423 réponses à ce sujet

[AlexXIV]

iEthanol wrote...

In Exile wrote...

Or, y'know, it could be taste.

Well, yeah, I suppose there are people out there with ginger fetishes. At any rate, this argument is pointless. If the modded model was the default one and the current default was the modded, people would be arguing the vice versa. Simply put, you can't reason with fanboys.

Amioran wrote...

iEthanol wrote...
I rest my case.

It is better.

Do you know how much time it took for the creator of that mod to create that variations to models (not including hairstyles that are yet another mod) to look as that? 5 months, working only on THAT, and only Leliana and Morrigan look noticeably better, the rest have very little vars.

If you don't have an idea of what you are talking about please shut up.

Oh, right and you know exactly how long it took because you've got magical powers. I've got an idea, stop pulling stuff out of your ass, bub. Not to mention that the Redesigned mod is not created by one person--- it is a compilation of the work of several authors. On top of that we're talking about authors who have jobs, lives, etc... of course it would take them some time to release content. It's not like they are getting paid fulltime to do it (like Bioware employees).

AlexXIV wrote...

iEthanol wrote...

Alright,
so I imply that you're retarded and the best retort you can come up with
is... the same exact one? Stay classy, bub. But hey, even if I'm
retarded, I guess I'm an elite retard considering with my limited brain
function I can still make two cents out of you. ../../../images/forum/emoticons/cool.png

Oh
and there I go agreeing with you. At least if 'elite' equals 'more than
most'. Sorry if that's not classy enough but it is not hard to see that
you have some kind of problem that doesn't really exist and most people
don't see it either. I guess it is because you have no idea what you
are talking about, and that's exactly the kind of people who always
complain alot for no reason. Also if you knew how easy it is to get one
dollar out of me you wouldn't be so boastful about the 2 cents.

Elite or not, you're still getting thorn apart by a supposed retard. I'm pretty sure that makes you something even lower. . I guess it is because you have no idea what you
are talking about, and that's exactly the kind of people who always complain alot for no reason. See what  I did there? I added a random claim with no what so ever backing, much like what you're doing. But hey, it's okay, bub. I don't mind if you pull **** out of your ass. You lack creativity due to some birth defect, I wont judge you. It happens.

Could you outline where exactly your creativity is? Maybe make it bold so I can see it better since I have so bad eyes. All I saw was you posting random pictures which didn't even have same lighting. You can't compare **** like that. Also I am not the one who stated 'I rest my case!' and still not ceasing to make a fool of himself.

[Youmu]

Another point why comparing stuff that was shipped with to what modders do is pointless.

It's on PC. Bioware, when making the original models and textures, is on a strict budget, processing power and texture memory wise. Modders don't have to care about any of that.

Just look at say, Morrowind. It has HD patches and stuff, it uses the same engines, but everything looks whole lot better, because the modders, years later, don't have any of the technical constraints in place now that we have much more powerful systems.

Even recent releases as New Vegas can make the top of the line computers bow down once you slap in the HD texture packs and pile up enough of the high-poly remodels of weapons, characters, and items in general. (albeit Gamebryo is mostly to blame)

Modifié par Youmu, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:02 .

[hangmans tree]

All in all I just hope the world will be more lively and vivid. It can be done. Looking back look what some "schmucks" from CDP did with late aurora...with all its limitations...

One of the biggest problems with DAO was that the spaces, lands, towns felt stale and dead. I could close an eye for graphics if the work was put to envigorate the land I was traveling.



The discussion will get us nowhere, most of the debate is turning OT which is taste and preferences. I could argue about aesthetics for hours here but that is not the point.



I wonder if the engine has its limitations which prevent BW from Puttin`g more work and resources into better quality graphics for PC (at least).



Off to bed for me, troumendously tired...I am.

[Mister Mida]

Amyntas wrote...

Mister Mida wrote...

The graphics in Bioware's games have always been fine. If you really want better graphics, go play other games.

Sadly, many players will take this advice to heart. The quality of graphics will affect sales significantly and thereby influence the future of the franchise. Just look at the comments on gametrailers or gamespot and you will see that many players immediately lose interest. I don't understand why ME2 looks so much better than DA2. I can personally live with DA2's graphics, but many players expect more. It would be sad to see the Dragon Age franchise fail because of that.

