  Some missions may be balanced specifically for AI Hacking to be necessary.  Do you tell the person who this has happened to that they're SOL?
 

I'm finding it hard to envision a level in which AI Hacking would be "necessary."  A far more vital power to use in your example would be Overload or Warp, though, especially if the defense system makes a comeback.  I understand your point though. 

One way to address this would be to give the squadmates access to a larger number of abilities, like in ME1.  Kaidan, for instance, could handle almost all of your Biotic and Tech needs.

[ScotOfClanDonald]

lazuli wrote...

I'm finding it hard to envision a level in which AI Hacking would be "necessary."  A far more vital power to use in your example would be Overload or Warp, though, especially if the defense system makes a comeback.  I understand your point though. 

One way to address this would be to give the squadmates access to a larger number of abilities, like in ME1.  Kaidan, for instance, could handle almost all of your Biotic and Tech needs.

But Kaidan... could be dead.  That's my point.  What happens if the only people that survived were Ashley, Liara, Grunt, and Samara... if your Shepard is a biotic or soldier, who would handle your tech stuff?  How could you handle a suicide mission-type scenario if there's nobody left who can "hack the vents" (or whatever the ME3 equivilant is)?  Are you just screwed at that point?

I'm just saying, Bioware won't do that.

[Ryuukishi]

 I am sincerely bewildered by the argument that "BioWare can't/won't waste time creating content that not all players will see." They do that all the time. ME1, ME2, and Dragon Age are full of content that's totally optional and content that branches or becomes inaccessible based on choices you make. You don't even have to recruit Grunt, Legion, Garrus, or Wrex. You are limited to one love interest per playthrough in ME1. Shepard can only have one gender per playthrough. There are all kinds of optional sidequests.

Honestly, what is the big difference between recording dialog and designing a skill tree for Jack (for instance) in Mass Effect 3, even though it's possible that some players won't experience that content because she's dead in their import; and recording dialog and designing a skill tree for Grunt in Mass Effect 2, even though it's possible that some players never take him out of the tank?

[Elite Midget]

I'm surprised this thread is still up? What's there to disguess anymore? There are the realistThe party I fall in) that know that we'll get a new Squaddie Party and there are the Disillusioned Ones(The Rival Party) that expects their selfish and self-centered demands to be met and care not the millions of dollars and thousands of man hours that would be required to bring back the Zombies and intergrateing them into the ME3 Story from start to finish.

This reminds me ofmany other debates of age old...

The Realists are those speak the truth and prepare for the worst case scenerios.

The Disillusioned Ones are those that are very vocal, defy all shreds of logic and fact, demand that things go 'their' way or they'll throw a fit, and don't prepare for anything else other than what they have selfishly demanded because there's 'no way' that their selfish demands wont be met despite the millions of dollars and thousands of man hours that would be required compared to the alternatives. To them none of this matters because they will simply throw a fit if they don't get what they want and care not what the developers had been throwing at them in the previous games.

Example - "Garrus will never reach his full potiential while he remains under Shepards Command"

Realists Logic - "Bioware may use this as an excuse to have Garrus leave since he can die in multiple ways in ME2."

The Disillusioned Ones Logic - "It means that Garrus WILL NEVER LEAVE MY SQUAD! EVER! Bioware will never do what I don't demand because my demands are the only path that is right!!!"

Example - "Tali is being considered for the Admiralty Board"

Realists Logic - "Perhaps this is foreshadowing that even an exiled Tali will eventually return to lead the Quarian people?"

The Disillusioned Ones Logic - "I bedded Tali! Thus that means only that scenerio should be acconted for! All others don't matter! TALI STAYS WITH ME SO THAT I MAY SHAG HER EVERY NIGHT! Besides... Tali is better off in my kitchen than doing anything 'important' like leading an entire people through an uncertiann future!"

Example - "My name is Thane and I am dieing of a disease and I refuse any and all medical treatments. I'm content with dieing now."

Realists Logic - "Guess that means that Thane will be dead anyway... Retribution takes place a year after ME2 and before ME3 while Thane has stated that at most he has 6 months to live."

