78 réponses à ce sujet

[MassEffect762]

Me getting out of the house. ha.



What LeonBrass said.

[Bamboozalist]

In ME1 90% of my galaxy side quests were spent shooting at the distant terrain in the Mako as a made my way across a vast wasteland of uninteresting terrain that was copy and pasted and across gigantic balls of nothing, oh and for some reason since it wasn't a main mission my squad mates had nothing to say.



In ME2 I instead got well designed and nice looking locations...that were linear short and non-eventful. Also most of side mission dialogue, which was already...lacking in ME1 was completely removed.



Both sucked. What is good exploration? Wide open level design. More Virmire and Ilos less those planets with 70-90% jagged terrain.

[Zulu_DFA]

Map. Radar. Zoom. Vast open spaces. Odd objects with popping up annotations. Driving a vehicle. You know what I mean.

[DOYOURLABS]

In mass effect, exploration was going straight up mountains in environments that looked the same so you could find dead salarians. In mass effect 2, exploration was scanning planets until you found a side mission, then going through a linear mission. Neither game did exploration well.



What I want is less explorable planets but more side missions and unique environments. I want explorable cities like Noveria and side missions that are less linear.

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

Bamboozalist wrote...

Both sucked. What is good exploration? Wide open level design. More Virmire and Ilos less those planets with 70-90% jagged terrain.

I fail to see how Virmire and Ilos were examples of "[w]ide open level design" in any way. The Mako portions of both were completely linear (except one portion of Virmire where you could go two ways around a rock).

[Fiery Phoenix]

While I agree ME1 didn't offer some actual exploration, it still did something. One thing I truly missed in ME2 is the feeling of being in space, of being in a galaxy so huge and mysterious where you feel there is always something incredible waiting to be known somewhere. Nothing caught me more than standing on the top of a mountain and staring at a red giant star shining peacefully on an uncharted planet in ME1, especially the first time through. It was beyond gorgeous.

Even if we weren't actually exploring in ME1's sidequests, there was still a noticeable sense of exploration. You still felt like you were looking for something while enjoying the view around you, no matter how dead the planet on which you happen to be looks.

Incidentally, I have no idea if I'm the only one who liked the idea of uncharted planets (that is, empty planets). The reason I liked it is because it conveys the reality of the worlds out there. Current studies in astronomy and planetary science indicate that an awful lot of planets / moons are just that; seemingly lifeless lands with nothing that catches attention. We also know our own Solar System's worlds are like that, save Earth.

Modifié par FieryPhoenix7, 30 décembre 2010 - 05:53 .

[TelexFerra]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

What I agree ME1 didn't offer some actual exploration, it still did something. One thing I truly missed in ME2 is the feeling of being in space, of being in a galaxy so huge and mysterious where you feel there is always something incredible waiting to be known somewhere. Nothing caught me more than standing on the top of a mountain and staring at a red giant star shining peacefully on an uncharted planet in ME1, especially the first time through. It was beyond gorgeous.

Even if we weren't actually exploring in ME1's sidequests, there was still a noticeable sense of exploration. You still felt like you were looking for something while enjoying the view around you, no matter how dead the planet on which you happen to be looks.

Incidentally, I have no idea if I'm the only one who liked the idea of uncharted planets (that is, empty planets). The reason I liked it is because it conveys the reality of the worlds out there. Current studies in astronomy and planetary science indicate that an awful lot of planets / moons are just that; seemingly lifeless lands with nothing that catches attention. We also know our own Solar System's worlds are like that, save Earth.

All of this; all of it.

[Praetor Knight]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

Even if we weren't actually exploring in ME1's sidequests, there was still a noticeable sense of exploration. You still felt like you were looking for something while enjoying the view around you, no matter how dead the planet on which you happen to be looks.

Incidentally, I have no idea if I'm the only one who liked the idea of uncharted planets (that is, empty planets). The reason I liked it is because it conveys the reality of the worlds out there. Current studies in astronomy and planetary science indicate that an awful lot of planets / moons are just that; seemingly lifeless lands with nothing that catches attention. We also know our own Solar System's worlds are like that, save Earth.

I enjoyed looking up to the sky and the horizon when I was planet side in ME. There are a few I remember where you can see planets and/or other satellites up there. ME2 had some nice vistas, but those few skies in ME were great, IMHO.

I'd really, really like that to return in ME3!

[Chaos Gate]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

Incidentally, I have no idea if I'm the only one who liked the idea of uncharted planets (that is, empty planets). The reason I liked it is because it conveys the reality of the worlds out there. Current studies in astronomy and planetary science indicate that an awful lot of planets / moons are just that; seemingly lifeless lands with nothing that catches attention. We also know our own Solar System's worlds are like that, save Earth.

You're not the only one.

