17177 réponses à ce sujet

[Demx]

Dave of Canada wrote...

ECuyler wrote...

It seems like that requires multiple assumptions about characters we know little about (almost to a ridiculous level).

Assumption of Fenris' part, yes. Though we know he's Tevinter and former slave, I doubt he'd really care much about elvendom.

Zevran views himself more as an Antivan than an elf, I doubt he cares about elfing it up.

The assumption on Merrill's part is what we're discussing.

Well Zevran does find the subject about his people rather touchy, after you slaughter the Dalish. But he got over it.

Modifié par Siradix, 15 janvier 2011 - 03:05 .

[Sabariel]

Dave of Canada wrote...

ECuyler wrote...

It seems like that requires multiple assumptions about characters we know little about (almost to a ridiculous level).

Assumption of Fenris' part, yes. Though we know he's Tevinter and former slave, I doubt he'd really care much about elvendom.

Zevran views himself more as an Antivan than an elf, I doubt he cares about elfing it up.

The assumption on Merrill's part is what we're discussing.

If she was willing to hook up with a human in the first place (knowing that she could only produce human babies with him) why would she care that much about having elven babies? Seems a little silly to me.

[Drizzt ORierdan]

Not at all... She could be "in love" with Hawke, but at the same time wanting to have Elven children... She could be torn about that...

Its more or less the same as anyone romantically interested in more than one person. How could you choose?

Modifié par Drizzt ORierdan, 15 janvier 2011 - 03:15 .

[Dave of Canada]

Sabariel wrote...

If she was willing to hook up with a human in the first place (knowing that she could only produce human babies with him) why would she care that much about having elven babies? Seems a little silly to me.

Because she still cares about her people?

[bsbcaer]

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

Not at all... She could be "in love" with Hawke, but at the same time wanting to have Elven children... She could be torn about that...

Its more or less the same as anyone romantically interested in more than one person. How could you choose?

For me, the better analogy would be two highly religious people of different religions...You love the other person, but would you be willing to change your faith for that person?

[Drizzt ORierdan]

The difference is that you "can" convert to another religion, and most religions admit conversions...
But Hawke can`t become Dalish or produce elven children...

Modifié par Drizzt ORierdan, 15 janvier 2011 - 03:44 .

[C-Gamer90]

We know absolutely nothing about Merrill's personality aside from the little to no information that can be taken from origins. Why are people making assumptions about what she would do in Hypothetical Situation A and in Hypothetical situation B when we can't know?

[Drizzt ORierdan]

Nobody is makin assumptions...  We're just speculating, like everybody in the forum.

Modifié par Drizzt ORierdan, 15 janvier 2011 - 03:25 .

[Darth_Trethon]

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

The difference is that you "can" convert to another religion, and most religions admit conversions...
But Hawke can`t become Dalish or prduce elven children...

Yeah genes and DNA are a bummer. I wish I could convert to having green eyes and black hair and wings and.......cake......oh nevermind I already have cake. But wait.....if I could convert from not having cake to having cake that must mean I can convert to being an elf.....and have elf children with Merrill!!! :O

Or maybe not......:crying:

[bsbcaer]

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

The difference is that you "can" convert to another religion, and most religions admit conversions...
But Hawke can`t become Dalish or prduce elven children...

I guess for me, your analogy tends to be the easier choice than the religion analogy.  I would think it would be easier to choose between two people than to choose between one's religion and one's love...

taking the hypothetical we're talking about, to me it's like choosing between how you were raised, your culture, everything you've grown up believing and the person that you love...I guess that's why the religion analogy works a little better for me in this situation...

[DragonOfWhiteThunder]

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

The difference is that you "can" convert to another religion, and most religions admit conversions...
But Hawke can`t become Dalish or prduce elven children...

Here's a specific example that I think illustrates bsb's analogy pretty well: tzar Nicholas II of Russia, and his wife Alexandra. Alexandra was a devout Lutherian, but Nicholas, as the heir apparent, not only had to follow Eastern Orthodoxy, he had to be ordained as a priest thereof. In that case, Nicholas did not have the choice to change religion for Alexandra, and Alexandra had to convert if she was to marry Nicholas. She eventually did convert, but it was a very agonizing decision for her. Not a perfect analogy, but close enough to draw parallels between.

[Drizzt ORierdan]

DragonOfWhiteThunder wrote...

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

The difference is that you "can" convert to another religion, and most religions admit conversions...
But Hawke can`t become Dalish or prduce elven children...

