228 réponses à ce sujet

[Eradyn]

I support BroJacob 100%. I do not support ****Shepard -100%. D;



I was supremely disappointed that I did not, in fact, get to spill drinks OR get loud on the Citadel post suicide mission. BW...I r very disappoint.

[Sinapus]

Aeowyn wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

yeah the contrast is kinda bad but don't make it seem like Shepard doens't get friendly with other squadmates and only gets that way with Jacob.

All I can say is that I didn't see that with anyone else.  And I was frustrated when even the renegade responses ended up being pickup lines.

I wonder if the in-your-faceness is because there will be a future story line with Cerberus where Jacob will play a role.  I thought he was a little too out there with the "I don't trust Cerberus" stuff, like he and Miranda were playing good cop- bad cop prescribed roles.  If I had had more of a free hand, I would have played it that Shepard was cool towards all the Cerberus ops.

Well personally I found all of the Cerberus crew, except for Miranda, were really just... a poor presentation of Cerberus. Half of them didn't even know much about Cerberus at all. It just felt like a joke. But that's a discussion for another time.

That actually does make a little sense. Shepard wrecked a bunch of Cerberus ops and probably doesn't have a good opinion of them. Maybe the current crew are that way because they were picked for that reason. Including Jacob. 

I've managed to stop cringing every time my Shepard speaks to Jacob and can actually see him as a good friend. But like I mentioned before, I want more friendship dialoue with him. And less spandex please. And yes, that includes Miranda as well.

My current FemShep's gotten to the part about drinks on the Citadel. Don't know if that's good or bad.

[lazuli]

Sinapus wrote...

My current FemShep's gotten to the part about drinks on the Citadel. Don't know if that's good or bad.

That depends on whether or not you intended to romance him.  As far as I can tell, ending up on the drinks line means that you and Jacob are in "just friends" territory forever.

[Sinapus]

Hadn't really decided, though I guess I did accidentally. Oops.

[HappyHappyJoyJoy]

On Jacob being worthless:
He used to die on his loyalty mission. Even on lower difficulty settings.
I read a tip to give him heavy pistol instead of shotgun. Low and behold, he did pretty well. Didn't die once. I think he tends to stay back with pistols because of the superior range, and that helps his ability to survive.
EDIT:  I decided to take him on the Strontium Mule with my Engineer, along with Legion.  He did well!

Modifié par HappyHappyJoyJoy, 03 janvier 2011 - 08:18 .

[Element Engine]

For a while he was okay, then he acted like an ass to Tali, which is unforgivable cause Tali's awesome. After that I noticed all the other whiny, dumb comments he made. Add that to the fact that everything else about the character is just extremely blah.



Verdict: Jacob = Annoying douchy cvnt

[Jarek_Cousland]

At first I didnt think much of Jacob. Now we're total brofist.

[G Dubbzilla]

Jacob is great!
Tali was being a jerk
Thane doesn't take responsibility for his murders
Jacob did nothing wrong. I bet in ME3 He gives Tali the Prize.

[ladyvader]

G Dubbzilla wrote...

Jacob is great!
Tali was being a jerk
Thane doesn't take responsibility for his murders
Jacob did nothing wrong. I bet in ME3 He gives Tali the Prize.

To quote Shepard at that beginning of the game, "He is nothing but a gun for hire."  It might not be the exact way Shepard said it but close enough.  That being said.  Jacob is nothing but a gun for hire and him being a jerk to Thane was uncalled for.  He claims he doesn't like mercs, but what is he really?  A gun for hire by a terriorst group.  His comments to me were very hypocritical. It didn't help any with his comments to Tali. 

To me, the majority of male characters BioWare creates bore me to tears.  There have been four that I actually care about in the five BioWare games I own.  Those are Wrex, Grunt, Garrus, and Thane.  I couldn't stand Carth in KotOR.  Same can be said about Kaidan.  Have both of those characters use the same VO could be part of the problem for me.  Don't get me started on the annoying characters in DA:O and DA2. 

