206 réponses à ce sujet

[Dean_the_Young]

Shepard has been filled with morally ambiguous allies. That's pretty much all your Team in ME2 was: murderers, terrorists, savages, war criminals, vigilantees, and just criminals of all types.



Heck, your girlfriend runs a galactic extortion racket and threatens to flaw people alive with her mind!



Paragon Kaiden and Anderson are about the only morally unambiguous characters in the game.

[Xilizhra]

Their cause and means to bring it about are all heavily ambiguous.



And while I won't make them into an enemy if I can avoid it... I hope to be unable to avoid it.

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Paragon Kaiden and Anderson are about the only morally unambiguous characters in the game.

And we saw in Retribution what stupidity Anderson was driven to by his insane morals.

[Fixers0]

Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Paragon Kaiden and Anderson are about the only morally unambiguous characters in the game.

And we saw in Retribution what stupidity Anderson was driven to by his insane morals.

Don't you dare try to insult the great David Anderson he's got more courage an honour then whole Cerberus and their pathetic leader. 

[Dean_the_Young]

Wow. That's the best (worst?) troll against Anderson fans I've seen in some time.

[azerSheppard]

Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Paragon Kaiden and Anderson are about the only morally unambiguous characters in the game.

And we saw in Retribution what stupidity Anderson was driven to by his insane morals.

Stupidity? You mean trying to take out a terrorist organisation? Uhh yeah how retardedly stupid of him:huh:

Cerberus got what was coming to them, Anderson should be receiving a medal the size of a Reaper, for lashing out against an organisation, which has infiltrated the Alliance so deeply. (or possibly been/being backed by)

I too believe Udina to have been backed by cerberus, mainly because he is more interested in dominance, rather than equality. Now i'm not saying the Council is completely un-biased, but if you read the first book, you would know about the human ambassador, and her internal monologues about the councilors.

The fact that TIM would work together with Aria and her crew, just proves him to be the mussolinian thinking bastard he is. The goal does NOT justify the means. NEVER.


On the topic, I would say working with cerberus was truely unexpected, as i could not see any clues within ME1 pointing out to this. This was obviously a twist inteded to make ME2 less predictable, but failed to certain degree.

How did Bioware not expect us to question cerberus about their experiments or the casual way Shepard talked to them about it. It blows my mind, thinking there could be a person who lost all his friends to a bunch of terrorists, accepts to work for them. What where they thinking?!!

I stopped my Earthborne playthrough once I found out about Shepard working for cerberus, thinking about how awesome it would be to get in their face with my Sole survivor. Big disappointment.

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

azerSheppard wrote...
Stupidity? You mean trying to take out a terrorist organisation? Uhh yeah how retardedly stupid of him:huh:

Cerberus got what was coming to them, Anderson should be receiving a medal the size of a Reaper, for lashing out against an organisation, which has infiltrated the Alliance so deeply. (or possibly been/being backed by)

1. Cerberus is not a terrorist organization.

2. Cerberus has not infiltrated the Alliance, they were created by the Alliance.

3. Anderson should be punished. A high-level Alliance officer going behind the Alliance's back to work with the Turian military to take down a pro-human group. Sensitive Alliance information would surely be taken by the Turians, as well as information linking Cerberus to the Alliance which will bring disgrace to the Alliance before the other Council races. This is starting to sound an awful lot like treason IMO.

[Dean_the_Young]

azerSheppard wrote...

Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Paragon Kaiden and Anderson are about the only morally unambiguous characters in the game.

And we saw in Retribution what stupidity Anderson was driven to by his insane morals.

Stupidity? You mean trying to take out a terrorist organisation? Uhh yeah how retardedly stupid of him:huh:

Cerberus got what was coming to them, Anderson should be receiving a medal the size of a Reaper, for lashing out against an organisation, which has infiltrated the Alliance so deeply. (or possibly been/being backed by)

I too believe Udina to have been backed by cerberus, mainly because he is more interested in dominance, rather than equality. Now i'm not saying the Council is completely un-biased, but if you read the first book, you would know about the human ambassador, and her internal monologues about the councilors.

The fact that TIM would work together with Aria and her crew, just proves him to be the mussolinian thinking bastard he is. The goal does NOT justify the means. NEVER.


On the topic, I would say working with cerberus was truely unexpected, as i could not see any clues within ME1 pointing out to this. This was obviously a twist inteded to make ME2 less predictable, but failed to certain degree.

How did Bioware not expect us to question cerberus about their experiments or the casual way Shepard talked to them about it. It blows my mind, thinking there could be a person who lost all his friends to a bunch of terrorists, accepts to work for them. What where they thinking?!!

I stopped my Earthborne playthrough once I found out about Shepard working for cerberus, thinking about how awesome it would be to get in their face with my Sole survivor. Big disappointment.

Yes, because attacking the one group besides Shepard actively opposing
and preparing for the Reapers, and letting loose an interstellar
disaster in the process, so won the day.



Whoo.

[Xilizhra]

3. Anderson should be punished. A high-level Alliance officer going behind the Alliance's back to work with the Turian military to take down a pro-human group. Sensitive Alliance information would surely be taken by the Turians, as well as information linking Cerberus to the Alliance which will bring disgrace to the Alliance before the other Council races. This is starting to sound an awful lot like treason IMO.

The pro-human group has no official connection to the Alliance and Anderson is under no obligation to respect it; considering its actions, I'm not even sure if he'd be officially allowed to. And the turians are part of the same galactic government through the Council. It's not nearly enough to qualify as treason, and the only questionable thing is possible information leakage to the turians.