The Disillusioned Ones Logic - "RETCON! Thane somehow lives and remains in my Squad!"

Finally...

Example - "Every single ME2 Squaddie can die and the save can still be imported. Only Shepard must be alive in every import save."

Realists Logic - "With all the Squaddies being killable, tons of hints thrown throughout ME2 via dialouge/hints/e-mails, and the such.... It seems that we shall be welcoming a new Permanent Squaddie Party for ME3. I suppose it couldn't be helped. What with the many different fates and combinations for the now dead ME2 Squaddies."

The Disillusioned Ones Logic - "Everyone of them 'MUST' return and as a member of my Squaddie party despite all the hints/dialouge/e-mails that Bioware threw at me in ME2! Whop cares about imports that lost Squaddies! They should be PUNISHED and have less dialouge, character interaction, less max Squaddie size, less missions, the worst possible ending as the ONLY ending, and less EVERYTHING so that they have a much WORSE ME3 experience than I! Their ME3 run should be harder, have less resources, less strategy, and everything of the such because they lost someone in ME2! I don't care what anyone else says! They WILL return because I demand it and I didn't say they were done being my 'MIND SLAVES'! Even than, if they 'must' die(Which 'DEVIES' all logic since anything that goes against my selfish demands is illolgical) than Tali and Garrus should return despite them having the same amount of death chances as the rest of the Suicide Squad!

I have spoken! Now gather my brothers and sisters and lets try and 'burn' the non-believers that refuse to submit to our selfish demands!!!"

[Praetor Knight]

Elite Midget wrote...

*snip*

I have spoken! Now gather my brothers and sisters and lets try and 'burn' the non-believers that refuse to submit to our selfish demands!!!"

What did I miss?

[Elite Midget]

Nothing, just me summing up the two parties.



Clearly we all know which party has the higher ground but the vocal ones will have you believe otherwise.

[ScotOfClanDonald]

Technically I think they would be the "Illusioned Ones," as the "Disillusioned Ones" would have no illusions about getting all their favorite squadmates back permanently



I do tend to fall on the side of Bioware being able to please everybody by putting a LotSB-type quest for each surviving squaddie within missions that we'd aready be doing anyway, thus maintaining both fanservice and making sure everyone gets to see the nice missions and environments that Bio painstakingly designed whether they have a returning loyal squadmate or not.



RE: "wasted" material. The point of the "wasted" material issue is that most people who purchase the game will probably only play once. I don't have the statistics on that, but I'm guessing it's reasonably accurate. Bioware wants anyone to play the game to have an effectively full game regardless of whether they're a newcomer to the series or importing a save (which can be an "everyone lives" save or a "complete cluster FUBAR" save or anyone in between). For a gameplay element as vital as companions, they can't really leave party composition to chance, and they want anyone playing the game to be able to recruit all of the main story's squadmates no matter what their statuses in the previous games are.

[Phaedon]

Elite Midget wrote...
Pointless wall of text

You have added absolutely nothing. You are trying to prove that it's impossible for Bioware to remove squaddies by changing a simple flag. I don't care if you have no experience in this kind of stuff, you could have not ignored everyone who replied to your posts or tried a Save Editor if you don't believe them.

Claiming to be a realist rather than an optimist while using a very peculiar definition of 'fact' should be noted as well.
From the looks of it, almost everyone agrees that it is possible. Whether or not you think that Bioware would do it is irrelevant and I blame myself for letting this thread degrade into a 'I don't think that Bioware would/should do it' discussion while there are other threads for this.

I also hear that inflammatory posts tend to be frowned upon by moderators, so please edit your post before someone reports you.

Modifié par Phaedon, 03 janvier 2011 - 08:24 .

[darth_lopez]

ScotOfClanDonald wrote...

darth_lopez wrote...

My god. What irks me is that i'm willing to bet half the people who say importing squadies is implausible or impossible support Multiplayer in ME 3 >.< something that has no grounds in the game series at all and would take sooo much effort to fix and would probably be screwed over by DICE influence. Apparenlty making a network for thousands of fans to play on is far easier than importing upto 12 characters My Bad.

