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What Paragon choices are most likely to bite you in the *** in ME3?


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#51
Exile Isan

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Bluko wrote...

Rewriting the Geth seems like a bad idea.

I've doubt we've seen the last of the Heretics. Would be hilarious if that one decision had a mjaor blowback for Paragons as all the Geth become Heretics. Well that is unlikely, but I'm guessing there will be rogue Geth to deal with still even in ME3.


This is the only decision that I have my doubts about. The Collector Base, not so much. In Retribution it makes it sound like Shepard destroyed the Base and TIM still ended up with Reaper tech.

#52
TexasToast712

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Not killing Vito Santiago.

#53
Arijharn

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Bluko wrote...
I've doubt we've seen the last of the Heretics. Would be hilarious if that one decision had a mjaor blowback for Paragons as all the Geth become Heretics. Well that is unlikely, but I'm guessing there will be rogue Geth to deal with still even in ME3.

I don't think they'll be 'rogue' but brainwashed by Admiral Xen in some capacity.

#54
PauseforEffect

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Letting Kasumi keep the greybox.

#55
Sajuro

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TexasToast712 wrote...

Not killing Vito Santiago.

I don't think so, what's he going to do? If he attacks you you can take him, if he starts running Amok Shepard will get word of it.

#56
TexasToast712

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Sajuro wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...

Not killing Vito Santiago.

I don't think so, what's he going to do? If he attacks you you can take him, if he starts running Amok Shepard will get word of it.

Not killing him I feel will lead to Zaeed not sticking around for ME3 because he wants his revenge.

#57
Aimi

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Since he was contracted for the Collector job, would he stay around anyway?

#58
Lunatic LK47

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Arijharn wrote...

I want consequences for my paragon and renegade to be sure... there shouldn't be such a thing as a 'perfect' outcome.

For paragon though; I would definitely like to see Corporal Toombs as a nice fitting consequence. You free him from Dr. Wayne's 'tender ministrations' and I'd like him to go crazy and try to kill you in ME3... bonus marks if he attempts it several times, but eventually it gets to a point where he either kills you or you kill him, because he can't trust anything you say anymore since you turned out to be a 'Cerberus lackey' anyway.


Problem with this: It makes making the decision completely meaningless.

#59
STG

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Joker: "Only a fool believes in the official story."



Shepard: "I agree."

#60
marshalleck

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None. Bioware don't punish their lawful good paladins.

#61
oldag07

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Destroying the base, while might not have big macro consequences, it might have unintended microconseqences.



Take for example Miranda's sister. Miranda's sister is protected because Cerberus wants her loyalty. Miranda turns on them with Shepard. Cerberus doesn't need to protect Miranda's sister anymore, and they have reason punish her. Cerberus therefore might give Miranda's sister away to her father.

#62
Guest_ShadowJ20_*

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oldag07 wrote...

Destroying the base, while might not have big macro consequences, it might have unintended microconseqences.

Take for example Miranda's sister. Miranda's sister is protected because Cerberus wants her loyalty. Miranda turns on them with Shepard. Cerberus doesn't need to protect Miranda's sister anymore, and they have reason punish her. Cerberus therefore might give Miranda's sister away to her father.


This doesn't make much sense because everyone is still on the same side. Doing the above^ isn't going to bring the base back and isn't going to help beat the Reapers.  Post mission screen said the location was extracted so Cerberus might not even know.

#63
klossen4

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Destroy Raiden wrote...


Destroying the geth

Thats renegade choice.

#64
didymos1120

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klossen4 wrote...

Destroy Raiden wrote...


Destroying the geth

Thats renegade choice.


That seems to a real problem for a lot of people.  They keeping citing renegade choices.

#65
Zan Mura

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TS2Aggie wrote...

Like the title describes.

Personally I think that the more criminals Commander Shepard lets go with only a stern warning, the more likely people will be to continue (or even start) committing atrocities against other sapient/sentient beings. After all, if there's no consequences to torture/murder/extortion, etc., why should they bother stopping? Worst you'll get is being "threatened" with a gun...that Shepard will never use against you.

Any other good ideas for what Paragons will regret?


Next to none, to be honest. The devs have stated multiple times their disdain for those "gotcha" moments, and it's not within the theme of ME to punish the player for their good intentions, as it occasionally is with Dragon Age: Origins. All those random criminals a goodie Sheps might have let go will play a miniscule role at best, and as far as the big decisions go, they will likely play out with the same overall power result regardless of which way you went. Saving the council that was stagnant and did nothing, wasting precious troops doing so, will not backfire. Saving the Rachni Queen with a very real risk that she was lying to you, or assuming that whatever the Reapers did to brainwash her people couldn't be repeated, will not backfire. Choosing to destroy the Human-Reaper construct and blowing up the base, effectively destroying technology and warfare potentially centuries or more ahead of the best the galaxy currently has, will not backfire.

And similarly, the opposite is also true. A brutal bad-ass Sheps will not benefit from doing the opposite decisions either. Story-wise, I'm sure they'll both deliver just fine and each feel as though your choices mattered. But my point is, you don't have to worry about pushing yourself into a corner or locking yourself out of serious content based on any previous choices. I'm pretty sure of that.

