17177 réponses à ce sujet

[DoNotIngest]

Marcin R wrote...well my Hawke would use some firewave [old-school i know ]to separathe himself and Merrill from enemies and then he would have a looong talk with Merril [unthreatened due to the firewall he's made] about how he loves Merrill and wants her to stay pure and if she does love Hawke that much also then she would agree to abandon bloody practices and after the battle Merrill and Hawke wold have another "chat" in Hawke's bedroom to make up for Merrill not using blood magic-how  about that?

Err... What?

[LobselVith8]

tmp7704 wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

If the demons could offer Hawke's companions their hearts' desire when rescuing Feynriel, why assume that Audacity wouldn't know that Marethari would sacrifice her life for Merrill? Audacity knew enough to make the claim about knowing about Arlathan and providing them mental images of the ancient civilization in the first place.

The demon could know that the Keeper would sacrifice herself to protect Merrill. But if it knew that, why not trick the Keeper way sooner, preferably as soon as Merrill started dealing with it? Instead, it tells Merrill how to fix the mirror and then just sits there on the off-chance that mere 5+ years later Merrill shows up again, and the clan of nomadic elves and their Keeper will be still around to save the person who abandoned them long time ago?

If Audacity had insight into Marethari's personality, why not? Waiting for Marethari is no different than if it were waiting for Merrill, after all. Since we only have the word of an abomination that the Eluvian would have been used as a gateway into the real world, we don't have any proof to state the truth either way. All you and I are doing is speculating on an issue that neither of us can prove.

tmp7704 wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Simply because she takes precautions doesn't tell us any more about what realistic changes she had when she dealt with Audacity

People don't take precautions if they don't think precautions are needed. When you check for incoming cars before you cross the street it's because there can be incoming cars. If there was no real risk of incoming car, no one would bother.

Merrill wasn't sure she could handle the demon herself. She actually spends quite a bit of time early in Act 3 moping around and talking as if she was about to die, in the "banter" with others. This isn't something people do when they think there is no good reason to worry. Or at least, it's not what Merrill does

random miner: Don't go ahead, there's huge dragon there!
Merrill: Oh, are we gonna go ahead? I've never seen a huge dragon before!

that's typical Merrill. She's an elf that goes alone through Lowtown late at night without second thought "because nothing ever happens when i do". If she starts taking precautions, then things are pretty grave.

People take precautions to plan for the worst. It was intelligent of Merrill to plan for the worst outcome, but again - we have no idea of how Merrill planned to handle Audacity. And given how different Merrill's dialogue is if she's rivalmanced, where she has a completely different attitude towards Hawke, I don't see why one line of dialogue should be used to sum how how she would handle a Pride Demon. 

tmp7704 wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Given her training with the Keeper and that she can handle herself going up Sundermount, she seems perfectly capable of handling herself.

And yet when she herself has doubts if she can handle the demon on her own, you're second-guessing her?

I'm acknowledging that we can't second-guess her chances of handling Audacity with no knowledge of how she would have handled it.

tmp7704 wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Regardless of whether Hawke takes her along or not, he gets involved in dangerous situations, and it sounds a little far-fetched for him to tell Merrill how issues about Dalish technology should be handled if she's studied the lore for years and he's completely unfamiliar with it.

Hawke is unfamiliar with Dalish technology but that's not what he/she lectures Merrill about. He/she is telling her whether it's smart to try making deals with demons. And the demons are something you insist Hawke has lots of experience with.

I insist Hawke has a lot of experience with killing, not with two thousand year old Dalish technology.

tmp7704 wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Hawke handles a demon in Feynriel's dream realm of comparable stature.

In the Fade, yes. We don't know if handling these demons outside of Fade is any different. Also, there's an extra problem here -- these demons were "just" demons. Outside of the Fade it could highly likely be Merrill possessed by said demon and turned into abomination... a much more powerful enemy especially when you're making point how powerful Merrill supposedly is just on her own.

I addressed that she is capable of using her magical abilities because she was trained in using them.

[Zjarcal]

TMA LIVE wrote...
I doubt she'd want to make a slave out of someone, drag him everywhere, just to sacrifce him at the right moment. Especially a murderer. Besides, I doubt she'd support such a thing. I mean, she wants Anders to live in order to redeem himself. And he blew up a church, and almost killed someone once (or could/did?).

I didn't said we'd be dragging him everywhere like a slave. What Maria said was about a single ritual that required someone to be sacrificed. In this case he'd be taken straight to wherever the ritual would take place.

And I'm not saying she'd do it for sure, but it's something she'd probably consider, especially if the benefits are worth it.

Modifié par Zjarcal, 28 mars 2011 - 08:24 .

