242 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryzaki]

Eh I disagree with the Jack's swearing being mature. It felt to me at times that she was one of those kids that constantly cursed for attention.



....Then again I have a multitude of problems with Jack and this isn't the place to go into them.

[Oloos]

Nick Fox wrote...
A movie about Napolen using the f words on the horizon from hollywood anyone ? God help us all.
Just my thoughts on the matter.

Actually, a movie showing Napoléon swearing will be quite accurate. Not the "f-words" of course, because he was french and then use french words for the same purpose but yeah i really seeing him swears. Not a lot, and not in every situations but yeah. People swears. And it's not because they are dumb or immatures. They swear because they can (and because it's fun ). Get used to it guys...

And Ryzaki... That's exactly what Jack was : a lost child seeking attention. See ? it adds to the character.

Modifié par Oloos, 17 janvier 2011 - 06:59 .

[nijnij]

I don't care too much for the "realism" of swearing ; to me, the less fluffed a sentence is, the more impact it has. It's like the new Batman movies being super violent and with more modern architecture so that it's more realistic. Why on Earth would one want to watch a realistic film about a man dressed as a bat chasing a clown ?



I love curse words if they have stylistic beauty or comedic value (I wouldn't take an f-word from the Big Lebowski), or add an aura to a character, but I think they're often unnecessary. I think you know there's too much swearing when it stops being offensive (or funny). Same goes with gore. IMHO.

[nijnij]

Oloos wrote...

Nick Fox wrote...
A movie about Napolen using the f words on the horizon from hollywood anyone ? God help us all.
Just my thoughts on the matter.

Actually, a movie showing Napoléon swearing will be quite accurate. Not the "f-words" of course, because he was french and then use french words for the same purpose but yeah i really seeing him swears.

Napoléon famously told Talleyrand, his Great Chamberlain : " you're sh$! in silk tights !"

Modifié par nijnij, 17 janvier 2011 - 07:09 .

[Maria Caliban]

Ryzaki wrote...

Eh I disagree with the Jack's swearing being mature. It felt to me at times that she was one of those kids that constantly cursed for attention.

....Then again I have a multitude of problems with Jack and this isn't the place to go into them.

There's a difference between Jack being mature and her swearing being mature. It fit her character. A mature game/story has characters talk the way they would talk without worrying about the audience being offended.

Huckleberry Finn by Mark Twain is the most banned book in the US because it's young adult literature and the characters use racial slurs. These characters aren't mature. Most of them are rather foolish. The book itself is mature, and most people understand what Twain was working with the language of the time and using it to characterize the setting itself.

[Nick Fox]

Oloos wrote...

Nick Fox wrote...
A movie about Napolen using the f words on the horizon from hollywood anyone ? God help us all.
Just my thoughts on the matter.

Actually, a movie showing Napoléon swearing will be quite accurate. Not the "f-words" of course, because he was french and then use french words for the same purpose but yeah i really seeing him swears. Not a lot, and not in every situations but yeah. People swears. And it's not because they are dumb or immatures. They swear because they can (and because it's fun ). Get used to it guys...

And Ryzaki... That's exactly what Jack was : a lost child seeking attention. See ? it adds to the character.

I know the man was intesive in his personality that few can match and that he swore from time to time and more often than not gave his generals a few slews! Think you miss my point a little though, F words is really quite new and  is used by the "gangsta generation" mostly. Not by your grandmother for ex. see my point now? Language changes and swering curses along with it, thats why a movie about say Napoleon using the f word would be...shall we say just plain awkward and silly. So does a game that is set in an era thousend years ago. Sure you can do it, but dont expect to be taken seriously then. Adding humor and swering is all fine and dandy (got nothing against it) if used with class and a flash/winkin/ from the eye so to spek.

[Images]

Nick Fox wrote...



I know the man was intesive in his personality that few can match and that he swore from time to time and more often than not gave his generals a few slews! Think you miss my point a little though, F words is really quite new and  is used by the "gangsta generation" mostly. Not by your grandmother for ex. see my point now? Language changes and swering curses along with it, thats why a movie about say Napoleon using the f word would be...shall we say just plain awkward and silly. So does a game that is set in an era thousend years ago. Sure you can do it, but dont expect to be taken seriously then. Adding humor and swering is all fine and dandy (got nothing against it) if used with class and a flash/winkin/ from the eye so to spek.

The F-word is 500 years old.

[Images]

Good article on the F word

[Ryzaki]

Maria Caliban wrote...

There's a difference between Jack being mature and her swearing being mature. It fit her character. A mature game/story has characters talk the way they would talk without worrying about the audience being offended.

