150 réponses à ce sujet

[fmsantos39]

I would like to see Jacob beeing pissed by some Shepard's action and then he shows all his acomulated rage and a fight starts and at the end show this options:

-Put some reason on his mind, the mission is more important

-Let him there injured, I don't what you on my crew(and late you see him again somewhere dead or alive)

-Finish him.

[Val Seleznyov]

diskoh wrote...

I listed in black and white (well, white on gray) the reasons I dislike him. There's nothing to figure out or dissect about it, to me the character was disrespectful and a contrarian. Just about every squad member Shepard brought on board, Jacob either made a rude comment to them ("Introduce yourself to the AI" to Tali) or didn't trust (Thane's just a precise mercenary).

After the second or third recruitment I found myself asking why this douchebag got to stand in the debriefing room berating everyone I brought on the ship. I wish there was a choice to not recruit him.

Yeah... the way Jacob praised Garrus as a "tough son of a ****" and personally escorted Mordin to the lab was just horrendous.

Modifié par Val Seleznyov, 10 janvier 2011 - 07:52 .

[Marta Rio]

mrsph wrote...

Except Jacob was really only a "douche" to Thane. And that whole conversation with Thane seems to be more of Bioware leading up to something without delivering.

Yep.  Jacob says perfectly nice things to Mordin, Garrus, and Samara, for example.

Modifié par Marta Rio, 10 janvier 2011 - 08:00 .

[diskoh]

Don't forget he wanted to throw Legion out an airlock.

[Slavka13748]

mrsph wrote...

Am I the only person who thinks that most of the problems with Jacob is how Jennifer Hale voiced Shepard when talking to him? Other than that? He's pretty a cool guy.

Just knock off the sexual harassment, Shepard.

This. I like the guy, really (after playing with a manShep), but I can't talk to him with my canon femShep. So it's not him that needs fixing.

[MsKlaussen]

DDG3595 wrote...

MajesticJazz wrote...

diskoh wrote...

There was a great deal of things that made me dislike Jacob as a character. From saying something rude to just about every new squad member, right down to constantly volunteering for things he can't do in the suicide mission. Not to mention "I'm not big on these talks..." You know what, shut the hell up, Jacob, I didn't ask if you were big on these talks.

My favorite thing to do is when he volunteers to crawl through the ducts, saying "Sure have at it if you volunteer" and watching him die.

It is funny because Jacob embraced Shepard from the beginning.

The funny thing is, NOBODY wants to talk about that. NOBODY wants to talk about how Jacob (besides Chakwas, Tali, and Garrus) really embraced Shepard.

Point is, no matter what Bioware does with Jacob, there are people who just will not like him.

For some people the only thing to fix Jacob is to make him have a darker personality (ala Liara)

For some people the only thing to fix Jacob is to make him more useful in combat.

For some people (they'll never admit it) is to make Jacob anything but an obvious black male character who femshep seems to have the hots for which really didn't rub off right with a lot of gamers considering how this is 2011 but people still seem to have racial ignorance.

Very interesting points (especially the last bit).

I agree with you completely on this. My actual reason for mentioning the bad Barry White imitation is because I think it's absurd that that is who Jacob turns into during his love scene. As if whoever designed him can't conceive of a Black male being intimate without such lounge lizard braggadocio, which is nothing more than a media construct. Other than that, Jacob is a normal guy.

The only Blacks who seem to escape this stereotype are bourgeois, college educated, and trying their level best to assimilate with White culture and expectations. This is a character flaw - an inability to deal with Blacks unless they leave themselves behind and conform. Failing that, they have to be over the top clowns who are easy to not take seriously. Shucking and jiving and showing their teeth all of the time like Chris Tucker. Anderson is the former - a character that would be the exact same guy no matter what race he was. And since he gets involved in nothing edgy all game, he's acceptable. Jacob's character gets in an edgy situation with Shepard, which can't happen unless he conforms to something non-threatening, like an outer space version of Chef from South Park.

Very unfortunate.

[Tyrael02]

TheBRADLeyB wrote...

Sorry there is no general ME3 Discussion thread so... here we go.

I was looking through some threads about who people want to have return as far as Squadmates and I  randomly thought of Jacob... And how almost everyone hates him.

I personally didn't like Jacob. I had no connection to him. I didn't care for his abilities (Pull, Cerberus Agent and Incendiary Ammo) nor his Special Ability (Barrier). I found his Loyalty mission to be pretty boring as well. Not to mention Jacob is a human which makes him boring when compared to a... Drell or Quarian.

