161 réponses à ce sujet

[JedTed]

A lot of people complain that the Human Reaper looks like a Terminator to much but how is that any different from the Rachni resembling the bugs in Starship Troopers?  There's lots of other things in ME that resemble stuff from other sci-fi but they don't bring down the quality of the story at all.

I just had to vent that because i'm sick of people always bringing up Terminator when they talk about the Human Reaper.

[Aeowyn]

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/5293969

[shinobi602]

I personally don't hate it, it just looked funny that's all...it just didn't LOOK like it belonged in the Mass Effect universe...



I have no problem at all with the concept of it, in fact I think it's a great concept. I'm just not too fond of the design too much...

[adam_grif]

In summary:



1. Why is it human shaped? Will the final reaper be like some kind of ridiculous giant robot superman that shoots lasers out of its dick, or will the human shape be covered in the standard cuttlefish design exterior? In the case of the former, it looks utterly ridiculous, and in the case of the latter it is completely redundant and unnecessary.



2. Why are they using mushed up humans as a construction material? EDI claims they are using the "essence" of humans, but this is total nonsense, philosophically and scientifically. Mushed up humans are certainly not a great construction material. Even so, why can they then not simply use raw materials that humans are made of (which are trivial to get in huge quantities and would not require wholesale kidnap and destruction of human lives to draw attention to themselves)?

[GodWood]

My problem with it (aside from it's look) is that it's powered by human goo.

[GnawLF]

Its only Human goo by our understanding, we dont really know what the Reapers do with the said "goo" or how they modify it. In any case its obvious that the reason the Reapers need the "goo" is to manipulate Mass Effect fields, that is why they are so interested in the Human biotic potential and the Ascention Project.

[Dionkey]

adam_grif wrote...

In summary:

1. Why is it human shaped? Will the final reaper be like some kind of ridiculous giant robot superman that shoots lasers out of its dick, or will the human shape be covered in the standard cuttlefish design exterior? In the case of the former, it looks utterly ridiculous, and in the case of the latter it is completely redundant and unnecessary.

2. Why are they using mushed up humans as a construction material? EDI claims they are using the "essence" of humans, but this is total nonsense, philosophically and scientifically. Mushed up humans are certainly not a great construction material. Even so, why can they then not simply use raw materials that humans are made of (which are trivial to get in huge quantities and would not require wholesale kidnap and destruction of human lives to draw attention to themselves)?

Mr Grif hit it right on the head. I don't even know what they were thinking when they chose the Human Reaper. Its not even efficent in combat at that size. Also mushed up materials is some fantasy stuff. If I kill a person/people and then mush them up and pump them through tubes, there is no reason they will turn into a human shape, infact that doesn't even make sense. I can see extracting gasses and vitamins/minerals from the corpses but that just seems illogical to farm colonies when you could do it in another fashion, especially if it is vital to the process of building a reaper.

[Sandbox47]

I have a theory on the Reapers. They look in the end like the race they devour, right? Or something along those lines. It would make sense then for that particular Reaper to have memory stored on it's databanks about the race. So that once it is gone, it's still not forgotten.

That would make sense, I think. Unless BioWare has some good explanation aside from "PURE EVIL" as to why they harvest lives.

[Dionkey]

Sandbox47 wrote...

I have a theory on the Reapers. They look in the end like the race they devour, right? Or something along those lines. It would make sense then for that particular Reaper to have memory stored on it's databanks about the race. So that once it is gone, it's still not forgotten.
That would make sense, I think. Unless BioWare has some good explanation aside from "PURE EVIL" as to why they harvest lives.

The thing is that they provide no explanation on how they preserve the
data after grinding them into liquid. ME has a lot of stuff that crosses
the line of science but they can't just pull another "Their reapers,
they can do what they want." I hope to see a twist on why they needed to
stop at Ilos other than the conduit, I sincerly think Vigil was lying,
but I am going off topic.

[adam_grif]

I have a theory on the Reapers. They look in the end like the race they devour, right? Or something along those lines.

Every reaper we've seen so far, including the ones in the final ME2 cutscene with the long shot, all look identical. If they do look like whatever species they were built from, then they have only used one species before as far as we can tell. More likely is they all end up looking the same.

[FOZ289]

The rachni looking like the Bugs might have been an intentional reference.



However, the final boss being a giant Terminator was just unintentionally hilarious, and that's the problem people have. It wasn't meant to be funny.

[Sandbox47]

Dionkey wrote...

Sandbox47 wrote...

I have a theory on the Reapers. They look in the end like the race they devour, right? Or something along those lines. It would make sense then for that particular Reaper to have memory stored on it's databanks about the race. So that once it is gone, it's still not forgotten.
That would make sense, I think. Unless BioWare has some good explanation aside from "PURE EVIL" as to why they harvest lives.

The thing is that they provide no explanation on how they preserve the
data after grinding them into liquid. ME has a lot of stuff that crosses
the line of science but they can't just pull another "Their reapers,
they can do what they want." I hope to see a twist on why they needed to
stop at Ilos other than the conduit, I sincerly think Vigil was lying,
but I am going off topic.

Nah, I meant that they save all the movies, ebooks and everything else that they can get from the net while they fly around, destroying stuff.

[wulf3n]

JedTed wrote...

A lot of people complain that the Human Reaper looks like a Terminator to much but how is that any different from the Rachni resembling the bugs in Starship Troopers? 

The Rachni ARE the bugs from Starship Troopers...basically, But they always were, and probably always will be, so it's not really a big deal, like you said Bioware took a lot of stuff from other sci-fi. 

