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[meonlyred]

I don't think Kaidan is a Spectre, maybe a candidate for one. It is kind of funny that humanity lost its one and only Spectre within a year. Go Team Earth...

But I wouldn't be surprised to find out Anderson pulled some strings and now has Kaidan as his personal "hey go on this mission for me" guy.

EDIT:
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Modifié par meonlyred, 08 février 2011 - 01:59 .

[Cypher0020]

speaking of Anderson...do you think he'd approve of Shep/Kaidan being in a relationship? I'm thinking he found out by ME2....

[jeweledleah]

Cypher0020 wrote...

speaking of Anderson...do you think he'd approve of Shep/Kaidan being in a relationship? I'm thinking he found out by ME2....

I think he would.  they are 2 of his favorite people and I think he feels someone fatherly towards both of them, or at the very least mentorly

[meonlyred]

Cypher0020 wrote...

speaking of Anderson...do you think he'd approve of Shep/Kaidan being in a relationship? I'm thinking he found out by ME2....

Anderson doesn't have room to judge nor would he. He is kind of involved with Sanders. (Which by the way I really hope she is in ME3)

[sesheta255]

Personally I don't think Anderson knows unless he guessed from Kaidan's reaction to Shepard's death. Of course Kaidan is pretty controlled so I doubt he would let his feelings show too much in public anyway.



I really don't want to see "new" characters/squadmates introduced. I have squadmates pouring out of my ears already. Sanders doesn't interest me in the slightest from reading the books.



I could see Kaidan being a spectre candidate but not Ashley and given their cookie cutter role I hope its not where they are at. My take is that either Anderson or Hackett has Kaidan/Ash looking for information on the reapers. It makes sense that they would use them as they know the truth, saw it first hand and might have more of an inkling of what to look for.

[FireEye]

Re: Betrayals.

MainShep is a Sole Survivor.  She hates Cerberus, hates that she was brought back to life, and most of all she hates Liara and feels very deeply hurt that Liara handed her corpse over to Cerberus rather than letting her rest in peace.  She considers it a betrayal of the worst kind and would be happy to never see Liara again in her now-abomination of a life.

Horizon?  Wasn't a betrayal.  The Alliance and the Council covering up the Reapers?  Not a betrayal, and probably important to keep people from panicking.  Kaidan not joining Cerberus to be with Shep?  Thank the effin' stars someone in this galaxy has a brain.

From a meta standpoint, The Alliance didn't turn their back on the Terminus colonies.  The colonies aren't Alliance, and specifically left the Alliance with an "F-you!" attitude towards the Alliance government.  Furthermore, Council or Alliance presence (particularly since the Alliance has a seat on the Council) in the Terminus can be considered an act of war, like... you know, we found that out in the first five minutes of ME1.

The fact that the Alliance is "reaching out" at all is a pretty big step for them, and they seem to be doing all they can do in a tricky political situation to give the human colonies in the Terminus a way to defend themselves without being attacked by the Terminus.  Yes, it is a pretense for Kaidan/Ashley to investigate the disappearances... which unto itself is not "doing nothing."

AND they seem to be investigating the Reapers on the side.  At the time of ME2, compared to Liara (who is obsessed with avenging Feron), Wrex (who is trying to save his people, again), Garrus (who is doing heavens-knows-what attacking Omega), and Tali (who is doing what her superiors say), the VS seems to be the only one doing anything at all relevant to build Shepard's previous work. 


Re: Anderson

Anderson probably knows about Kaidan and Shepard.  I don't know if he'd agree with it, and I generally write him as ambiguously not knowing or looking the other way (with Shepard often wondering whether he knows or not).  His situation with Kahlee isn't quite the same, but it bore pretty strong similarities around the time of Revelation (where he was falling for her while investigating her potential being a defector-insurgent-criminal).

I think he'd be slightly disappointed, but maybe he'd trust they'd be professional enough to handle it. 

[Commander Kurt]

FireEye wrote...

Re: Betrayals.

MainShep is a Sole Survivor.  She hates Cerberus, hates that she was brought back to life, and most of all she hates Liara and feels very deeply hurt that Liara handed her corpse over to Cerberus rather than letting her rest in peace.  She considers it a betrayal of the worst kind and would be happy to never see Liara again in her now-abomination of a life.

