36 réponses à ce sujet

[JnEricsonx]

I can tell her pre Landsmeet "you have my support", and then pull a 180 on her at the Landsmeet, right?

[Collider]

You most certainly can.

[Maugrim]

Yes you can lie.

[vdeity]

You can, but you don't need to.

It's possible to win the Landsmeet even without her support.

[Persephone]

JnEricsonx wrote...

I can tell her pre Landsmeet "you have my support", and then pull a 180 on her at the Landsmeet, right?

Yeah. But I never saw the necessity.

[IanPolaris]

Better yet, if you want to destroy her politically, you can artfully arrange it for her to lie in front of multiple witnesses (and I don't just mean by having Alistair kill Loghain).



You agree to support her if she agrees to Marry Alistair. She readily will do so. Then you bring up the subject of Loghain and opine that he absoutely has to die for his crimes. She is sadden BUT AGREES and then openly goes through the motions of betrothing herself to Alistair.



Then she lies in front of the entire Landsmeet (by not supporting you) and you can call her on it. You don't need Anora's support anyway to win the Landsmeet. In fact you don't even need to free the slaves to win the Landsmeet or even mention it at all (except that the Landsmeet won't convene until you finish that quest).



If you free Bann Sigurd's Son from Howe's Dungeon, and you do as Templar Iminric asks (his sister is a voting Bann), and you do Trial of the Crows, AND finally if you say the Blight not Orlais is the true threat, then you will win the Landsmeet running away.



-Polaris

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Yes you can totally double cross her. And if she sold you out in Howe's estate when you confront Cauthrien, you can consider it a payback. or, you can do it just to be a double crossing backstabbing bastard.

[mousestalker]

IanPolaris wrote...
snip

If you free Bann Sigurd's Son from Howe's Dungeon, and you do as Templar Iminric asks (his sister is a voting Bann), and you do Trial of the Crows, AND finally if you say the Blight not Orlais is the true threat, then you will win the Landsmeet running away.

-Polaris

I'm pretty sure you can't run away from the Landsmeet. It's a required encounter.

[Reika]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Yes you can totally double cross her. And if she sold you out in Howe's estate when you confront Cauthrien, you can consider it a payback.

Ever since my first time playing, I've done it because that's how I've seen her actions. Though I do love some of the responses you're given when you tell Cauthrien you were there to rescue the queen and she lies about it.

[errant_knight]

mousestalker wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...
snip

If you free Bann Sigurd's Son from Howe's Dungeon, and you do as Templar Iminric asks (his sister is a voting Bann), and you do Trial of the Crows, AND finally if you say the Blight not Orlais is the true threat, then you will win the Landsmeet running away.

-Polaris

I'm pretty sure you can't run away from the Landsmeet. It's a required encounter.

It's an expression meaning that you will totally win.

[goofyomnivore]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Yes you can totally double cross her. And if she sold you out in Howe's estate when you confront Cauthrien, you can consider it a payback. or, you can do it just to be a double crossing backstabbing bastard.

I could be remembering wrong wouldn't be the first time and wouldn't be last time either, but technically you sell her out, by blowing her cover.

[Gabey5]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Yes you can totally double cross her. And if she sold you out in Howe's estate when you confront Cauthrien, you can consider it a payback. or, you can do it just to be a double crossing backstabbing bastard.

she didnt doublecross you... you announced she was with you! she was in disguise for a reason. She didnt want to show her cards to logain yet

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Gabey5 wrote...

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Yes you can totally double cross her. And if she sold you out in Howe's estate when you confront Cauthrien, you can consider it a payback. or, you can do it just to be a double crossing backstabbing bastard.

she didnt doublecross you... you announced she was with you! she was in disguise for a reason. She didnt want to show her cards to logain yet

It's a matter of perspective, that part. So , looking at it from one angle, she did.

[IanPolaris]

Gabey5 wrote...

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Yes you can totally double cross her. And if she sold you out in Howe's estate when you confront Cauthrien, you can consider it a payback. or, you can do it just to be a double crossing backstabbing bastard.

she didnt doublecross you... you announced she was with you! she was in disguise for a reason. She didnt want to show her cards to logain yet

Almost certainly because she arranged for Ser Cauthrien to be there in the first place.  She has the self-survival instincts enough to apologize when you meet her again...and good thing too.  Otherwise more wardens than just mine would figure this out (i.e. Anora doublecrossed you in Howe's state to begin with just by having Ser Cauthrien there!)

-Polaris

[Reika]

IanPolaris wrote...

Almost certainly because she arranged for Ser Cauthrien to be there in the first place.  She has the self-survival instincts enough to apologize when you meet her again...and good thing too.  Otherwise more wardens than just mine would figure this out (i.e. Anora doublecrossed you in Howe's state to begin with just by having Ser Cauthrien there!)

-Polaris

The timing was way too convenient, Polaris. The size of force that Cauthrien had to assemble and get to the estate would've taken more time than your actions in Howe's Estate would've given. Especially since there wasn't that much of an alert made until you were either very deep into the dungeon, or on your way out.

