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[upsettingshorts]

Harid wrote...

It looks like me and Upsettingshorts are arguing the same point to two different arguments. Which is kinda funny.

Well, until I see a Rivaini that doesn't look more North African than West African, I'm going to assume that's what they mostly look like.  It's a reasonable assumption, but that's still what it is.  It's not as if - like you said - we've been there as players to see what they look like in a diverse, larger sample size.

[AlanC9]

Reidbynature wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

I find the italicized part highly questionable. But that doesn't make you egocentric; merely wrong.

I don't see how.

Of course you don't see the costs, or you wouldn't have made that post. I'll walk you through it

I'm assuming we're talking about the setting itself rather than defects in the character creator. Though obviously the design goals of the character creator are somewhat dependent on the setting.

So you want a diverse setting. How do you make a diverse setting? Four ways come to mind.

1: Turn off your brain and simply copy over the racial mix of, say , 21st century Brooklyn without any concern as to how this came about.

2: Grant the setting a level of technology (including magic) or social organization sufficient to have large-scale migration and/or transportation of people from widely scattered regions on the globe; this technology has to have been in place for a fairly long time before game start for people of different races to actually be integrated into the setting.

3: Assume that the technology in point 2 above once existed but has been lost.

4: Assume that magical and/or divine intervention has resulted in the creation of diverse races much closer to each other than happened on Earth.

1 is, well, stupid. 4 is inapplicable to DA. Either 2 or 3 would have been workable, but they would have imposed serious constraints on the design of the world.

[AlexXIV]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Ninja Mage wrote...

Obviously he does.

...this is infuriating.  "Black" and "White" is not some light switch between features of column A and features of column B - there are a ton of ethnicities out there.  Some of them are dark skinned without "black features" (most often in the West this means West African) I cited one.  You ignored it.  

AlexXIV wrote...
Anyway they shrunk her lips which even you can't deny and if that isn't changing a racial attribute then I don't know.

Yes, she used to be a white person with massive Angelina Jolie lips.  Now she is a North African person with smaller lips.  I am not bothered by this, nor do I feel like it is some "reduction in her blackness" which seems to be - oddly - the argument.

Sorry but I don't see that white person thing either. Granted in DA:O she is in a tavern and probably had different lighting, but I always conidered her dark skinned. Especially compared to Fereldans.

[Cobrawar]

I just wanted to say this thread is a mess

[Harid]

Captain Cornhole wrote...

ErichHartmann wrote...

Race is a socially constructed myth which has no legitimate use in science. We should be discussing ethnicity which attempts to define an individual's culture identity.

Hell your spot on, most of us are all one species here. *points to the extraterrestrials and sentient dolphins in the crowd*

Please don't start down the Stephen T. Colbert "I don't see race" bs ideology.  Because oftentimes, the people who use this argument do see race, and this is just a *sticks fingers in ears "BlahblahblahblahblahIcan'thearyoublahblahblahblah"* argument used when you don't want to address a point. . .just don't post in the thread if that's the case.

[Reidbynature]

Oh I don't care anymore. I think I got most of what I asked in the original post. This thread is getting too circular.



Captain Cornhole. I disagree with some things you said like looking too hard at things, I thought they were obvious, but I respect your opinion. And I'm leaving the cake well enough alone.

[Ninja Mage]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Ninja Mage wrote...

Obviously he does.

...this is infuriating.  "Black" and "White" is not some light switch between features of column A and features of column B - there are a ton of ethnicities out there.  Some of them are dark skinned without "black features" (most often in the West this means West African) I cited one.  You ignored it.  

AlexXIV wrote...
Anyway they shrunk her lips which even you can't deny and if that isn't changing a racial attribute then I don't know.

Yes, she used to be a white person with massive Angelina Jolie lips.  Now she is a North African person with smaller lips.  I am not bothered by this, nor do I feel like it is some "reduction in her blackness" which seems to be - oddly - the argument.

Dude, I know this. My whole family looks like this. But for you guys to say Rivain can't be black, when it doesn't even exist, is so freaking stupid. Why can't she have big lips? There's like some hidden agenda here

[Atakuma]

Harid wrote...

Whatever you need to say to make you 'win' the argument, buddy.

I'm not trying to 'win' anything. If you would like to counter my argument, go ahead.

[AlexXIV]

Cobrawar wrote...

I just wanted to say this thread is a mess

And so are you, welcome

[Dhiro]

So... people here are arguing about Isabela's lips? I'd think you would talk about her (lack of) pants.



Anyway... I do think we have racial diversity until now. Maybe not much, but some. Also, isn't Isabela black-skinned?

[AlanC9]

Harid wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

The Friends
complaints were bogus in the first place, except maybe for the
workplaces. I've lived in Manhattan for years. The sorts of places those
characters hang out in are pretty damn segregated.

Ok, buddy.  Thanks for proving my point, though.  Whitewashing is ok, apparently.

What are you talking about? It isn't whitewashing to get a real-world setting right.

[ErichHartmann]

Harid wrote...


Please don't start down the Stephen T. Colbert "I don't see race" bs ideology.  Because oftentimes, the people who use this argument do see race, and this is just a *sticks fingers in ears "BlahblahblahblahblahIcan'thearyoublahblahblahblah"* argument used when you don't want to address a point. . .just don't post in the thread if that's the case.

