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AI Hacking Hilarity


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#26
jwalker

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jlb524 wrote...

jwalker wrote...

Well, it seems like Hayley didn't fall asleep during classes and took notes on Eddy's lessons.

Prison full of trash. Too much work. Robots can help. :lol:
ME2 - Automated prison maintenance


Aw, that's awesome!

I just finished that level...I didn't hack the heavy mech :(

Next time I will, though.


Thanks !

Are you planning a NG+ run ?
I don't know if a low level Shep might be able max out AI hacking and passive to improve hack's duration. So far, I've done Mordin's RM and Kasumi's LM. So at this point I have 2 tech upgrades and tech duration researched. Maybe if you wait until before Horizon.

This will be an interesting run. I reinstalled windows a few days ago. I have my save files, but  I lost all my achievements. So no chance of changing my bonus power. Blowing the mech's head off got me half through the "Head hunter" cheevo and a nice little explosion. :devil:

#27
kstarler

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jwalker wrote...

Are you planning a NG+ run ?
I don't know if a low level Shep might be able max out AI hacking and passive to improve hack's duration. So far, I've done Mordin's RM and Kasumi's LM. So at this point I have 2 tech upgrades and tech duration researched. Maybe if you wait until before Horizon.

This will be an interesting run. I reinstalled windows a few days ago. I have my save files, but  I lost all my achievements. So no chance of changing my bonus power. Blowing the mech's head off got me half through the "Head hunter" cheevo and a nice little explosion. :devil:

I did this mission over the weekend with a level 14 Engineer and was able to max Mechanic and AI Hacking, but after about an hour of trying to get the YMIR to shoot the enemies instead of me, I gave up. I did have the tech duration upgrade (2/5 upgrades, I believe). The problem I kept running into was that the mercs would drop my shields between hacks and then the hacked YMIR would finish me with a rocket to the face. However, I wasn't using the mech as a mobile shield, or I'd have likely been more successful. I had much more success with the YMIRs on Garrus' LM and Kasumi's LM. The hallways really helped to focus their fire.

By the way, thanks for the vid jwalker!

#28
Tony Gunslinger

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jwalker wrote...

Well, it seems like Hayley didn't fall asleep during classes and took notes on Eddy's lessons.

Prison full of trash. Too much work. Robots can help. :lol:
ME2 - Automated prison maintenance


Damn you, jwalker! I was going to make the same vid with my engineer but you beat me to it :P.

#29
jwalker

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kstarler wrote...

I did this mission over the weekend with a level 14 Engineer and was able to max Mechanic and AI Hacking, but after about an hour of trying to get the YMIR to shoot the enemies instead of me, I gave up. I did have the tech duration upgrade (2/5 upgrades, I believe). The problem I kept running into was that the mercs would drop my shields between hacks and then the hacked YMIR would finish me with a rocket to the face. However, I wasn't using the mech as a mobile shield, or I'd have likely been more successful. I had much more success with the YMIRs on Garrus' LM and Kasumi's LM. The hallways really helped to focus their fire.

By the way, thanks for the vid jwalker!


You're welcome!

I did have some problem using that Mech. If you wait in the first part room (don't know what is called), behind that bridge, you can hack it, but either doesn't draw aggro or if it does, doesn't find the route back the center of the room. Useless.
Going up through the bridge helped a lot.

Also I noticed that the mech's shields are a lot stronger than Shepard's. When you hack it, those are 500 points if i'm not mistaken. The robot takes a lot of fire and its shields still stand. They usually disappear when the hack's duration has expired. Shepard has a bit less than 300 points and those last around 0.5 seconds. 1 second if it is only harsh language


Tony Gunslinger wrote...
Damn you, jwalker! I was going to make the same vid with my engineer but you beat me to it :P.


:ph34r::ph34r::ph34r:

#30
RAF1940

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This definitely gets an "lol wut?"

#31
Aynien

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Kaylee went to the Alarei to help Tali, but they couldn't imagine that a
geth rebellion taked the place. They took the oportunity to do what
they do best...kill geths.

The Geth Rebellion

Modifié par Aynien, 25 janvier 2011 - 12:26 .


#32
Bozorgmehr

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Awesome videos jwalker and Aynien!

Updated the OP

jwalker wrote...