[Eber]

Gabey5 wrote...

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Yes
you can totally double cross her. And if she sold you out in Howe's
estate when you confront Cauthrien, you can consider it a payback. or,
you can do it just to be a double crossing backstabbing bastard.

she didnt doublecross you... you announced she was
with you! she was in disguise for a reason. She didnt want to show her
cards to logain yet

She was in disguise to avoid getting caught and sneak out unnoticed. When your party is caught you're caught and it's time to play all diplomatic cards you have. If Anora wanted to she could have tried reasoning with Cauthrien. It works for a cunning Warden and I would think Cauthrien is more inclined to listen to Anora. The idea that Cauthrien, if told about what had (supposedly) happened, would accept and embrace Howe's plan to the extent that she would proceed to kidnap Anora, one of her betters, herself is farfetched. Even if that were to happen we would expect some of the men to follow the Queen rather than a treasonous Knight making the fight easier. Don't let Anora make you feel guilty about announcing her presence. It is the sensible thing to do.

I too think Cauthrien got there with the aid of Anora. I dont think they are working together though or that Cauthrien was in the know. Cauthrien is a wonderful woman with fierce loyalty to Loghain an no one else. Someone (from Anora's camp) just whispered in her ear that she needed to be there with a big force to stop the bad, bad Warden.

Modifié par Eber, 06 janvier 2011 - 08:58 .

[IanPolaris]

Reika wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

Almost certainly because she arranged for Ser Cauthrien to be there in the first place.  She has the self-survival instincts enough to apologize when you meet her again...and good thing too.  Otherwise more wardens than just mine would figure this out (i.e. Anora doublecrossed you in Howe's state to begin with just by having Ser Cauthrien there!)

-Polaris

The timing was way too convenient, Polaris. The size of force that Cauthrien had to assemble and get to the estate would've taken more time than your actions in Howe's Estate would've given. Especially since there wasn't that much of an alert made until you were either very deep into the dungeon, or on your way out.

Exactly my point.  I am suprised that more warden's don't realize this and draw the appropriate conclusion (i.e. Anora and really only Anora ratting you out can plausibly explain this without resorting to metagaming).

-Polaris

[Reika]

IanPolaris wrote...

Exactly my point.  I am suprised that more warden's don't realize this and draw the appropriate conclusion (i.e. Anora and really only Anora ratting you out can plausibly explain this without resorting to metagaming).

-Polaris

Quite frankly the whole situation just stank to me. Really, the only reason as a player I did it was because I had no choice. My HNF's reasoning was to stick it to Howe, she just didn't realize how much she got to stick it to him at first.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Reika wrote...

Quite frankly the whole situation just stank to me. Really, the only reason as a player I did it was because I had no choice.

It's a role playing premise I've certainly used, as it adds an extra element of intrigue and suits certain characters well.

[Reika]

Oh, I like the intrigue, there was just something about the whole setup that grated on my nerves.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Reika wrote...

Oh, I like the intrigue, there was just something about the whole setup that grated on my nerves.

I disliked having to take that route and rescue the queen in the first place, the same way I hated having to heal Eamon. But the game must go on, so I have to make up reasons to justify exactly why I'm doing it.

[Reika]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

Reika wrote...

Oh, I like the intrigue, there was just something about the whole setup that grated on my nerves.

I disliked having to take that route and rescue the queen in the first place, the same way I hated having to heal Eamon. But the game must go on, so I have to make up reasons to justify exactly why I'm doing it.

Probably why my HNF has been the only character I could play through on, I was able to justify what she was doing from her perspective, but couldn't really with the other characters.

[Zjarcal]

The only bad thing about lying to Anora is that she doesn't acknowledge this once you don't put her on the throne. It would've been great to see her pull a tantrum over how you lied to her.



It's a good thing my HNF always says "Death First!" right from the start when meeting Cauthrien, that way she has no hard feelings towards Anora. But it certainly is delicious to play with her just as she is playing with you.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Reika wrote...

Probably why my HNF has been the only character I could play through on, I was able to justify what she was doing from her perspective, but couldn't really with the other characters.

It was finding justifications for all my other characters that made playing them all the more fun. For my HN, the trip was a no-brainer. Kill Howe.

[Dakim Dragco]

its imposible to make dialog on all posible outcomes, there are times i wished i could do things difrent in the game, but some choices simply are premade. This is understandable in one fact, your a single warden who has the world around him falling to ruin, naturaly you are forced to do thing that are against the nature of your character, like giving up instead of fighting till the end.



As for anora, i never hated her, infact i admire her for her political mind and schrewdness (cunning). She does everything she can to better herself and stay in power, as evry politician out there does. If she needs to betray, double cross and lie to get that far, then so be it. the way you act to her betrayl says much about your character; Do you double-cross her back? if so then you are basicly taking revenge, or acting politicly in your own interest.