9 réponses à ce sujet

[Ranik15]

Not sure where to post this so I'm defaulting to here. When Obsidian (why on Earth the obsidian forums redirected me here when BioWare had jacksquat to do with NWN2 is beyond me) made SoZ, we all know the Random Number Generator for Dice Rolls was altered to artificially make all enemies harder and make all players weaker because a bunch of morons complained about how the OC and MotB were too easy even though that all falls to the individual choices each player makes when playing and using equipment.


So, has anyone come up with a method of undoing that hideously stupid idea to where the RNG is back to it's pree-SoZ days? If so, I'd just love a link to the way that undoes it. Before anyone mentions going and opening up the console command, note that I play on a PW where that doesn't quite happen and cheating NPCs has gotten older than moldy bread forgotten in the back of the pantry.

[I_Raps]

"we all know" - well, not really. I didn't know that, for example. In fact, I wonder where in the world you got that. Sounds apocryphal.

[kamalpoe]

I think you are confusing the RNG for the inclusion of parts of TonyK's ai. Things got harder because the ai got better. No changes were made to the RNG that I know of.

[Ranik15]

kamalpoe wrote...

I think you are confusing the RNG for the inclusion of parts of TonyK's ai. Things got harder because the ai got better. No changes were made to the RNG that I know of.

How in The Nine Hells of Baator and The Infinite Layers of the Abyss would an AI tweak change the dice rolls? I've seen no real change in the AI, and the Persistant World I play on, a lot of people, even the DMs and staff have pointed out that enemy NPCs get better rolls than they used to, and players get weaker rolls because a lot of people complained the OC and MotB were 'too easy'. Hell, go to tvtropes and you'll read that the RNG was changed with SoZ.

[kamalpoe]

Ranik15 wrote...

kamalpoe wrote...

I think you are confusing the RNG for the inclusion of parts of TonyK's ai. Things got harder because the ai got better. No changes were made to the RNG that I know of.

How in The Nine Hells of Baator and The Infinite Layers of the Abyss would an AI tweak change the dice rolls? I've seen no real change in the AI, and the Persistant World I play on, a lot of people, even the DMs and staff have pointed out that enemy NPCs get better rolls than they used to, and players get weaker rolls because a lot of people complained the OC and MotB were 'too easy'. Hell, go to tvtropes and you'll read that the RNG was changed with SoZ.

I haven't been able to find any references to a changed rng anywhere but this thread. The tvtropes page also makes no mention of it.
tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NeverwinterNights2
So I'll need to see more evidence.

[dunniteowl]

I think you need to first recognize the folks here are here since day one for the most part.  And we've probably all got all there is to have in NWN2.  So instead of telling us "everyone knows" and look on tvtropes (which I never heard of) to verify, you need to relax a bit and present us with some actual facts that back up your claim. 

Otherwise, perhaps it would be wise to hear out what you're being told and take our word for it over folks who aren't possibly as informed?  Just a thought.

No one here has heard that and it was certainly NOT something discussed by the developers, so I think you must be mistaken, which probably means you heard someone you respect say something off the cuff as an opinion and misunderstood it as fact.

Now I am not saying you're wrong.  I'm saying no one here has heard that and we've all been around for a while.  In many cases, on the NWN2 forums before the game was released.  At no time, do I recall any discussion in changing the RNG as you describe.  Now, I don't know about how you see it, but I would have to presume that such a change would have generated a wide and noteable uptick in the discussion of that with some sort of developer response.

Not one peep.

So, if you have some facts, by all means, present them.  Otherwise, it's most likely based on a perception of the changes in the AI or a fix in the misapplied stacking properties of weapons and armor that was a bug and was removed -- which could have the effect of appearing like the enemies are tougher and getting better rolls with characters not getting better ones, due to the stacking bug being removed.  Could it be that?
regards,
dunniteowl

[Zebranky]

... when BioWare had jacksquat to do with NWN2...

Much of the NWN2 engine is BioWare code, including the RNG and combat code you take issue with. Besides that, as the NWN forums and community system (multiplayer authentication too) were already hosted by BioWare, it was deemed sensible to keep infrastructure for the NWN series all in one place.

... we all know the Random Number Generator for Dice Rolls was altered to artificially make all enemies harder and make all players weaker...

Looking at the code for combat rolls, I see no evidence of this. In fact, I suspect if you were to turn on combat debugging (console, DebugMode 1, EnableCombatDebugging 1) and perform a statistical analysis on the rolls, you'd find a suitably random distribution.

Modifié par Zebranky, 04 janvier 2011 - 05:27 .

[kamalpoe]

dunniteowl wrote...

and look on tvtropes (which I never heard of)

Stay away from tvtropes if you value your free time. That site will have you clicking around in it for a long time going "ooh, that looks interesting".

[Ranik15]

kamalpoe wrote...

dunniteowl wrote...

and look on tvtropes (which I never heard of)

Stay away from tvtropes if you value your free time. That site will have you clicking around in it for a long time going "ooh, that looks interesting".

Trust me, I know all about that, and it's a way I pass time.

[kevL]

here's a way to pass time

I made literally thousands of rolls using the RNG in the space of a few days, and if the Raw Roll was weighted .. pretty sure I would have noticed.


oh, and combat *is* way too easy (see sig