591 réponses à ce sujet

[Augustei]

Something tells me Kal-Sharok is going to be the last standing Thaig soon though. Regardless of which choice players made

[LobselVith8]

XxDeonxX wrote...

The Circle in Orzamaar will accomplish nothing but an Exalted March against the Dwarves which will inevitably end in Orzamaar's defeat.

And who will they send into Orzammar, the templars?The Chantry will never risk the lyrium trade that the templars are addicted to.

XxDeonxX wrote...

I mean they are just one little thaig with only a handful of golems and not enough time to make more even if you do side with Branka. Whereas the Chantry is a massive world super power commanding vast armies with several nations under its dominion. And has only really failed one exalted march which was against Tevinter. Orzamaar clearly does not match the Might of tevinter.

Not one, several against Tevinter. And they had a truce with the Qunari, who they defeated primarily because of the Circle of Magi.

XxDeonxX wrote...

So It will be braught to its knees and they will be forced to live like the elves or they will be completely annihilated. This is more likely with Bhelen as he is stubborn and he will most likely not give up his power until the last possible moment.

Unlikely. Even an incompetent Harrowmont as King is able to blockade Orzammar from the surface world, who attack because of Branka's raids. 

XxDeonxX wrote...

Harrowmont on the other hand, is a man of compromise and where his abilities fail in Orzamaar's politics they will succeed in human ones. So Harrowmont would be the better choice if the circle in Orzamaar is established.  

I respectfully disagree. Harrowmont isolates Orzammar, and Bhelen doesn't. The Circle can propser under Bhelen's regime, not Harrowmont's.

[Augustei]

LobselVith8 wrote...

XxDeonxX wrote...

The Circle in Orzamaar will accomplish nothing but an Exalted March against the Dwarves which will inevitably end in Orzamaar's defeat.

And who will they send into Orzammar, the templars?The Chantry will never risk the lyrium trade that the templars are addicted to.

XxDeonxX wrote...

I mean they are just one little thaig with only a handful of golems and not enough time to make more even if you do side with Branka. Whereas the Chantry is a massive world super power commanding vast armies with several nations under its dominion. And has only really failed one exalted march which was against Tevinter. Orzamaar clearly does not match the Might of tevinter.

Not one, several against Tevinter. And they had a truce with the Qunari, who they defeated primarily because of the Circle of Magi.

XxDeonxX wrote...

So It will be braught to its knees and they will be forced to live like the elves or they will be completely annihilated. This is more likely with Bhelen as he is stubborn and he will most likely not give up his power until the last possible moment.

Unlikely. Even an incompetent Harrowmont as King is able to blockade Orzammar from the surface world, who attack because of Branka's raids. 

XxDeonxX wrote...

Harrowmont on the other hand, is a man of compromise and where his abilities fail in Orzamaar's politics they will succeed in human ones. So Harrowmont would be the better choice if the circle in Orzamaar is established.  

I respectfully disagree. Harrowmont isolates Orzammar, and Bhelen doesn't. The Circle can propser under Bhelen's regime, not Harrowmont's.

By Isolating Orzamaar he would be keeping out the very Apostates and Maleficarum that would start the exalted march in the first place however.

The Chantry still has Kal-Sharok for the lyrium trade and the seekers to keep the Templars in line, They would still be willing to risk it i'd bet. The Divine was already considering it during the epilogue

[KnightofPhoenix]

Kal-Sharok has no lyrium.

[Augustei]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Kal-Sharok has no lyrium.

Where does it say that?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Either the codex or the wiki, I forgot. What I do remember is that Kal Sharok has apparently no access to the surface and is very poor because of lack of ressources.

[LobselVith8]

XxDeonxX wrote...

By Isolating Orzamaar he would be keeping out the very Apostates and Maleficarum that would start the exalted march in the first place however.

The Chantry still has Kal-Sharok for the lyrium trade and the seekers to keep the Templars in line, They would still be willing to risk it i'd bet. The Divine was already considering it during the epilogue

Leading Orzammar to its stagnation and death, I can see. Harrowmont is a weak King, after all.

As for the Chantry, it depends on Orzammar, so I see no reason they'd be stupid enough to risk it or even win, especially with mages and golems at their side. Warrior caste and casteless who kick darkspawn butt on a regular basis. The rumor is that the Divine wants to declare an Exalted March because there's an independent Circle not under their control that is willing to harbor apostates, but they'll never risk their lyrium trade. This isn't the Dales.

[Augustei]

LobselVith8 wrote...

XxDeonxX wrote...

By Isolating Orzamaar he would be keeping out the very Apostates and Maleficarum that would start the exalted march in the first place however.

The Chantry still has Kal-Sharok for the lyrium trade and the seekers to keep the Templars in line, They would still be willing to risk it i'd bet. The Divine was already considering it during the epilogue

Leading Orzammar to its stagnation and death, I can see. Harrowmont is a weak King, after all.