[Shanya]

For me its not that I would realy dislike Jacob, but I realy utterly dislike how FShep speakis in dialogs with him. I dont like him in the CIC either actualy, but ok. I dont think he is boring either and there is nothing comical about him. It is just the overal feeling that I get when my Shepy talks to him, and then those "bad" lines about prizes... and the line when you check if he has something to say and he doesnt... you get that "Shep you are molesting me" vibe from it.
What I do like about Jacob however is that he is black. It is nice to have a non-white human around. I also like his reasonings and he overal isnt a bad character. It all depends on how your mind is set when you talk to him... and well, if you can suffer the annoying FShep facial expresions, FSheps sentences and voice when you talk to him. And well, I would still love if my Shep would punch the guy...

[NanQuan]

There's a really simple reason that a lot of people don't like Jacob. He's the only character who lacks a character arc.  He didn't change, and Shep's perception of anything didn't change when dealing with him. It's not that Jacob himself sucks - people have pointed out that he has many fine qualities - but from a story telling perspective he isn't a round character. So when people say "Jacob is boring" what they are really saying is "Jacob never changes." Storytelling is ingrained in our culture and good stories require that characters change.  Stories are about change (the one thing all stories have in common).

So here's what happens: In RL Jacob might be a great person, you might like a lot of his qualities, but as a character he seems uninspired because of his lack of change.  Now, if you like Jacob then you have probably 1) played ME so many times that the storyline no longer matters to you, thus your perception of characters is different (i.e. jacob grew on you), 2) the qualities that Jacob possessed are important enough to you that it overrode the natural desire you have to see change in a story (example, extreme loyalty is an important enough trait to me that I would instantly be drawn to any character with that trait), or 3) since a lot of people do not like Jacob, you want to be a rebel and like him (like disliking Tali because of the talimancers).

From a literature standpoint it's really simple why people dislike him. Most people probably met Jacob for the first time and were like ok cool, I wonder what this guy is all about.  They liked him fine up to a point, and then his loyalty mission came around and.... well he didn't change.  He stayed the same as he was before.  And while that would be fine in RL, it isn't ok for a story and people were disappointed.  That disappointment became dislike.

[Homebound]

Jacob is stale and some of him seems forced. He's a thinly veiled totting black guy cliche.

This is why I hate Jacob. He was just handled poorly from the get-go.

[ISpeakTheTruth]

The reason why he isn't liked is because he's the VS of ME2. He has nothing particularly interesting to add to the group besides his hypocracy. The reason people react more negative to him than they do the VS is because ME1 had very few good characters competing with them... Jacob had about 10 characters around him that were more interesting than him and by comparison he's nothing special.

[ashlover mark 2]

dont really recall any jacob jokes on the old ME2 forums,in fact dont remeber much talk about jacob period but maybe thats just beacuse i spent most of my time in ash related threads anyway.

i dont hate jacob,i like him enough for him not to die during my largely bloody suicide misson but not nearly enough to warrant him a return spot in my ME3 sqaud makeup...the little bit of male shep dialogue you get is unintersting and uninspired small talk. its pretty much........

*shep walks into armory*

Shepard:"Yo,whats up J".

jacob: "N/m shep,lets go kick some collecter ass".

he dosent talk about his past relationship with miranda,dosent talk about his relationship with his father much, and dosnt talk about his time with the corsairs he basicly talks about nothing of importance unless you ask him about the misson;so i can see why ppl would label him as "boring or "dull".

my main issue with him however is something that jack says about him and that is "jacob dosent know who he is".when hes not complaning about his time with the alliance hes complaining about cerberus.He left the alliance beacuse it was not gun-ho enough for him but tells shepard that he dosent really like working for cerberus all that much either beacuse their to ruthless and not very trust worthy.it just gets kindve annoying after awhile, he wants to defend humanity he wants be a hero but he dosnt like the way the two most powerful and relavant human factions go about doing it.

maybe if this would have been presented in a way that could have been influenced by the player on some level then maybe non fans would find him more intersting ala rather large moral dilema and life altering caree choice; Choose to return to the alliance, the largest and most powerful human govermant and organazation which most of the time tries to go about its bussines in a moraly and just way albeit  with politcal bull**** from time to time or stay with cerberus, the ruthless and extreme terroist organazation whos goals and intentions are some what noble but also whos methods will keep you up at night.

but alas not even this was realized for poor jacob.

Modifié par ashlover mark 2, 12 juin 2011 - 03:33 .

[phantomdragoness]

Jacob is interesting in the fact that he is stable, and you can trust him to be solid under pressure. But he is almost too stable in my opinion.