I loved that there were so many planets to explore, some of which could be actually charted by you. When you got down and dirty in the Mako, roving about the planet's surface always made me feel that I was only moments away from making a big discovery. And while I can't speak for everyone else, I honestly felt a deep sense of satisfaction when I stumbled on some resources/ an undiscovered artifact/alien bodies/ a mercenary base. Even with the planets that couldn't be manually explored, yet merely scanned, it all combined to make the Mass Effect universe feel so vast.

Add to this that I actually enjoyed hurtling the Mako off cliffs and hauling it up mountains (I never saw the problem with this) and you can understand why I really liked the exploratory aspect of ME1. I didn't find it repetitive or monotonous at all.

Unlike ME2's planet scanning, which is the most tedious subgame ever found in a video game. The less said about that, the better. Bleh. The ME2 universe also felt too restrained, in my opinion. The universe was stifled and strangled, and the game wasn't allowed to flourish like the prequel did.

[sympathy4saren]

Take one scoop of ME1 planet exploration, but twice as large.



Add one scoop Red Read Redemption/Rockstar environment detail.



Pour into bowl that makes it vital to character/mission/ experience upgrades and progression.



This is what I want.



Good exploration to me is immersion in a massive world that is unknown...and checking it out. Finding valuable or neat stuff. Learning stuff. Attention to detail is vital; its an amazing opportunity to take in artwork.

[Aglazzboi]

LeonBrass wrote...

exploration that directly links to the main plot! Enough with the meaningless side quest to collect Kr$$$ in order to make/buy more Kr***!
Something worth the trouble.. more like a true quest where we look for Prothean stuff to use against the reapers... and when we find it, it should be some kind of useful item or data not +1 medigel or $

Yes I rather have 5 planets full of interesting things than 10 empty ones

[Ulzeraj]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

While I agree ME1 didn't offer some actual exploration, it still did something. One thing I truly missed in ME2 is the feeling of being in space, of being in a galaxy so huge and mysterious where you feel there is always something incredible waiting to be known somewhere. Nothing caught me more than standing on the top of a mountain and staring at a red giant star shining peacefully on an uncharted planet in ME1, especially the first time through. It was beyond gorgeous.

Even if we weren't actually exploring in ME1's sidequests, there was still a noticeable sense of exploration. You still felt like you were looking for something while enjoying the view around you, no matter how dead the planet on which you happen to be looks.

Incidentally, I have no idea if I'm the only one who liked the idea of uncharted planets (that is, empty planets). The reason I liked it is because it conveys the reality of the worlds out there. Current studies in astronomy and planetary science indicate that an awful lot of planets / moons are just that; seemingly lifeless lands with nothing that catches attention. We also know our own Solar System's worlds are like that, save Earth.

Agreed. Couldnt express better.

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

While I agree ME1 didn't offer some actual exploration, it still did something. One thing I truly missed in ME2 is the feeling of being in space, of being in a galaxy so huge and mysterious where you feel there is always something incredible waiting to be known somewhere. Nothing caught me more than standing on the top of a mountain and staring at a red giant star shining peacefully on an uncharted planet in ME1, especially the first time through. It was beyond gorgeous.

Even if we weren't actually exploring in ME1's sidequests, there was still a noticeable sense of exploration. You still felt like you were looking for something while enjoying the view around you, no matter how dead the planet on which you happen to be looks.

Incidentally, I have no idea if I'm the only one who liked the idea of uncharted planets (that is, empty planets). The reason I liked it is because it conveys the reality of the worlds out there. Current studies in astronomy and planetary science indicate that an awful lot of planets / moons are just that; seemingly lifeless lands with nothing that catches attention. We also know our own Solar System's worlds are like that, save Earth.

Well stated, my friend, well stated.

[hawat333]

A good question, very good indeed as more exploration is often mentioned but it doesn't get described/detailed often.



What's good exploration? Something mixed. Something unique.

ME1 exploration wasn't bad, but apart from the side missions, it was all the same.

ME2 exploration (meaning the fast paced N7 missions) wasn't bad either, but it was all the same apart from what you were killing (apart from a few examples, where you did actually have a unique scenario).



By more exploration, personally I mean more misteries to solve. Or planets with own climate, own behaviour. Maybe something other than the same gravity everywhere? So exlporation doesn't only mean driving around in a nearly empty setting (and an uncomfortable terrain) or fast paced shooting.

Exploring abandoned science bases where something went wrong, maybe a war-torn, almost destroyed cities with a few survivors, looking for clues in a border world to solve a the govenor's murder there or why have all of them turned aggressive/crazed.



While exploring, I like to do something, and by something I don't mean killing enemies and unlocking lockers, mining resources. But exlporing something new, something unique to that planet, to that scenario, you get what I mean.



For me, ten of these kind of missions would worth more than ME1-2 exploration/N7 missions combined.



In short words: When I explore, I like to discover something - and not just repeating the same thing everywhere.