Here's a specific example that I think illustrates bsb's analogy pretty well: tzar Nicholas II of Russia, and his wife Alexandra. Alexandra was a devout Lutherian, but Nicholas, as the heir apparent, not only had to follow Eastern Orthodoxy, he had to be ordained as a priest thereof. In that case, Nicholas did not have the choice to change religion for Alexandra, and Alexandra had to convert if she was to marry Nicholas. She eventually did convert, but it was a very agonizing decision for her. Not a perfect analogy, but close enough to draw parallels between.

Im sure she was devastated... :whistle:But that didnt prevent her from "doing the dirty" with Rasputin...  lol

Modifié par Drizzt ORierdan, 15 janvier 2011 - 03:55 .

[Dave of Canada]

filaminstrel wrote...

Let's say it were a Dalish elf male LI, for argument's sake. You'd say the woman is selfish too?

Yes. If it's what he wants but the woman doesn't want to do it because they believe "true love" is invalid because of it, then I'd also call them selfish.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 15 janvier 2011 - 03:56 .

[mellifera]

Darth_Trethon wrote...

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

The difference is that you "can" convert to another religion, and most religions admit conversions...
But Hawke can`t become Dalish or prduce elven children...

Yeah genes and DNA are a bummer. I wish I could convert to having green eyes and black hair and wings and.......cake......oh nevermind I already have cake. But wait.....if I could convert from not having cake to having cake that must mean I can convert to being an elf.....and have elf children with Merrill!!! :O

Or maybe not......:crying:

The juxtaposition of the images in your signature are kind of disturbing 

[Maria Caliban]

filaminstrel wrote...

Let's say it were a Dalish elf male LI, for argument's sake. You'd say the woman is selfish too?

Yes. The entire concept of someone you sleep with only being allowed to sleep with you is selfish. That people slap the word 'love' on it is an insult to love.

[Drizzt ORierdan]

Maria Caliban wrote...

filaminstrel wrote...

Let's say it were a Dalish elf male LI, for argument's sake. You'd say the woman is selfish too?

Yes. The entire concept of someone you sleep with only being allowed to sleep with you is selfish. That people slap the word 'love' on it is an insult to love.

I agree.

[Dave of Canada]

Maria Caliban wrote...

filaminstrel wrote...

Let's say it were a Dalish elf male LI, for argument's sake. You'd say the woman is selfish too?

Yes. The entire concept of someone you sleep with only being allowed to sleep with you is selfish. That people slap the word 'love' on it is an insult to love.

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not, the forums have corrupted me.

[In Exile]

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

The difference is that you "can" convert to another religion, and most religions admit conversions...
But Hawke can`t become Dalish or produce elven children...

Not all religions actually believe this, including some of the world's largest.

[Sabariel]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

If she was willing to hook up with a human in the first place (knowing that she could only produce human babies with him) why would she care that much about having elven babies? Seems a little silly to me.

Because she still cares about her people?

But, like I said, why hook up with a human in the first place then? If she cared that much about her people she would find an elf to procreate with instead.

[Onyx Jaguar]

You elves are all racist!

[Eclipse_9990]

Maria Caliban wrote...

filaminstrel wrote...

Let's say it were a Dalish elf male LI, for argument's sake. You'd say the woman is selfish too?

Yes. The entire concept of someone you sleep with only being allowed to sleep with you is selfish. That people slap the word 'love' on it is an insult to love.

But if you love someone why would you hurt them by sleeping with someone else? 
I know some people think differently but for most people if their lover cheats on them it hurts.. ALOT.

[Drizzt ORierdan]

Monogamous relationshps are not the only possibility to experience love...

Love is a far too complex feeling for describing it as "being with someone" or not. Life is not that simple. At all... 

A game example: Even if Morrigan "loved" her Warden, she needed to part from him, we dont know for sure yet why... Did that mean she didnt "really" love him? Im convinced that she did, but as in her case, many times we're not free to do the things we would want with people we love...

Modifié par Drizzt ORierdan, 15 janvier 2011 - 04:27 .

[Maria Caliban]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Yes. The entire concept of someone you sleep with only being allowed to sleep with you is selfish. That people slap the word 'love' on it is an insult to love.

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not, the forums have corrupted me.

I'm dead serious.

Everyone is selfish to some degree. Healthy couples don't give up all selfish bits of themselves. However, deciding your significant other can't sleep with others is possessiveness, not love. Calling it love is just ignoring that this is something your partner chooses to do for you instead of some natural right.