What?  I have no concern for multiplayer whatsoever, and I don't even see how the issues are related.  It's almost certainly different teams working on those issues, if ME3 even has multiplayer.

not directed at you specifically, but equally important as the MP functionality has come up for debate recently and with no confirmation from BW that ME3 will/willnot have MP the multiplayer seems to have a horde of vocal supporters when it will take more resources to make an effective multiplayer feature than to import the characters. Yet people will still say that the characters either Have too many variables associated with them, or will take up too many resources. 

EDIT:
Also they wouldn't need to sub characters Morinth/samara style. Character = dead simply leave them red greyed out. done. 3-4 new squdies to acount for dead ones Done. Perhaps even cut like 4 potentially surviving squadies because they have other priorities. the only ones that really need to be with shepard for consistency/story sake are:
Mordin, tali, garrus, miranda, jacob, legion. all else are expendable. especially thane, being terminally ill and all him and zaeed would be the easiest to kick out, followed by samarra and kasumi then grunt

See, this is the problem.  You are making judgment calls based on who you think is important or expendable.  Believe me, there are folks out there who think that Garrus and Tali are completely expendable and wouldn't shed a tear if they weren't in the third game.  Almost everyone I talk to can barely even remember Jacob, much less note his relevance to the plot.

only garrus was a judgement call based off of Whom i think is important or expendable.

The fact of the matter is that jack, thane, samara/morinth, grunt, kasumi(maybe-another thread discussing this issue), and Zaeed are by all means not realated to the overarching plot of ME.

for the others the following

---maybe spoilers---
Tali-exiled, or popular potential admiral can influence geth/quarians/citadel diplomacy Key for gaining Quarian allies
Legion-Geth, necessary to unite geth, nnecessary for geth/quarian, citadel/geth peace True geth enemies of the reapers.
Mordin-necessary for reversal of genophage, influential factor on krogan relations, Krogan good warriors maybe necessary foot soldiers against the reapers, reversal of genophage ensures Krogan army for Citadel Krogan Alliegence to citadel(or just shepard)
miranda&jacob-Cerberus agents, Cerberus Ships, Cerberus mission, Cerberus= Plot armor.
---end---

Those are evaluations based off of fact and it shows their correlation tot he overarching(the important) story line of ME while not essential in ME 2 they are necessary to the plot.

furhtermore i remember hearing rumors that garrus may have been established as shepards cannonical best friend, if these are true then there is a good liklihood that he will be returning in ME 3 if BW rules it as such.

On top of that, you're still considering it okay to have dead characters just remain as wasted resources.  Yes, creating new characters is just as much work as importing the old ones, but at least with new characters, we're guaranteed not to completely miss out on them.

ah yes the "it's somewhat optional so it's wasted resources" argument again. This comes with every RPG it's a given of the field there will be wasted resources based off of player decissions if BW can get away with 6 potential wastes out of this i think that's good given the horrid amount of them in ME 2. too elaborate: all minable plannets, not all we're necessary for research, 8 party members, 12 missions[loyalty], every sidequest, upgrades for the normandy. These are all wasted resources if the player chooses not to use them. they add up to much more than 3 or so dead characters(rough statistical average).

however your argument is totally reliant on the idea that "because they can be wasted resources they are" which simply isn't true. Obviously not all players are goign to have the same dead characters and not all players are going to research, or pick up the same things in ME 2. if it enhances immersion and the player's enjoyment then it isn't waste of resources.

Also if you're worried about not being able to use all your former teammates that you want, there are walkthroughs. infact Game informer published a rather nice one not long ago.  so yeah if you want to use the characters you have all the resources you need to actually use them. I've only had 2 playthroughs where i actually lost people who would seem essential to ME 3s story and only 2 where i lost people i liked. given on average most people have the majority of their squad survive i'm guessing that others can say the same. so yes there is a garuntee that they won't simply be wasted resources. Besides Shepard dies if too few squaddies survive. (pretty sure the magic number is 3 survivors)

 There are gameplay balance issues.  Completely aside from fanservice, Bioware needs to make sure that the characters are balanced so that you can face all the challenges no matter what your character build is.  It's possible, for example, for you to get all the characters from previous games capable of AI Hacking killed.  Some missions may be balanced specifically for AI Hacking to be necessary.  Do you tell the person who this has happened to that they're SOL?

they can just change squaddie powers, they've done it once already shouldn't be a suprise. this is a relatively minor matter here.

frankly i think the majority of us found this Useless. AI hackign is very situational and often the situations it was really useful in both games were very scarce i'd say Axe it entirely.

