112 réponses à ce sujet

[ElectricZ]

Vaenier wrote...

You know, there are 17 million Quarians on the Flotilla. Thats it, their entire species comes down to 17 million people. That is one half the population of California. That is about two New York Cities...
There simply is no excuse for them to not of found a colony. They have the resources and manpower to colonize any planet they want in only a couple of years, and they choose not to. All to perpetuate this Battlestar Galactica ripoff...

Down from how many billions from the morning war? Right now there are close to 7 billion on our planet...  the quarians probably had more at their peak. So let's say 6,983,000,000 people are killed. What effect would that have on human civilization if that happened to us while we still had a planet on which to live? It'd be hard to bounce back from, especially if you couldn't guarantee the best and brightest were the ones to survive.

But the quarian survivors don't have that luxury. They're stuck in what amounts to life rafts for their civilization.  People from walks of life, different countries with different languages and cultures and histories. While keeping themselves alive in space, they've had to overcome their differences, settle old grudges come up with new laws and a working government, as well as come up with an infrastructure to survive and do it without any outside aid.

Is the right thing to do to keep telling them to bootstrap it? I think that would be more justified if say all attempts to render aid had been ignored, or offers to help find a world to colonize had been rejected. The quarians are hanging over a chasm. They'd probably appreciate a hand up.

Hell, just from an economic perspective, giving them safe harbor anywhere would benefit everybody. Too bad pride and hatred seems to be getting in the way of any real progress.

Modifié par ElectricZ, 03 janvier 2011 - 10:28 .

[Count Viceroy]

Sandbox47 wrote...

It's because they are narrowminded, much like every european and american.

You would have made an awesome troll, unfortunatly its clear you're being serious and that's just facepalm worthy. 

[Vaenier]

ElectricZ wrote...

Hell, just from an economic perspective, giving them safe harbor anywhere would benefit everybody. Too bad pride and hatred seems to be getting in the way of any real progress.

I agree. It wouldnt even take an entire race or even a government to help them, it would take just a single planet to offer aid. Their entire population can fit on a small island. Their entire population can be sustained on an island the size of Cuba, and still have room to grow. Nobody can spare that much for innocent people exiled for their long dead ancestors mistakes?

Humans should have helped them out when they entered the galactic community. then they can say how kind they are for helping them out and not punishing them for mistakes of their parents. and everyone would be like "aww, we were so mean" and everything would be better. Then the humans have the Quarians make a bunch of Cylons and show the council who is boss... [/joke]

Modifié par Vaenier, 03 janvier 2011 - 10:33 .

[Count Viceroy]

One figures the turians should be the council race that reaches out to the quarians, seeing as they share the same dextro based DNA, would make any and all intergration that much smoother.

Modifié par Count Viceroy, 04 janvier 2011 - 01:06 .

[FrancisKitt]

Naughty Bear wrote...

They are the illegal immigrants of the UK.

And yet, quarian plumbers are the best in the galaxy.

Modifié par FrancisKitt, 04 janvier 2011 - 02:20 .

[MaaZeus]

Eradyn wrote...
Also agree with this with one sole exception: The quarians need to get off their duffs and help themselves.  They have the means and manpower they can rectify or prevent all, or at least most, of the points you outlined.  They're smart enough to tinker trash into usable tools, they can be smart enough to solve their problems successfully.  When they show they are taking strides to do this, then perhaps the Council should extend their own olive branch if the quarians have shown a desire to work with the Council species...not to do everything for the quarians but to help enable them to succeed and thus help everyone as a whole.

 



And that is exactly the problem. They cannot. I think every newborn gets spoonfed "we are the victims" self-pity and stupid "Geth are evil and must pay" pride. Quarians are intelligent and smart, praised to be engineering geniouses, but their skewed views on themselves prevents them to be WISE.

This prevents them to start anew, they even refuse to do so as their pride driven by self pity simply doesnt let them. They rather keep banging their heads on the wall and keep on drifting and/or make plans on another war with the Geth. There are expections like Qwib-Qwib and borderline cases like Tali (thanks to Shepards influence) but I fear Quarians are in the need some serious 3rd party help.

Either Council needs to get of their ****** high-horse and throw Quarians a carrot, some small and relatively safe colony where they can reboot their lives (and save Council space a lot of headaches) OR someone (Shepard) has to help them to make peace with the Geth (latter might be the harder route. Quarians still have to overcome their pride and Geth do not trust them). Left alone and Quarians are on their way to sure self destruction, all thanks to stupid pride they just cannot let go.

[282xvl]

Quarians are justifiably hated for creating the Geth. The Geth represent the only REAL threat to the Citadel. They have been sitting out there behind the veil, an unknown and potentially super-power level enemy since long before claims of "reapers" were made and promptly dismissed.

If N@zi Germany's crimes had included creation of sentient machine army which set up shop on Mars and was to this day an ever-present extinction threat to all human beings I don't think ANYONE would be very forgiving to modern-day Germans.

Added to the Quarians' creation of the greatest danger to galactic civilization ever they are also guilty of unforgivable incompetence for failing utterly to eliminate the threat in its infancy. Their military incompetence failed to contain the threat when it was possible to do so at a reasonably affordable cost.

If they had had the competence to realize that they did not have the muscle or skill to shoot their own dog then they should have called in the assistance of the entire council fleet to ensure the Geth threat was smashed out of existence before it got out of hand. I assume they did not, even when things started going poorly, for reasons of pride (or shame) but either way it was insanely irresponsible to keep it "in house" when it became obvious they were going to fail and in so doing inflict the Geth on the galaxy at a large.

