74 réponses à ce sujet

[Addai]

Zjarcal wrote...

Gabey5 wrote...

to add... the dog seemed like a wasted party slot.

This post is full of fail.

Apparently someone never learned the joys of Overwhelm.

[Angband21]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Angband21 wrote...

mousestalker wrote...

Oghren was a huge wet blanket for me in Awakenings. I play games to escape, not relive past Al-Anon meetings.

Bioware seems attached to drunken slobbish dwarfs. BG1 had Yeslick and Kaigan, BG2 had Korgan (hope I didn't get them switched around) and now we have literally at the bottom of the barrel, Oghren.

C'mon Bioware, can we have at least one sober, intelligent dwarf NPC?

Sigrun doesn't count? 

Forgot Sigrun. First female dwarf NPC. Now if they could provide a Male Dwarf NPC that was as fun as Sigrun, I'd be happy.

[TrueAinaelin]

I think I liked... something in all companions, and found all of them annoying at times. Alistair seemed the most artificial to me, somehow, but maybe it was the voice acting. I kinda liked Morrigan, even though she was a pain in game, always disgruntled by my choices . And yes, I also likes Leliana, probably one of my favourites, although I can understand that some found her boring. Hervoice acting seemed somewhat overdone to me, but I guess it's true of most companions if you think of it.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

None are terribly boring in concept, but in terms of boring to listen to, Wynne wins for me. Her sermons make me cringe and pound the esc key. Leliana has some rather amusing moments to listen to.

[sylvanaerie]

She wasn't my top three but she wasn't on the bottom of companions either. And I have to agree with others who have said they must not be boring or we still wouldn't be talking about them months later.

[Sarah1281]

I don't feel that it's all that common to have a companion or other character that everyone can agree is boring. Peoples' tastes just vary so much that you'd be really hardpressed to be able to say 'X is boring' and have every single person agree with you. Maybe the inevitable fans of X, no matter how dull X is, want to keep talking about X but that doesn't automatically make X even remotely compelling.



(I should probably add that I wasn't talking about Leliana, just the theory that a character/subject being talked about means that it isn't dull and doesn't bore people which I disagree with)

[ReplicantZero]

At first thought Lel was a bit boring, but then after a while found she was rather sweet and had hidden...depths. Then she hit it off with my (female) city elf. Love the way she says 'Hello'.

Wynne's lectures did get boring on the other hand, especially when accidentally clicking on her instead of a corpse I was trying to loot.

[Shinobu]

ReplicantZero wrote...

At first thought Lel was a bit boring, but then after a while found she was rather sweet and had hidden...depths. Then she hit it off with my (female) city elf. Love the way she says 'Hello'.
Wynne's lectures did get boring on the other hand, especially when accidentally clicking on her instead of a corpse I was trying to loot.

"Sorry, Wynne, I thought you were a corpse!":wizard: Priceless.

I didn't get Leliana at first but I've come to really like her. It's fun to talk about shoes rather than dismemberment, death and duty sometimes. Oghren was the least scintillating conversationalist, IMO, though his banters were great.

[atheelogos]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

[DPSSOC]

I kind of have to agree with the OP. It's not that I don't like Leliana but she doesn't strike me as particularly interesting. Any regrets about what you did? No. Complaints about your current lot in life aside from shoes? No. Interesting stories? No. Maybe it's different if you romance her (I can't voice grates) but aside from the "My old mentor's trying to kill me" which covers one random encounter and a side quest there doesn't seem to be anything to her.



Alistair has his problems and they show in his character, same with Morrigan, Sten, even Zev has two interesting tales of daring-do to hold you over until you get to the good bits, but Leliana's like Teflon, she's been through all this stuff and the only things that seemed to have stuck are a love of shoes and stories. There's no old habits from her bard life creeping up, no conflict between who she was and who she is now, no drama aside from the above mentioned RE and SQ. I still like her but she's not exactly interesting.



Can't really comment on Oghren, I always do Orzammar last so I don't really tal,k to him.

[ZeRoToXiN]

DPSSOC wrote...

I kind of have to agree with the OP. It's not that I don't like Leliana but she doesn't strike me as particularly interesting. Any regrets about what you did? No. Complaints about your current lot in life aside from shoes? No. Interesting stories? No. Maybe it's different if you romance her (I can't voice grates) but aside from the "My old mentor's trying to kill me" which covers one random encounter and a side quest there doesn't seem to be anything to her.

