273 réponses à ce sujet

[Haexpane]

3rd times a charm? Tanks do go down way too fast

[Kolaris8472]

For people saying Mages are powerful in the lore because they're also dangerous, with the downside of being tempted by Demons -



The player will always be the 'maximum potential' of his class. There are no downsides when you play a Mage. There is not, say, a 20% chance that by the time you reach the end game control of your character will be wrenched away from you by a Pride Demon.

[Vasharai]

I was pwned by Dog the other day, I demand he be nerfed!

[natetk]

Lol, where are all those people before the game came out talking about how warriors rule and mages are squishy. Hahahahah sucks you to be you warriors. Btw I'm using Allistar as my tank. He is awesome, and he very rarely goes down.

[Broloc]

If the game is too ez as a mage.. then .. don't play one? Or perhaps ignore the OP'd skills?

[The-Cyber-Dave]

To people saying "if you feel the mage is overpowered, then don't play one," that doesn't work so well if you like the role-playing/storyline of the mage class, or the role-playing experience/dialogue that a mage party member brings to the group (such as Morrigan or Wyne), but not the overpowered aspects that such a character brings to the game. What if I want to play a mage, I want to use AoE spells, I like the idea of an arcane warrior, but I am not looking to be overpowered? Am I supposed to just not gain the experience of playing the mage in one play-through because I don't want to be overpowered?



I don't know that the mage actually is overpowered. On this playthrough, my rogue does a lot more damage then Morrigan or Wyne. I need Morrigan and Wyne for some of what they provide, but I need my rogue for DPS. But, if some aspects of the mage are overpowered, those aspects should be fixed. The underpowered aspects should be fixed too. Shapeshifter should be a useful specialization, not the garbage it currently is. Arcane Warrior shouldn't be an I win button... though I haven't actually played an Arcane Warrior yet, so I don't know if I actually feel that it is.

[Trepas]

It's a single player game. Game balance is a not even remotely relevant. If you think something is so powerful that it makes the game no fun for you.....just don't do it. You don't have to min/max in a single player game any more than you want to. If you think something is so weak that you do not enjoy doing it.....simply do something else.



It's really that simple.

[Skemte]

Enoch VG wrote...

Saying that there's an explanation for it in the lore is no excuse, especially given that this is an original IP, and that Bio had full control of the lore content. Bio is selling us a game, and when games give players choices at character creation, there is an unspoken promise that all of said options will be roughly equivalent in usefulness. Sure, there are synergies that can increase effectiveness, and there are always obvious ways one can gimp one's character (which the player should be warned against, e.g., putting points into "Magic" for a Rogue), but if the game allows the player to stumble into classes/abilities/spells that are either very overpowered or very underpowered, it leads to frustrated and unhappy players. That's not the result that any game designer should be aiming for.

Personally, I don't think that Mages, per se, are overpowered. I think that there are a half-dozen or so spells that are overpowered.

... This.. I really want to smack the people up side the head who say "well clearly mages should be the most powerful"..  NO THEY SHOULD NOT..  When mages can do alot of damage, they are extremely brittle or have numerous OTHER gimps..  The mage in Dragon Age Origins has none of those..  Abilities are very cheap to the point that they seem to be able to use their abilities far more than the warrior and do way more damage..  Make matters worse is they DO NOT HAVE A SPECIALIZATION.. seriously WHAT were they thinking about this?  Rogues, Warriors have to pick a weapon specialization.. When they do so there is no reason to go into another specialization because they would gimp them selves because there is no synergy..  There is NONE such restriction for the mage.. You can go alittle into primal, and alittle into others.. With NO real penalty.. At the very least they should have forced the mage to pick a specialization of the spell tree like you had to do for the warrior or rogue..

[Skemte]

Trepas wrote...

It's a single player game. Game balance is a not even remotely relevant. If you think something is so powerful that it makes the game no fun for you.....just don't do it. You don't have to min/max in a single player game any more than you want to. If you think something is so weak that you do not enjoy doing it.....simply do something else.

It's really that simple.

