Whacka wrote...
Wait, with Bethany?
Then I misread that part.Maria Caliban wrote...
Whacka wrote...
Wait, with Bethany?
Bethany: So you've... been with women. In bed?
Isabela: I know. Shocking, isn't it?
Isabela: You see, sweetness, men are only good for one thing. Women are good for six.
Bethany: Six? Which six?
Hawke: Isabela!
Isabela: (Laughs)
Merrill isn't part of that conversation.
Ok, its been bothering me...Maria Caliban wrote...
Modifié par Somebody, 23 mars 2011 - 06:22 .
Buy it from the 'hidden' merchant in the Wounded Coast (where the Tal'Vashoth were). It costs around 100 sovereigns though.Somebody wrote...
Where do you get that blue ice looking staff?
Maria Caliban wrote...
Whacka wrote...
Wait, with Bethany?
Bethany: So you've... been with women. In bed?
Isabela: I know. Shocking, isn't it?
Isabela: You see, sweetness, men are only good for one thing. Women are good for six.
Bethany: Six? Which six?
Hawke: Isabela!
Isabela: (Laughs)
Merrill isn't part of that conversation.
It's from the game. From the quest where the elf woman has stolen what she believes is the blackpowder recipe from the Qunari, but it's actually poisonous gas. Hake goes to Lowtown and a guard is in front of an alleyway saying no one can enter.Somebody wrote...
Ok, its been bothering me...Maria Caliban wrote...
Where is that quote from your signature from? I imagine that its not from the game, but Im curious.
Lizardviking wrote...
TMA LIVE wrote...
"There are no good spirits. I've always known that. I sorry you didn't".
Or Anders describing what it's like being possessed to the point of scaring her, and he says "Good. You should be. This could be you!"
And if you romanced her after your mother died, you can tell her "This is what Bloodmagic does." And she'll says "Bloodmagic isn't to blame. He could have easily used a knife instead."
And for someone that studied the dark art, she's the most pure-hearted in the party.
Which says more about Ander's character? I think it is him who shows the "there are no good spirits", with the the whole justice/vengance thing.
To avoid going in circles. What I'm trying say is this. That being a (blood)mage was not the part of Merrill's character that was in focus, it was just tools for her. Her character was more about "How far can/should you go to help your people?". Compared to the mages vs templar question which was more about "Suppresion of the minority for the sake of security to the majority".
Modifié par TMA LIVE, 23 mars 2011 - 06:44 .
Im guessing thats a sarcastic Hawke response?Maria Caliban wrote...
It's from the game. From the quest where the elf woman has stolen what she believes is the blackpowder recipe from the Qunari, but it's actually poisonous gas. Hake goes to Lowtown and a guard is in front of an alleyway saying no one can enter.Somebody wrote...
Ok, its been bothering me...Maria Caliban wrote...
Where is that quote from your signature from? I imagine that its not from the game, but Im curious.
Hawke: How about we skip this one, send your man instead?
Aveline: How about I shove a canary up your coal mine? Let's go.
That's not the same as being part of the plot.TMA LIVE wrote...
She adds context.
Somebody wrote...
Im guessing thats a sarcastic Hawke response?Maria Caliban wrote...
It's from the game. From the quest where the elf woman has stolen what she believes is the blackpowder recipe from the Qunari, but it's actually poisonous gas. Hake goes to Lowtown and a guard is in front of an alleyway saying no one can enter.Somebody wrote...
Ok, its been bothering me...Maria Caliban wrote...
Where is that quote from your signature from? I imagine that its not from the game, but Im curious.
Hawke: How about we skip this one, send your man instead?
Aveline: How about I shove a canary up your coal mine? Let's go.
I have to try that out for myself now.
Chouan wrote...
Imported a save from DA:O where my warden and Leliana had a threesome with Isabela and brought her and Merrill to meet Leliana (Sebastians quest in act3):
Isabela: "Sister Nightingale" indeed, I remember it didn't take much to make you sing.
Merrill: I like singing. Were you in a choir together?
Isabela: Not exactly kitten...
That's great.
well to have a say on the matter i think with Merrill's point of view about blood magic is like a thing with sharp knife -it's dangerous if you don't know how to use it and when to stop -otherwise it's just a toolTMA LIVE wrote...
Lizardviking wrote...
TMA LIVE wrote...
"There are no good spirits. I've always known that. I sorry you didn't".
