1252 réponses à ce sujet

[legbamel]

AlexXIV wrote...

TheMadCat wrote...

wulfsturm wrote...

Atakuma wrote...
I'm not going to be intentionally looking up her dress, just like I wasn't intentionally looking at Miranda's ass.

Well, no one is holding you at gun-point forcing you to look at anything - intentionally or not.

You're kind of forced to if that's what the shot focuses on, like BioWare did with Miranda's ass a few times.

And that's so terrible because ... ?

Because it breaks immersion to be having an emotional conversation and half of the screen shows her ass while you're supposed to be talking to her.  I'm trying to have a conversation about her family not sexually harass her.  And I'll be trying to fight a battle, not get repeated glimpses of Isabella's thong.  But I suspect there will be at least a few occasions where I'm forced to see her "assets" up close and personal whether I'm romancing her or not.

[Addai]

AlexXIV wrote...

TheMadCat wrote...

Well, no one is holding you at gun-point forcing you to look at anything - intentionally or not.

You're kind of forced to if that's what the shot focuses on, like BioWare did with Miranda's ass a few times.

And that's so terrible because ... ?

Because it kills immersion to be all "teh Collectoooorrrs" and to have the scene suddenly turn to "boom chicka."  Which I noticed more with the Consort in ME1, because they actually start playing boom chicka music. 

Modifié par Addai67, 18 janvier 2011 - 01:27 .

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...


You didn't lessen anything, I still think she is a prude. Have I not made my stance clear enough? Perhaps you should look up the definition of the former and the latter, so you can get a better grasp of the topic at hand.

Right because someone who believes someone is either a prude or promiscious has a grasp of the topic.

Yet you avoid looking up the definition.

I know the definitions hon. But I'm not stupid enough to believe there's two levels of sexuality.

lol what? two levels?

Ok this is necessary.

Promiscuity is a quality of the behaviour of individual which is ripe with sexual innuendo and serves the purpose of attaining sexual partners in the absence of sexual commitment or even perhaps in the presence thereof.

Being prudent is quite the opposite in this context. A conscious avoidance of sexual or promiscuous interactions with other individuals.

No one said anything about two levels of sexuality, the matter is quite black and white as far as a functional definition goes. Based on in-game character behaviour, Wynne fits the latter whether she is joking or not. She most definitely does not say "you should have bedded me while you had the chance" as Morrigan does. It may be age, it may be her personality type, but she most definitely displays an aversion to sex regardless of whether Ohgren or Zevran are gross. She says to zevran that her bossom is fine without Zevran touching her, which acknowledges the idea of promiscuity in Wynne, but she consciously avoids it. The choice to so convincingly avoid anything that has to do with sex intentionally fits the definition of a prude, rather than her being offended by it because Zevran's comment was lewd in nature. The way she answers Zevran tells us she is not alien to the idea of promiscuity, but that she wants no part in it.

Modifié par Tyrael02, 18 janvier 2011 - 01:28 .

[wulfsturm]

Atakuma wrote...

I'm not going to just pretend like it's not there. It's just juvenile pandering and in many ways it's insulting to the intelligence of the audience.

Well, that's your opinion and perogotive - but it is also subjective. While you may find it insulting and pandering that BioWare would do such a thing, it's really a simple fact of life: Sex sells, quite well in fact. Considering this game's target audience (young adults with a penchance for fantasy) it really makes sense that they would make the decision to show a little flesh here and there.

And besides, how many males do you see complaining about Fenris' and Varric's choice of clothing? One can say that BioWare is pandering to the young adult female crowd with the way both characters dress. However, do people like you complain about such a thing? Heh, one may think that some people here have double-standards.

Watch how everyone will ignore this post and continue arguing fruitlessly.

[TheMadCat]

The Bard From Hell wrote...

As far as I remember, and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but the celts did battle completely naked, only covered in blue paint or tattoos (can't remember which) and used heavy as hell weapons. Romans **** skirts that basically only covered their genitalia (yes, most media depicts romans and greek in a much more prude way than what really was), though some "blessed" individuals actually had their "parts" exposed. And they went to war like that. So the fact that Isabela is pantless and Varric exposes his chest hair dosn't bothers my in a bit. Hey, at least it's not Varric who's pantless (though the darker side of me wished Isabela to have an exposed breast...).