As for the Chantry, it depends on Orzammar, so I see no reason they'd be stupid enough to risk it or even win, especially with mages and golems at their side. Warrior caste and casteless who kick darkspawn butt on a regular basis. The rumor is that the Divine wants to declare an Exalted March because there's an independent Circle not under their control that is willing to harbor apostates, but they'll never risk their lyrium trade. This isn't the Dales.

To The Victor go the spoils, If they conquer the dwarves then they will be in complete control of The Lyrium.. They Outnumber the the dwarves 50 to 1. Their Mages dont count for much against that many templars. Their Golems are not of any noteworthy quantity and can be taken down easily since the chantry definitly has numbers on their side..

They take control of the lyrium, They take care of the Malificarum / Apostate problem. They have much to gain and not much to loose

[Giggles_Manically]

They would just have to lay siege to a mountain.

Then ship food all the way up there for tens of thousands of people.

Then not freeze to death.

Or all die from disease with all the garbage and ick that would pile up outside Orzamar.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

XxDeonxX wrote...

To The Victor go the spoils, If they conquer the dwarves then they will be in complete control of The Lyrium.. They Outnumber the the dwarves 50 to 1. Their Mages dont count for much against that many templars. Their Golems are not of any noteworthy quantity and can be taken down easily since the chantry definitly has numbers on their side..

They take control of the lyrium, They take care of the Malificarum / Apostate problem. They have much to gain and not much to loose

If you think numbers are the key, then you haven't paid much attention to history. For all their numbers, the Chantry is technologically inferior to the dwarves. The dwarves are also much better warriors than your average templar, since they spend much of their time fighting off darkspawn. The dwarves do not need alot of golems, as one golem is woth many dwarves in combat. By the time the Chantry ever called an exalted march (which would take a while to get suffiecent numbers of nations to sign on and contribute troops) the dwarves will have built plenty of golems to deal with the problem.

The Chantry is a really crap military entity, judging by the numers of FAILED exalted marches. About the only ones they succeeded in were against the Dales (the qunari they only got a temporary truce with). And well, let's face it: elves....lol. The Chantry even had some trouble there, which is really pathetic, as the elves have never been terribly difficult to conquor.

So the dwarves, even with Harrow-fail, have little to worry about on that sector. And of course, there's the lyrium issue. The Chantry needs it for the mages and the templars, especially the latter, to keep them under control. Were the Chantry to do something as stupid as an exalted march, they would pretty much be stuck with an army of drug addicts going through severe, disabling withdrawals.

[Augustei]

Skadi_the_Evil_Elf wrote...

XxDeonxX wrote...

To The Victor go the spoils, If they conquer the dwarves then they will be in complete control of The Lyrium.. They Outnumber the the dwarves 50 to 1. Their Mages dont count for much against that many templars. Their Golems are not of any noteworthy quantity and can be taken down easily since the chantry definitly has numbers on their side..

They take control of the lyrium, They take care of the Malificarum / Apostate problem. They have much to gain and not much to loose

If you think numbers are the key, then you haven't paid much attention to history. For all their numbers, the Chantry is technologically inferior to the dwarves. The dwarves are also much better warriors than your average templar, since they spend much of their time fighting off darkspawn. The dwarves do not need alot of golems, as one golem is woth many dwarves in combat. By the time the Chantry ever called an exalted march (which would take a while to get suffiecent numbers of nations to sign on and contribute troops) the dwarves will have built plenty of golems to deal with the problem.

The Chantry is a really crap military entity, judging by the numers of FAILED exalted marches. About the only ones they succeeded in were against the Dales (the qunari they only got a temporary truce with). And well, let's face it: elves....lol. The Chantry even had some trouble there, which is really pathetic, as the elves have never been terribly difficult to conquor.

So the dwarves, even with Harrow-fail, have little to worry about on that sector. And of course, there's the lyrium issue. The Chantry needs it for the mages and the templars, especially the latter, to keep them under control. Were the Chantry to do something as stupid as an exalted march, they would pretty much be stuck with an army of drug addicts going through severe, disabling withdrawals.

Numbers will make a difference when every one of them is a trained soldier, They have a choke point on the enemy even though they already outnumber them.. And they have the higher ground.

The Chantry doesn't need any other nations to agree to send their troops.. The Divine has direct control over all templars and if she wants them all to fight, they bloody fight. 

The Chantry didn't have trouble with the dales, Orlais did. They did not fail against Tevinter they just falled short of their goal. And Every enemy they have faced in the past had far more numbers and technology then the dwarves do anyway.

Modifié par XxDeonxX, 25 janvier 2011 - 08:12 .

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

XxDeonxX wrote...


