209 réponses à ce sujet

[Dean_the_Young]

I'm a Paragade/Rengon.

I get to look down my nose at BOTH sides!

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 14 janvier 2011 - 02:33 .

[Praetor Knight]

Ryzaki wrote...

Gah both renegades and paragons who think someone else's experience should be lesser because ra forbid they don't do the same things need to GTFO.

For every "ooh you didn't keep the collector base!" renegade whining there's some paragon whining about killing people.

Honestly both sides need to STFU because it's old. Really old.

And both uber renegade and uber paragon Shep is a sue not just one or the other.

Come to think of it, this kinda thing turns into a Renegade vs. Paragon argument right?

So maybe categorize such topics that turn into a Renegade vs. Paragon argument, as a  versus thread?

[Aggie Punbot]

Ryzaki wrote...

Gah both renegades and paragons who think someone else's experience should be lesser because ra forbid they don't do the same things need to GTFO.

For every "ooh you didn't keep the collector base!" renegade whining there's some paragon whining about killing people.

Honestly both sides need to STFU because it's old. Really old.

And both uber renegade and uber paragon Shep is a sue not just one or the other.

*hands you an internet cookie*

[Vaenier]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

I'm a Paragade/Rengon.

I get to look down my nose at BOTH sides!

Same. Lables ruin what was interesting about the choices of mass effect. Bioware is always imposing their judgement on you, telling you what the right thing to do it. I ignore it all and just pick what I think is right. Screw lables. Railroading choices does not help...

Modifié par Vaenier, 14 janvier 2011 - 02:44 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Actually, I lied.



It's just that my Renegade is so ruthless and heartless he ends up making a lot of paragon decisions (for incredibly inhumane, heartless reasonings), so much so that he's actually a bona-fide Paragon in ME1.



My Cerberus Paragon, on the other hand, takes so many big-game Renegade choices in ME2 (not least because they actually make more sense than in ME1) that if it weren't for her normal speaking tone, it'd be a question as to why she's considered a Paragon at all.

[Arijharn]

Example of a Renegade decision that will screw you over in ME3?



Killing Elnora. Despite the fact she pulled a gun on you, you had to let her live despite the fact as an Eclipse mercenary she has done bad™ Elnora is the key to defeating the Reapers. Why? Because in her family history (in which she's the last one of) there is a family that has existed throughout all time streams and is the only ones able to 'mindmeld' and defeat the Reapers by causing such a huge psychological shift within them.



My Shephard's are so screwed.

[thatguy212]

Arijharn wrote...

Example of a Renegade decision that will screw you over in ME3?

Killing Elnora. Despite the fact she pulled a gun on you, you had to let her live despite the fact as an Eclipse mercenary she has done bad™ Elnora is the key to defeating the Reapers. Why? Because in her family history (in which she's the last one of) there is a family that has existed throughout all time streams and is the only ones able to 'mindmeld' and defeat the Reapers by causing such a huge psychological shift within them.

My Shephard's are so screwed.

but you have to take in to account that by pushing mouse around it makes him realise he needs to stand up for himself which will lead to him single handedly taking down the reapers

[Ryzaki]

Oh god I hated letting Elnora go as a paragon. **** that's one paragon desicion I will never make because it makes paragon Shep out to be an idiot.



/sighs



I mean the guy tells you every eclipse sister kills to earn her uniform right before you leave.



There was no excuse for BW not to have a hand her over to the cops option.

[Ryzaki]

Vaenier wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

I'm a Paragade/Rengon.

I get to look down my nose at BOTH sides!

Same. Lables ruin what was interesting about the choices of mass effect. Bioware is always imposing their judgement on you, telling you what the right thing to do it. I ignore it all and just pick what I think is right. Screw lables. Railroading choices does not help...

Yeah but you later get screwed on certain choices (telling the admirals to screw themselves, settling disputes) unless you cheat with the points.

Gah. I hate that. It should just be a persuade. Paragon/renegade points be damned.