Bioware hopping on the bandwagon for the sake of the graphics ****s won't do them good. With the exception of ME2, the gameplay of their games is overall average. Putting more resources in the graphics may be at the expense of the gameplay turning mediocre. Their strength through their career has been story, not graphics.

Add to that now they've got the big friggin' marketing machine that is EA, who can make a turd look cool and make every sucker buy it.

[hangmans tree]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

I dunno--- looking at iEthanol's screenshots the modded hair looks much worse than the default to me. I just can't get past the silliness of the style. Could you maybe come up with a better 'do?

agreed.

now...if it looked like this:

(i hope a similar type of hair is in DA2)

Where is it from?

[iEthanol]

In Exile wrote...

Burdokva wrote...
I know,
different teams, but Mass Effect 2 had amazing shader effects, yet
close-ups (esp. random NPCs) can still be horrible. Looking at trailers
for Dragon Age II I see the same problem - fancy lighting, fluid
animation (not necassarily a fan of the combat moves, but dialogues
looked great), detailed models and... blurry textures. Very blurry textures at times.

I
know there are limitations - disc space, hardware capability etc. - but
I hope that at least for major characters and NPCs there could be a
high-res patch.

ME2 (and ME) cheated. They had high-res textures for the faces, but the models capped out at a certain level.

Very true. Still, I'm glad they focused on creating HQ face models since (as I mentioned earlier) a majority of the game takes place in the dialogue screen. The lighting was top notch too.

Above all else I think it's easier to accept ME2's graphics because the majority of them are of aliens as oppose to humans. Hair/perfect symmetry is not something seen to often and if it is it's pre-rendered.

AlexXIV wrote...

Could you outline where exactly your creativity is? Maybe make it bold
so I can see it better since I have so bad eyes. All I saw was you
posting random pictures which didn't even have same lighting. You can't
compare **** like that. Also I am not the one who stated 'I rest my case!' and still not ceasing to make a fool of himself.

Really? Did you have to quote all of that for a 3 line reply? /facepalm

My creativity you ask? Well I thought it was quite apparent considering you're recycling my each and every retort and stating the same exact thing. By now you should have a PhD in how to retort like iEthanol, congratulations!

Well, at least this time you tried to be original. I'm making a fool out of myself, eh? Well thank you for letting me know. Clearly you win arguments by simply shutting your eyes and declaring that the other person is a fool. You should try that in court, screw logic and validity behind claims, I'm just going to declare the other person a fool.

Oh and I did rest my case. As you can see we're no longer arguing about the ****ty DA:O graphics, we're arguing about your birth defect(s).

Modifié par iEthanol, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:14 .

[hangmans tree]

Lokatress wrote...

hangmans tree wrote...

Lokatress wrote...

I'm just happy if I don't have to change computer every year so that I could play games I know I will like

and on the another note....
The Witcher, Oct 2007 -> Witcher 2, spring 2011
Dragon age, Nov 2009 -> DA2, March 2011
Enough said about that

And that proves what exactly?

That witcher 2 has better graphics because they had more time to play with it? Ofcourse there is that they had to built entirely new engine but.... just saying

CDP started developing TW2 after TW:EE was done which is September 16, 2008 (release date). And yes, making the engine from scratch...

[Nimpe]

The graphics arn't bad. Others are just better.

[DaewaNya]

I kinda agree with the OP, but differently. I think Bioware games look good graphically but it's too inconsistent. Inconsistent on the texture and specially on the design. For example, anyone else except the main characters are poorly design: poor textures, very generic, bad outfit design.

I played JRPG since the SNES, begin my first Bioware with KOTOR. Now today I compare them and what I notice was a huge difference between them in term of design quality.

JRPG are far more consistent than Bioware. NPC design are correct and melt well with the rest of the game, great cinematics and I'm not just talking about CG, I'm talking about the way dialogues and actions are shown too, better facial animation (well better animation short).

