1044 réponses à ce sujet

[Saibh]

Merced652 wrote...

So what exactly is your problem with him expressing that their new way of story delivery is execessively and needlessly interfereing with RP when they've shown they can make a successful game that did it to a much lesser extent? Or is this one of those, LEAVE BRITNEY ALONE things?

Perhaps he should just post his topic, everyone should read it, and then move on, never speaking of it again?

Or is this a forum?

Modifié par Saibh, 17 janvier 2011 - 11:18 .

[John Epler]

Simply because someone posts something you disagree with, it does not make them a troll.



Let's avoid applying that label too casually.

[In Exile]

AlanC9 wrote...

Of course, we can do this even when the NPC is out of hearing range, and we can do it without enemies overhearing.

There is a better retort - it is gameplay element, just like HP metres (which are not how the world truly functions), levels, and other such abstractions.

All that you need to defend then is gameplay/story segregation.

[the_one_54321]

Nighteye2 wrote...
Yes it still feels arbitrary. Wouldn't it be better to have every class be able to use every weapon, even those that their classes won't ever be proficient with?

Why not let mages clumsily try shooting bows, if the player so wishes?

the_one_54321 wrote...
Limiting the mechanics creates a certain style and atmosphere in the game. The loss of freedom forces the game to be played a certain way and the benefit is in the presentation that is created by forcing this style. For those that are only interested in freedom, this is a bad thing. For those that are interested in the style and feel of a game, the atmosphere, this is a good thing.

Modifié par the_one_54321, 17 janvier 2011 - 11:18 .

[Black_Warden]

Merced652 wrote...

So what exactly is your problem with him expressing that their new way of story delivery is execessively and needlessly interfereing with RP when they've shown they can make a successful game that did it to a much lesser extent? Or is this one of those, LEAVE BRITNEY ALONE things?

Whooooaaaaaaaaaahhhhhh woah woah..... Leave Britney out of this. She's done nothing wrong.

[Saibh]

In Exile wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Of course, we can do this even when the NPC is out of hearing range, and we can do it without enemies overhearing.

There is a better retort - it is gameplay element, just like HP metres (which are not how the world truly functions), levels, and other such abstractions.

All that you need to defend then is gameplay/story segregation.

I could swear that's what I said.

[Heimdall]

Saibh wrote...

In Exile wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Of course, we can do this even when the NPC is out of hearing range, and we can do it without enemies overhearing.

There is a better retort - it is gameplay element, just like HP metres (which are not how the world truly functions), levels, and other such abstractions.

All that you need to defend then is gameplay/story segregation.

I could swear that's what I said.

You did, and I said it too, unfortunately it doesn't stop anyone from ignoring it if they don't agree...

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 17 janvier 2011 - 11:23 .

[moilami]

Vanni127 wrote...

Christ on a ******, people. How in the world has this troll thread lasted to 11 pages?

Rule number one of the internet: Don't feed the damn trolls.

Mad had actually very valid points and he have all the rights to express his wishes and concerns regarding DA, as anyone else have. I though don't know was he trolling or not but the points and requests squeezed out of him were valid.

If he was trolling, he was not ugly troll.

[eyesofastorm]

Sylvius the Mad a troll? lol

We're not in Kansas anymore.

Modifié par eyesofastorm, 17 janvier 2011 - 11:26 .

[upsettingshorts]

Sylvius isn't a troll. He's an idiosyncratic volunteer game development auditor.

[the_one_54321]

If Sylvius is a troll. He is the best troll in history.

[In Exile]

Saibh wrote...

I could swear that's what I said.

You did. You just didn't when I was typing the post. I got ninja'd.

[Black_Warden]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Sylvius isn't a troll. He's an idiosyncratic volunteer game development auditor.

Advice to Sylvius:

put that **** on a business card.

[In Exile]

Sylvius is absolutely not a troll. He legitimately believes what he says; and he has a more or less consistent view on the matter. There are some consequences of his view where I don't feel he goes far enough, but on the whole he catches a lot of uneccesary flak.

[Sylvius the Mad]

the_one_54321 wrote...

You're not paying attention. Limiting the mechanics creates a certain style and atmosphere in the game. The loss of freedom forces the game to be played a certain way and the benefit is in the presentation that is created by forcing this style. For those that are only interested in freedom, this is a bad thing. For those that are interested in the style and feel of a game, the atmosphere, this is a good thing.

Why can't they just play the game like that, though, without forcing everyone to do it?

You made a dialog choice. The character  you are interacting with has been shown, visually and sometimes auditorily when refering to "Warden," to be specifically speaking with your character. This indicates that your character has made a decision.

You're jumping to this conclusion.  It isn't supported by the evidence.

Lord Aesir wrote...

So how do you incorperate the damage calculations and level up screens into your roleplaying?