[outmane]

I dont hate Jacob but i feel hes too true to his character for his own good (or for the player's good).

Jacob's concept is the good guy who doesnt need to be fixed. Its understandable that with working with Cerberus and Miranda (just think of her role in his loyalty mission) he doesnt want to open up. His i-have-no-availible-dialogue quote demonstrates that very well tho it is also pretty harsh compared to others ('I dont like those forced talks Shepard'). His little quips on missions and hub planets show how serious and preoccupied he is. Coupled with how he handles being reunited with his father, its hard to find a more professional and stoic character.

On the other hand, Jacob not opening up (all other characters eventally do) makes it hard for the player to be moved by him. Its not surprising most ppl are simply indifferent towards him.

[ArawnNox]

Addai67 wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

yeah the contrast is kinda bad but don't make it seem like Shepard doens't get friendly with other squadmates and only gets that way with Jacob.

All I can say is that I didn't see that with anyone else.  And I was frustrated when even the renegade responses ended up being pickup lines.

I wonder if the in-your-faceness is because there will be a future story line with Cerberus where Jacob will play a role.  I thought he was a little too out there with the "I don't trust Cerberus" stuff, like he and Miranda were playing good cop- bad cop prescribed roles.  If I had had more of a free hand, I would have played it that Shepard was cool towards all the Cerberus ops.

Jacob and Miranda playing "Good Cop/Bad Cop" with Shepard.... *tucks that away in the fanfic file*

[ArawnNox]

NanQuan wrote...

There's a really simple reason that a lot of people don't like Jacob. He's the only character who lacks a character arc.  He didn't change, and Shep's perception of anything didn't change when dealing with him. It's not that Jacob himself sucks - people have pointed out that he has many fine qualities - but from a story telling perspective he isn't a round character. So when people say "Jacob is boring" what they are really saying is "Jacob never changes." Storytelling is ingrained in our culture and good stories require that characters change.  Stories are about change (the one thing all stories have in common).

So here's what happens: In RL Jacob might be a great person, you might like a lot of his qualities, but as a character he seems uninspired because of his lack of change.  Now, if you like Jacob then you have probably 1) played ME so many times that the storyline no longer matters to you, thus your perception of characters is different (i.e. jacob grew on you), 2) the qualities that Jacob possessed are important enough to you that it overrode the natural desire you have to see change in a story (example, extreme loyalty is an important enough trait to me that I would instantly be drawn to any character with that trait), or 3) since a lot of people do not like Jacob, you want to be a rebel and like him (like disliking Tali because of the talimancers).

From a literature standpoint it's really simple why people dislike him. Most people probably met Jacob for the first time and were like ok cool, I wonder what this guy is all about.  They liked him fine up to a point, and then his loyalty mission came around and.... well he didn't change.  He stayed the same as he was before.  And while that would be fine in RL, it isn't ok for a story and people were disappointed.  That disappointment became dislike.

You know, as I read through this thread, I was thinking about Jacob's "Daddy Abandonment" issues and realized that he'd already gotten over them. That he'd dealt with it and moved on. What happens after the Loyalty Mission? "Meh, I was already over him."

There's nothing compelling about a character who's personal issues are already dealt with (and, honestly, that's what ME2 was: gathering a crew and getting their personal lives in order before they go off on a mission they will most likely die on).

[outmane]

ArawnNox wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

yeah the contrast is kinda bad but don't make it seem like Shepard doens't get friendly with other squadmates and only gets that way with Jacob.

All I can say is that I didn't see that with anyone else.  And I was frustrated when even the renegade responses ended up being pickup lines.

I wonder if the in-your-faceness is because there will be a future story line with Cerberus where Jacob will play a role.  I thought he was a little too out there with the "I don't trust Cerberus" stuff, like he and Miranda were playing good cop- bad cop prescribed roles.  If I had had more of a free hand, I would have played it that Shepard was cool towards all the Cerberus ops.

Jacob and Miranda playing "Good Cop/Bad Cop" with Shepard.... *tucks that away in the fanfic file*

It does start with Miranda as the bad cop and Jacob as the good one but before you know it, Jacob is asking you to back off and leave him alone while Miranda shows how vulnerable she is under her ice queen persona. I think its a great idea overall but it does cast Jacob in the lesser role. 

[ArawnNox]

Now that I'm done commenting on comments, I'm going to weigh in because I have nothing else to do. It's been a while since I went through ME2, so bear with me.

