252 réponses à ce sujet

[Amioran]

tmp7704 wrote...
and #2, there seems to be complete lack of specular highlights in the DA2 screenshot. Not just the skin but also the armour and other elements appear completely dull, and that makes the armour seem like cardboard and the faces without the natural subtle shine the human skill has under the light also feel more artificial than what DAO presented, not less.

Specular light mapping is changed by enviornments, because that is its purpose. To really judge lighting you should have screenshots with the same environments and same light sources, a thing impossible between two games. Morale: juding lighting from screenshots of different games is pure follly, it doesn't work that way, you will never obtain anything else than idiocies.

People here insist on making comparisions on things they have neither the littlest amount of knowledge upon.

Number 1 can be something having to do with art style (as you said), but also with the same lightning.

[SufferingTormentDarkness]

The model for sebastians armor was stolen from Final Fantasy XI.

[Amioran]

Blacklash93 wrote...
My complaints have nothing to do with the art style. I'm just seeing bad graphics.

Well, if your knowledge on how to judge graphics is the same as with the one you show with everything else you talk about, then I'm sorry for you but what you are "seeing" means next to nothing.

A) You cannot judge graphic quality on a whole only by screenshots
You cannot judge lightining quality between different screenshots (and either less between screenshots of different games), nor you cannot judge the same without knowing the environments variables of the shots.
C) You cannot judge graphic style from some screenshots (graphic style can be judged ONLY on an ample set, better still when judging the same on the whole). This is a story of art: some critics in the past saw two paintings of Rosseau and thought he had nothing special (it was used then to judge the style of an artist only on one/two works). After some time, however that same critics, found all his works and changed drastically idea, actually understanding how idiot they were. From then on no critic will ever judge a style on a low set of paintings/figures. It happened also for Delacroix, but in different terms.
D) You cannot judge textures quality if you don't know the settings. You don't either know if those are console or PC shots, nor you know if those textures are finalized. More, texture quality means much less than most people think, probably it is the less important factor on graphic quality when playing.
E) Same as graphic style, you cannot judge meshes alone, without other in comparisions. Other games make no text since the background can be completely different: only exception can be a same engine with same parameters, only changed meshes.

In short terms, either if you had the knowledge to judge something (a thing I highly doubt), how can you do so with what is being showed?

Modifié par Amioran, 09 janvier 2011 - 04:36 .

[Herr Uhl]

tmp7704 wrote...
and #2, there seems to be complete lack of specular highlights in the DA2 screenshot. Not just the skin but also the armour and other elements appear completely dull, and that makes the armour seem like cardboard and the faces without the natural subtle shine the human skill has under the light also feel more artificial than what DAO presented, not less.

The lighting in the picture presented there had been heightened after being taken to make things more apparent. Hence the extremely white hand for example.

[tmp7704]

Herr Uhl wrote...

The lighting in the picture presented there had been heightened after being taken to make things more apparent. Hence the extremely white hand for example.

I know, but that doesn't affect the presence of specular highlights (or lack thereof) You can view the original trailer and you'll see the same thing, merely bit darker. This includes the white hands btw. They aren't extremely white in the trailer but they are noticeably lighter shade than the face.

It's possible the textures simply weren't finished at that point and didn't include the tint maps as well as the specular maps, but that's pretty much why i'm curious if what we got to see is "as good as it gets".

[tmp7704]

Amioran wrote...

Morale: juding lighting from screenshots of different games is pure follly, it doesn't work that way, you will never obtain anything else than idiocies.

People here insist on making comparisions on things they have neither the littlest amount of knowledge upon.

Indeed



do you need second picture simply to be able to tell whether specular highlights are being rendered in this scene?

The way these are calculated, the only time you won't possibly see any highlights is when all light sources are "behind" the item. But it so happens that the trailer in question shows the main character from both "sides" so to speak -- with camera looking first towards the chantry board and then another shot is set with camera looking in opposite direction.

[biostarfan]

I just hope the frame rate has a steady average of at least 30... with no major dips.

[Shining Ghost]

I believe the engine doesn't have the technology for the appropriate lighting. But then again what more can you expect from a 1-year-development cycle.

[AlanC9]

More like two years, actually, since development started before DAO shipped.

[tmp7704]

I don't think that includes much of active development though, given before the DA2 was announced we were being told the very same timeframe was supposedly used for production of Awakening. (and before that, for the "first day DLC" for DAO as well)

Modifié par tmp7704, 10 janvier 2011 - 06:48 .