.... Uhh yeah its relevent.. Lets have you play Shapeshifter in the shifted form for the entire game.. Lets see how you feel when you seem like you are getting carried by your party members..  Some balance is always neccesary to make character choices meaningful and fun..  It doesn't have to be extremely balanced, but as it stands Mages are so broken its not even funny....  Alot of their spells are extremely cheap to cast, more so than activatable abilities on warrior or rogue..  They do intense amounts of damage, lyrium potions are plentiful.. The cool down are on low cool downs, especially for ones like wintergrasp and cone of cold..  They also can pick any skills through any trees infact it seems to say that you should benefit form it.. If anything I could forgive the power of the mage, if it were not due to the fact I could choose and pick every spell I want in every tree.. Which the rogue and warrior certainly can not inless they wish to gimp themselves..

[Ryazan]

Warriors are underpowered...? What game are you playing?

[Skellimancer]

My Arcane Warrior (lv 12) has more defences than Alistair who is fully sword and board, same level as i and has MUCH nicer armor +shield (i use two swords), its insane.

If that wasn't enough i do more damage than the rest of my party put together.

I had hoped when Bioware dropped D&D license that they would make a much more balanced ruleset, instead the divide is much worse.

[Drunkencelt]

The important points are still being over looked by run of the mill play something else or omg mages are too l33t crap posts.

1. Arcane warrior mages shouldn't be better than a fully specced tank. Does not matter how you slice it. Couple that with blood mage and you can solo most of nightmare with few exceptions. You don't really even have to spend many talent points(away from your damage/cc tree) to acheive this. Compared to a warrior that spends every point toward increasing his survivability.

2. Mages have a ton of great talents way too early into there trees. Absolutely no specialization requirements outside of acheivements.

This is not a single player/multiplayer argument(stop bring up WoW ffs, you people are obsessed with WoW references). It is simply a roleplaying/class balance game issue. People can make all the observations they want. You spend the whole game playing the tank just to have a mage do it better with no work/wasted points/skill. It demeans the effort and value of some peoples characters. Can you not understand that people get attached to their characters?

[MingWolf]

I always thought the D&D mages were much more overpowered than they are here. Perhaps it all has to do with how you build the mage. There will always be powerful, cheap, but powerful builds out there I am sure . 'Course, in D&D, you can multiclass your warriors to make up for the gap. I have not learned all the ropes in DA:O yet, but aside from the potential of doing wicked amounts of damage, I find my mages can be easily picked off if I am not careful.

[Skellimancer]

My level 12 Arcane Warrior Mage has 42 armor and 69 defence wearing the full Juggernaut set and nothing else.

Alistair has 34 armor 61 defence using the same suit + a shield + Shield Wall talent.



This needs fixing.

[Shadow_Viper]

IFSW

[Eradyn]

Had an arcane warrior (why did my hdd have to go kaput? Why???) and it was great. I now have a dual-wielding warrior and she's great as well. I have no issues with either class, both are very effective in their own roles, and I enjoy both immensely...although both require slightly different tactics. But seeing as this is a single-player game, I'm not sure why it should matter if one is overpowered and the other underpowered. You can always change the difficulty setting or give yourself challenges to beat (play through the game as a naked mage or something). Or spec your warrior to be more affective...Again...it's a single player game...were this a multiplayer game with PvP components, then I'd say it's something that should be addressed. Imho.

Modifié par Eradyn, 14 novembre 2009 - 02:34 .

[Codemanjap]

I'm sorry but this post hardly seems relevant to me in any way. This game has no pvp in it so I dont see why it really matters that mages as you say are overpowered or not. If its too easy up the difficulty....that is what it is there for. If that is still too easy use one mage or none. I for one am playing it with a healer mage first and then switching to tank to make the game possibly more difficult.

