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[Bogsnot1]

The Panagodes and Reragons have long since gotten over the whole morality caper, and just get the job done, without fuss.

[Winterfly]

DarkSeraphym wrote...

Winterfly wrote...

Interesting. So either the Quarian or the Human will take control of the Geth? Only me seeing a conflict zone here?

There is no telling whether or not Daro'Xen actually has the technology to do it. At most, you get an email from her saying she went through those files and thinks she has discovered a way to claim them as servants again. Cerberus does appear to have the technology for it and if you sold Legion to Cerberus, there is a file in Lair of the Shadow Broker that affirms that Cerberus is going to use Legion for Project Overlord. Of course, there is no telling if it will work. However, so far it appears that David was able to gain control of any Geth he spoke to so I give Cerberus' claims of gaining control more credit than I do to Daro'Xen.

Either way, there is going to be some heated words for that. The Turians will use it as an example of humanity's growing greed for power while the Salarians will probably argue that it at least means the Geth are not going to be a problem anymore (really, it shocks me that the Salarians appear to not care nearly as much as the Turians and the Asari do that humanity is in control in my game). Doubtful it would cause conflict with the Quarians though. For one, it means they no longer have to get rid of the Geth. For another, it means humanity has leverage over the Quarians as a whole (their home planet) . If humanity gains control, both humanity and the Quarians end up winning.

That is a interesting alliance indeed. 

I also presume the Salarians are more peace mongering or that they have a new genocide in the wake for humans if  they try something. 

I would also never underestimate Quarians with a proper facility to experiment in then a ship. 

[Vaenier]

DarkSeraphym wrote...

elfadelbosco wrote...

well, being a full renegade in Me1 and 2 means killing a lot of savable people (Wrex, Racnhi Queen, and many other), it meant falling out with many people who could be friends or fan of yours, like Verner and many others... you kill or disappoint a full army of potential friends, so how can you hope to do as well as a paragon Shep???

I've gotten the vibe that full renegade is sacrificing allies in exchange for a technological advantage.

There is one huge problem with this though. What about the people who dont chose on color, but choose what they feel is best? I saved the Rachni and saved the Collector base. So I now get a bunch of rachni with uber guns and the reapers become a cakewalk?

And the alternative, what if you kill everyone and blow up everything. You get a few alliance ships equiped with outdated pea shooters...

[DarkSeraphym]

elfadelbosco wrote...

DarkSeraphym wrote...

I've gotten the vibe that full renegade is sacrificing allies in exchange for a technological advantage.

So you'll use the Ring to destroy Sauron? Very wise move!  <_<

You're going to have to take a leap of faith in technology regardless of how you look at it. There is simply no way that an army is going to be able to take out every single one of those Reapers that you saw by the end of Mass Effect 2, which is what has sparked the hypothesis that EDI could somehow be a sort of deus ex machina. The way I see it, the only difference between Full Paragon and Full Renegade is that Full Paragon is relying upon a massive army and the Full Renegade is focusing upon amassing a technologically superior (to that of the Full Paragon's) army for efficiency. Either way, at this point in time I don't see how either of them have greater odds than another of beating the Reapers given how the ME universe has played them off.

[DarkSeraphym]

Vaenier wrote...

DarkSeraphym wrote...

elfadelbosco wrote...

well, being a full renegade in Me1 and 2 means killing a lot of savable people (Wrex, Racnhi Queen, and many other), it meant falling out with many people who could be friends or fan of yours, like Verner and many others... you kill or disappoint a full army of potential friends, so how can you hope to do as well as a paragon Shep???

I've gotten the vibe that full renegade is sacrificing allies in exchange for a technological advantage.

There is one huge problem with this though. What about the people who dont chose on color, but choose what they feel is best? I saved the Rachni and saved the Collector base. So I now get a bunch of rachni with uber guns and the reapers become a cakewalk?

And the alternative, what if you kill everyone and blow up everything. You get a few alliance ships equiped with outdated pea shooters...

I can't really say what they might do for people who are kind of somewhere in the middle. I'm merely throwing out guesses as to how they are going to make it so that Paragons aren't the only ones who can win, which I can be honest is out of hope for myself because I would greatly lose interest in this series if the only way to win was to either be all blue or somewhere in the middle. You do bring up a great point and I'm afraid I don't have a counterargument to it. The only one I really have is that they could have it set up where if you are somewhere in the middle, certain decisions are going to take precidence over another. Of course, that is not a good alternative because that means some of your choices would, more or less, simply not matter anymore.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 13 janvier 2011 - 12:50 .

[Merchant2006]

Well considering the fact that my Renegade Shepard killed Wrex, let the council die, pushed for war between the Geth & Quarians, destroyed the Heretics (and most likely just delayed how long it will take them to come back, perhaps having 2 geth factions once again warring out), a weakened Krogan State, hatred of humanity by Aliens, Udina as Councillor and not to mention every single squad member dead except Kasumi/Morinth along with handing the Collector Base to TIM...