Horizon?  Wasn't a betrayal.  The Alliance and the Council covering up the Reapers?  Not a betrayal, and probably important to keep people from panicking.  Kaidan not joining Cerberus to be with Shep?  Thank the effin' stars someone in this galaxy has a brain.

From a meta standpoint, The Alliance didn't turn their back on the Terminus colonies.  The colonies aren't Alliance, and specifically left the Alliance with an "F-you!" attitude towards the Alliance government.  Furthermore, Council or Alliance presence (particularly since the Alliance has a seat on the Council) in the Terminus can be considered an act of war, like... you know, we found that out in the first five minutes of ME1.

The fact that the Alliance is "reaching out" at all is a pretty big step for them, and they seem to be doing all they can do in a tricky political situation to give the human colonies in the Terminus a way to defend themselves without being attacked by the Terminus.  Yes, it is a pretense for Kaidan/Ashley to investigate the disappearances... which unto itself is not "doing nothing."

AND they seem to be investigating the Reapers on the side.  At the time of ME2, compared to Liara (who is obsessed with avenging Feron), Wrex (who is trying to save his people, again), Garrus (who is doing heavens-knows-what attacking Omega), and Tali (who is doing what her superiors say), the VS seems to be the only one doing anything at all relevant to build Shepard's previous work. 

This is exactly what I think everytime someone brings it up. I've never really seen it argued either, which is too bad since I'm failing to find weak points in the logic myself.

[catabuca]

I completed my first (and only) Kaidan dies run of ME1 last night. Oh how I wailed when I left him at the bomb. Oh how I wailed when I looked back towards the bomb site just after I'd made my choice. Oh how I wailed as the Normandy came to pick us up. Oh how I wailed as Shep looked back out the window as the bomb went off.

I really lingered in the moment for a while: the crew meeting in the comm room afterwards; the sad music. You know one really moving part of that whole thing? When Joker comes over the intercom to ask if he should patch through to the council ... his voice is so sad. After that, Shep went and stood for a few moments in silence once everyone was dismissed at Kaidan's work station. Oh the music ( Then he went to seek solace with Ash.

Perhaps it's because it's new to me, but (and forgive me, I feel almost blasphemous, and I don't want to think this at all) I almost felt Ash's romance lines were deeper and more touching than Kaidan's. I'm hoping it's just because I'm used to Kaidan's romance now, so Ash's came as something fresh and new ... but I couldn't shake that feeling. Something about the pre-Ilos night and their dialogue together too. idk, maybe it's my imagination. It kinda just fuelled my ire at Kaidan being the least-loved guy in the BioWare offices.

Anyway, Mark Shepard has been imported into ME2, where he will stay faithful to Ash (ready for ME3) (and apart from some angry post-Horizon self-loathing sex with Jack). He's a vanguard - and it was the first time I've played that class in ME1 (and in ME2 ... charge? Wow!).

I'm still reeling from playing a game where Kaidan is dead in that universe, and I do not like it one little bit. But I just have to keep telling myself, in every single other game save I have he is alive and well (and hot and wonderful).

[Collider]

I've never left Kaidan behind before.

[catabuca]

And I should say, I really, really missed Kaidan on my team during Ilos and the Citadel. From a purely tactical standpoint, I can't imagine choosing anyone else as my number 1.

[catabuca]

Collider wrote...

I've never left Kaidan behind before.

I just did it so I would have an Ash save to import throughout the trilogy. I've put it off for so long, but decided now was the time. But I gotta tell you, it hurt.

My partner just stood there and laughed at me.

[jeweledleah]

I couldn't do it :/ I ended up importing a character into ME2 taken from Masseffectsaves, because I just couldn't go through with it :/ I keep on getting stalled on my renegade femshep as well, because I cannot do it, I cannot leave Kaidan at Virmire :/ I think I'm going to have to import another file O_O

Modifié par jeweledleah, 08 février 2011 - 10:02 .

[Collider]

I'm planning to do it on my renegade Shepard, who makes opposite decisions to my canon.

[catabuca]

I very nearly chickened out, it's true. But I'm glad (okay, glad isn't the right word) I did it in the end. I want to experience as much of the games as possible, rather than tying myself into only ever seeing a certain percentage. I may not ever experience Kaidan's death again in ME1, and I'm sure Ash will die a couple more times in the future (if I play it again - I always say this time is the last, but I've yet to do a Sentinel run through ... and that would be awesome to do with Kaidan in my team too) ... but at least I've done it once now.