Or Anders describing what it's like being possessed to the point of scaring her, and he says "Good. You should be. This could be you!"
And if you romanced her after your mother died, you can tell her "This is what Bloodmagic does." And she'll says "Bloodmagic isn't to blame. He could have easily used a knife instead."
And for someone that studied the dark art, she's the most pure-hearted in the party.
Which says more about Ander's character? I think it is him who shows the "there are no good spirits", with the the whole justice/vengance thing.
To avoid going in circles. What I'm trying say is this. That being a (blood)mage was not the part of Merrill's character that was in focus, it was just tools for her. Her character was more about "How far can/should you go to help your people?". Compared to the mages vs templar question which was more about "Suppresion of the minority for the sake of security to the majority".
Compare every bloodmage being complete crazy psychos in DA2. Now look at Merrill, who did it not for power, but to help her people. She adds context. She even adds more context to Anders. She could even add context for why you didnt side with the Templars. And Anders even adds context to her, since she's playing with fire. And if you side with the Templars, it depends on your level and what you say if she's with you or not.
Face it, she gives a point of view as much as Fenris. Fenris thinks Mages and Bloodmages are bad, and he has a point. but not enough for some to agree. Merrill disagrees that demons should be viewed as the Chantry views them, and isn't against using forbidden magic if it's to help her people. She also adds some points, though you might not agree either. She adds to the debate on what's good and what isn't. Which is "Should mages not be given freedom?"
Chouan wrote...
Imported a save from DA:O where my warden and Leliana had a threesome with Isabela and brought her and Merrill to meet Leliana (Sebastians quest in act3):
Isabela: "Sister Nightingale" indeed, I remember it didn't take much to make you sing.
Merrill: I like singing. Were you in a choir together?
Isabela: Not exactly kitten...
Maria Caliban wrote...
That's not the same as being part of the plot.TMA LIVE wrote...
She adds context.
Isabela? Stole the relic and is the reason the qunari are trapped in the city.
Varric? Lets you join the Deep Roads expedition which uncovers the relic and gets Hawke enough money to reclaim the family estate.
Anders? Blows up the Chantry, which leads to Meredith calling for the Rite of Annulment.
Merrill? Adds context.
No one is saying that Merrill adds nothing to the story, only that her place in it is minor and she herself is not engaged with what's happening compared to other characters.
Her biggest contribution would be helping to restore Flemeth. That might be a major action in the DA series (though I think the Keeper could have done it just as easily) but it doesn't have anything to do with the story of Dragon Age II.
Modifié par TMA LIVE, 23 mars 2011 - 07:03 .
I think thats what she is trying to say...TMA LIVE wrote...
Maria Caliban wrote...
That's not the same as being part of the plot.TMA LIVE wrote...
She adds context.
Isabela? Stole the relic and is the reason the qunari are trapped in the city.
Varric? Lets you join the Deep Roads expedition which uncovers the relic and gets Hawke enough money to reclaim the family estate.
Anders? Blows up the Chantry, which leads to Meredith calling for the Rite of Annulment.
Merrill? Adds context.
No one is saying that Merrill adds nothing to the story, only that her place in it is minor and she herself is not engaged with what's happening compared to other characters.
Her biggest contribution would be helping to restore Flemeth. That might be a major action in the DA series (though I think the Keeper could have done it just as easily) but it doesn't have anything to do with the story of Dragon Age II.
So what? Fenris doesn't add much to the story. You can even skip him. Same with Isebala and Seb. Should every person in the party blow up a church in order to matter? Do they have to be super involved?
Look at the Mass Effect series or Kotor. Most of those characters don't matter at all to the plot, yet they're great characters. And in DA:O, only 2 people really mattered to the story. Everyone else could be booted out.
Character don't need to matter to the plot, as long as they matter to you.
The discussion was about how Merrill wasn't tied into the story as much as other characters. You argued she was because she provided context. I gave examples as to how other character provided far more than context.TMA LIVE wrote...
So what?
Yeah, I already said that.Fenris doesn't add much to the story.
If you think Isabela didn't add anything to the story, you've apparently missed all of Act 2. She's the reason the qunari are in Kirkwall.Same with Isebala and Seb.
Yes, it's good for the main characters in a story to be involved in the events. Something beyond "I was there but didn't do much and had no personal stake."Do they have to be super involved?