[--Master of All--]

I'm with Ashley, Ulzeraj, Chaos Gate, Praetor Shepard, TelexFerra and Fiery Phoenix on this one. ME1's space exploration provided a nice compliment to the rest of the game, and despite the lack of scenery, the uncharted worlds still felt like real places.

Modifié par --Master of All--, 30 décembre 2010 - 10:02 .

[Lumikki]

Hard to say, but I conside good exploration when I have enough places to wander. Meaning that game world doesn't feel too small and all places too similar. But create effects when I go somewhere there is somehting new to see, wonders. Exploration could be finding something when just wandring around of the worlds. Could be mineral, new technology, old artifacts, new races or animals, colonies to visit, pirates space stations, ruins of some race or just empty rock. As long there is enough variety and not everyting starts look the same, I consider it as good exploration.



In Mass Effect case I think it means enough different planets or places to visit. When I mean visit, that doesn't mean gameplay like planet mining from space, but actually go down to planet "surface" or inside space station and look around what's there. Discover something new and intresting enough.

[BiancoAngelo7]

I just don't understand why they thought they had to reinvent everything after ME1.



If they had just kept everything in ME1 as far as exploration and built upon it, made it more interactive, given the planets a little more detailed environments (vegetation, fauna etc like in Overlord) and maybe flesh out the side quests.



Basically do what overlord did and only change a few things:



Make the map bigger to add more distance and vast feel to the exploration mission, let us exit the Mako, work a LOT more on the skybox to make it as good as it was in ME1, give us worlds that are hazardous and have stoic epic environments like raging blizzards, meteor showers, binary stars, quasars etc., and give our squad armor so we can realistically interact with the enivronment without having Miranda in a blizzard in her leotard cat suit.



If they followed this simple formula, and repeated it at least 5-10 times in ME3, you would all see that they would be hailed as the devs that did Planet Exploration how no one else did before.

[Ragnarok521]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

While I agree ME1 didn't offer some actual exploration, it still did something. One thing I truly missed in ME2 is the feeling of being in space, of being in a galaxy so huge and mysterious where you feel there is always something incredible waiting to be known somewhere. Nothing caught me more than standing on the top of a mountain and staring at a red giant star shining peacefully on an uncharted planet in ME1, especially the first time through. It was beyond gorgeous.

Even if we weren't actually exploring in ME1's sidequests, there was still a noticeable sense of exploration. You still felt like you were looking for something while enjoying the view around you, no matter how dead the planet on which you happen to be looks.

Incidentally, I have no idea if I'm the only one who liked the idea of uncharted planets (that is, empty planets). The reason I liked it is because it conveys the reality of the worlds out there. Current studies in astronomy and planetary science indicate that an awful lot of planets / moons are just that; seemingly lifeless lands with nothing that catches attention. We also know our own Solar System's worlds are like that, save Earth.

Agreed, especially the part in bold. Some hated that, but I loved it because it was so much more believable than every planet being a tropical paradise.

[Bocks]

Morrowind had the best exploration of any game I've ever played ever, hands down forever.



The landscape wasn't boring, the fauna and flora were alien but believeable and elements that we are used to seeing in everyday life were exaggerated (giant mushrooms) or simply not there. Mass Effect could learn a lot from Morrowind, especially the believeable creatures bit. I don't have anything against space monkeys or space cows but.. come ON! A bit more originality! The Varren and Klixen are a step forward, and so are the Thresher Maws... but a lot more species wouldn't hurt, Bioware!



They should avoid looking at Oblivion, though. God that **** was awful.

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

I like exploring the dead Reaper in ME2 and the Collector ships and bases. That I'm into because it's not random dull wandering. There's stuff to see and do and a story right there that you're moving through.



If driving the Mako across featureless polygons is your idea of good exploration... you need to get outside more often.

[Praetor Knight]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

If driving the Mako across featureless polygons is your idea of good exploration... you need to get outside more often.

But the Sky! There are only a few planets I liked in ME, but they are there, and then you can step out of the Mako.

To further clarify it is not "exploration," more admiration and imagination. And I'm well traveled in RL, so yeah.

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

If driving the Mako across featureless polygons is your idea of good exploration... you need to get outside more often.

But the Sky! There are only a few planets I liked in ME, but they are there, and then you can step out of the Mako.

To further clarify it is not "exploration," more admiration and imagination. And I'm well traveled in RL, so yeah.

Ok, I will totally give you that point about the sky.  You absolutely win on that one.  I =do= recall looking up in a couple place and being wow'd by the star overhead or the planet there.  There was one that was actually gorgeous.

Sadly, that's about as close as I can get to enjoying the Mako.     

Modifié par RinpocheSchnozberry, 30 décembre 2010 - 06:35 .

