1252 réponses à ce sujet

[Count Viceroy]

Addai67 wrote...

So Isabela is trying to look like a ho?  Is she financing her ship with some side business?

I recall Sheryl saying that they added the threesome/ foursome on a lark and that it wasn't supposed to define her character.  I guess they could have changed their minds.

I'd like to think she uses sexuality to gain an advantage in her field, wether it be combat or coersion. It's hard to tell without seeing her in game though. That's my impression so far at any rate.

Modifié par Count Viceroy, 17 janvier 2011 - 09:02 .

[Addai]

crimzontearz wrote...
in all honesty, YOUR character is not Isabela, nor varric, nor bethany...no..your character is Hawke and JUST hawke.

As we've been reminded endlessly on this board, the Warden and thus also Hawke is not our character, either.

Modifié par Addai67, 17 janvier 2011 - 09:03 .

[Addai]

Count Viceroy wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

So Isabela is trying to look like a ho?  Is she financing her ship with some side business?

I recall Sheryl saying that they added the threesome/ foursome on a lark and that it wasn't supposed to define her character.  I guess they could have changed their minds.

I'd like to think she uses sexuality to gain an advantage in her field, wether it be combat or coersion. It's hard to tell without seeing her in game though. That's my impression so far at any rate.

She didn't do so in Origins.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Addai67 wrote...

As we've been reminded endlessly on this board, the Warden and thus also Hawke is not our character, either.

If that were true there would be no point in playing the game at all.

[crimzontearz]

let me take this from a different angle....



answer this question fitst....have you ever played PnP rpg's?

[Ziggeh]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...
They don't have to be, certainly, but why can't they be?  Why create this restriction?  It seems malicious.

It's not malicious, it's just a different experience. It's more of an interaction than direct control. We affect their personalities in the same manner one might influence a friend, as opposed to letting us define them.

[Sigil_Beguiler123]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

sylvius.....

they are not your characters

They don't have to be, certainly, but why can't they be?  Why create this restriction?  It seems malicious.

One obvious example is story and dramatic tension goes out the window. You know how the characters will react, you know how the relationships will turn out, etc. Besides outside influence beyond the party there is no drama, story or tension that isn't simpy your own creation.

Would you have been surprised (or whatever) to find out Alistair was heir to the throne if you had decided beforehand that he would be? To give one example.

[Ryzaki]

Addai67 wrote...

As we've been reminded endlessly on this board, the Warden and thus also Hawke is not our character, either.

I thought it was Shepard and Hawke.

[Guitar-Hero]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Steffen wrote...

Because the characters are preconcieved no?

That doesn't stop us from doing it in DAO.

No, DA2's limitations seem designed to protect us from ourselves.  And that's something that should never happen.

Thats quite a theory, just because you could change the external does not mean you can change who the really are, they are still written, animated, and concieved by the bioware team.

if isabela is a sexy rogue pirate ninja with father issues(guess), then you can not make her the king of hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliofobia.,.. land

[Count Viceroy]

Addai67 wrote...

She didn't do so in Origins.

I'd say her fight with the thugs in the brothel fits the bill.

It was 3 guys vs 1 "pretty girl".

Modifié par Count Viceroy, 17 janvier 2011 - 09:11 .

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...

because prudes like wynne aren't exciting lol

Wynne's not a prude.

Well she certainly wasnt a Morrigan, Leliana or pearl employee haha

[Avilia]

Count Viceroy wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

She didn't do so in Origins.

I'd say her fight with the thugs in the brothel fits the bill.

It was 3 guys vs 1 "pretty girl".

I thought she used her duelling skills to win that fight.

[Tyrael02]

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...

because prudes like wynne aren't exciting lol

Putting her in the Chasind robes was an odd experince to say the least.

lmfao, or sans any robe

[Ryzaki]

Tyrael02 wrote...

Well she certainly wasnt a Morrigan, Leliana or pearl employee haha

Right because that automatically makes you a prude.

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...

Well she certainly wasnt a Morrigan, Leliana or pearl employee haha

Right because that automatically makes you a prude.