(I never think any character should have the ability to have special ammo, it just screws with everything else. Ammo should be a weapon upgrade)

So Anyway, I've been thinking and I think what Jacob needs to be better liked in ME3 is to be destroyed. Much like Shepard was destroyed and rebuilt by Cerberus. Here is what I'm thinking. Jacob ends up on a Cerberus mission that results in him being killed by an early skirmish with the new Reaper force and Cerberus obtains his body to get the intel he acquired. Cerberus however doesn't want to invest the money they put into Shepard and that time being of the essence they rush the job, focusing mainly on his brain they cut corners on the rest of his body replacing it with robotic pieces. Like a metal arm much like in 'Terminator 2: Judgement Day' (this will at least make him look cooler)

Now because Cerberus was so rushed in their reconstruction and Jacob is literally half a man he is upset and angry at Cerberus (but they however hold the key to him living and he confides in Shepard that he wasn't a fan of death). With that BioWare could write some interesting anti-Cerberus dialog (which may make Jacob more liked by the Anti Cerberus crowd) and constantly give Shepard the feeling he is teetering on revenge on Cerberus.

On a joking side Jacob's Loyalty mission would be a trip to Batteries +/- where Jacob gets a longer lasting battery for his heart and other body mechanisms.

So just a random though. I'm sure by now the story lines are actually finished but just a random thought. How's everyone else feel?

You might as well replace him with Jax from Mortal Kombat 

[Elvis_Mazur]

Fix? I don't think so. He is what he is, and I actually like his character.

[JG The Gamer]

Val Seleznyov wrote...

diskoh wrote...

I listed in black and white (well, white on gray) the reasons I dislike him. There's nothing to figure out or dissect about it, to me the character was disrespectful and a contrarian. Just about every squad member Shepard brought on board, Jacob either made a rude comment to them ("Introduce yourself to the AI" to Tali) or didn't trust (Thane's just a precise mercenary).

After the second or third recruitment I found myself asking why this douchebag got to stand in the debriefing room berating everyone I brought on the ship. I wish there was a choice to not recruit him.

Yeah... the way Jacob praised Garrus as a "tough son of a ****" and personally escorted Mordin to the lab was just horrendous.

I always considered Jacob the unofficial Orientation Officer for the people Shepard would recruit for the mission. And the only people Jacob had a problem with was Thane and Legion. He was very polite with everyone else.

[diskoh]

Let me be clear. I don't think Jacob should be changed. It's his character. I happen to hate him, but that is kind of cool and is a testament to how engaging Mass Effect is that I actually hate one of them for things he says.

I don't want him removed or altered because of my preference. There are lots of people who do like him and that's awesome.

I'm just posting in this thread because it's about Jacob. I don't agree that he needs to be "fixed." That would be like putting Jack in a dress because some people don't like her 'tough girl' character.

Modifié par diskoh, 10 janvier 2011 - 10:10 .

[fmsantos39]

mrsph wrote...

I've actually seen at least one person hate on Jacob for escorting Mordin to his lab.

what

fmsantos39 wrote...

I would like to see Jacob beeing
pissed by some Shepard's action and then he shows all his acomulated
rage and a fight starts and at the end show this options:
-Put some reason on his mind, the mission is more important
-Let him there injured, I don't what you on my crew(and late you see him again somewhere dead or alive)
-Finish him.

You seem to have mistook Jacob for Zaeed.

no I didn't, I just think that when one Person doesn't react much they are acumulation something insine, so I think Jacob is always so right that when something comes to his mind I will do something for good with out warning(and then fans will like him), Zaeed is just a dog who talks too much

[Ulzeraj]

Marta Rio wrote...

mrsph wrote...

Except Jacob was really only a "douche" to Thane. And that whole conversation with Thane seems to be more of Bioware leading up to something without delivering.

Yep.  Jacob says perfectly nice things to Mordin, Garrus, and Samara, for example.

I have no idea if when his comment to Tali "dont forget to introduce yourself to the AI" was meant to provoke but that glare she gave in response could probably oneshot a reaper. I laughed.

Anyway its just that femshep players are scared of him somehow. Come on the guy bro-hugs and invites you to spill some drinks on the citadel.

[diskoh]

I'm sure it stems from being forced to flirt with him at some point in order to gain full squad loyalty.

Billy Jean King Shepard doesn't flirt dammit!