Also I noticed that the mech's shields are a lot stronger than Shepard's. When you hack it, those are 500 points if i'm not mistaken. The robot takes a lot of fire and its shields still stand. They usually disappear when the hack's duration has expired. Shepard has a bit less than 300 points and those last around 0.5 seconds. 1 second if it is only harsh language


Yeah, I noticed that too. I also think anti-shield powers don't receive double damage bonus versus hacked enemies' shields. Try Overload or ED against those shields, you only strip about half whereas 500 points shield is only a little more than grunts @ level 30 (and you can easily insta-strip their ~450 points shields). Weapons are also less effective. It's pretty amazing how long those Improved AI Hacking shields last; 500 points ain't much but it's enough to have target survive heavy fire for many seconds - usually long enough to recast AI Hacking.

#33
CroGamer002

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+1



AI hacking is very underrated.

#34
lazuli

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I've been using Tali lately on my Sentinel to take advantage of instant recharges on her Combat Drone, but I've also secured Improved AI Hacking for her. Hacking the FENRIS mechs on Thane's recruitment mission was awesome. They make tenacious allies because enemies aren't as good at evading them as the player can be.

#35
Morzak

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Bozorgmehr wrote...

Awesome videos jwalker and Aynien!

Updated the OP

jwalker wrote...

Also I noticed that the mech's shields are a lot stronger than Shepard's. When you hack it, those are 500 points if i'm not mistaken. The robot takes a lot of fire and its shields still stand. They usually disappear when the hack's duration has expired. Shepard has a bit less than 300 points and those last around 0.5 seconds. 1 second if it is only harsh language


Yeah, I noticed that too. I also think anti-shield powers don't receive double damage bonus versus hacked enemies' shields. Try Overload or ED against those shields, you only strip about half whereas 500 points shield is only a little more than grunts @ level 30 (and you can easily insta-strip their ~450 points shields). Weapons are also less effective. It's pretty amazing how long those Improved AI Hacking shields last; 500 points ain't much but it's enough to have target survive heavy fire for many seconds - usually long enough to recast AI Hacking.


Yeah the shields from improved AI hack are pretty durable, and yes you do way less damge ageinst them a evi shot at close range does not take them out on a hunter.  You can keep a destroyer alive for 3 to 4 hacks against the colossus on Haestroem, it's fun to let him battle it out.

Love all those videos great use of Hacking.

#36
Bozorgmehr

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lazuli wrote...

I've been using Tali lately on my Sentinel to take advantage of instant recharges on her Combat Drone, but I've also secured Improved AI Hacking for her. Hacking the FENRIS mechs on Thane's recruitment mission was awesome. They make tenacious allies because enemies aren't as good at evading them as the player can be.


Yeah, those FENRIS are awesome hacking tools. They will charge their pals and start their CQC attack - beware though, their attacks will hurt Shep also (getting too close).

Morzak wrote...

Yeah the shields from improved AI hack are pretty durable, and yes you do way less damge ageinst them a evi shot at close range does not take them out on a hunter. You can keep a destroyer alive for 3 to 4 hacks against the colossus on Haestroem, it's fun to let him battle it out.

Love all those videos great use of Hacking.


You noticed that too, eh. I don't have a clue how those 500 point shields behave - but it ain't like "normal" shields. I guess Bioware tested AI Hacking to be useful on Insanity; I wonder how long target's shield last on Casual though :)

And thanks.

#37
lazuli

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Bozorgmehr wrote...
Yeah, those FENRIS are awesome hacking tools. They will charge their pals and start their CQC attack - beware though, their attacks will hurt Shep also (getting too close).


Good to know.  I didn't have my shotgun yet, as I usually recruit Thane before the Collector Ship, so I wasn't close enough to notice the friendly fire.  I imagine LOKI's function similarly.

I am not impressed with LOKI's as a hacking target.  They're fine if you snag one in the middle of a big fight, but if there's any amount of walking to be done, they fail.  The FENRIS, on the other hand, seek out foes rapidly.  Admittedly, these are just my first impressions, and likely inaccurate.  I haven't given AI Hacking much of a chance before now, so I'll have to keep playing and see how it goes.

#38
Yakko77

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I may have to rethink my use of AI hack and cryo. I always skipped AI hack and went mainly with inferno.

