68 réponses à ce sujet

[GodWood]

jlb524 wrote...

Bamboozalist wrote...
Play a Femshep if you just want to be friends with jack. You get more conversations with her than any non LI as Femshep.

Not really.

I'm pretty sure Jack has more dialogue with a femshep than Miranda or Tali.

Modifié par GodWood, 10 janvier 2011 - 05:35 .

[Bamboozalist]

jlb524 wrote...

Bamboozalist wrote...

Play a Femshep if you just want to be friends with jack. You get more conversations with her than any non LI as Femshep.

Not really.

Yes really. You get 6 conversations with Jack as femshep before she thanks you for being her friend and says she doesn't swing that way. Samara and Thane have the next highest conversation count for non LIs. (I realize Thane is an LI but you can get really far into his dialogue with out ever commiting to being in a relationship, farther than both Jacob and Garrus)

[jlb524]

GodWood wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Bamboozalist wrote...
Play a Femshep if you just want to be friends with jack. You get more conversations with her than any non LI as Femshep.

Not really.

I'm pretty sure Jack has more dialogue with a femshep than Miranda or Tali.

I don't think she does.  Regardless, I felt that my Shepard had become friends with both Tali and Miranda by the end, so it's the content that mattered.  With Jack...I felt nothing....I helped her out and she basically wanted nothing to do with me thereafter. 

[jlb524]

Bamboozalist wrote...

Yes really. You get 6 conversations with Jack as femshep before she thanks you for being her friend and says she doesn't swing that way. Samara and Thane have the next highest conversation count for non LIs. (I realize Thane is an LI but you can get really far into his dialogue with out ever commiting to being in a relationship, farther than both Jacob and Garrus)

I remember three convos that had any substance.  I'm not counting the quick, 'Oh, help me with my quest' and the 'Oh, thanks for helping me with my quest' dialog.  I don't remember anything about being a 'friend' either.

[Bamboozalist]

jlb524 wrote...

Bamboozalist wrote...

Yes really. You get 6 conversations with Jack as femshep before she thanks you for being her friend and says she doesn't swing that way. Samara and Thane have the next highest conversation count for non LIs. (I realize Thane is an LI but you can get really far into his dialogue with out ever commiting to being in a relationship, farther than both Jacob and Garrus)

I remember three convos that had any substance.  I'm not counting the quick, 'Oh, help me with my quest' and the 'Oh, thanks for helping me with my quest' dialog.  I don't remember anything about being a 'friend' either.

I'm counting the 'Oh, help me with my quest' and the follow up, which I do because they're just as long and have just as many investigate options as most conversations.

You have as Femshep
1. Thanks for letting me look at these files
2. Hanar Moon Conversation
3. Hey help me with my quest
4. Hey thanks for helping me with my quest
5. Conversation about the guy and the girl Jack stayed with for a while
6. Jack wondering why Shepard wants to talk with her so much, thanks her for it and for being there, and tells her she doesn't swing that way.

Compare that to
Miranda
1. Cerberus isn't evil
2. You're not a tool
3. Help me with my quest
4. Thanks for helping me with my quest

Tali
1. Working with Cerberus
2. Help me with my quest
3. Thanks for helping me with my quest
4. The I'd link suits with you...wait never mind I have some...tinkering to do.

So you can be just friends with Jack, you just have to be female because apparently a man and a woman can't have a non romantic relationship.

Modifié par Bamboozalist, 10 janvier 2011 - 06:57 .

[jlb524]

My point is that the content of Jack's dialog doesn't lend itself to a budding friendship, even with FemShep while Miranda's and Tali's does (also, even Thane if you don't romance him).



Also,I think you are missing a Miranda dialog. Not like it matters....regardless of how many dialogs there were, it felt like my FemShep and Miranda had become friends by the end....FemShep/Jack...not so much. Jack could have had 20 convos and this wouldn't change anything.

[Bamboozalist]

jlb524 wrote...

My point is that the content of Jack's dialog doesn't lend itself to a budding friendship, even with FemShep while Miranda's and Tali's does (also, even Thane if you don't romance him).