[Avilia]

I didin't mind Jacob too much and what problems I did have boil down to:

1. A little too self righteous for my taste - he seems to forget he's a mercenary working for a shady organisation
2. His outfit
3. The way female Shepard talks to him

Other than that he seemed a perfectly normal human being. Its a pity they didn't make him a full on soldier archetype but I suppose they had enough of those. His personality just seemed to fit that better imho.

Modifié par Avilia, 10 janvier 2011 - 10:48 .

[MajesticJazz]

MsKlaussen wrote...

DDG3595 wrote...

MajesticJazz wrote...

diskoh wrote...

There was a great deal of things that made me dislike Jacob as a character. From saying something rude to just about every new squad member, right down to constantly volunteering for things he can't do in the suicide mission. Not to mention "I'm not big on these talks..." You know what, shut the hell up, Jacob, I didn't ask if you were big on these talks.

My favorite thing to do is when he volunteers to crawl through the ducts, saying "Sure have at it if you volunteer" and watching him die.

It is funny because Jacob embraced Shepard from the beginning.

The funny thing is, NOBODY wants to talk about that. NOBODY wants to talk about how Jacob (besides Chakwas, Tali, and Garrus) really embraced Shepard.

Point is, no matter what Bioware does with Jacob, there are people who just will not like him.

For some people the only thing to fix Jacob is to make him have a darker personality (ala Liara)

For some people the only thing to fix Jacob is to make him more useful in combat.

For some people (they'll never admit it) is to make Jacob anything but an obvious black male character who femshep seems to have the hots for which really didn't rub off right with a lot of gamers considering how this is 2011 but people still seem to have racial ignorance.

Very interesting points (especially the last bit).

I agree with you completely on this. My actual reason for mentioning the bad Barry White imitation is because I think it's absurd that that is who Jacob turns into during his love scene. As if whoever designed him can't conceive of a Black male being intimate without such lounge lizard braggadocio, which is nothing more than a media construct. Other than that, Jacob is a normal guy.

The only Blacks who seem to escape this stereotype are bourgeois, college educated, and trying their level best to assimilate with White culture and expectations. This is a character flaw - an inability to deal with Blacks unless they leave themselves behind and conform. Failing that, they have to be over the top clowns who are easy to not take seriously. Shucking and jiving and showing their teeth all of the time like Chris Tucker. Anderson is the former - a character that would be the exact same guy no matter what race he was. And since he gets involved in nothing edgy all game, he's acceptable. Jacob's character gets in an edgy situation with Shepard, which can't happen unless he conforms to something non-threatening, like an outer space version of Chef from South Park.

Very unfortunate.

Thanks for the support!

I am not saying that if you dislike Jacob then you are racist. No, I am just pointing out there there are some if not many Mass Effect fans that dislike Jacob not because he is black, but because he is a black that their their perfect female Shepards seems to have the hots for. Not because he is black, but because he doesn't fit the comic relief roll that many people expect from black characters like Cole Train in Gears of War or Samuel L. Jackson in many of his movies (Snakes on a Plane). Not because he is black, but because unlike other prominent black characters (Griggs in Modern Warfare and Cole Train in GOW), Jacob is very opinionated and in some ways, trys to rub his thoughts onto Shepard and a lot of gamers found that as a huge breach.

Of course people would never admit to that so instead they find other nitpick reasons to attack Jacob which is really unfortunate as you say because people nitpick Jacob for his flaws/shortcomings and act as if ALL the other ME2 squad is just SOOOOOOOOO perfect and ONLY Jacob is the one who is flawed.

However, I applaud Bioware for doing what they did with Jacob. They (first developer to do this?) took a black male and made him sexual, a love interest in a market where the majority of the audience is white.  I applaud Bioware because they didn't make Jacob the minstrel show stereotype with slang talk here and slang talk there (Cole Train) but rather a well spoken individual with opinions.

In many ways, I believe the reaction to Jacob tells a lot about where we are as a society today and how far we still need to go. Having Obama as the President of the US wasn't going to eliminate racial ignorance because it is just too embedded in world culture. It won't be probably until another millennia when racial ignorance becomes pretty much non-existant. Until then, we have to deal with this "subtle" racism that exist today. This isnt the 1950s when it was normal for someone to come out and say something really racial and nobody would even twitch at this individual's words. Today, people like to deny racism even though it exist because they rather avoid the bigger debate/problem so they just dismiss it, like the counsil in regards to the Reapers.

