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Kaidan Alenko Support Thread Part 3


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#5201
CulturalGeekGirl

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M-Sinistrari wrote...

MICHELLE7 wrote...

I admit the setting appeals to me more but I think Kaidan himself was written in such a way that they hit it out of the ballpark with his character. His personality is perfect but then they had to go a make him eye-candy as well.

Most other characters in the Bioware universes have had some good points but they've had things that detracted as well (like Alistair's whining moodiness over losing Duncan...hey, my family died) or they are physically unappealing (forgive me for being shallow). Kaidan seems perfect...just hope they don't change him too much in ME3.


Having skimmed through the Boring/Forgettable/Worthless character thread, I find it interesting that some act like being normal/stable is some sort of horrific thing.  Granted that's the part of me that's taken too many psych classes, but since we all do put parts of ourselves into the game for perspective and such, I wonder why normalcy's concidered such a bad thing.

The way Kaidan and even Jacob are written, if they were real they'd be exactly the sort I would be interested in if I were single.  But then I did go through my phases for the Bad Boy types, the Moody Angsty types and all and once that initial 'oooh fascinating' glamour wears off, they do end up with some pretty intensive issues that are detrimental.  Even going with the rationale of 'I can change them!', it never works.

I wonder how much of the 'he's boooring/too normal' argument is some form of projection from those who concider themselves 'nice guys' and they somehow have thier mindset threatened with a character written truly normal that has a great amount of appeal to women yet they themselves don't have that appeal?

I probably could get a hell of a psych paper out of this, pity I've got all mine done for the term.


Ok, this was the first cute Kaidan image I found that hadn't been posted here in the last few pages. So... forgive me?

Posted Image

I found his ME1 hair adorable, actually. It was part of his awkward charm. I always pictured Kaidan as sort of a smoking hot nerd.

Man, I don't like Kaidan because he's normal. I like him because he's got a messed up past, but is still a functional human being. He has a lot of stuff to deal with, and he's dealing with it pretty damn well, most of the time. That's far more impressive than just being normal.

I think Kaidan worries that he's a little bit of a monster, even now. Imagine how it feels to accidentally kill someone when you're seventeen, and to have the person you care about most become terrified of you. Now imagine how that feels if you killed that dude with your brain, using powers you're expected to use every day now. He talks about holding back, with his biotics, his feelings, with everything. He always leaves a way out, like he said. That's not normal. It is an extremely effective coping mechanism, however. The fact that Kaidan is a nice, sane guy who seems to genuinely care about people after that is nothing short of miraculous. The fact that he didn't turn out vengeful, or racist against Turians, or too outwardly angsty is what I found so unique and attractive. I think all that stuff is still roiling inside of him, but what makes it even more interesting is that he actually finds my affection for him comforting and reassuring. He's not thinking "But how can she love me? I'm a monster?" rather, he's thinking "Hey, this amazing woman loves me, so maybe I'm OK after all."

And, that, I think, is why I started relying on him too much. I expected too much of him... he'd been holding his emotions back for so long, I thought he had control. So when he lost it on Horizon, it stung more than it would have coming from someone I knew to be unreliable, or angry.

Also, as for the other ME dudes... I don't like Garrus because he's the bad boy. I like him because he's my best friend, and kind of awkward. The awkwardness was my downfall, actually - if he'd been all cool like Jacob, or passionate like Thane, I would have been able to resist, but few sheepish looks and inadvertently horrible comments will turn a girl's head. I will admit to some desire to keep Garrus from going "to the bad" as we used to say, but I don't think that's because he's a stereotypical "bad boy" - it's more because he's a guy who doesn't have any real friends or support. Growing up in a vacuum of black and white morality, never being given a real chance to learn how to use your gifts... there's a difference between going for the bad boy and throwing away someone perfectly good just because they're kind of an idiot sometimes. OK, a lot of the time.

Ironically, Kaidan's outburst on Horizon and the subsequent email raised some "bad boy" flags for me. I've seen too many female friends of mine wrecked by the "I don't know who we are anymore, we'll see" email, or strung along by the "I loved you, once" email. While I knew Kaidan probably didn't mean it that way, it still struck some really bad chords for me. My current theory is that he's probably kicking himself over that email, too. Because for me it's true - if he had said "I love you," or even "I'm going to try to trust you for now," there's no way I would have strayed. But hey, pretty much everybody has that one email they've written that they wish they could unsend. If you don't, you've lived a charmed life, my friend.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 13 avril 2011 - 11:07 .