[DoNotIngest]

Anybody else wonder where Merrill got her scarf? She'd never been to a city before, and nobody else has one. Considering nobody liked her, I can't see them giving it to her. Wonder if Duncan left it behind after leaving with the Warden as a bit of consolation?

[Hero-Toxiko]

i love that girl and if i could have a girlfriend like her,
life would be more epic.

[DoNotIngest]

Hero-Toxiko wrote...

i love that girl and if i could have a girlfriend like her,
life would be more epic.

x1337

Why does every girl around here have to sleep half the country and her dog?

[mesmerizedish]

Last night, I dreamt that I was competing for Merrill's affections.




With Gumby.




WHAT DOES IT MEAN?!

[DoNotIngest]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Last night, I dreamt that I was competing for Merrill's affections.




With Gumby.




WHAT DOES IT MEAN?!

It means even Gumby can't resist Merrill.


(Dead serious) Last night, I dreamed I went to meet Merrill on some highlands, and we had just started to talk when we were interrupted by some two and a half foot tall cave men with gigantic beards. Then I woke up.

What does THAT mean?

[Zjarcal]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Last night, I dreamt that I was competing for Merrill's affections.




With Gumby.




WHAT DOES IT MEAN?!

That wasn't Gumby, that was the Pride Demon fooling you... and Merrill.

[tmp7704]

LobselVith8 wrote...

If Audacity had insight into Marethari's personality, why not? Waiting for Marethari is no different than if it were waiting for Merrill, after all.

Again, why wait at all?
 

Since we only have the word of an abomination that the Eluvian would have been used as a gateway into the real world, we don't have any proof to state the truth either way.

Considering at the point it happens the abomination who states it is already free, there's no practical reason for it to lie about it. It's very much a "villain gloats and explains his/her plan" routine, fitting for a pride demon. If that was a trick it'd make quite more sense for the demon of such nature to reveal that -- "see, i've used you and your pigheaded stupidity to trick your dumb Keeper into letting me free, how do you like them apples?"

People take precautions to plan for the worst. It was intelligent of Merrill to plan for the worst outcome, but again - we have no idea of how Merrill planned to handle Audacity.

We have no idea how Merrill planned to handle it, but just the same we do have solid idea she was highly doubtful her planned way to handle it would be successful. That's the thing with Merrill -- she normally doesn't plan for the worst and doesn't take precautions. So when she actually does there must be very good reason for it. 

I'm acknowledging that we can't second-guess her chances of handling Audacity with no knowledge of how she would have handled it.

Not second-guessing her chances would mean accepting her evaluation that things are likely to go wrong and she wouldn't be able to handle the demon.

I insist Hawke has a lot of experience with killing, not with two thousand year old Dalish technology.

And since Hawke isn't giving anyone advice on Dalish technology but on demons, i'm not sure what is the point of this insistence.

I addressed that she is capable of using her magical abilities because she was trained in using them.

Obviously; as such, abomination-turned Merrill would be more dangerous enemy than "just" demon, since it'd combine abilites of the demon with abilities of Merrill.

[Malevolence65]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Anders... can you come here for a second? Merrill needs your help with something!

this



I hate Anders.

[_Somebody]

Zjarcal wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Last night, I dreamt that I was competing for Merrill's affections.




With Gumby.




WHAT DOES IT MEAN?!

That wasn't Gumby, that was the Pride Demon fooling you... and Merrill.

More like desire.

[DoNotIngest]

Zjarcal wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

Last night, I dreamt that I was competing for Merrill's affections.




With Gumby.




WHAT DOES IT MEAN?!

That wasn't Gumby, that was the Pride Demon fooling you... and Merrill.

Lame. ...Unless the Pride Demon was also competing for Merrill's affections. I say that's why he wanted to help her with the mirror!

Modifié par DoNotIngest, 28 mars 2011 - 08:46 .

[_Somebody]

Malevolence65 wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Anders... can you come here for a second? Merrill needs your help with something!

this



I hate Anders.

Am I the only one here that actually likes him?

[DoNotIngest]

Somebody wrote...

Malevolence65 wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Anders... can you come here for a second? Merrill needs your help with something!

this



I hate Anders.

Am I the only one here that actually likes him?

I have to admit, I'd rather it be Anders than the mass murderer...

[Zjarcal]

Somebody wrote...

Malevolence65 wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Anders... can you come here for a second? Merrill needs your help with something!

this



I hate Anders.

Am I the only one here that actually likes him?

I like him. 

[Paraxial]

Hero-Toxiko wrote...
i love that girl and if i could have a girlfriend like her,

Yeah having a girlfriend that was a member of a mythological race and could wield magic would be different.