This is why the handling of characters in DA II is generally better than that of Knights of the Old Republic, Mass Effect, and Dragon Age: Origins.Look at the Mass Effect series or Kotor. Most of those characters don't matter at all to the plot, yet they're great characters. And in DA:O, only 2 people really mattered to the story. Everyone else could be booted out.
Maria Caliban wrote...
If you think Isabela didn't add anything to the story, you've apparently missed all of Act 2. She's the reason the qunari are in Kirkwall.TMA LIVE wrote...
Same with Isebala and Seb.Yes, it's good for the main characters in a story to be involved in the events. Something beyond "I was there but didn't do much and had no personal stake."Do they have to be super involved?
This is why the handling of characters in DA II is generally better than that of Knights of the Old Republic, Mass Effect, and Dragon Age: Origins.Look at the Mass Effect series or Kotor. Most of those characters don't matter at all to the plot, yet they're great characters. And in DA:O, only 2 people really mattered to the story. Everyone else could be booted out.
"We could get rid of all these characters and it wouldn't matter" isn't exactly a ringing endorsement.
Modifié par TMA LIVE, 23 mars 2011 - 07:49 .
ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
@everything Maria said:
I agree in principle, but I found that Merrill's own stories were just as important to me as the Qunari or the mages, because I liked the character so much.
Yes, it would have been better if she had more of a stake in the plot, but for me personally, it didn't make much a difference, unlike, say, Oghren, who just bored me.
well for me Merrill's quests were even more important than the whole main plotishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
@everything Maria said:
I agree in principle, but I found that Merrill's own stories were just as important to me as the Qunari or the mages, because I liked the character so much.
Yes, it would have been better if she had more of a stake in the plot, but for me personally, it didn't make much a difference, unlike, say, Oghren, who just bored me.
:wub:Modifié par Marcin R, 23 mars 2011 - 07:52 .
Marcin R wrote...
well for me Merrill's quests were even more important than the whole main plotishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
@everything Maria said:
I agree in principle, but I found that Merrill's own stories were just as important to me as the Qunari or the mages, because I liked the character so much.
Yes, it would have been better if she had more of a stake in the plot, but for me personally, it didn't make much a difference, unlike, say, Oghren, who just bored me.
this would sum it up nicely: let the word fall and burn as long as Merrill is with me safe, loving and happy everything is kay"
and by this statement i finish my today's presence on this forum
ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Marcin R wrote...
well for me Merrill's quests were even more important than the whole main plotishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
@everything Maria said:
I agree in principle, but I found that Merrill's own stories were just as important to me as the Qunari or the mages, because I liked the character so much.
Yes, it would have been better if she had more of a stake in the plot, but for me personally, it didn't make much a difference, unlike, say, Oghren, who just bored me.
this would sum it up nicely: let the word fall and burn as long as Merrill is with me safe, loving and happy everything is kay"
and by this statement i finish my today's presence on this forum
Haha, yeah. My character was pretty much the same. My current playthrough, I'm going to try to get Anders, but I don't know if I'll be able to resist Merrill.
Also, so I'm not misunderstood, I'm not saying that Merrill's lack of plot-relevance isn't an issue. Only that it's an issue that didn't bother me. Not everyone will have felt as involved as I did.
Yeah, I want to do a Anders romance run, but its hard....MasterSamson88 wrote...
ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Marcin R wrote...
well for me Merrill's quests were even more important than the whole main plotishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
@everything Maria said:
I agree in principle, but I found that Merrill's own stories were just as important to me as the Qunari or the mages, because I liked the character so much.
Yes, it would have been better if she had more of a stake in the plot, but for me personally, it didn't make much a difference, unlike, say, Oghren, who just bored me.
this would sum it up nicely: let the word fall and burn as long as Merrill is with me safe, loving and happy everything is kay"
and by this statement i finish my today's presence on this forum
Haha, yeah. My character was pretty much the same. My current playthrough, I'm going to try to get Anders, but I don't know if I'll be able to resist Merrill.
Also, so I'm not misunderstood, I'm not saying that Merrill's lack of plot-relevance isn't an issue. Only that it's an issue that didn't bother me. Not everyone will have felt as involved as I did.
Right, I can say that while Anders was definetly more involved in the plot per say, with the Templars Vs Mages, he just didn't grab me as much as Merrill did. And this is almost entirely just subjective. I loved Merrill.
Retour en haut