No.  A responsible developer makes sure that the previous games' variables don't interfere with the gameplay in the current game.  The plot will demand new characters, I'm guessing.

Now either you're saying it was a bad move for Bioware to have an import save file from ME 1 to ME 2 feature in ME 2 or you're honestly trying to troll me.

Eitherway unless you plan on revamping the general story layout of a trilogy(you know how the third is thypicaly the conlcusion) i dont' see how the plot could possibly demand new characters when ME 2 already served the purpose of team building and ME 1 a similar role. if we need to get a new squad and do their new missions again it would be totally redundant and not ME 3 which has been stated by BW to be the close of the shepard arc. Thus there needs to be a conclusions of the reaper threat or shepards role in it. Either shepard and his already assembled team dies. or the reapers are beaten back those are the only option plot wise and neither are really open to recruiting a vast amount of new members.

Listen, there's no chance that Bioware is going to hang us out to dry with no resolution for our favorite characters.  I'm just saying that bringing everybody back into the squad is a lot more complicated than some folks are letting on. 

it's not as complicated as most folks would have you believe. and frankly cameo resolutions of characters who people ended ME 2 thinking "hey we're going to fight the reapers with these guys" isn't going to cut it.

RE: "wasted" material. The point of the "wasted" material issue is that
most people who purchase the game will probably only play once. I
don't have the statistics on that, but I'm guessing it's reasonably
accurate. Bioware wants anyone to play the game to have an effectively
full game regardless of whether they're a newcomer to the series or
importing a save (which can be an "everyone lives" save or a "complete
cluster FUBAR" save or anyone in between). For a gameplay element as
vital as companions, they can't really leave party composition to
chance, and they want anyone playing the game to be able to recruit all
of the main story's squadmates no matter what their statuses in the
previous games are.

edit: now that i've seen this i can rebut it somewhat.

I'm fairly doubftul that msot people who buy ME 3 are planning on playing it only 1 time, if that were the case they should just rent it at blockbuster. Typically people only buy games they like to play which insinuates replay value. ME series has a high replayability value because each game is interconnected the entire trilogy so far has been designed for replay. especailly ME 2, given after the first time you beat the game you get bonus resources and after completeing loyalty missions you get a bonus power similarly ME 1 hat achievements and bonus talents associated with most combat achievements. A sign that the games have been designed with replay in mind. So far from these forums alone and the numerous suggestions various class groups i'm guessing their strategy to ecnourage replay has been working fine. Most people i know have played both games or Promptly bought the missing one after playing the one they tried. Lets also not forget about the New Game + featured in both ME 1 and ME 2. though more porminently used in ME 1 ,i'd guess only, is designed to reqard players with more gameply with their old shepards, new choices, new party same shepard. This is something that's obviously geared towarads replay.

Considering they made a Default shepard, for ME 2, i'm willing to bet they'd make a default shepard for ME 3, it's sorta obvious if they wanna make money, I'm willing to bet off of the gameplay statistics, if i remember the quote from earlier(80% of all squad mates survive) the squaddies they use are part of that 80% of survivors.  so the majority of default shepards party would most likely survive. this i would say is a reasonable expectation given the statistics and replay factor the game offers to it's audience.

Modifié par darth_lopez, 03 janvier 2011 - 08:57 .

[darth_lopez]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...

*snip*

I have spoken! Now gather my brothers and sisters and lets try and 'burn' the non-believers that refuse to submit to our selfish demands!!!"