[Destroy Raiden_]

The easiest way to say the exploration type I want is like fallout 3 and New Vegas I want large maps with hidden things to find, do, and blow up. I like hunting down the locations be it in the worse knife edge mountain ranges beyond Earth or down in a near never ending hole in the ground. seriously I drove that mako everywhere. I like that sort of thing when people in fallout say there are mines protecting some factory I'm like point me to them because I know goodies await beyond the mines! Basically if you want me out of your house, garage, factory, or yard I want in and defeating or disarming your traps are part of the fun.



I liked seeing the topography in ME1 I could see where platus or mountains were and a few major things like a small white dot showed the anomaly they detected from orbit but beyond that if I wanted minerals not shown I'd have to find them and often times I did just because it wasn't on the map didn't mean it wasn't' there. But in ME3 I'd like to see a more updated groundside exploration map like if there are rivers show them but I'd like it to be like fallout 3 and NV are were you have major towns you were told about shown, but towns you didn't ask about are not shown. I can see the topography streets, mountains but I have no idea if the millions of otherwise blank landscape on my map will yield any sort of town, settlement, shack, or city I just think I want to go over there and start walking or in ME's case driving that way and at somepoint you would see the city visually if it's in a visible location or you just stumble onto it if it's hidden by ranges. I'd like ME3 to have some planets being sparse with no one but animals on it, others that have trees grass and various towns, prefab trailers, and operations going on so I can interact with all three and have them hidden to the player unless they were priorly told about town Plenty over there then town Plenty would be on the map and they could go trade, get sidequests, and accomplished their quest if that is why they're there.



Now I know ME is no wide open exploration like FO but I liked the sizes of the maps in ME1. I liked driving my Mako and discovering new things and places to explore like buildings. Once you get to those buildings however they all shopped at the same prefab factory and it was a shooting gallery which most times was good because there was no or one threser maw as prior cannon fodder. I think at least 3 models of different buildings and layouts would work for ME3 as far as prefabs go for non prefabs make them interesting at least.



I also like not having to be on a quest to go raid some pirates hang out I like seeing a world, landing on it, and running around till I'm board. ME allowed me to roam where I pleased so long as I could get my mako up the mountains and if someone lived there usual I could screw up their day but ME2 took that away the closest I got to ME exploration was in overlord and it was very controlled. A larger map then all HH missions but I was still stuck in the car. I only went to predestined places I felt more lead they use of the cliffs and winding natural mountains to steer me to the next base I didn't have to try and find them I just took path A, path B, or path C and found the base they cut out an important part of exploring for me which is finding the thing on my own in the manner I choose. I understand poking around planets for no good reason isn't want the ME series is about but sense they introduced it in ME it was rare and a very fun experience to have it 100% gone in ME2 sucked I don't count the hovercraft missions sense they were very controlled and allowed for zero exploration. I don't care if I'm in a vehicle or on foot exploring I just want to do that I hope ME3 levels also provide hidden passageways for players to explore the general main and sidequest maps to get unique items and unique events in their play as well.

[Schneidend]

Ragnarok521 wrote...

I didn't really mind the long drives. As long as the path to the destination wasn't completely blocked by steep mountains anyway. Gave me time to look around at the gorgeous skyline, contemplate my place in the universe, etc. Also helped reinforce a feeling of isolation and quiet tranquility save for the sounds of a cold blizzard beating against the hull of the Mako or the rumbling beneath the surface of a geologically unstable world. Each planet felt like a different place in the galaxy though that's just me, I can't speak for everyone else.

I feel that ME2 dumped you into the action too quickly in most cases, not enough time to acclimate yourself to the environment.  

Long drives are fine, as long as it leads somewhere cool. I'd consider Noveria and Therum "long drives" but at least there was more at the end of those drives than another mummified salarian.

[BiancoAngelo7]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

While I agree ME1 didn't offer some actual exploration, it still did something. One thing I truly missed in ME2 is the feeling of being in space, of being in a galaxy so huge and mysterious where you feel there is always something incredible waiting to be known somewhere. Nothing caught me more than standing on the top of a mountain and staring at a red giant star shining peacefully on an uncharted planet in ME1, especially the first time through. It was beyond gorgeous.

Even if we weren't actually exploring in ME1's sidequests, there was still a noticeable sense of exploration. You still felt like you were looking for something while enjoying the view around you, no matter how dead the planet on which you happen to be looks.

Incidentally, I have no idea if I'm the only one who liked the idea of uncharted planets (that is, empty planets). The reason I liked it is because it conveys the reality of the worlds out there. Current studies in astronomy and planetary science indicate that an awful lot of planets / moons are just that; seemingly lifeless lands with nothing that catches attention. We also know our own Solar System's worlds are like that, save Earth.

Somebody give this man a prize. Perfect.

Seriously.



*SIT DOWN JACOB I WASNT TALKING TO YOU!!*