To tell the truth, I was shock when I first played ME: people wore the same outfit over and over, ugly textures, everything was so much static (hair, environnement, etc), dialogue were REALLY interesting but I could read them on a novel, the experience would have been the same as cinematics were really boring.

ME2 was a huge step forward graphically, but not so much for DA2. I think japanese have a strong experience helped by Anime/Manga, that's how they can do great visual stuff. Bioware is laking this kind of experience, the filming on ME2 and DAO was average. DA2 is getting better though, I can't wait to watch

Modifié par DaewaNya, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:25 .

[AlexXIV]

iEthanol wrote...

In Exile wrote...

Burdokva wrote...
I know,
different teams, but Mass Effect 2 had amazing shader effects, yet
close-ups (esp. random NPCs) can still be horrible. Looking at trailers
for Dragon Age II I see the same problem - fancy lighting, fluid
animation (not necassarily a fan of the combat moves, but dialogues
looked great), detailed models and... blurry textures. Very blurry textures at times.

I
know there are limitations - disc space, hardware capability etc. - but
I hope that at least for major characters and NPCs there could be a
high-res patch.

ME2 (and ME) cheated. They had high-res textures for the faces, but the models capped out at a certain level.

Very true. Still, I'm glad they focused on creating HQ face models since (as I mentioned earlier) a majority of the game takes place the dialogue screen. The lighting was top notch too.

Above all else I think it's easier to accept ME2's graphics because the majority of them are of aliens as oppose to humans. Hair/perfect symmetry is not something seen to often and if it is it's pre-rendered.

AlexXIV wrote...

Could you outline where exactly your creativity is? Maybe make it bold
so I can see it better since I have so bad eyes. All I saw was you
posting random pictures which didn't even have same lighting. You can't
compare **** like that. Also I am not the one who stated 'I rest my case!' and still not ceasing to make a fool of himself.

Really? Did you have to quote all of that for a 3 line reply? /facepalm

My creativity you ask? Well I thought it was quite apparent considering you're recycling my each and every retort and stating the same exact thing. By now you should have a PhD in how to retort like iEthanol, congratulations!

Well, at least this time you tried to be original. I'm making a fool out of myself, eh? Well thank you for letting me know. Clearly you win arguments by simply shutting your eyes and declaring that the other person is a fool. You should try that in court, screw logic and validity behind claims, I'm just going to declare the other person a fool.

Oh and I did rest my case. As you can see we're no longer arguing about the ****ty DA:O graphics, we're arguing about your birth defect(s).

Yeah I know we are argueing my birth defects now and tbh I'm hoping it will get this thread closed. Even though I wouldn't know why you would want that to happen since it is you agreeing with the OP and not me. But that must also have to do with my birth defect then. If I tried to 'argue like iEthanol' I'd just crap into my hand and throw it at the screen. But I think you think a bit too much of yourself, you're not that great.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:12 .

[RagingCyclone]

I think the graphics are good from a gameplay standpoint. What I have not seen from DA2 clips that DAO had was emotional range in the faces. Go to the Alistair Gush Thread and there are nicknames for the various facial expressions he has. But, and I will use the Sebastian vid as an example, while he sounded angry, he had he emotional expressions of someone using botox. I hope this is ffixed by the release because I am pretty sure the engine can handle it. But if a character cannot emote on their face they way their voice does, then the immersion fails because that character is not longer believable.

[AlanC9]

iEthanol wrote...

Well, yeah, I suppose there are people out there with ginger fetishes. At any rate, this argument is pointless. If the modded model was the default one and the current default was the modded, people would be arguing the vice versa. Simply put, you can't reason with fanboys.

I wouldn't be arguing that. But if you're going to simply assume that people who disagree with you are not being intellectually honest, there's no point to this. (Alex, I thought you were overdoing it, but I guess I was wrong).

Just for clarity, the redesigned Leliana doesn't look real to me. The hair color isn't the problem, since I suppose dyes exist in the DAO universe too.

Modifié par AlanC9, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:24 .

[Cra5y Pineapple]

Mass Effect is pretty damn modern in graphics so I don't see your argument for it there. As for DAII, it's mainly in progress and it's getting better.

Just remember that graphics is all about motion as well as details. DA: Origins and Mass Effect 1 were very static while Dragon Age II and Mass Effect 2 definately have much more organic movements.