#5202
Jean

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My gosh.

I can't get away from hate from either of my favorite characters. Ever. :mellow:

But with my whining, I hope they'll make Kaidan an LI for ME3 if you never romanced him. My canon Shep is single and I won't mind finally hooking her up with someone. :P

Modifié par Batteries, 13 avril 2011 - 11:16 .


#5203
irJessica

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Just wanted to say hi.
I feel like way too much of a lurker in this thread so I thought it was time to get involved.

I've only ever experienced Kaidan in ME1 as I'm yet to import my femshep into ME2.
After reading the Game Informer article I decided it'd import her a week before ME3 comes out and just run through the heartache so I can have him back quickly.

#5204
meonlyred

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Batteries wrote...

My gosh.

I can't get away from hate from either of my favorite characters. Ever. :mellow:


I've been lurking on the Anders page, I seen that about Kaidan. Can I just say I love both Anders and Kaidan. Two very very very different men but I have a soft smushy place in my heart for them.

#5205
Jean

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meonlyred wrote...

Batteries wrote...

My gosh.

I can't get away from hate from either of my favorite characters. Ever. :mellow:


I've been lurking on the Anders page, I seen that about Kaidan. Can I just say I love both Anders and Kaidan. Two very very very different men but I have a soft smushy place in my heart for them.


Eh it's two sides of the same coin. I see rage about both of them; Anders is more fresh and has more of a reason to hate him, though.
I'm never really going to understand the rage Kaidan produces in the end. Horizon was derpy either way :lol:

#5206
ebidebby

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I don't understand the Kaidan hate, either, but I totally don't find Kaidan normal. He's very in control - to a fault, and I think Horizon showed how he has changed, or how losing Shepard changed him, or brought back a side of him he had tried to forget or bottle up.

The more I thought about it, the more Horizon didn't seem so bad. For Kaidan, it's been 2 years of hell, and for Shepard, it's been like a long night's sleep (or whatever death is like). It wasn't perfect, but I kind of liked it. It gives the player a bit of motivation to move on if they want, and I think it will be worth it for those of us who didn't want to.

#5207
MICHELLE7

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Star58 wrote...

[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie] It's an escape after all.

:blink:You mean it's not real?:lol:

and as you say, we do put parts of ourselves into the game at times


This is the reason that I actually wind up enjoying playing as a male character more than a female. I usually play only as a femshep in ME because of Kaidan but in DA and said game which shall not be mentioned that's sequel  is coming out May 17 I enjoy playing as a male.

There is so little of me put into the character that I can just go wild...my evil blood mage in DA2 was a riot...I laughed more through that playthrough than any other. When I play as a female I find so much of myself in the character that there are certain things I just can't do...although I will say ME2 almost broke me of that.

Modifié par MICHELLE7, 14 avril 2011 - 12:19 .


#5208
ebidebby

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See, I can't play as a guy. I have to be a girl. I tried to play Dragon Age Origins as a guy and didn't like it at all.

#5209
Jean

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...If Meer used his Jethann voice when I'm playing my Sheploo I would never play as a female in that game again.

Modifié par Batteries, 14 avril 2011 - 12:09 .


#5210
Jenova65

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Batteries wrote...

My gosh.

I can't get away from hate from either of my favorite characters. Ever. :mellow:

But with my whining, I hope they'll make Kaidan an LI for ME3 if you never romanced him. My canon Shep is single and I won't mind finally hooking her up with someone. :P

Hey... :) I was only joking there was a lot of Fen digging so I thought I would in a lighthearted way point out that it is better to leave criticism behind on these threads. Because we all love Kaidan doesn't mean we all love Fen or Anders and so on, so just better to stay OT and talk Kaidan here really..... ;)

#5211
syllogi

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Batteries wrote...

meonlyred wrote...

Batteries wrote...

My gosh.

I can't get away from hate from either of my favorite characters. Ever. :mellow:


I've been lurking on the Anders page, I seen that about Kaidan. Can I just say I love both Anders and Kaidan. Two very very very different men but I have a soft smushy place in my heart for them.