Er, no. The Celts never battled naked, they've found leathers and hides buried with soldiers dating as far back 5th century BC which pre-dates their encounter with the Romans. Unless you're talking ancient as when damn near all civilizations lacked the capability to produce any type of armor or clothing and due to that fought naked, but there doesn't seem to be a need to bring that up. As for Romans, their skirts went down to their knees and depending on the grounds they were fighting on they wore greave's to cover the rest of their legs. Never heard of any Roman's fighting without the skirt.

Modifié par TheMadCat, 18 janvier 2011 - 01:33 .

[TheMadCat]

AlexXIV wrote...

TheMadCat wrote...

wulfsturm wrote...

Atakuma wrote...
I'm not going to be intentionally looking up her dress, just like I wasn't intentionally looking at Miranda's ass.

Well, no one is holding you at gun-point forcing you to look at anything - intentionally or not.

You're kind of forced to if that's what the shot focuses on, like BioWare did with Miranda's ass a few times.

And that's so terrible because ... ?

Did I say it was terrible? Maybe you should re-read the quotes and take everything into context.

[Ryzaki]

Tyrael02 wrote...

lol what? two levels?

Ok this is necessary.

Promiscuity is a quality of the behaviour of individual which is ripe with sexual innuendo and serves the purpose of attaining sexual partners in the absence of sexual commitment or even perhaps in the presence thereof.

Being prudent is quite the opposite in this context. A conscious avoidance of sexual or promiscuous interactions with other individuals.

No one said anything about two levels of sexuality, the matter is quite black and white as far as a functional definition goes. Based on in-game character behaviour, Wynne fits the latter whether she is joking or not. She most definitely does not say "you should have bedded me while you had the chance" as Morrigan does. It may be age, it may be her personality type, but she most definitely displays an aversion to sex regardless of whether Ohgren or Zevran are gross. She says to zevran that her bossom is fine without Zevran touching her, which acknowledges the idea of promiscuity in Wynne, but she consciously avoids it. The choice to so convincingly avoid anything that has to do with sex intentionally fits the definition of a prude, rather than her being offended by it because Zevran's comment was lewd in nature. The way she answers Zevran tells us she is not alien to the idea of promiscuity, but that she wants no part in it.

/facepalms

Wow. This is so wrong I don't know where to begin.

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...

lol what? two levels?

Ok this is necessary.

Promiscuity is a quality of the behaviour of individual which is ripe with sexual innuendo and serves the purpose of attaining sexual partners in the absence of sexual commitment or even perhaps in the presence thereof.

Being prudent is quite the opposite in this context. A conscious avoidance of sexual or promiscuous interactions with other individuals.

No one said anything about two levels of sexuality, the matter is quite black and white as far as a functional definition goes. Based on in-game character behaviour, Wynne fits the latter whether she is joking or not. She most definitely does not say "you should have bedded me while you had the chance" as Morrigan does. It may be age, it may be her personality type, but she most definitely displays an aversion to sex regardless of whether Ohgren or Zevran are gross. She says to zevran that her bossom is fine without Zevran touching her, which acknowledges the idea of promiscuity in Wynne, but she consciously avoids it. The choice to so convincingly avoid anything that has to do with sex intentionally fits the definition of a prude, rather than her being offended by it because Zevran's comment was lewd in nature. The way she answers Zevran tells us she is not alien to the idea of promiscuity, but that she wants no part in it.

/facepalms

Wow. This is so wrong I don't know where to begin.

Please begin with "two levels of sexuality" lol

[legbamel]

wulfsturm wrote...

Atakuma wrote...
I'm not going to just pretend like it's not there. It's just juvenile pandering and in many ways it's insulting to the intelligence of the audience.

Well, that's your opinion and perogotive - but it is also subjective. While you may find it insulting and pandering that BioWare would do such a thing, it's really a simple fact of life: Sex sells, quite well in fact. Considering this game's target audience (young adults with a penchance for fantasy) it really makes sense that they would make the decision to show a little flesh here and there.

