17177 réponses à ce sujet

[DrFumb1ezX]

thats1evildude wrote...

soccerchick wrote...

I'm insulted that you would dare compare us to Talimancers.
We're way better at english than they are. Not to mention nicer. Except for ismaeltheforsaken.

My intent was not to offend, but amuse. My apologies.

I romanced Merrill in DA2, so I'm not about to start making accusations towards my friend The Kettle.

I... too, was trying to be humorous. Sarcasm on the internet is hard.

[Tigerking]

soccerchick wrote...

Tigerking wrote...

Also, the Fade quest is very silly to me on multiple levels. In-character, the fact the whole thing was taking place in the mind of a Somniari created rather unique conditions, as it seems EVERYONE (except Justice and Hawke) had their willpower scores set to zero there. Even in DAO, the only reason people fell for demonic deception is because to them, it was seriously like being in a dream, with a corresponding lack of rational thought.
OOC, it was simply a) a hamhanded attempt to show how awesomely uncorruptible Hawke is, and a reminder that your companions have their own desires and agendas, and may place them over Hawke in the future, foreshadowing the ending a bit.

Hawke can be corrupted. Take the demon's offer. But Anders TOTALLY cheated. Unfair, dude.

That's true that Hawke can work with the demon, but it isn't quite the same thing. Hawke isn't COMPELLED to work with Torpor, Hawke chooses to of their own free will (OR DO THEY?!). Whereas all the other companions are seemingly compelled to follow the demon after a (fairly shoddy) argument. It shows that apparently Hawke is the only one who can decide for themselves.

[Todd23]

Anders is already possessed, but he can betray you if you side with Torpor, or at least say your gonna' side with him.

[Tigerking]

Todd23 wrote...

Anders is already possessed, but he can betray you if you side with Torpor, or at least say your gonna' side with him.

Like I said, everyone except Janders and Hawke is compelled to work with the demons. Janders has his own crap going on, which can involve betraying you.

[Sepewrath]

Well Hawke had PC armor obviously, being able to make deals with the demon is corruption though, because that's what demons do. There just wont be any repercussions for it, at least not for the PC. And the same excuse that applies to everyone in DAO applies to the DA2 crew, just because they went into the Fade willingly, doesn't mean it wont have any effect on them.

That is the point of the Harrowing, they don't just say "Surprise!" and push the mage into the Fade, they go in willing and still some fall prey to demons. I doubt the place has any less of an effect on someone, just because you go in willingly, especially for non mages. Remember you didn't exactly go in willing in Origins either, so in essence they should be less susceptible to it.

Modifié par Sepewrath, 03 septembre 2011 - 12:56 .

[goofyomnivore]

Having Tali and Merrill in the same sentence/picture has always annoyed me. They're really nothing alike. Merrill's virtually a copy of ME1 Liara.

Agreed. I wouldn't say a copy, but very similar.

Like I said, everyone except Janders and Hawke is compelled to work with the demons. Janders has his own crap going on, which can involve betraying you.

Meh the fade sucked all around in DA:2. I didn't find it too farfetched on how the companions reacted. The three strongest types of demons were involved. It would be weird for them to resist since they have no training or prior encounters. The two most prepared companions(Anders and Merrill) both have unique circumstances.

Modifié par strive, 03 septembre 2011 - 09:07 .

[jlb524]

Northern Sun wrote...

Having Tali and Merrill in the same sentence/picture has always annoyed me. They're really nothing alike. Merrill's virtually a copy of ME1 Liara.

I tend to agree...though not an exact copy.

*I could go into all the similarities though...pretty easily*

[jlb524]

Jestina wrote...

From what I recall from DA:O the mirrors were a communication device, used by a kingdom of elves that no longer exists. Now the remaining ones are used as portals, usually by demons and darkspawn.

Like the one Morrigan used?

That 'kingdom of elves' don't exist but the Dalish are supposed to 'keep them alive' by hunting for their lost lore.  In a way, they still do exist.

Jestina wrote...
The one she's repairing probably leads to a lair of darkspawn or something...which is why Duncun destroyed the thing.

He destroyed it b/c it was tainted...we don't know 'how' it was tainted...and Duncan is hardly an expert on ancient elven artifacts.

Jestina wrote...
The problems I had with Merrills character in DA2 was that they made her overly naive and weak willed. For an elf messing around with blood magic, she sure didn't last long in the fade when it came to resisting temptation from a demon.

All companions fall under the demon's mind control...

To be frank, Merrill resisted Audacity for years as she decided to try to find her own way to restore the mirror instead of taking the obviously easy path and just going to it at the beginning and asking how the mirror could be fixed.

Jestina wrote...
She had so much potential from DA:O too. I was disappointed with what they did to her in DA2.

How did she have potential in DA:O?