#66
Vaenier

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Releasing a terrorist that was about to kill a planet should bite you in the ass so badly, yet nothing. Bioware sucks at writing consequences. When a planet killing terrorist can just walk away without anything bad happening, then the writers have failed to create a convincing story. Fraking morality system sucks, "oh they are Paragon, they should never have anything bad happen to them because of their extremist views..."

#67
jbblue05

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Bioware isn't going to severely punish decisions.

Bioware wants to make your choices lead to the same objective.

Bioware knows people are going to re-do saves if Balak winds up destroying 2 human colonies in the past couple of years.

#68
Vaenier

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jbblue05 wrote...

Bioware isn't going to severely punish decisions.
Bioware wants to make your choices lead to the same objective.
Bioware knows people are going to re-do saves if Balak winds up destroying 2 human colonies in the past couple of years.

Without consequence, there is no choice. Paragons should have to make that choice, save the hostages now and risk his next attack succeding, or take him out and risk the hostages. instead the terrorist magically disapears and never attacks again. terrorism is super easy with FTL and orbital bombardment, he should have no trouble commiting more acts.

And if the Renegade choice is a better choice in this instance, then good. They need to stop being equal and interchangable. Sometimes one is just better than the other. People need to learn to be flexable, stop being principle zealots.

#69
Zan Mura

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Vaenier wrote...

Without consequence, there is no choice.


Partially agreed. But it's not simple to bring this about in a videogame. In real life, you have to balance between a goody and an a-hole all the time in order to get things done. It's just the way things work. When it truly matters, people will not bow down to you because you're nice and kind... you need to force them to do that. Of course there are shades there as well, no need to go all black / white and immediately jump to violence simply because of one exception.

But movies and games are different. They can be escapism in more ways than just the sci-fi theme and seemingly magical powers, allowing for the player to feel as if they're the most important person in the galaxy etc... there's also that ability to be true to an ideal and have the world bend around it. Another kind of escapism, you could say.

Now I don't disagree with your sentiment, what with the idea of the principles zealot and all. But I do believe that should depend on the trademark. ME has already established itself as the sort of game where you can be as good as you want, without any severe consequences. You should note the SAME idea applies to being an a-hole as well. At worst, Shepard can behave in such a manner he would never have been given the power and the political respect to make many of his feats possible. This game is about being able to do all that, even when you couldn't in real life.

DAO is more realistic in that respect, since even while it's quite lenient on this stuff as well, it still carries greater consequences than ME. For instance, the whole decision with who gets to rule Orzammar.

Modifié par Zan Mura, 19 janvier 2011 - 08:24 .


#70
Sajuro

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I expect many will want the main punishment to be for not being renegades.

#71
Omnicrat

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Vaenier wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Bioware isn't going to severely punish decisions.
Bioware wants to make your choices lead to the same objective.
Bioware knows people are going to re-do saves if Balak winds up destroying 2 human colonies in the past couple of years.

Without consequence, there is no choice. Paragons should have to make that choice, save the hostages now and risk his next attack succeding, or take him out and risk the hostages. instead the terrorist magically disapears and never attacks again. terrorism is super easy with FTL and orbital bombardment, he should have no trouble commiting more acts.

And if the Renegade choice is a better choice in this instance, then good. They need to stop being equal and interchangable. Sometimes one is just better than the other. People need to learn to be flexable, stop being principle zealots.


I'm a rl principle zealot, so I like the fact that the game lets you do that.  Now, I do make renegade choices, but thats because the renegade choice is the right choice.  (ie, blowing up the heretics instead of brainwashing them).  I haven't played the dlc for ME1 yet (I lent it to a freind befor getting xbox live and he still hasn't finnished it) so I'm not 100% certain I'm going to save the colony, but I probably am.  And the terrorist should go on to kill more people.  But I saved the ones I could.

#72
Omnicrat

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Sajuro wrote...

I expect many will want the main punishment to be for not being renegades.


Seriously.  Why are so many people pro-renegade?  I just don't get it.

#73
Bigdoser

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This whole paragon vs renegade is ****ing childish, just enjoy the dam game and stop worrying about what other peoples choices are dear god =_=

Modifié par Bigdoser, 19 janvier 2011 - 08:57 .


#74
Omnicrat

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Bigdoser wrote...

This whole paragon vs renegade is ****ing childish, just enjoy the dam game and stop worrying about what other peoples choices are dear god =_=


It is childish to have a disscusion of the ethical/practical ramifications of brainwashing a race as opposed to preforming genocide on it? Posted Image

edit:  I like the word ramifications better.

Modifié par Omnicrat, 19 janvier 2011 - 09:14 .


#75
Mr. Sniper Rifle

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Omnicrat wrote...

Bigdoser wrote...

This whole paragon vs renegade is ****ing childish, just enjoy the dam game and stop worrying about what other peoples choices are dear god =_=


It is childish to have a disscusion of the ethical/practical ramifications of brainwashing a race as opposed to preforming genocide on it? Posted Image

edit:  I like the word ramifications better.


The debates fine; it's a fun little thing to discuss. Problem is, people are treating it like a war over which is the 'right' way to play, and then trying to cram it down the other side's throat.

Modifié par Mr. Sniper Rifle, 19 janvier 2011 - 09:37 .