Eh it's two sides of the same coin. I see rage about both of them; Anders is more fresh and has more of a reason to hate him, though.
I'm never really going to understand the rage Kaidan produces in the end. Horizon was derpy either way :lol:


Yeah, I feel so much the same way.  For all my misgivings about DA2 as a game, Anders is a really compelling character, and I can't get enough of him.  BUT, I can totally understand why people kill him, and I even think that can be the more merciful option.

Kaidan, on the other hand, is TOTALLY RIGHT ON HORIZON.  In my opinion, of course, but I cannot understand all the raging.  He is in the position of the outside observer, and from the outside, it looks like Shepard has gone insane or gotten brainwashed or turned Stupid Evil.  So it's very, very hard to comprehend the haters who point to Horizon as to why they don't like the VS.  I can even understand not liking his voice actor more than that.

But whatever.  He will be back in ME3, hopefully as a full squadmate, and there is nothing the haters can do about it.  Woot!!!  Now all we need is some "Resurrect Anders" DLC...

#5212
Jean

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Jenova65 wrote...

Batteries wrote...

My gosh.

I can't get away from hate from either of my favorite characters. Ever. :mellow:

But with my whining, I hope they'll make Kaidan an LI for ME3 if you never romanced him. My canon Shep is single and I won't mind finally hooking her up with someone. :P

Hey... :) I was only joking there was a lot of Fen digging so I thought I would in a lighthearted way point out that it is better to leave criticism behind on these threads. Because we all love Kaidan doesn't mean we all love Fen or Anders and so on, so just better to stay OT and talk Kaidan here really..... ;)


I didn't know you posted anything about anyone

I just saw about three threads with Kaidan hate and posted that. It does not compute to me :lol:
I'm someone who <3<3<3<3s all companions for all their faults and derps along with their good parts. If someone doesn't like a character it's not going to effect my life but sometimes I just cannot wrap my head around some of the reasons why that get posted.

Modifié par Batteries, 14 avril 2011 - 12:15 .


#5213
MICHELLE7

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M-Sinistrari wrote...

MICHELLE7 wrote...

There have been some Kaidan haters that have honestly admitted it (I have to respect them for being honest) that the only reason they hated Kaidan was his voice...they associated it with Carth Onasi because of Sbarge and jump to the conclusion that they must be just alike.

I think Kaidan is a nice guy and pretty much a stable guy but I don't consider him a typical nice guy...He's got a lot of edge.

The stuff with Vyrnnus...the "I will destroy you"...he's got little things here and there that say he's got a temper and if you really got on his bad side and pushed the wrong buttons like Vyrnnus you might wind up dead so for me at least I think there is a side of danger. He's kinda like the guy that had every reason in the world to turn out bad ( and dark) but forced himself to do the right thing...yet just underneath the surface there lingers that nagging feeling of "what if".


My fiance was one of those who initially heard the voice and contracted Carthitis.  However with time and patience it is curable.

Mostly what I was thinking about the 'nice guy' paradigm from the player aspect is in line with the one from the Heartless B*tches website.  The type of guy who bewails women don't like him because he's a 'nice guy' and only want jerks and don't see that they're manifesting personality aspects that are a turnoff.

That sort of guy, I believe, would likely look at the nice/normal Kaidan and his appeal as a threat to thier perspective that the non-normal type is what appeals to women so they act out as they can by decrying him in all the ways we've seen for a long while.

Perhaps there very well is that element of danger with Kaidan as you state, still doesn't change that he's still a refreshing breath of normalcy that's often missing in a RPG character.


You may be right that Kaidan would appear to be a threat to the way they see things. I really don't know much about nice guys bewailing women not liking them...I married a nice guy who had come out of a string of relationships of girls who dumped him. Girls were dying to date him but I guess he was just too nice when they got to know him. Since I'm kind of agressive I latched on and didn't let go. He didn't seem to do any complaining that I can remember...but that has been a long time.

#5214
MICHELLE7

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Selenora wrote...

Just out for curiosity.....if the previous Kaidan support threads hadnt being closed, how many pages would be there?


lol I'm not going back and counting that's for sure...those threads are long.  I guess the upside is that the moderators found us long enough to have to shut down.

#5215
MICHELLE7

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TeenZombie wrote...