#39
Yakko77

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The OP videos are awesome to be sure and not to take anything away from them but there's no way you could play that aggressively on insanity. Having a Claymore mod helps I'm sure but cover and a balanced squad are a must on insanity which is why I skipped on AI hack all together and focused on inferno instead of cryo.. Mattock rifle for the win at distance. Still, epic vids. i favorited and commented on several. Well done!

#40
Bozorgmehr

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lazuli wrote...

Good to know.  I didn't have my shotgun yet, as I usually recruit Thane before the Collector Ship, so I wasn't close enough to notice the friendly fire.  I imagine LOKI's function similarly.

I am not impressed with LOKI's as a hacking target.  They're fine if you snag one in the middle of a big fight, but if there's any amount of walking to be done, they fail.  The FENRIS, on the other hand, seek out foes rapidly.  Admittedly, these are just my first impressions, and likely inaccurate.  I haven't given AI Hacking much of a chance before now, so I'll have to keep playing and see how it goes.

LOKI's move slower but that's not a big deal. 'Course it's better when they can do their CQC attacks, but for me the most important aspect of hacking is the distraction. Keeping the LOKI between you and the other enemies will have it take all enemy fire (enemies always attack nearest (visible) enemy); this allows Shep to do as (s)he pleases - targeting enemies one at a time > sent in a drone and shoot to kill.

AI Hacking basically creates a "super" drone - instead of distracting a single enemy, target can distract multiple enemies. And like drones, damage isn't their main function. Positioning and timing is - knowing when and who to hack and how to move and position your squad will make a huge difference, and played right it can make any fight with synthetics involved very easy.

Just experiment and watch what happens to enemies; how they react and behave with a hacked enemy nearby. I tested the effect myself by hacking an enemy and moving in close to see what'd happen to Shep. Nothing if you keep your distance - check the Geth Gladiator video how to do it. It's great to watch enemies kill each other without paying any attention to Shepard - the main enemy :)

#41
Bozorgmehr

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Yakko77 wrote...

I may have to rethink my use of AI hack and cryo. I always skipped AI hack and went mainly with inferno.

AI Hacking is great, but Cryo Blast is good at rank 1 (you need rank 2 to unlock AI Hacking). Overload and Incinerate are great powers also, but there are too few hotkeys for Shep and squad, my Engineer has got room for 4-5 powers (depending on level and squadmates) hence some powers are not used and I invest those skill points in the powers I do use. I roughly use 3 builds (bold powers are hotkeyed):

1) Versus Bloodpack and Collectors: Overload (3); Heavy Incinerate (10); Attack Drone (10); Mechanic (10); Neural Shock (1); 17 points left.

2) Versus Geth: Attack Drone (10); Cryo Blast (3); Improved AI Hacking (10); Mechanic (10); Area Drain (10); 8 points left.

3) Versus BS and Eclipse mercs: Attack Drone (10); Cryo Blast (3); Improved AI Hacking (10); Mechanic (10); Neural Shock (1); 17 points left.

Engineers have too many powers to map; so I prefer investing the remaining points in powers I use often, and extra Cryo and/or Neural Shock duration is always nice (though not needed - both Cryo Blast and Neural Shock are great at rank 1). If you don't mind pausing occasionally it's probably better to invest in Overload and Incinerate; Incinerate rank 1 will trigger the fire dance on unprotected organic enemies and below level 20 (with a couple of tech upgrades) it can insta-strip Husk, Varren, FENRIS, LOKI and Vorcha armor - Overload rank 3 is required to take down shields, but 1 point is enough to detonate Pyros.

I prefer Neural Shock against organics - instant effect and better cooldown than Cryo Blast. But Cryo Blast also works on synthetics and gives a huge damage bonus when target is frozen; very effective versus powerful enemies.

The OP videos are awesome to be sure and not to take anything away from them but there's no way you could play that aggressively on insanity. Having a Claymore mod helps I'm sure but cover and a balanced squad are a must on insanity which is why I skipped on AI hack all together and focused on inferno instead of cryo.. Mattock rifle for the win at distance. Still, epic vids. i favorited and commented on several. Well done!



All videos are on Insanity and playing very aggressively makes things easier but also more risky. Enemy AI doesn't like you to get close and with proper distraction (Hacking and Drones) you can kill fast and easy. One mistake, however, can get you killed. I like the high risk, high reward playstyle, you'll die on a regular basis, but when everything works out it's awesome.