Jacob was... ultimately forgettable for me ( a guy who plays female leads, if that matters). I was playing a soldier. I could out-gun Jacob, and if I needed strong biotics, I generally went with Jack or Miranda. So, he didn't get a lot of use.

The other thing that turned me off was Hale's voice direction, as others have mention. I was playing an imported femshep who had romanced Liara and I wanted her to stay faithful. Both, because I like Liara and also because none of the romance options interested me (Samara and Kelly don't count as they're not full romances). I'm sure I'm not the only one who wanted their Shep to stay with their ME1 LI.

Consider the timing of it, too. You haven't had a fight with the virmire survivor and you haven't been cold-shouldered by Liara (and this is before we knew about LotSB was on it's way) and the first bit of dialogue from femshep is HEAVY with flirty subtext. That put me on my guard and forced me to tread lightly around him.

Now, to balance this out, that's not to say I don't have my issues with other chars or aspects of ME2. I felt like Steve Blume was wasted on Grunt, who was basically a teen going through puberty (in a litteral sense) (I'm willing to admit I find Steve Blume's voice sexy as hell). Thane held no interest to me at all (I murder people in cold blood, but I'm just a tool. Yeah, you really are, buddy.)

I've got a handful of mini-rants, but that's getting off topic.

And, as I pointed out, above, Jacob has no character flaws that make him interesting.

[ladyvader]

ArawnNox wrote...

Now that I'm done commenting on comments, I'm going to weigh in because I have nothing else to do. It's been a while since I went through ME2, so bear with me.

Jacob was... ultimately forgettable for me ( a guy who plays female leads, if that matters). I was playing a soldier. I could out-gun Jacob, and if I needed strong biotics, I generally went with Jack or Miranda. So, he didn't get a lot of use.

The other thing that turned me off was Hale's voice direction, as others have mention. I was playing an imported femshep who had romanced Liara and I wanted her to stay faithful. Both, because I like Liara and also because none of the romance options interested me (Samara and Kelly don't count as they're not full romances). I'm sure I'm not the only one who wanted their Shep to stay with their ME1 LI.

Consider the timing of it, too. You haven't had a fight with the virmire survivor and you haven't been cold-shouldered by Liara (and this is before we knew about LotSB was on it's way) and the first bit of dialogue from femshep is HEAVY with flirty subtext. That put me on my guard and forced me to tread lightly around him.

Now, to balance this out, that's not to say I don't have my issues with other chars or aspects of ME2. I felt like Steve Blume was wasted on Grunt, who was basically a teen going through puberty (in a litteral sense) (I'm willing to admit I find Steve Blume's voice sexy as hell). Thane held no interest to me at all (I murder people in cold blood, but I'm just a tool. Yeah, you really are, buddy.)

I've got a handful of mini-rants, but that's getting off topic.

And, as I pointed out, above, Jacob has no character flaws that make him interesting.

I always thought that FemShep was always a little flirty with just about every squad member actually.  And I knew if I wanted my FemShep to remain faithful to Liara(which I did btw), I just picked the middle option and left it at that. 

[ArawnNox]

ladyvader wrote...
]I always thought that FemShep was always a little flirty with just about every squad member actually.  And I knew if I wanted my FemShep to remain faithful to Liara(which I did btw), I just picked the middle option and left it at that. 

With Jacob and Thane, yeah, with Garrus, it's not until the "reach and flexability" talk that she gets overtly flirty.

[Antivenger]

I always thought of the relationships in ME2 to be like the whole of DA2. Rushed, incomplete. Jacob was just an extreme case.

I don't particularly like him, but his somewhat introvertedness does him good in my book.

[Seboist]

The problem with Jacob is that he's literally just a security guard who happened to be at the right time and place and ended up on the Normandy for no adequately explained reason. It feels like they took a random crew member like Chakwas or Gardner and made them into a squadmate. His personality and background are utterly bland and if it wasn't the unintentional hilarity with femshep he'd be completely forgettable. He just doesn't feel like he belong there.

[HogarthHughes 3]

I have two problems with Jacob: The conversations with femshep, and his outfit. Sure, in the future soldiers may be able to wear body suits as armor, but it just looks like he is wearing a fancy gimp-suit or something. Even the light armor in ME1 looked like more than latex.