159 réponses à ce sujet

[Schneidend]

Eag07 wrote...

Allowing players to choose is the logical decision, since there is a significant amount of people not happy with the ammo system. But since when do people make logical decisions, right?

Having the developers do a lot of unnecessary work is never a logical decision when it comes to game design. Games already leave enough potentially awesome content on the cutting room floor by the time they go gold, and your "logic" is encouraging more waste because you want to be able to fire your weapon infinitely.

Also, a vocal minority on a forum does not constitute a "significant amount."

[marshalleck]

slimgrin wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

They didn't put all that work into redesigning combat just to throw it away. Sorry. Not going to happen.

They did in the first game.

The first game wasn't a sequel. 

At any rate, ME2's success has clearly gone to Bioware's collective heads. The rare times they comment on ME2 it's always about how many awards they won, as if that means anything. 

Modifié par marshalleck, 09 janvier 2011 - 08:27 .

[slimgrin]

marshalleck wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

They didn't put all that work into redesigning combat just to throw it away. Sorry. Not going to happen.

They did in the first game.

The first game wasn't a sequel. 

I know. But they didn't hesitate throwing out wholesale what they didn't want during the dev process. And they certainly didn't hold back in this regard for ME2. My post was unclear.

Modifié par slimgrin, 09 janvier 2011 - 08:29 .

[Vit246]

What should be done is a sort of hybrid system between the thermal clips and overheating. You have a number of clips, and if your gun overheats all the way, you have to eject a clip, but if you can control the firing rate and heating, you'll never have to.

[Praetor Knight]

Well there is unlimited ammo in the ME universe. I think there are complaints about how it was presented in game. And I'm fine with ME2 combat, its better that ME, IMHO.

One think I thought about for ME3 is to change the HUD, so that instead of seeing numbers displayed for how many shots you can make before ejecting a Thermal Clip and how much you have in reserve.

There is instead is a red meter that increases until you eject the Thermal Clip. And instead of displaying the number of reserve / spare shots, you see the Thermal Clips you carry, maybe have a HUD toggle for that.







Nonetheless, I would like to see in ME3, a Universal Thermal Clip system, where all guns except Heavy Weapons draw from that one pool of clips. Then when you finish, combat the omnitool is used to make omnigel from items on the battlefield (similar to how items were converted to omnigel in ME) and them use the omnigel to replenish your Thermal Clip pool with freshly made ones.

Gameplay-wise (and what the player sees) it could be implimented with simply having the Omnitool glow after a fight just like it already does when some powers are activated or Unity is used.

[General Douchington]

I never understood why you NEEDED thermal clips. They absorb heat, yes. If you dont have a thermal clip, you can't fire at all? More importantly, why/how do guns just have infinite ammo otherwise? They do fire bullets, as it would seem.



GOSH DARN SCI-FI

[Schneidend]

Presumably, most people don't survive hi-tech railguns exploding in their hands, hence the safety measure of being unable to fire without any form of heat management.

[slimgrin]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Well there is unlimited ammo in the ME universe. I think there are complaints about how it was presented in game. And I'm fine with ME2 combat, its better that ME, IMHO.
One think I thought about for ME3 is to change the HUD, so that instead of seeing numbers displayed for how many shots you can make before ejecting a Thermal Clip and how much you have in reserve.
There is instead is a red meter that increases until you eject the Thermal Clip. And instead of displaying the number of reserve / spare shots, you see the Thermal Clips you carry, maybe have a HUD toggle for that.



Nonetheless, I would like to see in ME3, a Universal Thermal Clip system, where all guns except Heavy Weapons draw from that one pool of clips. Then when you finish, combat the omnitool is used to make omnigel from items on the battlefield (similar to how items were converted to omnigel in ME) and them use the omnigel to replenish your Thermal Clip pool with freshly made ones.
Gameplay-wise (and what the player sees) it could be implimented with simply having the Omnitool glow after a fight just like it already does when some powers are activated or Unity is used.

These are some good ideas. Quite few good ideas in this thread, actually. 

[flem1]

Eag07 wrote...

Allowing players to choose is the logical decision, since there is a significant amount of people not happy with the ammo system. But since when do people make logical decisions, right?

"Add a toggle"!?

You haven't been around here very long, have you...

[Eag07]

flem1 wrote...

Eag07 wrote...

Allowing players to choose is the logical decision, since there is a significant amount of people not happy with the ammo system. But since when do people make logical decisions, right?

"Add a toggle"!?

You haven't been around here very long, have you...