What did I miss?

i think he's finally cracked i'm not sure i'm very confused now....i don't know what just happened

srry for double post some how i missed his wall of text while scrolling down the page.

Modifié par darth_lopez, 03 janvier 2011 - 08:46 .

[Wittand25]

Phaedon wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...
Pointless wall of text

You have added absolutely nothing. You are trying to prove that it's impossible for Bioware to remove squaddies by changing a simple flag. I don't care if you have no experience in this kind of stuff, you could have not ignored everyone who replied to your posts or tried a Save Editor if you don't believe them.

Claiming to be a realist rather than an optimist while using a very peculiar definition of 'fact' should be noted as well.
From the looks of it, almost everyone agrees that it is possible. Whether or not you think that Bioware would do it is irrelevant and I blame myself for letting this thread degrade into a 'I don't think that Bioware would/should do it' discussion while there are other threads for this.

I also hear that inflammatory posts tend to be frowned upon by moderators, so please edit your post before someone reports you.

It is also possible that I will become elected pope within the next month. Possible does not imply likely.

And what you and others want is that Bioware creates significant content and then disables it for those with a wrong safe. Not only does creating the content take up lots of resources, making sure that the game remains playable and finish-able for every possible import would be a nightmare and use up even more resources if Bioware attempted to do it that way.

I do agree however to your opinion regarding Elites style. Even if I believe that he is right and anyone believing the whole squad will be back is in denial or worse his style of writing is inflammatory and I hope that he will tone it down a bit.

[Phaedon]

Wittand25 wrote...

It is also possible that I will become elected pope within the next month. Possible does not imply likely.

And what you and others want is that Bioware creates significant content and then disables it for those with a wrong safe. Not only does creating the content take up lots of resources, making sure that the game remains playable and finish-able for every possible import would be a nightmare and use up even more resources if Bioware attempted to do it that way.

I do agree however to your opinion regarding Elites style. Even if I believe that he is right and anyone believing the whole squad will be back is in denial or worse his style of writing is inflammatory and I hope that he will tone it down a bit.

I think that you have misunderstood me. The common misconception is not that it's unlikely, but that it's impossible. It is in fact, technically possible. Whether or not squaddies will return or not, is right now only a matter of opinion since there is nothing to adaquetely support either side of the arguement, at least for now.

[darth_lopez]

Wittand25 wrote...

Phaedon wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...
Pointless wall of text

You have added absolutely nothing. You are trying to prove that it's impossible for Bioware to remove squaddies by changing a simple flag. I don't care if you have no experience in this kind of stuff, you could have not ignored everyone who replied to your posts or tried a Save Editor if you don't believe them.

Claiming to be a realist rather than an optimist while using a very peculiar definition of 'fact' should be noted as well.
From the looks of it, almost everyone agrees that it is possible. Whether or not you think that Bioware would do it is irrelevant and I blame myself for letting this thread degrade into a 'I don't think that Bioware would/should do it' discussion while there are other threads for this.

I also hear that inflammatory posts tend to be frowned upon by moderators, so please edit your post before someone reports you.

It is also possible that I will become elected pope within the next month. Possible does not imply likely.

And what you and others want is that Bioware creates significant content and then disables it for those with a wrong safe. Not only does creating the content take up lots of resources, making sure that the game remains playable and finish-able for every possible import would be a nightmare and use up even more resources if Bioware attempted to do it that way.

it would take up the same amount of resources as adding new characters to it. The problem does however then becomes a series of questions: who do most players use and survive with? who is integral to plot? who is--etc. and as i've previously stated, in an edit, the game series has been designed for rplay, couldn't use the characters the first time around? roll through again. it isn't hard to figure out what to do to save the team.

edit: srry i'm a bit sleepy atm if anything seems outta place pm me and i'll fix later

Modifié par darth_lopez, 03 janvier 2011 - 09:10 .

[Wittand25]

Phaedon wrote...
I think that you have misunderstood me. The common misconception is not that it's unlikely, but that it's impossible. It is in fact, technically possible. Whether or not squaddies will return or not, is right now only a matter of opinion since there is nothing to adaquetely support either side of the arguement, at least for now.

just because there is no proof for either site does not mean that it cannot be discussed or that one outcome is far more likely to happen than the other one. And even if Elite frequently misuses the term fact, we can look at facts, past behavior and announcements from Bioware and with the help of logic try to find out what will likely happen.