Modifié par Cra5y Pineapple, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:26 .

[John Epler]

Warnings handed out. If you guys can't be civil to each other, you will be banned. Consider this a general warning.

[In Exile]

hangmans tree wrote...
CDP started developing TW2 after TW:EE was done which is September 16, 2008 (release date). And yes, making the engine from scratch...

I don't see a big difference:

Modifié par In Exile, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:32 .

[nightcobra]

hangmans tree wrote...

nightcobra8928 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

I dunno--- looking at iEthanol's screenshots the modded hair looks much worse than the default to me. I just can't get past the silliness of the style. Could you maybe come up with a better 'do?

agreed.

now...if it looked like this:

(i hope a similar type of hair is in DA2)

Where is it from?

castlevania lords of shadow

gabriel has great hairB)

[Naitaka]

In Exile wrote...

hangmans tree wrote...
CDP started developing TW2 after TW:EE was done which is September 16, 2008 (release date). And yes, making the engine from scratch...

I don't see a big difference:

Geralt doesn't look like he just woke up and having a bad hair day?

[Maria Caliban]

iEthanol wrote...
Oh, and one last comparison before I leave this topic:

Leliana in trailer:


Leliana in-game:


Leliana Modded:


I rest my case.

The modded Leliana does look much, much better.

Dragon Age ought to do something like Mass Effect where they give companions individual outfits and bodies, and spend the time to make each one look unique. I don't think all of them have to be attractive, but the second image strikes me much more as the playful seductress we know Leliana was before she left Orlais.

[PanosSmirnakos]

Although I kind of agree with the OP about Bioware games, graphics alone don't make a good game... Especially for RPGs. F.e. Jade Empire, which was also a Bioware title, for me, it had awful graphics for a 2007 pc game, but it was also one of the most original and memorable action RPGs I've ever played. People who love RPGs still buy and play old (and "ancient") pc and console titles and my guess is that it's not to admire their breathtaking visuals.

[mellifera]

Naitaka wrote...

Geralt doesn't look like he just woke up and having a bad hair day?

He looks like he tore the tail off a horse and taped it to his head instead.

[AlexXIV]

Maria Caliban wrote...


The modded Leliana does look much, much better.

Dragon Age ought to do something like Mass Effect where they give companions individual outfits and bodies, and spend the time to make each one look unique. I don't think all of them have to be attractive, but the second image strikes me much more as the playful seductress we know Leliana was before she left Orlais.

Thing is just it is not about whether Leliana looks better but whether the graphics are better in one picture compared to the other. I mean you can portray ugly people in good graphics etc.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:44 .

[crimzontearz]

in all honesty, if everyone thought this way no one would have watch animated movies because they are not "realistic and cutting edge" enough (anyone even begins to mention Beowulf I'm gonna peronsonally troll slap them)



but like in the world of visual entertainment JUST because something is not 100% super realistic CGI that does not mean that it is not artistically worthy of notice BECAUSE of the fact its particular direction strays from the realism.



Mass Effect is an extremely realistic game, it was praised sooooooooo many times for its amazing looks but not because they were "just" realistic but because the art direction was amazing within the choice of sticking to a movie-like view.



Just like ME should be praised so should DA2 because its artistic direction is phenomenal (have you looked at the opening of kirkwall?....AWESOME)



in my eyes one of the games with the most amazing visuals EVER was Darksiders and not because it was hyperrealistic (hell GOW is much more realistic while using the same engine) but because god dammit they SUCCEEDED in bringing a comicbook world to life with a style ever so similar to that of the artist who generated it in a way other games did not.

[SultryVulcan]

iEthanol wrote...

I agree about DA:O. The graphics, in general, were god awful. For the most part ME2 had pretty good GFX though. I guess Miranda's face looked pretty ugly, but that was one tiny exception.

You must have very high standards my friend!

[Naitaka]

yukidama wrote...

Naitaka wrote...

Geralt doesn't look like he just woke up and having a bad hair day?

He looks like he tore the tail off a horse and taped it to his head instead.

It keeps the flies away when you're trudging through the swamp.

Utility + 1