1869 réponses à ce sujet

[Lotion Soronarr]

White_Buffalo94 wrote...

I think the Circles are necessary, I just feel they should not be governed by a biased system. The Chantry is biased, nobody can deny it, because it is basic human instinct to be biased against something that has caused harm in the past to your people.I compare Zthrian to the Chantry in fact, because he oppresses a people for something their ancestors did, just as the Chantry oppresses people for something people with their talents did.

Give me an example of a non-biased system and then we can talk.
No matter whom you put in charge, there will not be any less bias.

[LoneStalker]

I know, it's not directly relevant but I can't keep myself from asking:

How does the phlactery's work exactly? Yes, they contain blood of Circle mages and yes, templars use them to locate mages going rogue. But how exactly? It sounds as if blood magic is involved here. But hey, since it's conducted by the Chantry, who am I to suspect, right?

[atheelogos]

White_Buffalo94 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

SgtElias wrote...

Seagloom wrote...

 I also think that there is no other viable alternative to policing mages. An organization with a few bad eggs keeping order is better than no order at all. If David Gaider's quotes in the previous page are any indication, life before mage circles was far from idyllic for either enchanters or mundanes.

I disagree, but that's one of the reasons I'm so excited for Dragon Age 2; I wonder what sort of choices we'll have to make about this very subject?

How can you disagree with Word of God?
If DG sez Circles are necessary, then they are.
If he sez that the world was worse off before the Circles, then it is so.


EDIT: B.t.w - a Circle is led by the First Enchanter (mage) and Knight-Commander (templar). So to say that mages have no say in how the Circle is run is bollocks.

I think the Circles are necessary, I just feel they should not be governed by a biased system. The Chantry is biased, nobody can deny it, because it is basic human instinct to be biased against something that has caused harm in the past to your people.I compare Zthrian to the Chantry in fact, because he oppresses a people for something their ancestors did, just as the Chantry oppresses people for something people with their talents did.

The First Enchanter can be superceded by the Knight-Commander. Although, Gregoir seemed like one of the few good templars. I in fact, don't think tempalrs are all that bad, I think that what they follow is evil, and brainwashes them. If every tempalr was like Gregoir, then it wouldn't be so bad, but non-mages are bred to believe magic is evil and sinful. Ser Perth gets a little pissy if you tell him the medallions are not magical, which made me end up killing him right on Eamons doorstep

"I think the Circles are necessary, I just feel they should not be governed by a biased system" I agree. Magical schools are very necessary indeed. Note the key word there "school" They have the potential to be wonderful places for learning where people go for a majority of the year and then they could return to their families for holidays or other breaks, but as it stands today they're just prisions run by a bigoted church.

[atheelogos]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

White_Buffalo94 wrote...

I think the Circles are necessary, I just feel they should not be governed by a biased system. The Chantry is biased, nobody can deny it, because it is basic human instinct to be biased against something that has caused harm in the past to your people.I compare Zthrian to the Chantry in fact, because he oppresses a people for something their ancestors did, just as the Chantry oppresses people for something people with their talents did.

Give me an example of a non-biased system and then we can talk.

I think he knows that. What I think he meant is bias within bounds of reason. The Chantry is not that.

[Seagloom]

LoneStalker wrote...

I know, it's not directly relevant but I can't keep myself from asking:
How does the phlactery's work exactly? Yes, they contain blood of Circle mages and yes, templars use them to locate mages going rogue. But how exactly? It sounds as if blood magic is involved here. But hey, since it's conducted by the Chantry, who am I to suspect, right?

David Gaider at PAX

He answers that question starting at the 9:50 mark. Technically it is blood magic. Just one of the many reasons the Chantry is... iffy.

Modifié par Seagloom, 19 janvier 2011 - 11:38 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

atheelogos wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

White_Buffalo94 wrote...

I think the Circles are necessary, I just feel they should not be governed by a biased system. The Chantry is biased, nobody can deny it, because it is basic human instinct to be biased against something that has caused harm in the past to your people.I compare Zthrian to the Chantry in fact, because he oppresses a people for something their ancestors did, just as the Chantry oppresses people for something people with their talents did.

Give me an example of a non-biased system and then we can talk.

I think he knows that. What I think he meant is bias within bounds of reason. The Chantry is not that.

Sez who?

[Morroian]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Sez who?

The history of any medieval religious church.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Bollocks.



What.. You think he king of Ferelden would be any less biased? A mage organization itself?

Everyone has their own reasons and agendas..EVERYONE. No exceptions.



The only difference is weather you approve of those reasons or agendas.

And what would "bias within the bounds of reason" even mean in this context? I have a feeling already know the answer, but humor me...

[AlexXIV]

I guess 'mages are dangerous' is bias within the bounds of reason. Because it's true. I think magic is about the biggest threat to the citizens of Thedas.

[Reaverwind]

Seagloom wrote...

LoneStalker wrote...

I know, it's not directly relevant but I can't keep myself from asking:
How does the phlactery's work exactly? Yes, they contain blood of Circle mages and yes, templars use them to locate mages going rogue. But how exactly? It sounds as if blood magic is involved here. But hey, since it's conducted by the Chantry, who am I to suspect, right?