[Sandbox47]

I understand why I had to work with Cerberus. I understand why I had to take out the Collectors, ignoring the Reapers (speaking of which, did Shepard know that they would return at all? Because I got the feeling that she assumed they could only work through mediums like the Collectors) But I don't much like how devoted the Cerberus is to humanity. Especially Jacob. Don't like him.

[Dean_the_Young]

Jacob? Jacob's about as much a well-intentioned idealist as you can get. The worst thing he's done is join Shepard if Shepard's a uberdick Renegade.

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

Xilizhra wrote...

3. Anderson should be punished. A high-level Alliance officer going behind the Alliance's back to work with the Turian military to take down a pro-human group. Sensitive Alliance information would surely be taken by the Turians, as well as information linking Cerberus to the Alliance which will bring disgrace to the Alliance before the other Council races. This is starting to sound an awful lot like treason IMO.

The pro-human group has no official connection to the Alliance and Anderson is under no obligation to respect it; considering its actions, I'm not even sure if he'd be officially allowed to. And the turians are part of the same galactic government through the Council. It's not nearly enough to qualify as treason, and the only questionable thing is possible information leakage to the turians.

The Alliance will be severely compromised by Anderson's actions. The information leaks to the Turians happened without a doubt. Anderson realized how close Cerberus and the Alliance were. He should have made the right decision and let it be.

Not to mention the reason he orchestrated this scheme was because some chick he knew for like a week came to him wanting to save some ex-assassin. I facepalmed so many times reading Retribution at Anderson's impulsiveness.

[Dean_the_Young]

I don't agree with the first half of that, but I am more inclined towards the second half.



Anderson shouldn't have acted against Cerberus when he did, but NOT because it would simply have embarassed the Alliance. No, the reason Cerberus should have been left alone for the time was because it has been and is an ally against the greater enemy, and weakening it and the Alliance before the fight is Not A Good Idea.



However, his reasons for doing it when and as he did? Intergalactic incidents on short notice at the behest of potential love-interest to save still-criminal criminals is, well, a bit lacking.

[Dean_the_Young]

Xilizhra wrote...

Why would you expect the only organization actively working against the Reapers to be Shepard's biggest problem?

Its extreme moral ambiguity that's only been reinforced in the latest novel. I doubt it'll be a mandatory ally for all Shepards.

But all your allies, mandatory and not, are morally ambiguous. Cerberus is far from unique in that.

[Xilizhra]

The Alliance will be severely compromised by Anderson's actions. The information leaks to the Turians happened without a doubt. Anderson realized how close Cerberus and the Alliance were. He should have made the right decision and let it be.

It can't be treason if Cerberus isn't officially part of the Alliance.

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Anderson shouldn't have acted against Cerberus when he did, but NOT because it would simply have embarassed the Alliance. No, the reason Cerberus should have been left alone for the time was because it has been and is an ally against the greater enemy, and weakening it and the Alliance before the fight is Not A Good Idea.

The sad thing is, Anderson understands the Reaper threat while the Alliance does not. He also knows via Shepard (who is hopefully a more trusted friend than Kahlee Sanders), that Cerberus is working against the Reapers. As I was implying in the post that started this, it's Anderson's misguided morality that leads to the crippling of one of the few allies against the Reapers and at least a political sh*tstorm for the Alliance (if you don't agree that the Alliance will be compromised).

[Xilizhra]

I suppose we'll see, then, how much this has crippled the anti-Reaper defense.



Also, saving Anderson from the Alliance might be fun.

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

Xilizhra wrote...

I suppose we'll see, then, how much this has crippled the anti-Reaper defense.

Also, saving Anderson from the Alliance might be fun.

Well, as we all know, none of the decisions will have a huge effect on ME3, and it's safe to say Cerberus will have a smaller roll.

As for saving Anderson, I just hope there's a choice. I could see my Shepard going to defend him (thinking he couldn't have possibly been that stupid), then finding out he had been that stupid, and then asking for the firing squad.

[Xilizhra]

So you'd order your own friend into death without offering any other chance?

[Sable Rhapsody]

Xilizhra wrote...

I suppose we'll see, then, how much this has crippled the anti-Reaper defense.

Also, saving Anderson from the Alliance might be fun.

I saw Anderson's actions more as a plot reason to keep Cerberus from being absolutely essential in ME3 as they were in ME2.  Their resources will be useful, but not make-or-break in the final assault against the Reapers.

Also, I have my doubts about some of TIM's...judgment calls.  I don't know if it's just taken him forever to realize this, but messing around with Reaper tech tends to get you burned.  What does he do?  Implants Grayson with Reaper tech and leaves him in a lightly guarded cell.  Seriously, there should have been f-ing CAINS trained on Grayson's head if he so much as sneezed on his cell door.  *headdesk*

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

Xilizhra wrote...

So you'd order your own friend into death without offering any other chance?

I wouldn't order him to death. I don't feel that's my Shepard's call. I wouldn't try to keep him from it if that is his decided fate.

[Xilizhra]

"Asking for the firing squad" made it seem otherwise. Ah well.

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

Xilizhra wrote...

"Asking for the firing squad" made it seem otherwise. Ah well.

I could see Anderson about to be convicted of treason. My Shepard finds out what happens and in an angry reaction says Anderson should be killed. Shepard would cool down quickly and state that he doesn't care about Anderson's fate, telling Anderson how disappointed he is in his complete failure to prioritize.

[Xilizhra]

Well, your own Shepard will of course do as he will.

[Kristofer1]

Anderson committed treason. He should be hung. Or put in front of the ME1+ME2 crews Firing squad.