Selenora wrote...

Just out for curiosity.....if the previous Kaidan support threads hadnt being closed, how many pages would be there?


The first thread was 175 pages, and the second was 2541.  So added to this one, that's very close to 3000 pages of Kaidan love over the past year or so.  Pretty impressive!  :wizard:


Wow that second thread was pretty long.

#5216
tehprincessJ

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Batteries wrote...

...If Meer used his Jethann voice when I'm playing my Sheploo I would never play as a female in that game again.


LMAO. Seriously.

#5217
MICHELLE7

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Jenova65 wrote...

Anders sucks, Fenris rules and Kaidan kicks both their asses.... Especially on the Kaidan thread!
There.
Balance redressed :P *Runs off giggling*

Plus Kaidan would hate Anders, just sayin'.............. He wouldn't buy the freedom fighter bit, he would lump Anders with Cerberus, don't you think? ;)


Setting the whole chantry thing aside...Anders and Kaidan have a lot in common...they both have been persecuted for being born different...the biotics thing is nothing more than the magic for the ME universe. They also were taken away from their homes because of being different and locked up...Kaidan at Jump Zero...Anders at the Circle of Mages. Neither of them had much control over what was done to them when they were younger.

The interesting thing to me is that you have to wonder what level of self-control does Anders have to exhibit to keep Justice controlled...and self-control is also a factor in Kaidan's personality. The difference...Kaidan continues to be stable whereas Anders loses it. So while they are not the same and I would never pick Anders over Kaidan...the core of their characters are very similar.

#5218
MICHELLE7

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CulturalGeekGirl wrote...



Ok, this was the first cute Kaidan image I found that hadn't been posted here in the last few pages. So... forgive me?

Posted Image




:lol::lol::lol::lol:I love it.

#5219
MICHELLE7

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irJessica wrote...

Just wanted to say hi.
I feel like way too much of a lurker in this thread so I thought it was time to get involved.

I've only ever experienced Kaidan in ME1 as I'm yet to import my femshep into ME2.
After reading the Game Informer article I decided it'd import her a week before ME3 comes out and just run through the heartache so I can have him back quickly.


Kinda wish I'd done that....my pain would have been way shorter.

#5220
MICHELLE7

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Posted Image

Modifié par MICHELLE7, 14 avril 2011 - 01:06 .


#5221
MICHELLE7

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ebidebby wrote...

I don't understand the Kaidan hate, either, but I totally don't find Kaidan normal. He's very in control - to a fault, and I think Horizon showed how he has changed, or how losing Shepard changed him, or brought back a side of him he had tried to forget or bottle up.

The more I thought about it, the more Horizon didn't seem so bad. For Kaidan, it's been 2 years of hell, and for Shepard, it's been like a long night's sleep (or whatever death is like). It wasn't perfect, but I kind of liked it. It gives the player a bit of motivation to move on if they want, and I think it will be worth it for those of us who didn't want to.


That control to the fault is because he's so afraid of losing control again like with Vyrnnus.  It's the same thing with him always leaving a way out...he's trying to protect himself from getting hurt again like with Rhana. Just a couple of way's he's put up walls in his life...his character is really kinda complex and well written when you look at it. Tearing down those walls was what made it fun to romance him at least for me...it was almost like a conquest.

As for Horizon I think a little of that was as much about continuing to protect himself from getting hurt as it was against Cerberus. I mean no matter what the truth was when you look at it from his side of things he probably felt somewhat rejected. I mean Shepard's back...there are rumors to that affect flying around and he was madly in love with her. Even if she did try to find him it's still going to register with him that she has other people with her...that she even found Tali and Garrus before him.

I even kind of wonder if he might not have a little fear of getting involved with Shepard again...if he was devasted the first time she died how would he be able to handle it if he got involed with her again and she was killed again. I mean he's got to be going through the gambit of emotions on Horizon...but I don't really see him as being changed from ME1...he just came with more depth. Just my opnion.

#5222
MICHELLE7

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Jenova65 wrote...

Batteries wrote...

My gosh.