[FireEye]

catabuca wrote...

I completed my first (and only) Kaidan dies run of ME1 last night. Oh how I wailed when I left him at the bomb. Oh how I wailed when I looked back towards the bomb site just after I'd made my choice. Oh how I wailed as the Normandy came to pick us up. Oh how I wailed as Shep looked back out the window as the bomb went off.

You left him at the bomb to do it?  Ouch. 

Leaving someone at the bomb is much more painful to me.  Hearing them cut off in the middle of a firefight is bad enough, but watching them struggle up to the last minute is agonizing. 

DAMN YOU, VIRMIRE!



...

[Jenova65]

I'm glad that most everyone's take on betrayal etc. is so close to mine. There seems to be a lot of Liara justifying going on and she never acted in the greater good giving Shepard's body to Cerberus, it is just lucky that the greater good is being served by it..... I mean Asari are a long lived race and are supposed to accept that they will lose people that matter along the way and Liara is the only one that *can't* let go? Nothing against Liara, just stating the facts in the game as they are

presented. :-)

@Fire, I always pick paragon options in the talks with Liara, how does it go if you pick the renegade choices? (It sort of reminds of as situation of the resurrection of Buffy, she was dead and really miffed at being brought back)

Re leaving Kaidan, I left him with the bomb once just see the dialogue but had saved before and then reloaded, I was never really going to leave him behind, ever... Kudos to those who can, but I can't :-O

[Jenova65]

FireEye wrote...

catabuca wrote...

I completed my first (and only) Kaidan dies run of ME1 last night. Oh how I wailed when I left him at the bomb. Oh how I wailed when I looked back towards the bomb site just after I'd made my choice. Oh how I wailed as the Normandy came to pick us up. Oh how I wailed as Shep looked back out the window as the bomb went off.

You left him at the bomb to do it?  Ouch. 

Ummmm, yeah.................. 

[catabuca]

FireEye wrote...
You left him at the bomb to do it?  Ouch. 

Leaving someone at the bomb is much more painful to me.  Hearing them cut off in the middle of a firefight is bad enough, but watching them struggle up to the last minute is agonizing. 

DAMN YOU, VIRMIRE!



...

I very rarely get to see the AA tower because I leave Kaidan at the bomb and go back for him, so it made sense to use this as a chance to go fetch Ash (and saving the Salarian team was another way I could square it with myself as something Shep would do). But watching him being shot as the Normandy flies away --- heartbreaking.

That said, I realised while I was making the various decisions that lead up to the Ultimate Evil Virmire Choice™ that it really does make more sense to save Kaidan, from a tactical and story point of view. As others said a few pages back, he's got a list of commendations, has more potential (seemingly) than Ash, is a rare L2 biotic who's in control of his pain, and seems like he'd be a better commander than Ash. And maybe it's my bias, but it felt like the game was suggesting Ash should be the sacrifice, even in the way things were worded on Virmire.

All I know is, I won't ever be making that choice in that way again.

[Jenova65]

@Catabuca, well you have done it now and can move on ;-) Just have a playthrough straight after this one to save him, it will make you feel better..........

*offers coffee and a comforting chocolate cake*

[catabuca]

Jenova65 wrote...

@Catabuca, well you have done it now and can move on ;-) Just have a playthrough straight after this one to save him, it will make you feel better..........
*offers coffee and a comforting chocolate cake*

Heh, thank you

I just had to keep telling myself that in every single other game I've played Kaidan is alive and well. And at least his picture was still there on Anderson's desk XD

This Ash game, once I've finished it in ME2, will be right at the bottom of my list of ones to import to ME3. Heck, I even created a Shep from scratch in ME2 before doing an Ash ME1 playthrough to import ... and we all know how rubbish an ME2 'canon' Shep is.

[meonlyred]

Leaving either one of them at the bomb is so damn painful. I did it to Ashley once to she the difference. Yeah it was more dramatic that Saren hung Shepard over the edge of the AA tower but then you don't have that wonderful scene where Shepard reaches down to help the VS (Kaidan *cough cough*) up then throws (him) over her soldier. Which by the way makes me laugh a little every time.



Re: Sanders, I see it more like Shepard saying "You have her, I want him *pout*"

[FireEye]

Jenova65 wrote...