[toxiconflict]

Let me clarify that I play both a Paragon and Renegade. It is very possible that the renegade could have a negative ending based on bad decisions. Bioware did it with Jade empire, anyone remember the sacrifice ending? It was horrible, and you regret not choosing the good path when you pick it. Here's the vid.

Modifié par toxiconflict, 14 janvier 2011 - 06:28 .

[thatguy212]

toxiconflict wrote...

Let me clarify that I play both a Paragon and Renegade. It is very possible that the renegade could have a negative ending based on bad decisions. Bioware did it with Jade empire, anyone remember the sacrifice ending? It was horrible, and you regret not choosing the good path when you pick it. Here's the vid.

but thats the neutral ending, the evil ending you rule with an ironfist

[OmegaXI]

To the OP,

Not true at all because my racist and renegade shep had let the coucil die and scared the turians so bad the started building up a larger fleet of ships that just means that human will have lots of turian canon fodder to help slow the reapers and maybe even take a few down. And I'm sure my renegade shepard will have the support of the krogan because humans and krogans have something in common- we both wiped out the rachni. And without an arms treay in place the humans of my renegade shepards universe would have been able to build up a larger fleet no hindered by the non human council and their treaty.Besides with humanity being the dominat power in the universe along the renegade route the other races have to help humans because if humanity falls they will soon follow.

I maybe make another play through just to make a super ruthless renegade shep instead of my somewhat renegade shep.

So with the paragon route you will have willing help and with the renegade route you will have help because they have no choice and they know it.

But it will be interesting to see how big the differences are if any between the paragon and renegade routes will effect everything in ME3.

Modifié par OmegaXI, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:16 .

[Zeke01231]

I think Paragons will have more allies and less "tech" than renegades...simplifying but I'm guessing that's what it will boil down to.

[Bigdoser]

Ryzaki wrote...

Gah both renegades and paragons who think someone else's experience should be lesser because ra forbid they don't do the same things need to GTFO.

For every "ooh you didn't keep the collector base!" renegade whining there's some paragon whining about killing people.

Honestly both sides need to STFU because it's old. Really old.

And both uber renegade and uber paragon Shep is a sue not just one or the other.

There we have it folks the answer to this topic. *Gives Ryzaki a cookie*

[DarkSeraphym]

elfadelbosco wrote...

Don't know why, but I believe that there's more than mere Collector's tech in the Collector's base, I got the impression that there was something purely 'reaperish' ...
Anyway, I destroyed it because I saw what it was able to do to the strongest minds, like Saren's and Benezia's, and I thought it was better to find another way. But in my 3rd playthrough I'll keep it to see what will happen.
The good thing in ME series is that any action goes for itself, I mean, you don't have to be a renegade to get the chance to keep the base, you can do a full playthrough as a paragon and decide to keep the base.
What I don't like is killing all the people standing on your path, and most of all Wrex, he's a friend of yours, good heavens!

Well, as I pointed out any Collector tech is, for all intents and purposes, Reaper technology. The Reapers are the ones who gave it to them in the first place so all tech on the Collector Base is Reaper tech. I'm just pointing out that Shepard has already had to rely upon Reaper technology in the past and he will have to continue to do so. I don't think the Collector Base is going to have nearly as much impact upon the destruction of the Reapers as it will just lead to an easier fight, possibly even create enough technology to "secure humanity's dominance against the Reaper's and beyond" and end up providing humanity with a way of securing their control of the Council. BioWare isn't going to screw Paragon or Renegade players into a losing situation just because they are Paragon or Renegade. If this premise is true, then that likely means the thing that will beat the Reapers probably isn't in the Collector Base anyways. That or BioWare could surprise us all and create different ways of defeating the Reapers depending upon your choices, which would likely be just two choices where either you use the Collector Base or you have to use something else.

Besides, I'm interested in knowing whether or not the Reapers even thought to put much of a defense, like devices for indoctrination, on the Collector Base in the first place. As we've seen, the Reapers aren't as much an omniscient race, like they claim they are, as much as they are extremely intelligent machines with superior technology and enough tactical know-how to be able to make organic life develop however they wanted, relying upon the ignorance of their existence as their greatest weapon. As we've seen from the first and second game, the Reapers appear to be sort of "shellshocked" now that their master plan has been disrupted twice. The Collectors even did a rather poor job of defending the base when Shepard got there. Hell, the biggest defense of the entire base was the fact that only the Collectors could reliably avoid being launched by the Omega-4 Relay into the supermassive black hole.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 14 janvier 2011 - 11:14 .