If you do not believe me that Jacob carries a lot of race hate, then just goto youtube and type in Jacob ME2 romance and look at the various videos and read the comments. The N word is mentioned a lot and other phrases like "black sea monster" and "space jungle fever" and so on.

I am going to stand by my word in that I do NOT want Bioware to change anything about Jacob's personality. Bioware cannot keep on changing their characters to be more darker or edgy (Like Liara/Garrus in ME2) just because fans want their characters to gain more cool points. Jacob was a breath of fresh air because he was essentially normal and not some person with some WILD and crazy backstory. Hell, in a way, Jacob really reflected Shepard in many ways. Like Shepard, Jacob was on in the alliance and served at Eden Prime. Like Shepard, Jacob saved the Counsil from a threat....not as huge as Saren and the Geth but it was a threat. Like Shepard, Jacob's heroics were dismissed with the notion that they did not want to show how "broken" the system is as Jacob told Shepard in ME2.  

In the end, Jacob is a fine character. Thing is, he just isn't what everyone else expects him to be which is some space badazz like a Garrus, Thane, Zaeed and others. And in some ways, Jacob was TOO MUCH for people in regards to his sexual nature and femshep's reaction to him which did NOT run smoothly with some sensitve people who are still living in a closed minded world.

Great character with much potential in ME3 and in my opinion.

Again, I applaud Bioware.

Modifié par MajesticJazz, 10 janvier 2011 - 11:10 .

[LOST SPARTANJLC]

The thing is , I'm sure everyone's trusts Jacob after the suicide mission.I'm sure whatever problems he had with other members or they with him are gone for the most part.



Now Miranda and Jack is a whole another story.

[Teddie Sage]

... Jacob needs no fixing. Miranda does. She's way too perfect. lol

[diskoh]

MajesticJazz wrote...

MsKlaussen wrote...

DDG3595 wrote...

MajesticJazz wrote...

diskoh wrote...

There was a great deal of things that made me dislike Jacob as a character. From saying something rude to just about every new squad member, right down to constantly volunteering for things he can't do in the suicide mission. Not to mention "I'm not big on these talks..." You know what, shut the hell up, Jacob, I didn't ask if you were big on these talks.

My favorite thing to do is when he volunteers to crawl through the ducts, saying "Sure have at it if you volunteer" and watching him die.

It is funny because Jacob embraced Shepard from the beginning.

The funny thing is, NOBODY wants to talk about that. NOBODY wants to talk about how Jacob (besides Chakwas, Tali, and Garrus) really embraced Shepard.

Point is, no matter what Bioware does with Jacob, there are people who just will not like him.

For some people the only thing to fix Jacob is to make him have a darker personality (ala Liara)

For some people the only thing to fix Jacob is to make him more useful in combat.

For some people (they'll never admit it) is to make Jacob anything but an obvious black male character who femshep seems to have the hots for which really didn't rub off right with a lot of gamers considering how this is 2011 but people still seem to have racial ignorance.

Very interesting points (especially the last bit).

I agree with you completely on this. My actual reason for mentioning the bad Barry White imitation is because I think it's absurd that that is who Jacob turns into during his love scene. As if whoever designed him can't conceive of a Black male being intimate without such lounge lizard braggadocio, which is nothing more than a media construct. Other than that, Jacob is a normal guy.

The only Blacks who seem to escape this stereotype are bourgeois, college educated, and trying their level best to assimilate with White culture and expectations. This is a character flaw - an inability to deal with Blacks unless they leave themselves behind and conform. Failing that, they have to be over the top clowns who are easy to not take seriously. Shucking and jiving and showing their teeth all of the time like Chris Tucker. Anderson is the former - a character that would be the exact same guy no matter what race he was. And since he gets involved in nothing edgy all game, he's acceptable. Jacob's character gets in an edgy situation with Shepard, which can't happen unless he conforms to something non-threatening, like an outer space version of Chef from South Park.

Very unfortunate.

Thanks for the support!

I am not saying that if you dislike Jacob then you are racist. No, I am just pointing out there there are some if not many Mass Effect fans that dislike Jacob not because he is black, but because he is a black that their their perfect female Shepards seems to have the hots for. Not because he is black, but because he doesn't fit the comic relief roll that many people expect from black characters like Cole Train in Gears of War or Samuel L. Jackson in many of his movies (Snakes on a Plane). Not because he is black, but because unlike other prominent black characters (Griggs in Modern Warfare and Cole Train in GOW), Jacob is very opinionated and in some ways, trys to rub his thoughts onto Shepard and a lot of gamers found that as a huge breach.