And taking all the problems that having the whole squad return as part of the squad in ME3 into account, I would say that the probability for that to happen is bellow 0.1 .

[JrayM16]

Indeed, plotting will likely be the concern. I have no doubt that Bioware could atleast get all squaddies into the game as party members. The question is whether or not they could develop a plot that would involve most or all of the squaddies while at the same time compensating for the fact that they may have died previously.

[Zulu_DFA]

Phaedon wrote...

Wittand25 wrote...

It is also possible that I will become elected pope within the next month. Possible does not imply likely.

And what you and others want is that Bioware creates significant content and then disables it for those with a wrong safe. Not only does creating the content take up lots of resources, making sure that the game remains playable and finish-able for every possible import would be a nightmare and use up even more resources if Bioware attempted to do it that way.

I do agree however to your opinion regarding Elites style. Even if I believe that he is right and anyone believing the whole squad will be back is in denial or worse his style of writing is inflammatory and I hope that he will tone it down a bit.

I think that you have misunderstood me. The common misconception is not that it's unlikely, but that it's impossible. It is in fact, technically possible. Whether or not squaddies will return or not, is right now only a matter of opinion since there is nothing to adaquetely support either side of the arguement, at least for now.

There is only one misconception here: your thinkning that when people say "impossible" they mean "100% impossible", while in fact they mean "99% unlikely". Which is understood by everybody except you, and considered as good as impossible. Even by some people who don't think so, but choose not to to create another "Bring all squadmates back" thread under the disguise of picking on semantics.

[darth_lopez]

@jray
i'm fully confident if bioware chose to allow some, or all preferably some, of the squaddies back from ME 2 they would be able to work out the plotting fine. So long as they don't pull an ME 2 type story.

Modifié par darth_lopez, 03 janvier 2011 - 09:21 .

[Phaedon]

Wittand25 wrote...
just because there is no proof for either site does not mean that it cannot be discussed or that one outcome is far more likely to happen than the other one. And even if Elite frequently misuses the term fact, we can look at facts, past behavior and announcements from Bioware and with the help of logic try to find out what will likely happen.

 

I am generally OK with discussion about squaddies returning or not in this thread, even though it's far from this thread's subject. I will no longer support it however, if it degrades this thread more with additional inflammatory posts.

And taking all the problems that having the whole squad return as part of the squad in ME3 into account, I would say that the probability for that to happen is bellow 0.1 .

To which problems are you refering to exactly? And no, unless you mean 0.1/1, then your estimate is too extreme. In fact, I personally consider the squaddies returning likely, but uncertain at this point.

Zulu_DFA wrote...
There is only one misconception here: your thinkning that when people say "impossible" they mean "100% impossible", while in fact they mean "99% unlikely". Which is understood by everybody except you, and considered as good as impossible. Even by some people who don't think so, but choose not to to create another "Bring all squadmates back" thread under the disguise of picking on semantics.

Except that the misconception that I am refering to is common not only here, but other forums as well. There are people who said 'There is no way that squaddies return to ME3, too many variables. As for discussion about squaddies actually returning, then I'd rather see it elsewhere, on more appropriate threads, but as I said to Wittand, I am OK with it right now.

Modifié par Phaedon, 03 janvier 2011 - 09:44 .

[Zulu_DFA]

Phaedon wrote...
Except that the misconception that I am refering to is common not only here, but other forums as well. There are people who said 'There is no way that squaddies return to ME3, too many variables.

That doesn't mean "It's impossible".

That means: "It's extremely unlikely, practically impossible, the possibility is miniscule, negligible, not worthy being talked of."

[Phaedon]

Zulu_DFA wrote...
That doesn't mean "It's impossible".

That means: "It's extremely unlikely, practically impossible, the possibility is miniscule, negligible, not worthy being talked of."

And it's extremely unlikely because of all the variables?