But it does. Jack makes it clear that she appeciates that Shepard is the first person who has actually given two ****s about her and has displayed any real attempt to learn about her and be her friend. Her final conversation with Femshep is her thanking Shepard for all their talks and how she appeciates it. Her final line is about how she doesn't swing that way and how they have a good thing going and they should leave it at that. Compare that to Tali who abruptly cuts herself off before she ventures into lesbian territory.

And yes, Thane is the only LI who you can become good friends with as the sex that can romance him, even if you don't romance him. Samara is also someone who you can become a really good friend with.

Edit: You're correct Miranda has a 5th conversation about what she intends to do now.

Modifié par Bamboozalist, 10 janvier 2011 - 07:23 .

[Elite Midget]

I wonder... Why doesn't Jack swing that way? I mean, she mentions that she's been with both of the genders and even mentions that she had fun in the rack with that guy and his girlfriend, which implies that she did both at once, before killing them after their betrayal.

[AntiChri5]

You can be just friends with Jack as a male. Simply never start the romance.

[Raizo]

To the best of my knowledge, No, there is no way to just be friends with Jack, you either have to romance her or accept the fact that she won't talk to you.

It really is a shame that you can't offer her jsut friendship. It's one of the many reasons why Jack will always end up near the bottom in any character popularlity poll that I do for ME2. I won't romance her since I'm not attracted to her and I can't get to know her unless I try to get into her pants.

Edit:
Obviously  I've been playing as male Shepard. I haven't comleted ME1 with female Shepard I can't go through that game again and I have no intention of creatiing a female Shepard for ME2 since I don't like the default storyline choices.

Modifié par Raizo, 10 janvier 2011 - 07:36 .

[AntiChri5]

I wonder... Why doesn't Jack swing that way? I mean, she mentions that she's been with both of the genders and even mentions that she had fun in the rack with that guy and his girlfriend, which implies that she did both at once, before killing them after their betrayal.

She talks about that relationship as if it was something where she was too young to know she was being used. Having been manipulated into a threesome when young doesn't make someone bisexual, people frequently experiment before their sexuality is completely defined. It is plausible she simply isn't into girls.

Either that or the big bad homophobic BioWare changed it because evil corporate evilness. You decide.

[Bamboozalist]

Elite Midget wrote...

I wonder... Why doesn't Jack swing that way? I mean, she mentions that she's been with both of the genders and even mentions that she had fun in the rack with that guy and his girlfriend, which implies that she did both at once, before killing them after their betrayal.

For the same reason why Tali has to "tinker" when she embarrasses herself in front of Femshep. Lesbians make Baby Grunt cry.

Modifié par Bamboozalist, 10 janvier 2011 - 07:33 .

[AntiChri5]

To the best of my knowledge, No, there is no way to just be friends with Jack, you either have to romance her or accept the fact that she won't talk to you.

The same is true of Garrus, Thane, Miranda and Tali.

The only LI who has dialogue after you do not romance them is Jacob.

[Elite Midget]

Though Jack isn't shy that she's been with more people and not just of the male gender even after that experience. The only explination for it is most likely that Bioware wanted it to be interpted as...

'Jack swings both ways but she can't see herself in a meaningful relationship with a woman.'

I'm thinking that Bioware is still fearful of the Fox News thing as for why Jack and Tali weren't made Bi options. Especially from the things said in the game. Though I believe this to be the case because Bioware lacks the will to even the Romances out and making some of the men gay options as well.

Don't see why... Especially with how popular that Jacob/Male Shepard Romance thing turned out to be on the internet.

Modifié par Elite Midget, 10 janvier 2011 - 07:38 .

[jlb524]

Bamboozalist wrote...

But it does. Jack makes it clear that she appeciates that Shepard is the first person who has actually given two ****s about her and has displayed any real attempt to learn about her and be her friend. Her final conversation with Femshep is her thanking Shepard for all their talks and how she appeciates it. Her final line is about how she doesn't swing that way and how they have a good thing going and they should leave it at that. Compare that to Tali who abruptly cuts herself off before she ventures into lesbian territory.