Alistair has his problems and they show in his character, same with Morrigan, Sten, even Zev has two interesting tales of daring-do to hold you over until you get to the good bits, but Leliana's like Teflon, she's been through all this stuff and the only things that seemed to have stuck are a love of shoes and stories. There's no old habits from her bard life creeping up, no conflict between who she was and who she is now, no drama aside from the above mentioned RE and SQ. I still like her but she's not exactly interesting.

Can't really comment on Oghren, I always do Orzammar last so I don't really tal,k to him.

Are you kidding me? Have you payed attention while playing the game? No inner conflict? That appears in several conversations, most notably after her sidequest but also in a few other ones. There are many connections to her old bard life, like her mentioning things being "games" a few times. I think you just havent been paying attention to her much.

Leliana's Song adds a lot to her character and history, but even without playing that, there's still a lot to her and a lot to find interesting.

[Addai]

ZeRoToXiN wrote...

Are you kidding me? Have you payed attention while playing the game? No inner conflict? That appears in several conversations, most notably after her sidequest but also in a few other ones. There are many connections to her old bard life, like her mentioning things being "games" a few times. I think you just havent been paying attention to her much.

Leliana's Song adds a lot to her character and history, but even without playing that, there's still a lot to her and a lot to find interesting.

Yeah, even as a confirmed Leli hater, I'm scratching my head at that one.  Chick had too much conflict.  LOL  I found her on the clingy and needy side.

Leliana's Song didn't add to the character and in some ways took away from it IMO, mostly by retconning how she had told her own story in Origins.

[Addai]

Shinobu wrote...
"Sorry, Wynne, I thought you were a corpse!":wizard: Priceless.

Well, she kind of is!

I didn't get Leliana at first but I've come to really like her. It's fun to talk about shoes rather than dismemberment, death and duty sometimes. Oghren was the least scintillating conversationalist, IMO, though his banters were great.

I loved talking to Oghren in camp.  The Warden falling over from drinking his brew was great.

[Ryzaki]

Nah Leli isn't boring. Honestly I didn't find any of the PCs to be boring. Some of the NPCs on the other hand like Eamon and Loghain yeah. Boring as hell.

[Sarah1281]

The Water God wrote...

So French redheaded bisexuals who are ex spy/assassins because they were betrayed by their lesbian lover/mentor to be framed for treason and wrongly totured. Who then have to break out and flee to another country to keep from being excuted for crimes they did not commit, only to join the church in hopes for redemption and end up receiving a mysterious vision from god convincing them that they should use their skills to help save the world instead of locking themselves up in a nunnery are boring/uninteresting to you.

May I know what store you rent most of your movies from sir?

 
You know, just throwing together a backstory with all those things doesn’t actually mandate that one be an interesting character. In fact (to move away from Leliana specifically and getting into the more general), one could easily write an OC of their own with that exact backstory and have a really, really dull Mary Sue character. Just throwing out ‘Oh, she’s bisexual!’ and ‘Oh yeah, the torture she endured!’ isn’t going to make a character interesting. I also don’t think that nationality or appearance has anything at all to do with how interesting a character will be. The character has to be well-done. Leliana may or may not be an interesting and/or well-done character but all those backstory facts don’t force her to be awesome.
 
I think 13 from House is a great example of a professional character who is widely considered extremely hot and who has had all sorts of backstory thrown at her (Bisexual! Temporary drug-and-sex lifestyle! Brain tumor! Huntington's! Father issues! Mother issues! Mysterious! Currently missing!) and yet she's so dull and uncompelling.

[wizardryforever]

Angband21 wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

Angband21 wrote...

mousestalker wrote...

Oghren was a huge wet blanket for me in Awakenings. I play games to escape, not relive past Al-Anon meetings.

Bioware seems attached to drunken slobbish dwarfs. BG1 had Yeslick and Kaigan, BG2 had Korgan (hope I didn't get them switched around) and now we have literally at the bottom of the barrel, Oghren.

C'mon Bioware, can we have at least one sober, intelligent dwarf NPC?

Sigrun doesn't count? 

Forgot Sigrun. First female dwarf NPC. Now if they could provide a Male Dwarf NPC that was as fun as Sigrun, I'd be happy.

Well there was Drogan and Dorna from Shadows of Undrentide (first expansion to Neverwinter Nights), as well as Grimgnaw from the vanilla game.  These are very stereotype breaking dwarves.  Drogan was a wizard (the ultimate break from stereotype), Dorna a rogue/cleric, and Grimgnaw a monk that worshipped death.  All of these in a Bioware game.