Be right back real quick, bout to go get me some Minotaur booty.

[_Somebody]

Zjarcal wrote...

Somebody wrote...

Malevolence65 wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Anders... can you come here for a second? Merrill needs your help with something!

this



I hate Anders.

Am I the only one here that actually likes him?

I like him. 

Woot, Somebody approves. 

And I also approve of your avatar. There are like 20 different pics in it.

[Bann Duncan]

Somebody wrote...

Malevolence65 wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Anders... can you come here for a second? Merrill needs your help with something!

this



I hate Anders.

Am I the only one here that actually likes him?

I do, and this makes me sadface.

[Zjarcal]

Somebody wrote...
Woot, Somebody approves. 

And I also approve of your avatar. There are like 20 different pics in it.

25 to be precise... 

I just can't choose a single avatar pic... 

Modifié par Zjarcal, 28 mars 2011 - 08:56 .

[LobselVith8]

tmp7704 wrote...

Again, why wait at all?

And how is waiting for Merrill different than waiting for Marethari to make a deal, exactly?

tmp7704 wrote...
 
Considering at the point it happens the abomination who states it is already free, there's no practical reason for it to lie about it. It's very much a "villain gloats and explains his/her plan" routine, fitting for a pride demon. If that was a trick it'd make quite more sense for the demon of such nature to reveal that -- "see, i've used you and your pigheaded stupidity to trick your dumb Keeper into letting me free, how do you like them apples?"

Or tricking the Keeper Marethari was the plan all along, so the only person demonstrating stupidity was the Keeper.

tmp7704 wrote...


We have no idea how Merrill planned to handle it, but just the same we do have solid idea she was highly doubtful her planned way to handle it would be successful. That's the thing with Merrill -- she normally doesn't plan for the worst and doesn't take precautions. So when she actually does there must be very good reason for it. 

That's a great deal of speculation you're putting forth about Merrill. Again, we have no actual idea what she planned, only that she planned for the worst by bringing Hawke.

tmp7704 wrote...

Not second-guessing her chances would mean accepting her evaluation that things are likely to go wrong and she wouldn't be able to handle the demon.

She planned for the worst.

tmp7704 wrote...

And since Hawke isn't giving anyone advice on Dalish technology but on demons, i'm not sure what is the point of this insistence.

And how is Hawke more experienced with demonology than Merrill?

tmp7704 wrote...

Obviously; as such, abomination-turned Merrill would be more dangerous enemy than "just" demon, since it'd combine abilites of the demon with abilities of Merrill.

Since the Keeper became an abomination and Hawke could kill her, I'm not certain why you think Merrill should have assumed Hawke wouldn't be capable of handling another abomination when he's fought plenty over the years.

[ydaraishy]

Bible Doctor wrote...

Hero-Toxiko wrote...
i love that girl and if i could have a girlfriend like her,

Yeah having a girlfriend that was a member of a mythological race and could wield magic would be different.

Be right back real quick, bout to go get me some Minotaur booty.

See if you can borrow Merrill's ball of twine.

*rimshot*

[Sunnie]

jlb524 wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Basically, it kind of feels wrong to outright kill this indivdual when they've had time to possibly reflect on their actions.

True, but if we're talking about somoene like say the Magistrate's son, who actually begs to be killed, she might think it's better to make his death worth it.

Okay, but I still think it would be difficult for her to do.  In the heat of battle when goons are attacking you, it's not too difficult to kill them as you are mainly defending yourself.   A different mindset is there.

I think it would be more difficult for her to kill a person that's tied up and is no immediate physical threat to her, even if they deserve it.  I'm not saying she wouldn't do it, but it would be different.

Don't forget that Merrill doesn't want to hurt anyone, and would rather die herself than see someone else die because of what she is doing or trying yo do. She would most definitly NOT kill another to power some blood magic ritual some demon would require, she would instead sacrifice herself.

[Sunnie]

Somebody wrote...

Malevolence65 wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...
Anders... can you come here for a second? Merrill needs your help with something!

this



I hate Anders.

Am I the only one here that actually likes him?

Anders from Awakening was ok... that thing in DA2 is not Anders. Andice is a mass murderer, no different than Merideth when it comes down to it. They both killed a lot of people for selfish and petty reasons.

[jlb524]

Sunnie22 wrote...

Don't forget that Merrill doesn't want to hurt anyone, and would rather die herself than see someone else die because of what she is doing or trying yo do. She would most definitly NOT kill another to power some blood magic ritual some demon would require, she would instead sacrifice herself.

True.  I can't argue with that.

Modifié par jlb524, 28 mars 2011 - 09:19 .