[jlb524]

PuppyFlavour wrote...

She struck me as a strict librarian type.

If you accept porn as a viable source of information, that has a LOT of potential.

Not that I'm complaining about the change, mind you.

Why did you see her as a strict librarian?

I saw someone over-eager to study the mirror no matter the risk to her own health, which fits what we see in DA2.

[jlb524]

PuppyFlavour wrote...

jlb524 wrote...


Why did you see her as a strict librarian?

I saw someone over-eager to study the mirror no matter the risk to her own health, which fits what we see in DA2.

No clue. It's just a connection I made that I can't unmake.

Is it b/c she insisted you get permission from Marethari to bring Fenarel along?

[jlb524]

Though, this conversation does remind me of something I've been thinking about since playing through the DA:O Dalish Origin again.

Did Mary Kirby attempt to create 'harmony' between DA:O Merrill's character and DA2 Merrill's character?

I tend to think so, but it seems a good portion of people disagree and treat them as two separate characters and even state that Merrill has been retconned between the two games.

[Jacopo07]

i agree, actually there was no screentime of merrill in origins, that's why some people tend to consider her a whole new character in DA2, with just few connection between the two games...

however, considering what we can see of her in both games, i think that the "two merrill" are quite the same, at least to me.

[Zjarcal]

jlb524 wrote...

Did Mary Kirby attempt to create 'harmony' between DA:O Merrill's character and DA2 Merrill's character?

I tend to think so, but it seems a good portion of people disagree and treat them as two separate characters and even state that Merrill has been retconned between the two games.

I also think so.

Most people who claim she's retconned point out that she behaves much more seriously and that she seems more "mature" in DAO. But let's not forget that Merrill's awkwardness and cluelessness occur only when she's around humans or in the city itself.

Compare Merrill's behavior when first meeting Hawke and at other random points to her behavior when talking to Keeper Marethari or Master Ilen. When talking to them her demeanor becomes a lot more serious and she seems confident in what she talks about. This is no different than how she was in DAO, where we only see her amongst her clan, thus she never has to feel awkward there.

It makes sense for Merrill to feel totally awkward when dealing with complete strangers and later when starting life in a whole new world for her (which is what the city must have felt for her). To claim that this is a retcon is just failing to acknowledge that people react differently in different situations, and that what we saw in the dalish origin in DAO was simply too little to judge her character.

[ipgd]

I just question why anyone seriously cares about the consistent characterization of a throw-away Origins NPC who had, like, five lines and was basically of no consequence to the game whatsoever.

[DrFumb1ezX]

ipgd wrote...

I just question why anyone seriously cares about the consistent characterization of a throw-away Origins NPC who had, like, five lines and was basically of no consequence to the game whatsoever.

Because they slew the Archdemon! DIDN'T YOU PLAY ORIGINS?!

[Zjarcal]

ipgd wrote...

I just question why anyone seriously cares about the consistent characterization of a throw-away Origins NPC who had, like, five lines and was basically of no consequence to the game whatsoever.

And of course, this.

[bleetman]

I found it helps to read her Origins lines in Eve Myles's voice.

[leggywillow]

ipgd wrote...

I just question why anyone seriously cares about the consistent characterization of a throw-away Origins NPC who had, like, five lines and was basically of no consequence to the game whatsoever.

This.  And this may just be me being weird, but I also tend to look at any character inconsistencies as the result of my character's POV: the Dalish elf who'd been around Merrill her entire life vs. a human who just met her.  All I remember about Origins Merrill is the general impression my Dalish got: a weird know-it-all who they didn't want tagging along with them.  And DA2 Merrill confirms that's how most of her clan saw her.  

[jlb524]

bleetman wrote...

I found it helps to read her Origins lines in Eve Myles's voice.

I do this too. 

Zjarcal wrote...
*snippage awesome post*

I agree with all of that!

Modifié par jlb524, 03 septembre 2011 - 10:16 .

[thats1evildude]

What do I remember of Merrill from Origins?

Well, she had black hair. And tattoos. And she was First to Keeper Marethari. She was interested in the Eluvian. And she expressed concern for others.

SO MUCH HAS CHANGED.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 05 septembre 2011 - 08:02 .

[Knight of Dane]

There was no Merrill in DA:O. There was a placeholder while Mary Kirby swung her awesomepen.

[Collider]

Having Tali and Merrill in the same sentence/picture has always annoyed me. They're really nothing alike. Merrill's virtually a copy of ME1 Liara.

Foreign accent? Check.
Awkward romance scene? Check.
Considered very talented in one area? Check.
Race/people are pariahs? Check.
Wants to help her people? Check.
Disagrees with her people's leadership? Check.
Exiled from people? Check.
Wants to help her people despite being exiled? Check.

Merrill is basically a combination of both Tali & Liara.