I just didn't get it, I guess.   The last convo I had was her basically telling me to '****** off' and that she's not in the 'girls club', whatever that means.  Tali, on the other hand, basically tells me I'm the one person she trusts more than any other in her last convo.

I'm also not sure what any of it has to do with the dreaded 'lesbian territory'.

[Bamboozalist]

Elite Midget wrote...
I'm thinking that Bioware is still fearful of the Fox News thing as for why Jack and Tali weren't made Bi options. Especially from the things said in the game. Though I believe this to be the case because Bioware lacks the will to even the Romances out and making some of the men gay options as well.

The blame Fox News excuse has gotten so old its not even funny, especially considering that the stuff Fox News was ****ing about wasn't cut from the game. I highly doubt EA and Bioware run every idea through a "will this ****** off Fox News" machine especially considering that middle aged/elderly conservatives arent exactly the target demographic for 90% of videogames.

[Bamboozalist]

jlb524 wrote...

I'm also not sure what any of it has to do with the dreaded 'lesbian territory'.

Tali was originally Bi and the way she cuts herself off has several implications. That and "Nerve Stim Pro" still applies to Femshep.

[Xilizhra]

Either that or the big bad homophobic BioWare changed it because evil corporate evilness. You decide.

It's far from unknown to them.

[jlb524]

Bamboozalist wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

I'm also not sure what any of it has to do with the dreaded 'lesbian territory'.

Tali was originally Bi and the way she cuts herself off has several implications. That and "Nerve Stim Pro" still applies to Femshep.

That's debatable and has been debated.

Anyway, all I see is that my FemShep is trying to be nice to Jack and she gets all paranoid as she believes I'm hitting on her (when I'm clearly not) and I don't see how this is a basis for any decent or healthy friendship.  Just because you help someone out and they thank you for it doesn't make you friends.

[Xilizhra]

I do agree. Jack remains annoyingly standoffish to Femshep even though they start to have some sort of relationship going.

[AntiChri5]

Though Jack isn't shy that she's been with more people and not just of the male gender even after that experience. The only explination for it is most likely that Bioware wanted it to be interpted as...

What women? When?

[jlb524]

Xilizhra wrote...

I do agree. Jack remains annoyingly standoffish to Femshep even though they start to have some sort of relationship going.

To me the relationship is too businesslike to be called a 'friendship'....you need her for the mission and she needs you for the Cerberus data.  That's it.

Though, what happened in ME2 could lay the foundation for a future friendship with Jack in ME3, but I don't see it in ME2.

Modifié par jlb524, 10 janvier 2011 - 08:03 .

[Bamboozalist]

@Jib:

You have to understand her personality. She thinks everyone is out to get her and doesn't want/need anyone's help. That's why she's so antagonistic towards you at the beginning, you then peel that away to where she's not the emotionally open person she is in a maleshep romance with her but she's still beyond only interested in Cerberus data. It's not a friendship like say Samara, but it's still a friendship. I don't know what you're expecting from a gigantic ball of emotional baggage and ****ed up. Her thanking you for talking to her about stuff is a damn miracle.

[Chuvvy]

DEEP. CHARACTER. INTERACTION.



*unless you don't want to sleep with them

[jlb524]

Bamboozalist wrote...

@Jib:
You have to understand her personality. She thinks everyone is out to get her and doesn't want/need anyone's help. That's why she's so antagonistic towards you at the beginning, you then peel that away to where she's not the emotionally open person she is in a maleshep romance with her but she's still beyond only interested in Cerberus data. It's not a friendship like say Samara, but it's still a friendship. I don't know what you're expecting from a gigantic ball of emotional baggage and ****ed up. Her thanking you for talking to her about stuff is a damn miracle.

I'm not saying I have a problem with her personalitly...I just don't think it's what could be called a 'friendship' with FemShep.  I don't think it is....it could become one in the future, but it isn't there yet.