I know it is just a silly dream. From developers' standpoint implementing both systems wouldn't probably be feasible. Then again, I don't have enough information about how the systems are implemented to say whether it is possible or not. I only want to point out that it would be a solution to please both sides of this argument.

[Cheesy Blue]

WowWTF wrote...

Nawh, I felt as if the ammo made the combat more smooth, and overall realistic.

How can you think that it makes the game more realistic when the guns in ME already have an established reason why they have near unlimited ammo?

[Schneidend]

Guns still have unlimited ammo with the thermal clip system, they just have a limited amount of coolant to compensate for all the unlimited ammo that's being flung all over the place.

[Zurcior]

They should make upgrades that allow for more shots to be fired before ejecting the heat sink.

[SalsaDMA]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Well there is unlimited ammo in the ME universe.

Actually there isn't.

An assault rifle clip holds around 4000 shots.

It's a number that is silly to keep track of for normal purposes, though, so the gamedesigners appearantly decided to not actually implement the clip zise, as it would be a meaningless number in game mechanics.

[Praetor Knight]

SalsaDMA wrote...

An assault rifle clip holds around 4000 shots.

It's a number that is silly to keep track of for normal purposes, though, so the gamedesigners appearantly decided to not actually implement the clip zise, as it would be a meaningless number in game mechanics.

Do you mean the ammo brick/block? Or something in the game files?

[SalsaDMA]

The number is given in one of the novels. I think it was 'Revelation' that had the number.



...Found it.



Page 28 of 'Mass Effect: Revelation': "They each carried half a dozen grenades and the Alliance's standard issue Hahne-Kedar g-921 Assault Rifle. The ammo clip on each weapon held over four thousand rounds; minitature pellets smaller than grains of sand."

[Darth Wraith]

I liked the heat sink system. It meant you had to think more strategically in combat, switching between weapons when one ran low on heat sinks. The overheating mechanic they used in ME1 was mostly annoying.

[Ghost Warrior]

I like both heat clips from ME2 and overheating system from ME1 so I really don't care what happens with it in ME3,I'm happy either way.But just for the record,I really doubt they'll bring ME1 system back.

[_punt172o]

mR.Waffles wrote...

Dear Bioware,

Please remove heat clips from Mass Effect 3 and return to the unlimited ammo system I found so enjoyable in Mass Effect 1, or in the very least, allow the player to chose between the two systems. Thank you.

There is unlimited ammo, thermal clips absorb heat and you eject and replace it with a fresh heat sync.  You do this so you can maintain a higher rate of fire. 

In ME1 you didn't have replaceable heat sinks (aka thermal clips) which is why you risked overheating.

UNDERSTAND THE SCIENCE BEHIND IT BRA

[Praetor Knight]

SalsaDMA wrote...

The number is given in one of the novels. I think it was 'Revelation' that had the number.

...Found it.

Page 28 of 'Mass Effect: Revelation': "They each carried half a dozen grenades and the Alliance's standard issue Hahne-Kedar g-921 Assault Rifle. The ammo clip on each weapon held over four thousand rounds; minitature pellets smaller than grains of sand."

Oh, OK, thanks.

For me, when I said unlimited in the earlier post, I was thinking about how omnigel can be used to keep the ammo supply in the weapons topped off.

I didn't know that pellets were described, I've always imagined flechettes were sheared off of a block of metal, I need to pick those books up

[padaE]

Only if they want to walk backwards.

.

The thermal clip system is a must for a high level gameplay.

[SinDr0me]

Unlimited ammo sucked, my weapon always overheated!

[Bocks]

Keep the clips, make them cool down.



Problem solved.

[The Smoking Man]

SinDr0me wrote...

Unlimited ammo sucked, my weapon always overheated!

You're doing it wrong.

The problem with ME1's system was that, if you used the right weapon/ammo mods, you could spam bullets nonstop. Which is what everyone would always do by the final mission.
ME2's is stupid as well, in its own ways. Some weapons have not nearly enough spare clips that can be carried. And that you would have to go on a scavenger hunt after every firefight just looking for clips.

Modifié par The Smoking Man, 09 janvier 2011 - 11:04 .

[adembroski11]

I don't mind Thermals... I preferred the cooldown system simply because it was different, but either way works.



That said, the thermal clips need to work like thermal clips, not just be regular magazines just like every other shooter. A thermal clip is good for a certain number of shots, period. If you eject early, you don't get those shots transferred to the next clip.



Also, no running out. If I run out of clips, I wait for cooldown like ME1. Reduce the number of clips found to make this a dynamic and interesting part of the game.



THAT would make it work.