Umm... the same way you incorporate Newton's Laws of Motion into your daily life.

What an odd question.

the_one_54321 wrote...

But it creates a concrete limitation to your ability to control your character.

So does gravity.  Not really a problem. 

Merci357 wrote...

You can accept that, just like it? How is saying, a warrior can't use a bow any different to saying a swashbuckler (as a specialty class) can't use a bow?

Wait.  So she's not a Rogue at all?  That would change a lot.

[Saibh]

In Exile wrote...

Saibh wrote...

I could swear that's what I said.

You did. You just didn't when I was typing the post. I got ninja'd.

Good god, man, then put the ninja emote in your post! How can I add you to my ongoing ninja tally if you don't? Soon, I shall be a green belt in ninja.

[the_one_54321]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...
Why can't they just play the game like that, though, without forcing everyone to do it?

Because, according to your view, it is not your game. It's BioWare's game, and this is how they want it to be experienced.

Sylvius the Mad wrote...
You're jumping to this conclusion.  It isn't supported by the evidence.

I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. In a number of cases there are things that specifically do happen on-screen. These things occur in the game world. They are not interpretable.

[Heimdall]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

So how do you incorperate the damage calculations and level up screens into your roleplaying?

Umm... the same way you incorporate Newton's Laws of Motion into your daily life.

You rationalize Newton's Law of Motion?

[Saibh]

Slyvius the Mad wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...

So how do you incorperate the damage calculations and level up screens into your roleplaying?

Umm... the same way you incorporate Newton's Laws of Motion into your daily life.

What an odd question.

"Hey, Beth, guess what!"

"What?"

"You know how I was trying to put on that Helm of the Seeker earlier, and it was too heavy, and I toppled over every time I tried?"

"Sure."

"Well, I just went and read a bunch of books on Kirkwallian history, and now I can wear it! Weird, huh?"

This makes no sense in real life. None. How do reading Codexes and doing nothing but reading Codexes give you the power to better dodge arrows, take axes to the head, wear plate armor, or pick locks, if they have nothing to do with any of those?

[the_one_54321]

Lord Aesir wrote...
You rationalize Newton's Law of Motion?

No, he's saying that the mechanical calculations made by the game are the equivilant of the laws of physics in the game world.

Saibh wrote...
This makes no sense in real life. None.

Nothing about any of these games makes much of any sense in real life when you take the time to really consider it. It's a matter almost entirely of personal interpretations.

Modifié par the_one_54321, 17 janvier 2011 - 11:34 .

[Heimdall]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...
You rationalize Newton's Law of Motion?

No, he's saying that the mechanical calculations made by the game are the equivilant of the laws of physics in the game world.

I'm talking about level up mechanics and such in general.  Though I'm curious how he would handle the floating numbers...

[AlanC9]

Saibh wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Of course, we can do this even when the NPC is out of hearing range, and we can do it without enemies overhearing.

Like I said, the game part of gameplay.

I honestly don't really care what the Warden is allowed to do and what the party members are allowed to do.

Roleplaying and gameplay do not always mesh without fail. I can't think of a single game where I can reasonably say "absolutely no part of this game interfered with roleplaying".

Sure. If you're saying that the gameplay line is inherently arbitrary, I'm with you. But then it's not really correct to say that we're doing what a "commander" can do. We're executing a bunch of game functions which have a fairly large overlap with what a RL squad leader can do. I thought you were going simulationist in that post.

I actually came to appreciate NWN1's limited control after a while 

[Heimdall]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Saibh wrote...
This makes no sense in real life. None.

Nothing about any of these games makes much of any sense in real life when you take the time to really consider it. It's a matter almost entirely of personal interpretations.

That's the point.

[In Exile]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...
You're jumping to this conclusion.  It isn't supported by the evidence.

It is. The preponderance of evidence points to it being true. Which, of course, you don't think is evidence.

Umm... the same way you incorporate Newton's Laws of Motion into your daily life.

Incorrectly? These laws of motion don't actually describe the fundamental rules of the universe insofar as physics is concerned. If we are going to be purely philosophical about it, without allowing abudction as a justified form of reaosning, the logical concluson is that they don't describe anything more than a convenient mathematical shortform that allows for technological advances.

Modifié par In Exile, 17 janvier 2011 - 11:37 .

[eyesofastorm]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Lord Aesir wrote...
You rationalize Newton's Law of Motion?

No, he's saying that the mechanical calculations made by the game are the equivilant of the laws of physics in the game world.

Is it me or have things changed a bit since this crowd was last altogether here?  

edit:  I suppose it's possible you folks have been here debating DA2 for weeks or months.  This is the first one I've seen.

Modifié par eyesofastorm, 17 janvier 2011 - 11:37 .