But the reapers aren't "terminators" in any sense of the word, so the fact that they look like them stands out more.

also...
           - Machines that are insulted by the very notion of organic life, being made from organic material is ridiculous.
           - No explanation was ever giving as to "why" they take on the form of the material they're made from, makes the very idea ridiculous.

All of which makes the final encounter so ridiculous its funny to the point where you just wanna make fun of it as much as you can, and the easiest way to do that is call it the Terminator...or pants

I'm guessing the response Bioware wanted from the human reaper was more of a "OMG Soylent green is ppl" which may have been the case for some people, but for me the first and only thought was "Really!"

[Dreddo]

Who knows how the Reaper species looks like? We only know about their Vanguard and Harbinger who is not looking alike. Humans are not all looking the same, so who says that Reapers couldn't have different shapes too? Especially when you consider that they claim to have build the Citidal, and the mass relays, but how would they do that if they all looks like those seen so far, i mean it's not like they are in the most effective building design. I think that there's a creator behind the reapers, or maybe some kinda of companions to the reapers, a bit like the keepers at the Citidal.



that's my theory.



Also if you make a human Reaper, aka machine, in metal skeleton, how is it not gonna look like Terminator in any way? It's kinda standard look imo.



Also i also though of Starship Troopers as soon as i saw the Rachni =D

[Nightwriter]

People think the science - or lack thereof - behind the Reaper is silly. The fact that it looks like a Terminator is just icing on the cake.

Making fun of the similarity is just capitalizing on the fact that the whole idea is silly in general.

[Dreddo]

Nightwriter wrote...

People think the science - or lack thereof - behind the Reaper is silly. The fact that it looks like a Terminator is just icing on the cake.

Making fun of the similarity is just capitalizing on the fact that the whole idea is silly in general.

a silly idea, is it? I mean what if this eventually happened in a century or two... I'm playing with that idea atm. Thinking a lot about it... Brain training and fun to think of =)

[Dionkey]

Dreddo wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

People think the science - or lack thereof - behind the Reaper is silly. The fact that it looks like a Terminator is just icing on the cake.

Making fun of the similarity is just capitalizing on the fact that the whole idea is silly in general.

a silly idea, is it? I mean what if this eventually happened in a century or two... I'm playing with that idea atm. Thinking a lot about it... Brain training and fun to think of =)

But it is just not possible. What if you were making it a snowman but decided to make it of squirrel meat. Does that mean it will force you to make a squirrel shape? No, it makes no sense.

[Mister Mida]

I don't like the whole concept of the Reapers being cyborgs instead of AI and tech as was implied in ME (1). I'm keeping my hopes up that the human Reaper was just some weird last resort plan of the Reapers but I expect the worst in ME3.

[Fredvdp]

I happened to find this thread after posting about this somewhere else. Anyway, I think the final design is great. It's outrageuos in a very good way. However, I personally prefer one of the older concepts, which was a giant embryo. It would have been controversial to keep that in the game, but it would ad so much to the game's creepy atmosphere. If they're turning ME2 into a movie I think this is one of the things that should definitely change in the adaptation. People will protest, but oh well.

[Jabarai]

Nightwriter wrote...

People think the science - or lack thereof - behind the Reaper is silly. The fact that it looks like a Terminator is just icing on the cake.

I'm not sure if it's silly, exactly. Of what I'm one hundred percent certain, however, is that you could say that everything that is scary and odd in, say, Twin Peaks is really rather silly. That is, if you simply wish to think so. But why would you do that?

I'd say that the levels of biotechnology the Reapers could be seen mastering are beyond what we can imagine. Storaging the data (i.e. knowledge, memories and so on) of each individual that ends up gooed and stored in a Reaper can also be seen quite viable and sensible.

And then we get to the appearance of the thing. Yes, it looks a bit naive, and a far cry from any other Reaper seen in the games. Then again, it's only claimed to be a reaper larva (assuming it doesn't refer to the constuct being unfinished), and a reasonable conclusion would be that it also ends up with a shell, similar to any other Reaper out there. Why the human figure, then, in the first place? Well, one possible reason would be entirely religious. The geth are capable of assuming gods or other 'higher purposes', so it stands to reason that the Reapers could, too. And no amount of arguments rooting for logic and sense can touch religion.

Frankly, few people are concerned in speculating or figuring out the Reapers' motives for doing what is generally regarded as silly stuff. I'd say it's a lot more rewarding that what seems like the favourite pastime here, poking and ripping holes in the story.

Modifié par Jabarai, 05 janvier 2011 - 11:48 .

[Captain Crash]

The Reapers were original and Mass Effect had an original story. Of course you can make comparisons across sci-fi its inevitable. Gazing at a giant Terminator took away so much of the originality of the first game. The fact people mention Terminator all the time shows it straight away!

[adam_grif]

The Reapers were original

That's a negative Cap'n.



They evoke Revelation Space's Inhibitors very strongly.

[Dionkey]

adam_grif wrote...

The Reapers were original

That's a negative Cap'n.

They evoke Revelation Space's Inhibitors very strongly.

It doesn't even need to be argued the Reapers aren't original, the concept is a bad plot device in itself.  I enjoyed the story before coming to the forums, for the simple fact that you miss alot that your peers can point out for you. More of a curse than a blessing but ill just have to bite the bullet and try to continue while avoiding the forums for spoilers regarding ME3.

[The Smoking Man]

Would have been so much better. And made the pulpification thing make more sense.