I can't get away from hate from either of my favorite characters. Ever. :mellow:

But with my whining, I hope they'll make Kaidan an LI for ME3 if you never romanced him. My canon Shep is single and I won't mind finally hooking her up with someone. :P

Hey... :) I was only joking there was a lot of Fen digging so I thought I would in a lighthearted way point out that it is better to leave criticism behind on these threads. Because we all love Kaidan doesn't mean we all love Fen or Anders and so on, so just better to stay OT and talk Kaidan here really..... ;)


lol I don't Fen dig...I just honestly didn't like his character but then I've been pro-mage since DAO so it kind fits...but we can agree on Kaidan so all's well:D

#5223
ebidebby

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MICHELLE7 wrote...

ebidebby wrote...

I don't understand the Kaidan hate, either, but I totally don't find Kaidan normal. He's very in control - to a fault, and I think Horizon showed how he has changed, or how losing Shepard changed him, or brought back a side of him he had tried to forget or bottle up.

The more I thought about it, the more Horizon didn't seem so bad. For Kaidan, it's been 2 years of hell, and for Shepard, it's been like a long night's sleep (or whatever death is like). It wasn't perfect, but I kind of liked it. It gives the player a bit of motivation to move on if they want, and I think it will be worth it for those of us who didn't want to.


That control to the fault is because he's so afraid of losing control again like with Vyrnnus.  It's the same thing with him always leaving a way out...he's trying to protect himself from getting hurt again like with Rhana. Just a couple of way's he's put up walls in his life...his character is really kinda complex and well written when you look at it. Tearing down those walls was what made it fun to romance him at least for me...it was almost like a conquest.

As for Horizon I think a little of that was as much about continuing to protect himself from getting hurt as it was against Cerberus. I mean no matter what the truth was when you look at it from his side of things he probably felt somewhat rejected. I mean Shepard's back...there are rumors to that affect flying around and he was madly in love with her. Even if she did try to find him it's still going to register with him that she has other people with her...that she even found Tali and Garrus before him.

I even kind of wonder if he might not have a little fear of getting involved with Shepard again...if he was devasted the first time she died how would he be able to handle it if he got involed with her again and she was killed again. I mean he's got to be going through the gambit of emotions on Horizon...but I don't really see him as being changed from ME1...he just came with more depth. Just my opnion.


Good point - he is trying to protect himself from getting hurt. I guess changed is too strong of a word, although I'm sure losing Shep changed him somewhat. He couldn't move on even after two years, and rejects the opportunity to be reunited with her, sort of reverting back to how he was before their relationship - all principled and duty minded. Control freak, not ready for the chaos that Shepard tends to draw in.

I should go back and play again - my Kaidan is pretty rusty.

#5224
soren7550

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MICHELLE7 wrote...

ebidebby wrote...

I don't understand the Kaidan hate, either, but I totally don't find Kaidan normal. He's very in control - to a fault, and I think Horizon showed how he has changed, or how losing Shepard changed him, or brought back a side of him he had tried to forget or bottle up.

The more I thought about it, the more Horizon didn't seem so bad. For Kaidan, it's been 2 years of hell, and for Shepard, it's been like a long night's sleep (or whatever death is like). It wasn't perfect, but I kind of liked it. It gives the player a bit of motivation to move on if they want, and I think it will be worth it for those of us who didn't want to.


That control to the fault is because he's so afraid of losing control again like with Vyrnnus.  It's the same thing with him always leaving a way out...he's trying to protect himself from getting hurt again like with Rhana. Just a couple of way's he's put up walls in his life...his character is really kinda complex and well written when you look at it. Tearing down those walls was what made it fun to romance him at least for me...it was almost like a conquest.

As for Horizon I think a little of that was as much about continuing to protect himself from getting hurt as it was against Cerberus. I mean no matter what the truth was when you look at it from his side of things he probably felt somewhat rejected. I mean Shepard's back...there are rumors to that affect flying around and he was madly in love with her. Even if she did try to find him it's still going to register with him that she has other people with her...that she even found Tali and Garrus before him.

I even kind of wonder if he might not have a little fear of getting involved with Shepard again...if he was devasted the first time she died how would he be able to handle it if he got involed with her again and she was killed again. I mean he's got to be going through the gambit of emotions on Horizon...but I don't really see him as being changed from ME1...he just came with more depth. Just my opnion.

I'm in pretty much total agreement with you two here.

#5225
Jean

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Man's human.

Can't blame him.