Oh yes, Renegades will really do well /sarcasm

However with Humanity being the dominant ones in the Galaxy... who knows... and eventually the other alien races will be under threat by the Reapers. Humanity has a lot of control and power and the fact TIM has the base, who knows, but perhaps there is the danger of going down the 'preset route' the Reapers plan for all races when stumbling across their 'dangerous tech'.

I'm guessing ME3 will have most aliens not giving a fark about Humanity and allowing Earth to be annihilated, but they too will realise the Reapers are on the move and might attack them... who knows. GAAHHHH NEED ME3 NAO >.>

Modifié par Merchant2006, 13 janvier 2011 - 12:51 .

[DarkSeraphym]

Merchant2006 wrote...

Well considering the fact that my Renegade Shepard killed Wrex, let the council die, pushed for war between the Geth & Quarians, destroyed the Heretics (and most likely just delayed how long it will take them to come back, perhaps having 2 geth factions once again warring out), a weakened Krogan State, hatred of humanity by Aliens, Udina as Councillor and not to mention every single squad member dead except Kasumi/Morinth along with handing the Collector Base to TIM...

Oh yes, Renegades will really do well /sarcasm

I did precisely the samethings you did, short of having everyone survive the Suicide Mission and the fact that I opted to sell Legion (as keeping him required me to earn like 25 paragon points or something like that, plus I am interested to see what Cerberus can make out of him). Though, you almost sound like making Udina as Councillor is a bad thing.

[DarkSeraphym]

elfadelbosco wrote...

yes, BUT... do you remember that Reapers' technology is indoctrinating people who deal with it?
Saren was indoctrinated and fought for the Sovereign, all the zombies were once men, and the Colletors were once Protheans... you'll be another Saren and you'll fight for the sake of the Reapers, IMHO +_+

If you were that worried about Reaper technology and indoctrination, you'd be worried about the fact that EDI was created by Cerberus from Reaper technology and the Thanix Cannon, which was also created by the Turians from Reaper technology. Despite the fact that Reaper technology runs the risk of indoctrinating people, it  kind of seems like it has been a pretty necessary evil throughout much of Mass Effect 2. If people hadn't taken risks, Normandy SR-2 would have been a husk by the time Shepard got back (if the Collectors opted not to destroy it) and you would have at least lost 1 team member from not having the Thanix Cannon.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 13 janvier 2011 - 01:00 .

[RVallant]

I thought EDI was from Reaper tech not IS reaper tech?



Oh and one point of paragon/renegade which, may align the outcome is related to Turians. Paragon's get Turians and Humans doing joint-manouveres, Renegades get an arms race. Both will probably lead to the same conclusion.

[Asheer_Khan]

I am sure that in pure renegade world Turian Admirals will recive very familiar for renegades order from Hierarchy in respond at Alliance plea for help to defend Earth "Let the Humanity die"...



And no i assure you that this Turian dreadnought build up (in default/renegade set up) most obiviusly don't have purpose to repel reapers...



And seriously... why every single human related SF game must have this "Human Dominance over everyone around" factor is beyond me... but i suppose Cortez syndrome is still alive within humanity... what is in matter of fact really sad.

[Merchant2006]

DarkSeraphym wrote...
I did precisely the samethings you did, short of having everyone survive the Suicide Mission and the fact that I opted to sell Legion (as keeping him required me to earn like 25 paragon points or something like that, plus I am interested to see what Cerberus can make out of him). Though, you almost sound like making Udina as Councillor is a bad thing.

Oh not a bad thing to be honest, rather that he's got the sole purpose of raising humanity further, and when coupled with Cerberus having the Base etc along with a human council... yeah.. a lot of 'domineering' so to speak.

But goddamn, your probably right, I think it would have been more renegade to hand over Legion to Cerberus... that would pretty much remove the whole 'gain the trust of the geth faction' and perhaps the Heretic virus would spread further... very interesting choice but I think significantly weakening the Geth/allowing the heretics to return in the long term might be more effective.

Anyhow I'll sell Legion to Cerberus on my other Renegade playthrough ^^. Ooooh... wonder how it's gonna play out in ME3... cripes.

[DarkSeraphym]

RVallant wrote...


I thought EDI was from Reaper tech not IS reaper tech?

Oh and one point of paragon/renegade which, may align the outcome is related to Turians. Paragon's get Turians and Humans doing joint-manouveres, Renegades get an arms race. Both will probably lead to the same conclusion.

That is what I said, she was created by Cerberus from Reaper tech. The game never specifies what kind of tech she was built from. I'm merely pointing out that twice in the game, you've had to rely on Reaper technology just to get the job done (I'm not going to count the Reaper IFF). As far as I'm concerned, dealing with Reaper technology is a necessary evil.

[Winterfly]

No one considers that the Council pretty much knows but put a veil over it? The derelict reaper, the collectors, the reapers.