And besides, how many males do you see complaining about Fenris' and Varric's choice of clothing? One can say that BioWare is pandering to the young adult female crowd with the way both characters dress. However, do people like you complain about such a thing? Heh, one may think that some people here have double-standards.

Watch how everyone will ignore this post and continue arguing fruitlessly.

If they frame fraught conversations around shots of chest hair and biceps, then yes, I would complain.  Sex sells, yes, but it doesn't have to be tastelessly shoved into a serious conversation during which it's irrelevant.  Save it for the romance convos!

[KBomb]

Tyrael02 wrote...


Being prudent is quite the opposite in this context. A conscious avoidance of sexual or promiscuous interactions with other individuals.

No one said anything about two levels of sexuality, the matter is quite black and white as far as a functional definition goes. Based on in-game character behaviour, Wynne fits the latter whether she is joking or not. She most definitely does not say "you should have bedded me while you had the chance" as Morrigan does. It may be age, it may be her personality type, but she most definitely displays an aversion to sex regardless of whether Ohgren or Zevran are gross. She says to zevran that her bossom is fine without Zevran touching her, which acknowledges the idea of promiscuity in Wynne, but she consciously avoids it. The choice to so convincingly avoid anything that has to do with sex intentionally fits the definition of a prude, rather than her being offended by it because Zevran's comment was lewd in nature. The way she answers Zevran tells us she is not alien to the idea of promiscuity, but that she wants no part in it.

Where and when does Wynne show an aversion to sex? I think she takes Zevran’s jokes with a roll of the eye and a grain of salt, but that doesn’t mean she has an aversion to sex in general.

[Ryzaki]

Tyrael02 wrote...
Please begin with "two levels of sexuality" lol

Why? I doubt you'd listen. For one your definition of promiscuity is flat out wrong.

[wulfsturm]

legbamel wrote...

If they frame fraught conversations around shots of chest hair and biceps, then yes, I would complain.  Sex sells, yes, but it doesn't have to be tastelessly shoved into a serious conversation during which it's irrelevant.  Save it for the romance convos!

What's the differance between something being tastelessly shoved into a serious conversation, and it being tastelessy shoved into a romance? Cannot a rommance have a serious conversation?

Modifié par wulfsturm, 18 janvier 2011 - 01:38 .

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...
Please begin with "two levels of sexuality" lol

Why? I doubt you'd listen. For one your definition of promiscuity is flat out wrong.

You've been attacking every one of my posts since i said i thought he was a prude, don't stop now. Correct my definition then. I wouldn't argue at length if I wasn't confident in my argument and my understanding. I could've copied and pasted off of the web, which sounds like what you are going to do if my grasp of promiscuity as an idea is so off that it caused you to /facepalm (lol?). Obviously it's unavoidable, so go ahead.

enlighten me.

Modifié par Tyrael02, 18 janvier 2011 - 01:43 .

[Ryzaki]

Tyrael02 wrote...

You've been attacking every one of my posts since i said i thought he was a prude, don't stop now. Correct my definition then. I wouldn't argue at length if I wasn't confident in my argument and my understanding. I could've copied and pasted off of the web, which sounds like what you are going to do if my grasp of promiscuity as an idea is so off that it caused you to /facepalm (lol?). Obviously it's unavoidable, so go ahead.

enlighten me.

Why? The only thing you've been doing is insisting Wyne is a prude when you have no evidence of that other than her not liking characters like Oghren! and Zevran hitting on her.

Also "attacking?" 

And dude wikipedia is your friend. Use it. http://en.wikipedia....iki/Promiscuity
                                                                            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prude


Considering Wynne openly tells Alistair "It's been a while since I've had a young man in my bed." and gives the PC her blessing when s/he's in love with their LI I doubt she's a prude. (Alsothe loud at night convo is hilarious)

Modifié par Ryzaki, 18 janvier 2011 - 01:47 .

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...