Even if they weren't a pack of homeless, leeching, robbing vagrants and bums today, they are still guilty for the Geth. In this particular instance, the sins of the father DO apply to the son (or great X10 grandson) because this is a horrifying sin that just keeps on giving - and that has a very real potential to be the death of literally everyone.

Here's how I would "help" the Quarians if I were Human Chancellor.

I would send the entire force the citadel fleet and any terminus or independent allies I could bribe or convince to join along with the migrant fleet to smash the Geth out of existence. It is just something that has to be done. No, the Geth aren't at fault for really anything, nor can they really be blamed for their actions. But this is not a morality call, this is a survival call. Synthetic life, if allowed to evolve and tech up in parallel with organic life, will inevitably outpace, overrun and eventually consume, enslave or at very least militarily and economically marginalize us.

Once the Geth have been smashed extinction (or at least sufficiently decimated as to pose no meaningful threat for a 5 or 6 centuries) then the Quarians can be returned to their homeworld. But in classic Council form, they will suffer a species-wide punishment for the ghastly cost of taking down the Geth. We'll set them up in pre-fab towns, provide aid and material support for years, even pay for the cost of genetic therapy to repair their immune systems - BUT...

Since their population is so small their planet can easily support them on the food produced by manual or very low-level mechanized agriculture. Therefore they will be resettled and denied access to any computer technology of any kind by way of blockade. (Exactly like the Krogan are denied warships or heavy weapons.) This seems fitting and will eliminate any chance of their revisiting their sins and putting the galaxy through another bloody Geth war in the future.

[Jonathan Shepard]

I dunno, but I find most of them, including Tali, annoying. The vagrant girl was okay, but I always wondered why Paragon Shep can't give her some credits after she mentions eating from ration tubes and living in a turian shelter...

Still. Kal Reegar is an okay guy. But it's pretty much a stigma that all quarians live with. I mean, there are stereotypes in our world. Why not the ME universe?

[GreenDragon37]

Now, I like the Quarians and sympathize with their delima, but really, they are bunch of whiners! They whine about how it was all of the Geth's fault that they lost their homeworld and now they are forced to drift through space. The reality was that they were really trying to kill their creation(the Geth) for achieving sentience. When they failed and were defeated, they fled. They should have established a colony long ago instead of floating in space forever, blaming the Geth.

I'm shocked that Admiral Koris vas Qwib-Qwib is the only Quarian with a darn good head on his shoulders! Instead of trying to wage a war that would likely get them all killed, he's trying to find alternatives. Something that their ancestors should have done a long time ago.

It is sad that the Quarians of today are paying for the sins of their ancestors. However, it is foolish that a lot of them want to make the same mistakes that their ancestors did, and that put them in their current situation.

It's their pride that's getting in the way of them actually getting good, constructive things done. More people should listen to Qwi-Qwib.

[MaaZeus]

GreenDragon37 wrote...

Now, I like the Quarians and sympathize with their delima, but really, they are bunch of whiners! They whine about how it was all of the Geth's fault that they lost their homeworld and now they are forced to drift through space. The reality was that they were really trying to kill their creation(the Geth) for achieving sentience. When they failed and were defeated, they fled. They should have established a colony long ago instead of floating in space forever, blaming the Geth.

I'm shocked that Admiral Koris vas Qwib-Qwib is the only Quarian with a darn good head on his shoulders! Instead of trying to wage a war that would likely get them all killed, he's trying to find alternatives. Something that their ancestors should have done a long time ago.

It is sad that the Quarians of today are paying for the sins of their ancestors. However, it is foolish that a lot of them want to make the same mistakes that their ancestors did, and that put them in their current situation.

It's their pride that's getting in the way of them actually getting good, constructive things done. More people should listen to Qwi-Qwib.

Hence why I always recommend peace at the trial, though I doubt it does any good. As much as I hate Qwib-Qwib for obvious backstabbing, he is pretty much the ONLY admiral that has good ideas in his head. There might be more like him amongst the civilians, (not just counting Qwib-Qwibs crew) but unfortunately admiralty board is full of dumbasses that are getting their race killed.

[lovgreno]

didymos1120 wrote...

lovgreno wrote...

Silentmode wrote... I'm not a sympathizer but its understandable why the other races of the galaxy, especially long lived ones who were around when it all happened, still hold Quarian today accountable for the mistakes of their ancestors.

Yeah. Imagine how bloody scary it must have been at the time. It was something like the rise of the Terminators in real life. Such things are hard to forget, even if the responsible quarians are dead.

The problem with that is, the geth never attacked anyone except the quarians, who they nearly wiped out. Everyone else? Just fine.  They never made moves outside of the former quarian territory.  They didn't like people coming in, but that's a very different thing.  

But how could the other races know that at the time? The Geth was something completely new to everyone in the galaxy, all they knew was that they were obviously dangerous. No reason to assume that they would stop after beating the quarians. Then they dissapeared to become some scary unknown bogeyman hiding behind the Perseus veil, some violent encounters proved that they were still dangerous enough. I'm guessing the geth are still probably the thing most people in the galaxy fears most, especialy after Sarens attack on the Citadell.

[marshalleck]

lovgreno wrote...

 I'm guessing the geth are still probably the thing most people in the galaxy fears most, especialy after Sarens attack on the Citadell.

You should take Legion with you to the Citadel and have a chat with Anderson if you think geth are still the galactic boogeyman. 

As for the quarian hate, it's really simple. It boils down to "dey terk our jerbs!" You know, scapegoating the "other", the people not of one's social group. It's a phenomenon all throughout human history and apparently it's the same with alien cultures.

Modifié par marshalleck, 04 janvier 2011 - 01:05 .