By definition yes....? Have I offended? wearing provocative/revealing clothing doesn't make you less prudent, especially if the agenda is a sexual one? Wynne so obviously plays the mother-role while morrigan and leliana are willing to sleep with the protagonist. I think her lack of sexuality at old age makes her a prude. You can be promiscuous at old age as well, that would be the opposite of prudent. But even when talking to ohgren or zevran, wynne downplays sexual comments. I believe that makes her a prude 

[Ryzaki]

Tyrael02 wrote...

By definition yes....? Have I offended? wearing provocative/revealing clothing doesn't make you less prudent, especially if the agenda is a sexual one? Wynne so obviously plays the mother-role while morrigan and leliana are willing to sleep with the protagonist. I think her lack of sexuality at old age makes her a prude. You can be promiscuous at old age as well, that would be the opposite of prudent. But even when talking to ohgren or zevran, wynne downplays sexual comments. I believe that makes her a prude 

You forget what you posted already? 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 18 janvier 2011 - 01:51 .

[Addai]

Count Viceroy wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

She didn't do so in Origins.

I'd say her fight with the thugs in the brothel fits the bill.

It was 3 guys vs 1 "pretty girl".

Ok but she was not tarted up at the time, just wearing normal leather armor.  So I fail to see the relevance to DA2.

[TheMadCat]

Steffen wrote...

No, clothing almost always depicit who we are, examples: the person that succombs to peer pressure, and dresses the way other people want him/her to, the guy/girl that tries so hard not to fit in instead of figuring out who they are, the guy/girl that is comfortable with who they are even if they feel the need to not wear pants. Two of these indicates internal struggle to figure out who they are, struggle that creates interesting characters, and appeal. 

Ok, and what is this individual is in freezing weather, what if this persons culture deplores the particular clothing in question? What if their wealth prevents them from owning this type of clothing? Sigil and yourself keep pointing to these very isolated, very limited scenarios and completely ignore as many external elements as you can. Let's remember the rudimentary purpose of clothes are one, survival, two, social status, and three, practicality. The idea of clothes being a direct reflection of the wearers personality, while having some truth to it, is overshadowed by so many other more pratical and external reasons.

The use of clothing can have some impact in a story and give a visual and simplistic idea of the character or contrasts with other characters, an off the top of my head example, the color of Luke's primary clothes change (White, grey, black) as he get's more powerful and the Darkside slowly comes closer to tempting and engulfing him.  Ultimately though this didn't add any more depth to his character and doesn't necessairy reflect who he is, it didn't do anything to further explain anything we didn't witness from the character itself developing and in fact went over many peoples heads. Ultimately it comes down to the ability of customizing your character or adding in a small, trivial bit to character depth.

[Maria Caliban]

Tyrael02 wrote...

By definition yes....? Have I offended? wearing provocative/revealing clothing doesn't make you less prudent, especially if the agenda is a sexual one? Wynne so obviously plays the mother-role while morrigan and leliana are willing to sleep with the protagonist. I think her lack of sexuality at old age makes her a prude. You can be promiscuous at old age as well, that would be the opposite of prudent. But even when talking to ohgren or zevran, wynne downplays sexual comments. I believe that makes her a prude 

My virgin/**** sense is tingling.

There are a wide range of sexual behaviors and attitudes one can have. Not two.

We know that mages, in general, tend to be less restrained by social mores. We know that Wynne didn't (originally) approve of the Warden having relationships.

Other than that, we don't know much about Wynne when it comes to sexual matters.

[Atakuma]

Addai67 wrote...
I recall Sheryl saying that they added the threesome/ foursome on a lark and that it wasn't supposed to define her character.  I guess they could have changed their minds.

This is exactly the problem. They are using her sexuality to define her character, which is an awful thing to do to a female character if you want her to be taken seriously.

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...