@Fire, I always pick paragon options in the talks with Liara, how does it go if you pick the renegade choices? (It sort of reminds of as situation of the resurrection of Buffy, she was dead and really miffed at being brought back)

It depends.  It's been a while since I played that part, but if I recall, the renegade options when talking about the Shadow Broker stuff seemed to be mostly, "Right on, go get 'im Liara!" while the parargon options seem to be "You know, I'm worried; you seem like you're being a little obsessed."

But if you worm the "I gave you to Cerberus," line out of her, the renegade choice gets a very petulant sounding little speech along the lines of, "So that's how you knew I was coming back.  You gave me to Cerberus.  You did this to me!"  But at least it's an option....  yet you can still end on the "Don't become what you're hunting"/"Says the dead Spectre working for Cerberus" exchange, which... um... way to rub salt in the wound, Liara. 


I'm still rather annoyed that Liara never seems inclined to tell Kaidan what was going on, but... maybe it's not as malicious as it seems.  Maybe she just didn't know Shepard was up and about yet and didn't want to jump the gun in case Lazarus failed.


As for Virmire... I played one of each my first time through to see the differences - Saved Kaidan at the Bomb, left Ashley at the tower; Saved Ashley at the tower, left Kaidan at the Bomb; Saved Kaidan at the tower, left Ashley at the Bomb; Saved Ashley at the bomb, left Kaidan at the tower....

The tower seems more dramatic somehow, but I can't do it. 

[Commander Kurt]

I've left him once as well, but I couldn't keep playing after that. I just really couldn't relate to that Shep at all, and that takes the fun out of it for me (it was my only try at renegade).

And I think the Virmire decision is constructed slightly in Kaidans favour, just because Ash is a woman and a LI for the average gamer. In order to make the choice difficult Kaidan is the ranking officer and more valuable to the Alliance. I would have a much harder time saving him if it was him or Captain Anderson for instance.

[Jenova65]

It is painful leaving one of them behind, as a gaming decision it is the hardest one ever, imo. I hate it, I really like Ash, she is the best after Kaidan (imo) and I really thought of her as my gal pal in a way I can't ever see Liara or Tali, personality wise IRL they are bit too girly and *female* for my tastes. Ash could hold her own and was a hell of a woman :'(

I don't mind Miranda, she grows on you....slowly, but Ash is still better. Kasumi was great until I did a Jacob romance (thanks to the rubbish comic on PS3 was able to sidestep the Kaidan puppy eyes) and then she became creepy. Cos she has a thing for Jacob doesn't she.... And she kept saying that we had split up and she should wear her 'come hither hood'........ It is an annoying glitch cos it is all she says and won't say anything else ¬_¬

And yes, Cata, canon Shepard is................ not nice!

[Jenova65]

FireEye wrote...

Jenova65 wrote...

@Fire, I always pick paragon options in the talks with Liara, how does it go if you pick the renegade choices? (It sort of reminds of as situation of the resurrection of Buffy, she was dead and really miffed at being brought back)

It depends.  It's been a while since I played that part, but if I recall, the renegade options when talking about the Shadow Broker stuff seemed to be mostly, "Right on, go get 'im Liara!" while the parargon options seem to be "You know, I'm worried; you seem like you're being a little obsessed."

But if you worm the "I gave you to Cerberus," line out of her, the renegade choice gets a very petulant sounding little speech along the lines of, "So that's how you knew I was coming back.  You gave me to Cerberus.  You did this to me!"  But at least it's an option....  yet you can still end on the "Don't become what you're hunting"/"Says the dead Spectre working for Cerberus" exchange, which... um... way to rub salt in the wound, Liara. 


I'm still rather annoyed that Liara never seems inclined to tell Kaidan what was going on, but... maybe it's not as malicious as it seems.  Maybe she just didn't know Shepard was up and about yet and didn't want to jump the gun in case Lazarus failed.


As for Virmire... I played one of each my first time through to see the differences - Saved Kaidan at the Bomb, left Ashley at the tower; Saved Ashley at the tower, left Kaidan at the Bomb; Saved Kaidan at the tower, left Ashley at the Bomb; Saved Ashley at the bomb, left Kaidan at the tower....

The tower seems more dramatic somehow, but I can't do it. 

Mmmmmmmmmmmmm........... Actually hadn't thought of that before......... <_< Cynical me says ''Trying to get rid of the competition, Liara?''