Numbers will make a difference when every one of them is a trained soldier, They have a choke point on the enemy even though they already outnumber them.. And they have the higher ground.

Ehh, the dwarves live in a massive, undergorund fortified fortress. They have the tactical advantage over the Chantry. The dwarves are better trained soldiers than the templar by far. Everyone of the dwarven soldiers is not only highly trained, but battled hardened against darkspawn.

And if you are going by an army of only templars, then again, the dwarves have the advantage. I think you grossly overestimate the numbers of templars out there.

The Chantry doesn't need any other nations to agree to send their troops.. The Divine has direct control over all templars and if she wants them all to fight, they bloody fight.

Again, you are wrong. Exalted marches to do not simply consist of templars, otherwise, it would be a pretty small army, as there really aren't many templars as you think. Exalted marches consist of templars, as well as loan troops from nations who have agreed to join the exalted march. The Exalted Marches are basically the ingame equilivant to the medieval Crusades.

The Chantry didn't have trouble with the dales, Orlais did. They did not fail against Tevinter they just falled short of their goal. And Every enemy they have faced in the past had far more numbers and technology then the dwarves do anyway.

Semantics. It still took Orlais and the Chantry a while to fully crush the Dales. pitfully long when you consider how pathetic the elves are.

Let me say it again: they failed on numerous occasions against Tevinter. I don't care at this stage why they failed. They failed. Multiple times.

And they do not even come close to the technological prowess of the dwarves, who are on par with the qunari technologically. The only thing that prevents the wunari from overruning the vastly technologically inferior nations of the Chantry is the use of magic, something the qunari don't use because they fear it.

[Joy Divison]

Wow.  Instead of writing a highly problematic counterfactual how picking the fool Harrowmont isn't worse than Behlen, just crown Behlen.

Behlen is cool.  All the Dust Town chics did him

[Augustei]

Joy Divison wrote...

Wow.  Instead of writing a highly problematic counterfactual how picking the fool Harrowmont isn't worse than Behlen, just crown Behlen.

Behlen is cool.  All the Dust Town chics did him

Eww even that gross one in the corner thats all like "Hey stranger, 2 bits for a tumble" or whatever she says..

Yuck.. Harrowmont it is

[thesuperdarkone]

[quote]XxDeonxX wrote...

[quote]Joy Divison wrote...

Wow.  Instead of writing a highly problematic counterfactual how picking the fool Harrowmont isn't worse than Behlen, just crown Behlen.

Behlen is cool.  All the Dust Town chics did him
[/quote]

Eww even that gross one in the corner thats all like "Hey stranger, 2 bits for a tumble" or whatever she says..

Yuck.. Harrowmont it is

[/quote 

So I guess you hate Rica and enjoy making her live in the slums of Dust Town again jerk

[LobselVith8]

XxDeonxX wrote...

To The Victor go the spoils, If they conquer the dwarves then they will be in complete control of The Lyrium.. They Outnumber the the dwarves 50 to 1.

So all the Chantry has to do is penetrate a fortress kingdom that even the darkspawn haven't managed to, despite their superior numbers? Battle hardened dwarves who basically fight against the darkspawn every day of their lives despite their disadvantage in numbers? I think you're underestimating the dwarves here, and added with Bhelen opening up fighting for the casteless, they'd have more numbers.

XxDeonxX wrote...

Their Mages dont count for much against that many templars.

Mages don't count? You think an independent Circle of mages and possible blood mages is going to be a cakewalk for the templars? You might want to tell that to the Qunari, because the New Exalted Marches entry of the Qunari codex makes it clear that mages were the biggest advantage that the Chantry had against them, and one of two reasons why they were able to repel the Qunari...

XxDeonxX wrote...

Their Golems are not of any noteworthy quantity and can be taken down easily since the chantry definitly has numbers on their side..

Golems are worth at least a dozen dwarves in battle, were specifically designed to take on and take down the darkspawn, and actually kept the dwarven kingdoms safe for generations when they were regularly in use. To dismiss them so easily would be a very big mistake.

XxDeonxX wrote...

They take control of the lyrium, They take care of the Malificarum / Apostate problem. They have much to gain and not much to loose

 Who will mine it? Surface dwarves lose their "immunity" to lyrium over time. You basically need dwarves from the dwarven kingdom, and they're going to be fighting against the Chantry. I see no win/win for the Chantry here. If they take on Orzammar, they need to be sure they can win, and they can't be sure with so many factors working in Orzammar's favor. With an army of battle hardened dwarves, mages, and golems at their side, I don't see a possible victory for the Chantry, who wouldn't even be abe to mine the lyrium even if they did somehow manage to break into Orzammar. Not to mention that the templars are literally addicted to lyrium, and risking losing that may cause an insurrection on the Chantry's hands.