Huckleberry Finn by Mark Twain is the most banned book in the US because it's young adult literature and the characters use racial slurs. These characters aren't mature. Most of them are rather foolish. The book itself is mature, and most people understand what Twain was working with the language of the time and using it to characterize the setting itself.

What? 

Frankly I found the moments were Miranda and co cursed to be mature. It was appropriate to the situation and hell I fond myself cursing at the same moments.

With Jack it's like...I don't know it just sounds like those kids outside my house. /shrug

And I wasn't offended by her language (frankly I wondered why Shepard was crazy enough to have such a hostile person on his ship). Just at points it seemed really really lame to me (particularly the I'm a dangerous b****. Just plain cheesy and nonsenical.

Though I see your point about MT I don't see it applying to ME2.

[Nick Fox]

Images wrote...

Nick Fox wrote...



I know the man was intesive in his personality that few can match and that he swore from time to time and more often than not gave his generals a few slews! Think you miss my point a little though, F words is really quite new and  is used by the "gangsta generation" mostly. Not by your grandmother for ex. see my point now? Language changes and swering curses along with it, thats why a movie about say Napoleon using the f word would be...shall we say just plain awkward and silly. So does a game that is set in an era thousend years ago. Sure you can do it, but dont expect to be taken seriously then. Adding humor and swering is all fine and dandy (got nothing against it) if used with class and a flash/winkin/ from the eye so to spek.

The F-word is 500 years old.

That may be, still it wasnt used as often as it is today. Ask your daddy or grandfather and you know what I mean. Of course there have always been cursing but it changes (and so does the view of words etc) over time so even if the f word would be 700 years old the point for DA series to use it for ex is pretty moot. Wouldnt you say?
Some may see it fitting to use todays modern cuses in the game, I am not one of them however and I express why, thats all. (concerning DA series) 

Modifié par Nick Fox, 17 janvier 2011 - 07:34 .

[Oloos]

Quoting myself.

Oloos wrote...
Not the "f-words" of course, because he was french and then use french words for the same purpose but yeah i really seeing him swears.

So, as i say, Napoléon of course did'nt use the "f-word". Simply because the word alone did'nt mean anything in french. Or at least nothing really insulting. We have way more words in old or present french to choose for. He probably used some words religiously based like "Nom de dieu" and others. Choking by the time, not so much now.

Modifié par Oloos, 17 janvier 2011 - 07:42 .

[Oloos]

doublepost

Modifié par Oloos, 17 janvier 2011 - 07:42 .

[Nick Fox]

Oloos wrote...

Quoting myself.

Oloos wrote...
Not the "f-words" of course, because he was french and then use french words for the same purpose but yeah i really seeing him swears.

So, as i say, Napoléon of course did'nt use the "f-word". Simply because the word alone did'nt mean anything in french. Or at least nothing really insulting. We have way more words in old or present french to choose for. He probably used some words religiously based like "Nom de dieu" and others. Choking by the time, not so much now.

Well there you go then. We agree that it would be silly for a movie about Napoleon using the f word.  I dont get why you begun debate about that if you agreed though. Maybe your point was that he cursed and we agree there too.

Modifié par Nick Fox, 17 janvier 2011 - 07:53 .

[Images]

Nick Fox wrote...

That may be, still it wasnt used as often as it is today.

Nope, but it was still used. And if it wasn't there was probably an equivelant that was deemed JUST as harsh at the time. The same would go for any insult we use now. I point you to the series "Deadwood" which used modern curse words instead of the more time specific ones like "dern it" and "dangnabbit" because as viewers these would not get across the vulgarity the statement is supposed to have. Even with reaction shots it would still not feel right.

Ask your daddy or grandfather and you know what I mean.

Yeah...I'm gonna say a great big "shove it" to that wonderful example of a condescending sentence to direct at a grown man. My "daddy"? For real?

[Oloos]

Nick Fox wrote...

Well there you go then. We agree that it would be silly for a movie about Napoleon using the f word.  I dont get why you begun debate about that if you agreed though. Maybe your point was that he cursed and we agree there too.

My point was the curse in general yeah, not a word in particular. But still, in a movie where Napoléon speeks in english, i don't mind at all if he say "f***" sometimes. Because it's just an equivalent for the audience. Nothing more. As it can be in a Dragon Age game. A simple equivalent for the audience.

Modifié par Oloos, 17 janvier 2011 - 07:59 .

[Nick Fox]

Images wrote...

Nick Fox wrote...

That may be, still it wasnt used as often as it is today.

Nope, but it was still used. And if it wasn't there was probably an equivelant that was deemed JUST as harsh at the time. The same would go for any insult we use now. I point you to the series "Deadwood" which used modern curse words instead of the more time specific ones like "dern it" and "dangnabbit" because as viewers these would not get across the vulgarity the statement is supposed to have. Even with reaction shots it would still not feel right.