You've been attacking every one of my posts since i said i thought he was a prude, don't stop now. Correct my definition then. I wouldn't argue at length if I wasn't confident in my argument and my understanding. I could've copied and pasted off of the web, which sounds like what you are going to do if my grasp of promiscuity as an idea is so off that it caused you to /facepalm (lol?). Obviously it's unavoidable, so go ahead.

enlighten me.

Why? The only thing you've been doing is insisting Wyne is a prude when you have no evidence of that other than her not liking characters like Oghren! and Zevran hitting on her.

Also "attacking?" 

And dude wikipedia is your friend. Use it. http://en.wikipedia....iki/Promiscuity
                                                                            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prude


Considering Wynne openly tells Alistair "It's been a while since I've had a young man in my bed." and gives the PC her blessing when s/he's in love with their LI I doubt she's a prude. (Alsothe loud at night convo is hilarious)

Lol wikipedia, sure. what the wiki says is fine. And what I said is not wrong. Thats what promiscuity is and the wiki - if you want to use it on me - says the same deal. If you want something with more authority (say published literature) that corroborates what I said, look up the following and refer to the portion on the "promiscuous 10%". I don't want to dig into this any further than required, but if you're going to say someone is flat out wrong, make sure you aren't.
J Epidemiol Community Health 2004;58:889-890 doi:10.1136/jech.2004.027847

And yes, she does say that. It has been a while since she had a man in her bed. A choice she takes part in as much as any man that is willing to jump into bed with her such as ohgren or zevran. Its clearly happened before. If she ever propositioned anyone in the slightest, at any point in the game, I'd agree with you. but she doesnt and she refuses any proposition. The interpretation of the game is what is driving this out of hand. All opinions aside and with what we were shown by BioWare and a functional definition, this is where I arrive. And if it is only on the basis of her thinking ohgren and zevran are gross, then you are assuming she'd say yes to someone she found attractive and in that way not be a prude. thats a bad assumption to make if you're going to argue, work with what you've got as far as the game goes

[Torhagen]

legbamel wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

TheMadCat wrote...

wulfsturm wrote...

Atakuma wrote...
I'm not going to be intentionally looking up her dress, just like I wasn't intentionally looking at Miranda's ass.

Well, no one is holding you at gun-point forcing you to look at anything - intentionally or not.

You're kind of forced to if that's what the shot focuses on, like BioWare did with Miranda's ass a few times.

And that's so terrible because ... ?

Because it breaks immersion to be having an emotional conversation and half of the screen shows her ass while you're supposed to be talking to her.  I'm trying to have a conversation about her family not sexually harass her.  And I'll be trying to fight a battle, not get repeated glimpses of Isabella's thong.  But I suspect there will be at least a few occasions where I'm forced to see her "assets" up close and personal whether I'm romancing her or not.

That is a whole other "problem" and has nothing to do with how a character is dressed

Modifié par Torhagen, 18 janvier 2011 - 02:16 .

[Ryzaki]

Tyrael02 wrote...
Lol wikipedia, sure. what the wiki says is fine. And what I said is not wrong. Thats what promiscuity is and the wiki - if you want to use it on me - says the same deal. If you want something with more authority (say published literature) that corroborates what I said, look up the following and refer to the portion on the "promiscuous 10%". I don't want to dig into this any further than required, but if you're going to say someone is flat out wrong, make sure you aren't.
J Epidemiol Community Health 2004;58:889-890 doi:10.1136/jech.2004.027847

And yes, she does say that. It has been a while since she had a man in her bed. A choice she takes part in as much as any man that is willing to jump into bed with her such as ohgren or zevran. Its clearly happened before. If she ever propositioned anyone in the slightest, at any point in the game, I'd agree with you. but she doesnt and she refuses any proposition. The interpretation of the game is what is driving this out of hand. All opinions aside and with what we were shown by BioWare and a functional definition, this is where I arrive. And if it is only on the basis of her thinking ohgren and zevran are gross, then you are assuming she'd say yes to someone she found attractive and in that way not be a prude. thats a bad assumption to make if you're going to argue, work with what you've got as far as the game goes

...

So you're saying not sleeping with someone makes you a prude.   People who don't hit on others nor wish to be hit on are prudes. It can't be they're not attracted to anyone nearby. Nope. Never that.