By definition yes....? Have I offended? wearing provocative/revealing clothing doesn't make you less prudent, especially if the agenda is a sexual one? Wynne so obviously plays the mother-role while morrigan and leliana are willing to sleep with the protagonist. I think her lack of sexuality at old age makes her a prude. You can be promiscuous at old age as well, that would be the opposite of prudent. But even when talking to ohgren or zevran, wynne downplays sexual comments. I believe that makes her a prude 

So what? 

...You know absolutely nothing about Wynne. She is not a prude so please stop. There is no if you're not promiscious you're a prude. That's complete and utter nonsense.

And Oghren is a perverted drunk and Zevran a sleeze. I'd downplay them hitting on me too.

I'd love to know how someone who had a kid out of marriage of her own free will and suggests to tell Alistair "where babies come from" is a prude. She has nothing against sex just you having emotions get in the way of duty.

LOL if I know nothing about wynne, then neither do you and your claim is no more valid than mine, except i have evidence, and you really don't. don't get upset.

[Count Viceroy]

Avilia wrote...

I thought she used her duelling skills to win that fight.

My god, it's like I'm talking through a bottle, only half of the words seem to go through and the rest is distorted or lost.

But I will spell it out.

It gives her an advantage in that the enemy thinks she's harmless which allows her to better put those skills to use than if the enemy was expecting her to be dangerous.

Addai67 wrote...
Ok but she was not tarted up at the time, just wearing normal leather armor.  So I fail to see the relevance to DA2.

I think the radical change in apperance is more due to her promotion from a minor character to a full fledged companion. Plus the mass effecting they've done to the companion armors and the unique look they've been given. If they were to redo the DAO scene again with the new isabella, I guarantee you she would not be wearing armor.  

Modifié par Count Viceroy, 17 janvier 2011 - 09:38 .

[pizoxuat]

Wynne reads romance novels and if Fereldan romance novels are anything like ours, she's probably not a prude. She just isn't attracted to anyone in your party.

[Ryzaki]

Tyrael02 wrote...

LOL if I know nothing about wynne, then neither do you and your claim is no more valid than mine, except i have evidence, and you really don't. don't get upset.

Yes because Wynne was such a prude that she never had sex ever. And especially never had a child. Or considered using contraception.

Yup.

Your claim about her being a prude is totally correct. Yup. You know all there is to know about Wynne.

Nice dragging "evidence" though. I mean totally your evidence is irrefutable!

[Maria Caliban]

Atakuma wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
I recall Sheryl saying that they added the threesome/ foursome on a lark and that it wasn't supposed to define her character.  I guess they could have changed their minds.

This is exactly the problem. They are using her sexuality to define her character, which is an awful thing to do to a female character if you want her to be taken seriously.

Actually, this is the description on the website:

"I win because I cheat, Kitten. I thought that was obvious."

Isabela is the pirate scourge of two coastlines, four nations, and countless tavern floors. She's equally skilled with dagger and insult, and it's hard to know which cuts deeper. It's rare to see her in one place for long, but with her ship reduced to timbers, Isabela's had to content herself with whatever bounty Kirkwall has to offer. And that means no end of headaches for the rich and foolish, and no end of amusement for her. She's as desired as she is feared, which is to say, a lot and often. Fall on her blade, or at her feet—a win is a win, in her book. Shipwrecked, hounded, Isabela hasn't decided if she's cornered yet. She's having too much fun.

It doesn't define her by her sexuality. It defines her as free-spirited, a troublemaker, skilled with a blade, willing to use dirty tricks, and desirable.

It's the fans that focus on her sexuality to the exclusion of all else.

Count Viceroy wrote...

Avilia wrote...

I thought she used her duelling skills to win that fight.

My god, it's like I'm talking through a bottle, only half of the words seem to go through and the rest is distorted or lost.

But I will spell it out.

It gives her an advantage in that the enemy thinks she's harmless which allows her to better put those skills to use than if the enemy was expecting her to be dangerous.

There's no indication that she uses her looks to win battles. If she were a hairy brute that bathed once a year and looked like a dog's ass, she still would have won that fight.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 17 janvier 2011 - 09:40 .