Personally I belive that was done to apeel to a younger audience and becouse of lack of understanding history. Thats my thought on the matter. Maybe you liked it, I did not.

Ask your daddy or grandfather and you know what I mean.

Yeah...I'm gonna say a great big "shove it" to that wonderful example of a condescending sentence to direct at a grown man. My "daddy"? For real?

Hmmm older generation feels better for you perhaps? You know what I meant (I think). If its offensive to you to use the word daddy I apologise my native tounge isnt English. But hey after that "Showe it" I may not!

[Nick Fox]

Oloos wrote...

Nick Fox wrote...

Well there you go then. We agree that it would be silly for a movie about Napoleon using the f word.  I dont get why you begun debate about that if you agreed though. Maybe your point was that he cursed and we agree there too.

My point was the curse in general yeah, not a word in particular. But still, in a movie where Napoléon speeks in english, i don't mind at all if he say "f***" sometimes. Because it's just an equivalent for the audience. Nothing more. As it can be in a Dragon Age game. A simple equivalent for the audience.

Ok so we dont agree on the f word part then, fine. Equivalent you say, perhaps to some and not for others!
So be it then, we have to agree to disagree then. Np.

[Images]

Urrrm, I think no matter what generation you think of, no matter how far back, swearing has been a part of it. Not in public speech but between human beings it is a natural part of showing frustration, ecstasy, annoyance, wonder or any number of potent emotions. Should it be done in front of children? Not really, but this game is not meant for children. And believe you me, when faced with a time of death, destruction, evil monsters and big breasted pirates, I would swear loud and proud.

[Oloos]

Well it's mostly because i don't find your "f-word" choking or anything. It's just a word like another one for me. As usual as "tool" or "fool". Nothing less, nothing more. So i find all this debate quite funny (like about every french people i know).

Modifié par Oloos, 17 janvier 2011 - 08:20 .

[Malanek]

Ryzaki wrote...
Eh I disagree with the Jack's swearing being mature. It felt to me at times that she was one of those kids that constantly cursed for attention.

Jacks character used bad language. It was realistic. Go into a prison or a violent gang head quarters and you will soon see that Jacks language was toned down if anything.

[Nick Fox]

Images wrote...

Urrrm, I think no matter what generation you think of, no matter how far back, swearing has been a part of it. Not in public speech but between human beings it is a natural part of showing frustration, ecstasy, annoyance, wonder or any number of potent emotions. Should it be done in front of children? Not really, but this game is not meant for children. And believe you me, when faced with a time of death, destruction, evil monsters and big breasted pirates, I would swear loud and proud.

Its not the swering in general that I mean, its that set in the "right" sort of cursing in its context that i am after. Not a big fan of trying to use modern language in "historical" set pices (Movies, games books etc).
To a certain degree you can imo but to me f-word in a DA game is just plain wrong choice of words. Its awkward to say the least.

[Ryzaki]

Malanek999 wrote...
Jacks character used bad language. It was realistic. Go into a prison or a violent gang head quarters and you will soon see that Jacks language was toned down if anything.

I have visited prisons and no her language didn't sound like that to me. It sounded more like an angry 15 year olds. As for violent gangs there's enough around my house to be sure.

*wonders why everyone treats thoughs who felt the language odd to never curse or be naive about language*

Edit: It's not her usage of the words but where she uses them. It mostly feels random. 


That said it's mostly the "they turned a scared girl to an all powerful b****." line. It just bothers me. It sounds so damn cheesy.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 17 janvier 2011 - 08:40 .

[ErichHartmann]

I gave up trying to count how many times I heard F*$! (and other colorful words) in a single day while I was in the Army. Jack would fit right in.

Modifié par ErichHartmann, 17 janvier 2011 - 08:38 .

[Images]

Ryzaki wrote...

As for violent gangs there's enough around my house to be sure.

Okey dokey. Ya ever...ask them to leave? Or at least to start paying rent? Is the kitchen neutral territory for the rival factions?

[Nick Fox]

Today its so common to hear swering on many different occasions that its truly lost its function in many ways. To insult somebody today with regular swering wont have the desierd effect any more.
Its also more used by certain people compared to others and will never ever be socialy accepted among older and higher social communitys as a social way of life. The more anonymous a peson can be (internet or in a car for ex) the more they let lose their "rage" that they wouldnt do publicly for ex. There are those who do but they are never really socialy acepted are they ?
Its the times we live in and cant say I enjoy hearing people act like cavemen but there it is. Its just the times we live in. We are all children of the enviroment we live in. Thats what i mean with cursing nowdays and how it was just say 50 years ago (before TV and multimedia culture we have today). Colder and harder society with more and more separetion between generations etc etc.

Just an observation, may be true or not.