[menasure]

my 'tank' is a regular 2h warrior without secondary class, my character is more of a healer-hex mage which got her hands full with keeping everyone alive because she doesn't have a real specialization, my archer-rogue-bard sucks at sneaking and lock picking and the npc mage-shape shifter is keen on freezing my own team mates and i've no clue what to do with the shape shifting part. of course half of my team is 'evil' while the other half is 'good' so relations and the conversations between them can be described as very 'interesting'.

sure i can see the 'imbalance' between characters but eventually you pick your own party and i can honestly say that i'm having a blast in game despite -or is it because of?- my bad team building XD

Modifié par menasure, 14 novembre 2009 - 03:08 .

[Rainen89]

Mage is overpowered, yes that's how it is that's how it'll always be. It's not supposed to be balanced as far as a who can kill who first scenario. This isn't pvp. Mage's are better at killing and doing much more damage. I do think they went a tad...insane when they made arcane warriors. Alistair is a tad useless now. However, that doesn't make it incorrect I dare anyone to try nightmare/hard with 4 mages, do it. Mages are better at one role, yeah that's kinda how it should be especially when you're fighting tens of hundreds of monsters at once.



Hell, if anyone's overpowered it's the PC's party. Imagine reading darkspawn forums now. Warriors are plenty useful sten can and does hit for 70+ pretty regular. Each class has a pretty distinct use. Sadly it seems in order for rogues to do well however, you have to play them. Leliana/Zevran = useless.

[ITSSEXYTIME]

Surfie wrote...

It's not about that Spaghetti. It's about making the game too easy.

I'm sorry but not everyone wants to walk around in God Mode. Some people like using cheat codes, but many people like myself don't.

Playing as a Mage on Nightmare feels like I'm cheating. I really enjoyed the game balance as a Warrior class. There was just the right amount of difficulty and challenge.

Here's a thought: If you don't like that arcane warrior is super easy then don't play it.  Or mod your own difficulty.



I'm playing as a AW/BM combo. Mana Clash is basically OP.  The amount of CC plus damage just makes it easy.  Cone of Cold shouldn't work on bosses for one thing. 

[The-Cyber-Dave]

I had hoped when Bioware dropped D&D license that they would make a much more balanced ruleset, instead the divide is much worse.

Ironically, with the advent of D&D 4e, D&D has become a whole lot more balanced. Had this game used a digital real time derivative of the D&D 4e ruleset, it would have been a balanced game.

[Kiya_Elle]

Rainen89 wrote...
Sadly it seems in order for rogues to do well however, you have to play them. Leliana/Zevran = useless.

I've found Lelliana to be awesome if you play without a mage in your party.  I'm going through on easy mode without a mage, and her bard skills make all the differance.  I set her at the back using her Captivating Song and while the enemies stand around dazed my Elf archer, Alistair and the dog can pick them off easily.

[ITSSEXYTIME]

Also forgot to add that: The reason arcane warrior's have a higher Defense rating than Warriors is because Defense is dictated by Dexterity. Rogues and AW will always have higher Defense than Warriors because of this. Warriors should have ideally the highest Armour rating.



Defense is how likely an attack is to hit you, Armour mitigates damage. An AW having higher Defense does not mean that they are more durable than a fully decked out warrior.

[Skellimancer]

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...

Also forgot to add that: The reason arcane warrior's have a higher Defense rating than Warriors is because Defense is dictated by Dexterity. Rogues and AW will always have higher Defense than Warriors because of this. Warriors should have ideally the highest Armour rating.

Defense is how likely an attack is to hit you, Armour mitigates damage. An AW having higher Defense does not mean that they are more durable than a fully decked out warrior.

Arcane Warrior with Spell Might and Rock armor will have much more Armor than any Warrior.

[Rainen89]

Really now? I might have to use her. I've just gone juggernaught using arcane/warrior blood mage (WAY too powerful of a combo, good god.) and Sten/Ohgren hm, might be worthwhile when I do warrior playthrough. I wish there was a harder setting than nightmare, or I just wish arcane warrior wasn't so...godlike.

Edit. Also, really the defense is irrelevent yellows are hitting my mage for 4-5 damage and he's auto attacking for 50-60. I'm fine with melee mages but they shouldn't have given them so much defense, should've relied more on a primal set. Do people even play shapeshifters?

Modifié par Rainen89, 14 novembre 2009 - 04:09 .