[Sarah1281]

The Water God wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

The Water God wrote...

So French redheaded bisexuals who are ex spy/assassins because they were betrayed by their lesbian lover/mentor to be framed for treason and wrongly totured. Who then have to break out and flee to another country to keep from being excuted for crimes they did not commit, only to join the church in hopes for redemption and end up receiving a mysterious vision from god convincing them that they should use their skills to help save the world instead of locking themselves up in a nunnery are boring/uninteresting to you.

May I know what store you rent most of your movies from sir?

 
You know, just throwing together a backstory with all those things doesn’t actually mandate that one be an interesting character. In fact (to move away from Leliana specifically and getting into the more general), one could easily write an OC of their own with that exact backstory and have a really, really dull Mary Sue character. Just throwing out ‘Oh, she’s bisexual!’ and ‘Oh yeah, the torture she endured!’ isn’t going to make a character interesting. I also don’t think that nationality or appearance has anything at all to do with how interesting a character will be. The character has to be well-done. Leliana may or may not be an interesting and/or well-done character but all those backstory facts don’t force her to be awesome.
 
I think 13 from House is a great example of a professional character who is widely considered extremely hot and who has had all sorts of backstory thrown at her (Bisexual! Temporary drug-and-sex lifestyle! Brain tumor! Huntington's! Father issues! Mother issues! Mysterious! Currently missing!) and yet she's so dull and uncompelling.

I see alot of people commenting that they like Leliana because she's French, red headed, and bisexual. And I didn't say those were the only things that made her awesome, interesting, or well done.... so yeah.

People do comment on that but I think that's in more of a 'I find that attractive' case than a 'I find that that adds to her interest as a character.' The bisexuality, I guess, can be interesting depending on how it's handled. The others? Oghren is a redhead and Isolde is 'French.'

I never did say that you were claiming that the things in your list were all that made her interesting, You did say that 'You find X physical characteristics and backstory components make for a not interesting character?' and so that is what I addressed. Those characters you listed or any other characteristics you could think of about Leliana or any other character won't guarantee that they are interesting. It's in the execution.

[Sarah1281]

I was not trying to put words into your mouth. At all. That was how I interpretted what you posted.



****, why is it that even when I am going out of my way to NOT be offensive I still manage to ****** people off? I should just stop telling people when I disagree with them.



I will try to clarify (but I have no doubt it will not help): I do not feel that a list of characteristics, no matter whose characteristics they are or what those characteristics are, mean that a character has to be interesting. In your list, you described Leliana but did it in the plural. I took that to mean that anyone with those characteristics listed had to be interesting which I do not find to be true as I'm a believer in execution being key. That is it. I am not implying anything else. I meant just what I said and nothing else. I have no doubt that Leliana can still be interesting to you for those reasons you listed but I feel that the execution is a large part of that as she could very easily have been a horribly written and cliche character with all of those attributes you listed.

[Angband21]

wizardryforever wrote...

[

Well there was Drogan and Dorna from Shadows of Undrentide (first expansion to Neverwinter Nights), as well as Grimgnaw from the vanilla game.  These are very stereotype breaking dwarves.  Drogan was a wizard (the ultimate break from stereotype), Dorna a rogue/cleric, and Grimgnaw a monk that worshipped death.  All of these in a Bioware game.

I never played NWN so I wasn't aware of those characters. Good to know that there is a dwarf NPC that doesn't belch in your ear every minute or so.

Could you imagine Kaigan, Korgan, Yeslick and Oghren all being in the same game and available as playable NPCs? It would sound like a frat party for freshmen.

[jaikss]

Yeah I wouldnt call any of the companions in DAO boring per say,but Wynne definetely goes to the top of the "urgh" list for me.Not only because of her character,but more because I felt like bioware was forcing the warden to talk a certain way to wynne more than to the other companions in the form of dialogue choices.

*still slightly grumbled about my maleficar not given the chance to point out the irony of the holier than thou Wynne turning out to be an abomination * .

[Collider]

Sten, Wynne, Oghren, and of course dog were less interesting.

I did think that Leliana was uninteresting. I have not put much thought into it however, partly to my own disinterest (hah) in qualifying my opinion, so perhaps it's just that she is not to my taste.

Modifié par Collider, 08 janvier 2011 - 08:59 .