Some luck is involved in those videos - I cannot play like that 24/7. But I don't care dying a couple times each mission getting close to unload the Claymore - my favorite ME2 weapon. You need to mod the weapon loadout, but using the GPS or Mattock is probably more effective. Claymore requires getting really close to the enemy to be truly effective, but it's the best looking shotgun and I love the way it sounds :)

Glad to know you liked the videos :wizard:

#42
kstarler

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After having tried and finished the game as a hacking Engineer (and reducing the amount that I dislike the class by quite a bit), I was curious what builds folks are using to pull this off. Personally, I found the following build to be very useful:

3 Overload
10 Area Incinerate
10 Assault Drone
6 Cryo Blast
10 Improved AI Hacking
10 Mechanic
1 Stasis

I thought about doing 6 Overload and 3 Cryo, but by the end of the game, with all upgrades, 3 Overload was enough to drop shields on tightly grouped enemies (first time I ever did LotSB Parking Lot without dying even once, thanks to Area Pull with Samara and Unstable Warp with Liara!) Basically, I found this build to be viable even for non-hack missions once I hit level 30, though I'm not sure how viable it would be in a NG+, since the tech upgrades clearly make a difference.

I tried out a full mind control build (Maxed Dominate in place of Stasis and I could only get 3 Incineration or a gimped drone), but I found the delay on Dominate to be a big let down (first time I ever tried it.) It seems like Dominate would be a lot better if it didn't rag doll the enemy when it hit them. Plus, they don't draw enemy fire until they stand back up, and it seems like it didn't last as long as Hacking.

#43
Bozorgmehr

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Yeah, Dominate isn't that useful if you play CQC. Depending on enemy rank, it can take between 1-3 seconds before the effect kicks in and that time does count towards the duration. Dominating a Krogan with Dominate rank 1 is useless - the effect wears off before the Krogan is truly affected :)

Engineer is very flexible, there isn't a "best" build - which is good. I would go for Overload 6 and Cryo 3 - I think Overload is useless if it cannot strip shields, and rank 3 is enough (with some upgrades) and it still has an small AoE (you can still hit 2-3 enemies occasionally). You can even swap Stasis for Neural Shock or Slam for some Warp bombing. I don't like saying this, but the Engineer has more viable options regarding builds and bonus powers than Adepts!

#44
implodinggoat

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AI hacking and dominate are definitely some of the most underrated and powerful abilities in the game.  Although I find they work better on low level enemies rather than elite ones (like Krogan and YMIR mechs) since the effect lasts longer on them and since you can cast the power on them again to recharge their shields or barriers.

Even level 2 AI hacking will allow you to continually recharge the shields on a synthetic enemy that you've already hacked effectively keeping its allies constantly focused on their own ally rather than you and your squad. On top of that if your hacked puppet goes down you can just hack another one who's protection has gone down.

Modifié par implodinggoat, 02 février 2011 - 07:40 .


#45
Guest_iOnlySignIn_*

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I've been trying out AI Hacking with my new Engineer on the Purgatory and on Zorya.

Gotta say the most important issue in hacking a YMIR is *where* to hack it - if you hack it when it is moderately away from the other enemies (The critical distance is definitely less than 40 meters. I'd say it's about 20.) it will stand there stupidly doing nothing. You *have* to hack it before it walks too much away from its former allies, which requires you to either:

(1) Take down its armor and shields very fast from a distance. This option is viable for  Widow/Sniping Infiltrators;

or

(2) Get in closer and dance with it, wearing its defenses down while distracting its allies. This option is viable for Engineers/CQC Infiltrators.

After that there's the problem of *when* to hack it. If you hack it too late (after most other enemies are dead) it is useless. If you hack it too early, you run the risk of being gunned down by its allies.

All in all I have to say YMIR hacking is a b***h, and way less entertaining/satisfying than LOKI/Geth hacking. Big stupid ugly mechanical oafs. I find Stasis to be much more satisfying against them. For Engineers, I find the constant Drone spam + gunning it down straight away is often more productive than Hacking.

Modifié par iOnlySignIn, 02 février 2011 - 07:52 .


#46
Evilsod

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Surely its time for a Dominate version with a tag team of Shepard and Morinth?

#47
implodinggoat

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iOnlySignIn wrote...