[Arijharn]

Without getting sidetracked too much about the whole CB thing, I think the paragon decision is like this:

* Get allies to combat Reaper force.

* Knowledge of Reapers being 'impervious' to Dreadnought level firepower (therefore making other firepower mute for all classes below)

* ???

* win.



It's that ??? that gets to me as being a flight of fancy and sure I like how Cmdr. Shephard is more capable than your average man, and I like flights of fancy very much in my games, I think a call for some sense of 'realism' is not out of the question. But you know, I may be alone in this.



I have to agree though, I don't like the idea of killing Wrex if only because I think Wrex is bad ass -- although honestly I think he comes second to Garrus.

[Arijharn]

Ryzaki wrote...

Oh god I hated letting Elnora go as a paragon. **** that's one paragon desicion I will never make because it makes paragon Shep out to be an idiot.

/sighs

I mean the guy tells you every eclipse sister kills to earn her uniform right before you leave.

There was no excuse for BW not to have a hand her over to the cops option.

What's truly amazing for me is that the bolded section is stressed to you at least 2 or 3 times before you even run into Elnora... and not all by Pitne For.

[XyleJKH]

elfadelbosco wrote...
maybe we'll discover that the Reapers are Collector's technology, and that the Protheans got corrupted all by themselves and became Collectors, then created these intelligent machines to take control of all the Galaxy... maybe Reapers have been 'convinced' to be very ancient and that organic life is just an accident by a sofisticate software installed by Collectors... or maybe the Protheans created the Reapers so as the Quarians created the Geths, and then their creation turned against them... we shall see

thats stupid, Prothean technology? THats the dumbest theory I have heard yet

[Arijharn]

I don't think so, mainly because we know that the Reapers are at least 37 million years old as 'dated' by the crater on Klendagon.



I would actually be disappointed if the key to defeating the Reapers somehow lies buried in a Prothean legacy, because it makes a) The Prothean's defeat all the more puzzling and The Reapers less of a menace imo.

[DarkSeraphym]

elfadelbosco wrote...

maybe we'll discover that the Reapers are Collector's technology, and that the Protheans got corrupted all by themselves and became Collectors, then created these intelligent machines to take control of all the Galaxy... maybe Reapers have been 'convinced' to be very ancient and that organic life is just an accident by a sofisticate software installed by Collectors... or maybe the Protheans created the Reapers so as the Quarians created the Geths, and then their creation turned against them... we shall see

An impossibility. It has been mentioned that the Reapers have actually been doing this for millions of years and, if I'm not mistaken, that the Reapers last did this 50,000 years ago as of Mass Effect. There is no way that the Protheans, who became Collectors, could have created the Reapers as Mass Effect implies that there have been hundreds, thousands, possibly even millions of cycles like this one that have taken place already.

[DarkSeraphym]

Arijharn wrote...

I don't think so, mainly because we know that the Reapers are at least 37 million years old as 'dated' by the crater on Klendagon.

I would actually be disappointed if the key to defeating the Reapers somehow lies buried in a Prothean legacy, because it makes a) The Prothean's defeat all the more puzzling and The Reapers less of a menace imo.

Honestly, I think the defeat of the Reapers being a Prothean legacy would not necessarily make their defeat all the more puzzling. Keep in mind that the Reapers are aware themselves that they have their own limitations, which is why they must hide in deep space to avoid being found and must rely upon ambush in order to start the cycles. The Protheans, as far as we know, were the first species that the Reapers messed up by neglecting Illos so it is theoretically possible that the Protheans could have developed something to stop them. What would puzzle me more is why Vigil just didn't hand them this kind of weapon instead of giving Shepard something that would only delay Sovereign and, hopefully, lead to its destruction.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 14 janvier 2011 - 11:29 .