To scare the people is to bring in instability.

EDIT: Humans are almost built to conquer, maybe its why they are one of few really pointing at the reapers and the others rather go play politics and caring of people 

Modifié par Winterfly, 13 janvier 2011 - 01:07 .

[DarkSeraphym]

elfadelbosco wrote...

ok, but it was Cerberus's choice, Shep found him/herself in the middle of it, but as long as it is MY choice, I won't take the risk, I prefer an army of loyal friends instead of tricky technology

Well, I hate to be picky, but at any time did you scan any technology out of the Collector Cruiser? According to the game, you are getting paid a bounty for it and selling it to Cerberus. Any technology that the Collectors have is directly based upon Reaper tech so if you did scan anything, you kind of already have actively given Reaper tech to Cerberus.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 13 janvier 2011 - 01:06 .

[DarkSeraphym]

Asheer_Khan wrote...

I am sure that in pure renegade world Turian Admirals will recive very familiar for renegades order from Hierarchy in respond at Alliance plea for help to defend Earth "Let the Humanity die"...

And no i assure you that this Turian dreadnought build up (in default/renegade set up) most obiviusly don't have purpose to repel reapers...

And seriously... why every single human related SF game must have this "Human Dominance over everyone around" factor is beyond me... but i suppose Cortez syndrome is still alive within humanity... what is in matter of fact really sad.

You're absolutely right. Those dreadnoughts are by no means for fighting off the Reapers. That particular users post was moreso the fact that the tension between humanity and the turians has created a cold war, which means an arms race. Regardless of whether or not the Turians built them to fight off the Reapers, that is precisely what is going to have to happen with them. The Reapers aren't coming to the Milky Way just to tear Earth asunder and then leave. The Turian Hierarchy, along with every other species, is on the list too. It is certainly the Turians perogative whether or not they opt to protect humanity, but not protecting it means that the Turians will have to bear the burden of their own stupidity in allowing the only other military power to be destroyed.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 13 janvier 2011 - 01:13 .

[DarkSeraphym]

elfadelbosco wrote...

DarkSeraphym wrote...

Well, I hate to be picky, but at any time did you scan any technology out of the Collector Cruiser? According to the game, you are getting paid a bounty for it and selling it to Cerberus. Any technology that the Collectors have is directly based upon Reaper tech so if you did scan anything, you kind of already have actively given Reaper tech to Cerberus.

I didn't see it that way, I assume that I didn't send anything to him, if you go through a paragon gameplay you see TIM very very very very angry and upset !! 

That is not what I am refering to. I am refering to when you get on the Collector Cruiser, not the Base. That is when the Collectors try to spring a trap on you and capture you in the floating space turd (surely you thought of it too). It's the same ship that you get your weapon upgrade of choice. If at any point you scanned anything and got paid for doing so, I think on average it is 5000 caps since the tech in that thing is extremely valuable, you kind of already are taking Reaper tech and selling it to Cerberus. The game literally tells you that you are getting paid a bounty from Cerberus for that technology when you scan it. I am assuming that BioWare isn't even going to make it matter, as it was just a way of making money, but from a roleplaying perspective you are taking Reaper technology out of that Cruiser and selling it to Cerberus everytime you scan anything there.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 13 janvier 2011 - 01:19 .

[Phaedon]

lol. People still think that the Rachni are evil?

[Winterfly]

Phaedon wrote...

lol. People still think that the Rachni are evil?

I hate bugs, all kinds of Insectoids but the Rachni even seem cozy after the talks one had with the queen. Bit cheesey still but cozy with talking bugs. 

Rachni mount/recruit for ME3? 

[hawat333]

toxiconflict wrote...

You kill the rachni queen and the rachni aren't going to help you fight the reapers, you have an all human council and get no help from the council races, you kill wrex and the krogans will probably not help you, and by using the collector base, you have chosen to have your society go along the paths that the reapers desire like with the mass relays. It all plays into the reapers hands.

You kill the rachni and the rachni aren't going to be subdued by the Reapers again, you have an all human council so there won't be infighting delaying the help for Earth, you kill Wrex so the krogans will be busy with infighting, and won't be manipulated and used to overrun the Citadel while you're away, and by using the collector base you have technology to defeat the Reapers. You can blow it afterwards.

Point: You cannot know what will be the consequences.

[wolfsite]

Don't you just love the Internet, allowing people to argue around in circles without anything getting done?


Paragons are gonna Paragon

Renegades are gonna Renegade.

Moving on.

[DarkSeraphym]

Phaedon wrote...

lol. People still think that the Rachni are evil?

No, I believed the story that they were indoctrinated by the Reapers. My biggest concern was the fact that the "hive mind" problem of the Rachni's build creates a weakness that could be abused by the Reapers all over again as they only need to get ahold of the Rachni Queen. Her species, to me, was too great a risk in the face of an enemy like that to just let go free.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 13 janvier 2011 - 01:27 .