All in all I have to say YMIR hacking is a b***h, and way less entertaining/satisfying than LOKI/Geth hacking. Big stupid ugly mechanical oafs. I find Stasis to be much more satisfying against them. For Engineers, I find the constant Drone spam + gunning it down straight away is often more productive than Hacking.


RE: AI Hacking Targets.

Very Poor


YMIRs are probably the worst target for AI hacking since the duration of AI hacking is reduced on them since they are considered subboss enemies.  Also since they take so long to lock onto and start attacking that by the time they start firing the hack has almost worn off.  I find the best way to take them down is just to unload on them with your guns and ideally finish them off with a sniper rifle headshot to make them go nuclear and take down any nearby enemies.

Poor

Geth Primes and Destroyers (the ones with the Flamethrowers) are also poor choices for hacking since they are also considered subboss enemies and thus the effect wears off on them rapidly although they do target their allies quicker then YMIRs.  FENRIS mechs are also very poor targets for AI hacking since they don't have guns and have to run up to their allies before they attack them and they also seem to take a very long time before they target their allies.

Good

LOKI mechs and Geth troopers are good targets since they make for an excellent distraction although they
won't be able to lay down damage as well as a Geth Hunter or Geth Rocket Trooper.   Combat Drones also make pretty decent targets for AI hacking even though they do expire eventually since they don't have any protection to take down and since they close in on their allies rapidly and can draw a decent amount of fire particularly if you
target them immediatley after they've been summoned.

Great

The best targets for AI hacking is probably the Geth Hunter since the AI hacking duration isn't as significantly reduced on them and since they can do heavy damage with their shotguns.  Geth Rocket troopers are also awesome targets for AI hacking since they aren't an elite enemy and their weapons are very devestating.


RE: Dominate Targets.

Very Poor

Krogan are rather poor targets for dominate; but since they're elite enemies the effect won't last as long and since they're kind of slow they'll probaly take a while to get to their targets.  Husks and Abominations are even worse targets since they won't turn and attack; but will merely die immediatley, granted this is still useful; but you have plenty of better options for killing them.  Varren and Klixen are also pretty sucky targets for dominate since they have to get within melee range before they start attacking their allies.

Poor

Elite Mercs and Collector Guardians are also poor targets for dominate since they are elite enemies the effect doesn't last as long and they don't do any more damage then a standard merc or collector would.  Merc Engineers or Biotics are also rather poor targets since they don't do more damage than standard mercs and they won't use their powers much if at all.

Good

Merc Troopers and Collector Troopers both make good targets for Dominate since they are low level enemies so the duration of dominate will be longest against them although mercs with shotguns are inferior targets unless they are already close to their allies in which case they are even better targets since shotguns are brutal at close range.

Great

Mercs or Vorcha with Rocket Launcher or Flamethrowers are the best possible targets for dominate since they are low level enemies who will be effected for the maximum duration of dominate and because their weapons are devestating.  Collector Assasins are also great targets even though they are elite troops who won't be effected for quite as long a duration because their particle beams are devestating at close or long range.


Pro Tips

#1:  If you've hacked an enemy and they're in a good position to attack their allies and you have level 2 or higher AI hacking or dominate keep hacking them to recharge their shields or barriers.

#2: If your hacking target's health drops lower than one of their allies whose defenses are down or if the defenses of a better AI target are taken down stop using hack or dominate to recharge the shields or barriers of your old target and switch over to the stronger enemy as your new choosen puppet.

#3:  An enemy effected by dominate can be detonated with a warp explosion.  So in effect you can use dominate to turn them into a walking bomb then detonate them in the middle of their friends.

#4:  I'd advise taking AI hacking or dominate to level 3; but not to level 4.  At level 3 you can significantly recharge your puppet's shields or barriers and the duration of your control over them is almost as long or longer than the recharge time on your power.  You don't really need the adittional shield or barriers and duration granted by level 4 hacking or dominate and the area effect of the other level 4 evolution isn't as useful as you might think since one puppet makes for nearly as good a distraction as two puppets will and since the area of effect is rarely large enough to capture two unprotected enemies.

Modifié par implodinggoat, 02 février 2011 - 09:20 .


#48
ShaggyWolf

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Nice videos, I think I'll definitely play an engineer after I finish my Adept playthrough. Love how you let yourself get nuked at the end of the last one :)

#49
Bozorgmehr

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Evilsod wrote...