[AlanC9]

They can't do things in parallel?

[tmp7704]

They can of course, but unless you have two or more full teams then you run into a simple physical limitation -- person working on a level for Awakening isn't at that particular time working on a level for DA2, e.g. Which may lead to relatively slower pace of development in mentioned.

[HolyMoogle]

Looks pretty awful so far to me - previewers keep on going on about how it's more colorful, but all I'm seeing is a drained palette with the occasional flash of red. This isn't Sin City... And yeah while I like Sebastian's design, the textures on him are PS2-grade. As somebody said, looks like his armor was stolen from FFXI.



Still, graphics have never really been what has drawn us to these games, have they? I'm sure I'll love the game regardless. (But please improve the graphics...)

[Hawke-gr]

We haven't actually seen any screenshot with the maximum details of the PC version yet (with directx11futtures like SSAO, soft particles, tessellated terrain). According to Mr. Papathanasis they will give a quite different look to the game. So maybe those screens are from the Console versions or PC with DirectX9 with medium details, and if you compare these with the Console version of DAO then these are a lot better besides the fact that the game is still under development. So lets just wait for some screenshots of the PC version with directX11 and full detail(according to Andreas Papathanasis sometime in February), and make then our comparrison.

[HolyMoogle]

What worries me more is that the characters (clothing especially) look to.. almost not have normal maps? They just look like pure, flat textures. That's certainly not something they'd cut out for consoles - consoles have been using them since the original X-Box's days.

[Harid]

SufferingTormentDarkness wrote...

The model for sebastians armor was stolen from Final Fantasy XI.

Oh my god yes.  It looks like the Iron Musketter Cuirass.  I wonder why that's been bugging me.

[Harid]

double post

Modifié par Harid, 10 janvier 2011 - 01:12 .

[Hawke-gr]

Here we have some decent screens for the faces, (besides that bizarre look of Bethany and that mass what supposed to be a Fur?) The second one who is the most previus one I thing, has also some very nice clothing textures. images.bit-tech.net/content_images/2010/10/dragon-age-2-preview/dragon-age2-screenshot-10.jpg , media.curse.com/CommunityServer.Components.PostAttachments/00/00/81/37/35/QunariUsurperWTMK.jpg , www.coated.com/dragon-age-ii-with-female-lead-character-0907201009/.

Modifié par Hawke-gr, 10 janvier 2011 - 01:45 .

[Arkynomicon]

My only real complain with DA1 graphics was how often a lot of the clutter looked like polygon blocks and blurry up close.

[Rixxencaxx]

Obviously the game has really bad graphics and low res textures...this judging from the few screens and the 4 minutes of gameplay they showed us when the game is about to go gold...
Are them final?? maybe the answer is into the amount of gameplay they showed us.....
In the end i could like the game as is, cause usually bioware produce nice story driven games, but really dont' tell us that the game has stellar graphics cause it is not true....

Modifié par Rixxencaxx, 10 janvier 2011 - 02:16 .

[Blacklash93]

It... kinda seems worse in the new Dev Diary. The lighting in particular.

[wolfman99202]

I think right now we are only seeing basic graphics but (to me) they do look a little cleaner. Maybe in the coming months before release we will get a demo and see the graphics for ourselves other than what has been shown online.

[Blacklash93]

Yes, they do look cleaner, but everything else is still sub-par.

Lip-syncing seemed unusually bad. We've still got blurry, low-res, undetailed textures everywhere in the environments. As I've said before, the lighting looks much worse, especially in the Lothering section compared to how it looked in the RtP trailer. I also saw the same NPC models like 5 times in some scenes. *Inhales* Character's arms seem borderline textureless and a bit edgy in spots. Some character's hair texture looks painted on, like the Arishok's. Colors don't seem to pop out as much anymore.

I could go on and on all day. Seriously, this game looks terrible right now. It doesn't look half as good as the year-old ME2.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 10 janvier 2011 - 11:02 .

[Rixxencaxx]

the last video is a clear evidence of the extremely bad level of new textures....

[Liablecocksman]

I'm sad to say that I am underwhelmed.

It will not affect my purchase in the slightest, as I am forever doomed to buy anything Bioware releases, and I'll enjoy it, too.



I'm disappointed.