I better tell me perverted virgin friends they're prudes even though they watch more hentai than most of the people I know in sexual relationships but don't find themselves willing to sleep with anyone around them.

Also...you know what you're trolling. I don't know why I didn't see it before.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 18 janvier 2011 - 02:20 .

[Thiefy]

you know, it's nice that people want less trampy females in games. makes it seem like some people still care for a little respect for ladies instead of treating them like sex objects. Very nice change of pace compared to most modern media outlets.



By the same token though, you do realize for all the complaining being done, you really DON'T see that much. Infact, were it not winter right now, you would probably see a 10 year old and a 50 year old female wearing less just shopping in your local mall.



Can't we all just find a nice middle ground? pretty please?

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...
Lol wikipedia, sure. what the wiki says is fine. And what I said is not wrong. Thats what promiscuity is and the wiki - if you want to use it on me - says the same deal. If you want something with more authority (say published literature) that corroborates what I said, look up the following and refer to the portion on the "promiscuous 10%". I don't want to dig into this any further than required, but if you're going to say someone is flat out wrong, make sure you aren't.
J Epidemiol Community Health 2004;58:889-890 doi:10.1136/jech.2004.027847

And yes, she does say that. It has been a while since she had a man in her bed. A choice she takes part in as much as any man that is willing to jump into bed with her such as ohgren or zevran. Its clearly happened before. If she ever propositioned anyone in the slightest, at any point in the game, I'd agree with you. but she doesnt and she refuses any proposition. The interpretation of the game is what is driving this out of hand. All opinions aside and with what we were shown by BioWare and a functional definition, this is where I arrive. And if it is only on the basis of her thinking ohgren and zevran are gross, then you are assuming she'd say yes to someone she found attractive and in that way not be a prude. thats a bad assumption to make if you're going to argue, work with what you've got as far as the game goes

...

So you're saying not sleeping with someone makes you a prude.

I better tell me perverted virgin friends they're prudes even though they watch more hentai than most of the people I know in sexual relationships.

Also...you know what you're trolling. I don't know why I didn't see it before.

Nope. I said wynne wasn't exciting in my opinion because i thought she was a prude and some people thought it was funny, and you told me to stop. go back and read the thread. Im not trolling you just kept arguing with what was originally a joke which some people thought was funny, and thats how we got here.

[Ryzaki]

It was a joke?



...Dude your sense of humor sucks.

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

It was a joke?

...Dude your sense of humor sucks.

Who is trolling now? lol 

[Ryzaki]

Tyrael02 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

It was a joke?

...Dude your sense of humor sucks.

Who is trolling now? lol 

Consider it payback for unnecessary facepalming.

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

It was a joke?

...Dude your sense of humor sucks.

Don't be a troll dude, don't like the joke, don't read it. Some people enjoyed it, you didn't. congratulations. 

[legbamel]

Torhagen wrote...

legbamel wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

TheMadCat wrote...

wulfsturm wrote...

Atakuma wrote...
I'm not going to be intentionally looking up her dress, just like I wasn't intentionally looking at Miranda's ass.

Well, no one is holding you at gun-point forcing you to look at anything - intentionally or not.

You're kind of forced to if that's what the shot focuses on, like BioWare did with Miranda's ass a few times.

And that's so terrible because ... ?

Because it breaks immersion to be having an emotional conversation and half of the screen shows her ass while you're supposed to be talking to her.  I'm trying to have a conversation about her family not sexually harass her.  And I'll be trying to fight a battle, not get repeated glimpses of Isabella's thong.  But I suspect there will be at least a few occasions where I'm forced to see her "assets" up close and personal whether I'm romancing her or not.

That is a whole other "problem" and has nothing to do with how a character is dressed

Ah, but they wouldn't have done it if their leading females hadn't been wearing skin-tight pleather or exposing enough of themselves that you wonder how they manage to stay in their tops when dodging melee attacks.

[Tyrael02]

Ryzaki wrote...

Tyrael02 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

It was a joke?

...Dude your sense of humor sucks.

Who is trolling now? lol 

Consider it payback for unnecessary facepalming.

LOL you /facepalmed first!