Of course we have to talk about the concept of race simply because racism still has a very strong presence.  Until people accept the fact skin color is simply the amount of melanin our body produces, this way of thinking will never end.

[upsettingshorts]

Ninja Mage wrote...

Dude, I know this. My whole family looks like this. But for you guys to say Rivain can't be black, when it doesn't even exist, is so freaking stupid. Why can't she have big lips? There's like some hidden agenda here

Here's what I'm saying:  

People who have dark skin, but not West African features, are not "tanned white people."  That's all. 

[AlexXIV]

Dhiro wrote...

So... people here are arguing about Isabela's lips? I'd think you would talk about her (lack of) pants.

Anyway... I do think we have racial diversity until now. Maybe not much, but some. Also, isn't Isabela black-skinned?

No because her lack of pants isn't something that bothers me lol

Modifié par AlexXIV, 04 janvier 2011 - 11:03 .

[Dhiro]

AlexXIV wrote...

Dhiro wrote...

So... people here are arguing about Isabela's lips? I'd think you would talk about her (lack of) pants.

Anyway... I do think we have racial diversity until now. Maybe not much, but some. Also, isn't Isabela black-skinned?

No because her lack of pants isn't something that bothers me lol

Touché.

Modifié par Dhiro, 04 janvier 2011 - 11:03 .

[AlanC9]

Ninja Mage wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Ninja Mage wrote...

Obviously he does.

...this is infuriating.  "Black" and "White" is not some light switch between features of column A and features of column B - there are a ton of ethnicities out there.  Some of them are dark skinned without "black features" (most often in the West this means West African) I cited one.  You ignored it.  

AlexXIV wrote...
Anyway they shrunk her lips which even you can't deny and if that isn't changing a racial attribute then I don't know.

Yes, she used to be a white person with massive Angelina Jolie lips.  Now she is a North African person with smaller lips.  I am not bothered by this, nor do I feel like it is some "reduction in her blackness" which seems to be - oddly - the argument.

Dude, I know this. My whole family looks like this. But for you guys to say Rivain can't be black, when it doesn't even exist, is so freaking stupid. Why can't she have big lips? There's like some hidden agenda here

Weird -- he didn't say any such thing. Or did you quote the wrong post?

[King Killoth]

how can any one say no ethnic diversity did no one notice sten or zev.. sten was tall darkskind and had a funny acsent and zev was a bi sexual italian elf.. not to mention Duncan was only half white he was part Rivain

[Harid]

AlanC9 wrote...

What are you talking about? It isn't whitewashing to get a real-world setting right.

I lived in Manhattan before I moved back to Long Island, and I've never seen any part of it that had no other minorites in it, from working behind the counter to doing business in the type of places they hung out in.  They got the setting wrong, and that's why it was changed in the first place.

Atakuma wrote...

I'm not trying to 'win' anything. If you would like to counter my argument, go ahead.

I did.  Your sample size is too low for you to come to the conclusion you did.  Based on your logic I could say Brentwood, Long Island is a hispanic town.  It is not.

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Here's what I'm saying:  

People who have dark skin, but not West African features, are not "tanned white people."  That's all. 

I addressed this point earlier. . .with the VF5 example with Vanessa.

Modifié par Harid, 04 janvier 2011 - 11:08 .

[Russalka]

I wonder if Bioware will be called a bigot for closing this thread too. It has derailed, after all.

[Cobrawar]

AlexXIV wrote...

Cobrawar wrote...

I just wanted to say this thread is a mess

And so are you, welcome

 yeah I kinda made it too easy

[drahelvete]

It won't be a problem much longer. The master race, aka the Qunari, will soon incorporate all of Thedas in their mating program. Then there won't be any "white" or "brown" people, just soldiers and pastry chefs.

[Ninja Mage]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Ninja Mage wrote...

Dude, I know this. My whole family looks like this. But for you guys to say Rivain can't be black, when it doesn't even exist, is so freaking stupid. Why can't she have big lips? There's like some hidden agenda here

Here's what I'm saying:  

People who have dark skin, but not West African features, are not "tanned white people."  That's all. 

I was referring to another post, in which he said that Isabela looked like a british person with a tan. And she f**&&**g does. I never said middle eastern people or people with dark skin were tanned white people. Please

[AlexXIV]

Captain Cornhole wrote...

Harid wrote...

Captain Cornhole wrote...

ErichHartmann wrote...

Race is a socially constructed myth which has no legitimate use in science. We should be discussing ethnicity which attempts to define an individual's culture identity.

Hell your spot on, most of us are all one species here. *points to the extraterrestrials and sentient dolphins in the crowd*

Please don't start down the Stephen T. Colbert "I don't see race" bs ideology.  Because oftentimes, the people who use this argument do see race, and this is just a *sticks fingers in ears "BlahblahblahblahblahIcan'thearyoublahblahblahblah"* argument used when you don't want to address a point. . .just don't post in the thread if that's the case.

Don't worry I won't, Stephen Colbert is a well...I'm not going to say the word. But seriously I just think the word needs to be redefined as culture instead of race. And by the way I'm not claiming to be a saint here.

Well idk, you could adopt a culture if you liked. But changing your race seems more difficult.