David Gaider at PAX

He answers that question starting at the 9:50 mark. Technically it is blood magic. Just one of the many reasons the Chantry is... iffy.

That's how it works? I'm surprised mages haven't figured out how to circumvent it.

[Shadelon]

Johnny Shepard wrote...

There was a really intresting discusion in the Meredith thread before it go compleatly of track with talk about Mages should be ruling the world and blowing up things for fun.

Awww....But that sounds like so much fun!

[Nerevar-as]

AlexXIV wrote...

I guess 'mages are dangerous' is bias within the bounds of reason. Because it's true. I think magic is about the biggest threat to the citizens of Thedas.

Five Blights and two sleeping OG waiting to become AD disagree with you.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Once those two OG are gone...no more Blight? At least that problem has a solution and is highly visible/detectable.

[Beerfish]

LoneStalker wrote...

I know, it's not directly relevant but I can't keep myself from asking:
How does the phlactery's work exactly? Yes, they contain blood of Circle mages and yes, templars use them to locate mages going rogue. But how exactly? It sounds as if blood magic is involved here. But hey, since it's conducted by the Chantry, who am I to suspect, right?

That is something I've wondered about as well.  How the whole "find the mage via his vial of blood thing" works.


Ah, didn't see Seaglooms link.  Thanks for that!  Yeah that is hypocrisy indeed but yes the Chantry is 'iffy' indeed.  (Mages still need to be regulated.)

Modifié par Beerfish, 19 janvier 2011 - 03:09 .

[chunkyman]

If mages were meant to be free, the Maker wouldn't have made them so easy to stuff into cages.

[atheelogos]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Bollocks.

What.. You think he king of Ferelden would be any less biased?

:pinched::pinched::pinched: ..........Obviously seeing as both Alistair and Anora are tolerant enough to grant the Mages in Ferelden their freedomd, or did you not get that ending lol;)

[atheelogos]

chunkyman wrote...

If mages were meant to be free, the Maker wouldn't have made them so easy to stuff into cages.

Assuming the Maker exist at all.

[BIO18]

Im gonna root for the templars on this one . Mages should be kept in that tower . Its alwaise been that way . "The goal is not to make the world a better place , but to make sure to keep it the way it is " If I have to pick between religious drug addicts that have been here since the dawn of time and the dangerous blight starting mages ... I choose templars no hesitation .

[atheelogos]

BIO18 wrote...

Im gonna root for the templars on this one . Mages should be kept in that tower . Its alwaise been that way . "The goal is not to make the world a better place , but to make sure to keep it the way it is " If I have to pick between religious drug addicts that have been here since the dawn of time and the dangerous blight starting mages ... I choose templars no hesitation .

"The goal is not to make the world a better place" Actually yes it is. Thats why the Chantry does what it does. To make the world a better place and hope that by doing so their good actions will brings the Maker back.

"and the dangerous blight starting mages" Your assuming that story is true. Right now I don't think their is enough evidence to say one way or the other on that one.

[Reaverwind]

atheelogos wrote...

BIO18 wrote...

Im gonna root for the templars on this one . Mages should be kept in that tower . Its alwaise been that way . "The goal is not to make the world a better place , but to make sure to keep it the way it is " If I have to pick between religious drug addicts that have been here since the dawn of time and the dangerous blight starting mages ... I choose templars no hesitation .

"The goal is not to make the world a better place" Actually yes it is. Thats why the Chantry does what it does. To make the world a better place and hope that by doing so their good actions will brings the Maker back.

"and the dangerous blight starting mages" Your assuming that story is true. Right now I don't think their is enough evidence to say one way or the other on that one.

I think it IS likely some over-ambitious magisters were experimenting in the Fade and accidentally unleashed something - and then the Chantry put their spin on what happened.

[Addai]

LoneStalker wrote...

I know, it's not directly relevant but I can't keep myself from asking:
How does the phlactery's work exactly? Yes, they contain blood of Circle mages and yes, templars use them to locate mages going rogue. But how exactly? It sounds as if blood magic is involved here. But hey, since it's conducted by the Chantry, who am I to suspect, right?

When the Chantry supervises, it's not really blood magic.  It's blood-based magic.  Get the difference?

Neither do I.  lol

[Addai]

atheelogos wrote...

"The goal is not to make the world a better place" Actually yes it is. Thats why the Chantry does what it does. To make the world a better place and hope that by doing so their good actions will brings the Maker back.

Technically it's just to spread the Chant of Light everywhere to get the Maker to come back.  That's not quite "making the world a better place."  Especially if you're on the receiving end of an Exalted March.

[BIO18]

Yeah but what I mean is why change the order of things . The world still exists and existed for a long time with the templar protection . Why risk changing that , it could end up better , but it could end up really bad .

[Captain Crash]

Everyone has the right to freedom. No matter what your belief on the issue of mages being powerful or a threat. Being subjugated only causes fear and anger which in turn causes revolt.



Common theme in history which happens over and over again. Take away someones right to live free and face the consequences. No one ever learns.

[Schneidend]

The Chantry's been on my spit list ever since the Lothering Revered Mother outright ignored my evocation of the Right of Conscription.



Free the mages to spite them, I say!