Surely its time for a Dominate version with a tag team of Shepard and Morinth?


Dominate takes too long before taking (full) effect hence less suitable for CQC playstyle. But I'll give it a try. I do have a Dominate Engineer (low level) video: www.youtube.com/watch Dominate is one of the best powers for Mordin's RM, very effective and funny watching Vorcha Pyros do their thing on their pals :)

#50
Bozorgmehr

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implodinggoat wrote...

YMIRs are probably the worst target for AI hacking since the duration of AI hacking is reduced on them since they are considered subboss enemies.


True, YMIRs are not the best targets, but without defenses they're goners anyway. Not the easiest targets and they don't always play ball, but priceless if everything works out. :) Well worth the (small) effort IMHO.

Geth Primes and Destroyers (the ones with the Flamethrowers) are also poor choices for hacking since they are also considered subboss enemies and thus the effect wears off on them rapidly although they do target their allies quicker then YMIRs.


Those Geth are the perfect targets; Destroyers destroy their pals very quickly and duration isn't a issue. You can perma-hack all enemies in ME2 on your own (using Improved AI Hacking). Cooldown upgrades are not needed and maybe you can ignore passive duration bonus also.

FENRIS mechs are also very poor targets for AI hacking since they don't have guns and have to run up to their allies before they attack them and they also seem to take a very long time before they target their allies.


FENRIS are also perfect targets - you want targets to charge enemy positions and FENRIS have a nasty CQC attack that makes short work of enemy defenses. One FENRIS can do all sorts of damage to a enemy squad. Damage is not that important, distraction is - and since all enemies will target the closest visible enemy, a FENRIS moving towards them will take all enemy fire. You can walk behind the FENRIS without having to worry you get shot.

LOKI mechs and Geth troopers are good targets since they make for an excellent distraction although they
won't be able to lay down damage as well as a Geth Hunter or Geth Rocket Trooper.

  

LOKI's are perfect targets, Geth Troopers are tricky. All enemies who understand the concept of taking cover are potential backstabbers. Hacking / Dominating one nearby will almost always results in target getting to your position (taking cover). It doesn't draw enemy fire and when effect wears off, you'll end up with an angry enemy in your ranks - not good.

If you hack one who's far away (there must be an enemy between Shep and target) is better. Target can't get to your position and likely draws a lot of aggro - the things you want AI Hacking to accomplish.

Combat Drones also make pretty decent targets for AI hacking even though they do expire eventually since they don't have any protection to take down and since they close in on their allies rapidly and can draw a decent amount of fire particularly if you target them immediately after they've been summoned.



You can Hack enemy drones? LOL, didn't know that - I'll give it try, thanks for the tip.

The best targets for AI hacking is probably the Geth Hunter since the AI hacking duration isn't as significantly reduced on them and since they can do heavy damage with their shotguns.  Geth Rocket troopers are also awesome targets for AI hacking since they aren't an elite enemy and their weapons are very devastating.


Geth Hunters and Destroyers receive a 30% duration penalty - Primes a 40% penalty (like YMIRs). Hunters are nice, but they do little damage compared to Destroyers, but they always charge enemies (no cover) - all non-trooper-geth are excellent targets.

Krogan are rather poor targets for dominate; but since they're elite enemies the effect won't last as long and since they're kind of slow they'll probably take a while to get to their targets.


Same as other powerful enemies, with enough points in Dominate/Hacking this isn't a problem. Krogan are perfect target coz they will charge enemies - drawing all aggro. The delay before effect kicks in is annoying though. It makes Dominate far less useful compared to AI Hacking.

Husks and Abominations are even worse targets since they won't turn and attack; but will merely die immediately, granted this is still useful; but you have plenty of better options for killing them.

 

Husks die when Dominated, Abominations will suicide bomb for you - fun, but not that effective. It would be cool if you could orchestrate a Husk battle :D, not possible unfortunately.

All enemies who ignore cover and move towards their target are the best targets, the amount of damage they'll do isn't that important. The CC effect is what makes Hacking powerful. Hacking the right target and positioning Shepard accordingly can result in enemies butchering themselves, ignoring Shepard & Co completely. This allows easy kills, just pick them off one at a time.

Modifié par Bozorgmehr, 03 février 2011 - 06:19 .