Of course people would never admit to that so instead they find other nitpick reasons to attack Jacob which is really unfortunate as you say because people nitpick Jacob for his flaws/shortcomings and act as if ALL the other ME2 squad is just SOOOOOOOOO perfect and ONLY Jacob is the one who is flawed.

However, I applaud Bioware for doing what they did with Jacob. They (first developer to do this?) took a black male and made him sexual, a love interest in a market where the majority of the audience is white.  I applaud Bioware because they didn't make Jacob the minstrel show stereotype with slang talk here and slang talk there (Cole Train) but rather a well spoken individual with opinions.

In many ways, I believe the reaction to Jacob tells a lot about where we are as a society today and how far we still need to go. Having Obama as the President of the US wasn't going to eliminate racial ignorance because it is just too embedded in world culture. It won't be probably until another millennia when racial ignorance becomes pretty much non-existant. Until then, we have to deal with this "subtle" racism that exist today. This isnt the 1950s when it was normal for someone to come out and say something really racial and nobody would even twitch at this individual's words. Today, people like to deny racism even though it exist because they rather avoid the bigger debate/problem so they just dismiss it, like the counsil in regards to the Reapers.

If you do not believe me that Jacob carries a lot of race hate, then just goto youtube and type in Jacob ME2 romance and look at the various videos and read the comments. The N word is mentioned a lot and other phrases like "black sea monster" and "space jungle fever" and so on.

I am going to stand by my word in that I do NOT want Bioware to change anything about Jacob's personality. Bioware cannot keep on changing their characters to be more darker or edgy (Like Liara/Garrus in ME2) just because fans want their characters to gain more cool points. Jacob was a breath of fresh air because he was essentially normal and not some person with some WILD and crazy backstory. Hell, in a way, Jacob really reflected Shepard in many ways. Like Shepard, Jacob was on in the alliance and served at Eden Prime. Like Shepard, Jacob saved the Counsil from a threat....not as huge as Saren and the Geth but it was a threat. Like Shepard, Jacob's heroics were dismissed with the notion that they did not want to show how "broken" the system is as Jacob told Shepard in ME2.  

In the end, Jacob is a fine character. Thing is, he just isn't what everyone else expects him to be which is some space badazz like a Garrus, Thane, Zaeed and others. And in some ways, Jacob was TOO MUCH for people in regards to his sexual nature and femshep's reaction to him which did NOT run smoothly with some sensitve people who are still living in a closed minded world.

Great character with much potential in ME3 and in my opinion.

Again, I applaud Bioware.

I understand what you're saying, but I think here on this board you should give people more credit than that. This isn't Youtube, we're all fans of the game and I think by and large more mature than that.

I'm not offended by your ideas at all, and I agree with them in a lot of ways, I would just hope you aren't quick to assume the worst about someone in such a way. Never know who you're talking to.

[DTKT]

A sniper and a clear line of sight.

[diskoh]

mrsph wrote...

diskoh wrote...

Don't forget he wanted to throw Legion out an airlock.

I don't get why people are so over protective of Legion. He's a geth! People aren't going to trust him!

But the fact remains he wanted to throw Legion out of an airlock. Whether you think it's justified or not.
I'm seeing a lot of justifying like this for Jacob regarding Tali, Legion, Thane, his glibness, his lack of respect, etc. But it's yet to click for some of you that even if you make excuses for these things individually, it's the sum of these things that makes some people dislike him. The fact that there are so many things that NEED excuses and explantions. The fact that his character is meant to be basically an ordinary dude who is a hero and a good person, but there are so many little comments like "Already Shepard? I'm not big on these talks" that seem so snide and annoying to people.
Miranda says "there's a lot to do." Tali says "I need to clean up these engines." Garrus says he's doing calibrations. But Jacob? He just decided he's not gonna talk to you because he doesn't feel like it. That's douchey to me.

[adriano_c]

Jacob needs some sort of hook to his character. As it stands, he's just that "strong, silent type" of guy who's just a little too squared away to make people take notice. I wouldn't say that many players have an actual active dislike for the guy, rather it's just indifference, but when it comes to all these ridiculous "rate the character" polls...how else are they going to vote? Low.

[diskoh]

mrsph wrote...

Maybe Commander Shepard should just **** off and let Jacob work?

Or say "I didn't ask if you're big on these talks, you'll follow orders or find a new ship."