[LobselVith8]

XxDeonxX wrote...

Numbers will make a difference when every one of them is a trained soldier, They have a choke point on the enemy even though they already outnumber them.. And they have the higher ground.

An enemy heavily dependent on the dwarves' lyrium, mind you. With an efficient King at their helm (Bhelen) and an army consisting of dwarves, mages, and golems, I don't think the templars have much in their favor, especially if they're going through this siege alone.

Besides, who would even aid the Chantry? As for potential allies, I doubt Ferelden could or would even want to help (considering they need to focus on rebuilding the nation), especially after the dwarves aided the nation against the Blight. A Warden-Commander hailing from the Circle of Magi certainly has no reason to aid the Chantry, and I can't see the other Wardens trying to intervene after the dwarves aided them in a Blight. However, you said they would be going through this alone with the military arm of their organization, so it's basically just the templars vs. dwarves/golems/mages. Templars have issues fighting just mages, much less dwarves and golems.

XxDeonxX wrote...

The Chantry doesn't need any other nations to agree to send their troops.. The Divine has direct control over all templars and if she wants them all to fight, they bloody fight. 

Fair enough; but if the supply of lyrium runs out, how willing will those same templars be if the dwarves start waving lyrium in their faces? We can see in Denerim how prolonged exposure (Denerim Chantry) and withdrawal (the Howe dungeon) will impact a templar.

XxDeonxX wrote...

The Chantry didn't have trouble with the dales, Orlais did. They did not fail against Tevinter they just falled short of their goal. And Every enemy they have faced in the past had far more numbers and technology then the dwarves do anyway.

Orlais and the Chantry are pretty much intertwined, considering that the religious institution was created by the first Orlesian Emperor and the Divine resides in Orlais. If the templars in A Broken Circle were able to get their collective butts handed to them by some abominations and apostates, they certainly aren't the invincible force some might think they are.

[Sarah1281]

So I guess you hate Rica and enjoy making her live in the slums of Dust Town again jerk

Rica never goes back to Dust Town. She stays on as Endrin's mother. I know they barely even mention it if you're not a DC but don't you think that if the Aeducans don't send her away out of sheer spite if Rica's sibling almost singlehandedly removes their family from the throne that they won't do it if someone else does it?

[Augustei]

LobselVith8 wrote...

XxDeonxX wrote...

Numbers will make a difference when every one of them is a trained soldier, They have a choke point on the enemy even though they already outnumber them.. And they have the higher ground.

An enemy heavily dependent on the dwarves' lyrium, mind you. With an efficient King at their helm (Bhelen) and an army consisting of dwarves, mages, and golems, I don't think the templars have much in their favor, especially if they're going through this siege alone.

Besides, who would even aid the Chantry? As for potential allies, I doubt Ferelden could or would even want to help (considering they need to focus on rebuilding the nation), especially after the dwarves aided the nation against the Blight. A Warden-Commander hailing from the Circle of Magi certainly has no reason to aid the Chantry, and I can't see the other Wardens trying to intervene after the dwarves aided them in a Blight. However, you said they would be going through this alone with the military arm of their organization, so it's basically just the templars vs. dwarves/golems/mages. Templars have issues fighting just mages, much less dwarves and golems.

XxDeonxX wrote...

The Chantry doesn't need any other nations to agree to send their troops.. The Divine has direct control over all templars and if she wants them all to fight, they bloody fight. 

Fair enough; but if the supply of lyrium runs out, how willing will those same templars be if the dwarves start waving lyrium in their faces? We can see in Denerim how prolonged exposure (Denerim Chantry) and withdrawal (the Howe dungeon) will impact a templar.

XxDeonxX wrote...

The Chantry didn't have trouble with the dales, Orlais did. They did not fail against Tevinter they just falled short of their goal. And Every enemy they have faced in the past had far more numbers and technology then the dwarves do anyway.

Orlais and the Chantry are pretty much intertwined, considering that the religious institution was created by the first Orlesian Emperor and the Divine resides in Orlais. If the templars in A Broken Circle were able to get their collective butts handed to them by some abominations and apostates, they certainly aren't the invincible force some might think they are.

their Mages will do little help against an enemy that can dispell magic and make it useless. The Qunari dont have Templars and thats why they had so much trouble against the mages. If they were trained to dispell their magic the way Templars are they would have faired much much better. That Exalted March also consisted of many more mages then this possible one. The Ratio would be something like 1:30 or 1:20.

Golems are said to be equal to about 10 dwarven men. So lets say that they have about 15 golems.. The Chantry still outnumbers them, and has a choking point, and has higher ground. The Only disadvantage is the lyrium. But then they have a moderate supply already and once withdrawl comes into effect they have the seekers to keep them in line.

And Failing that, They have influence in nearly every nation in Thedas save 3. They can conscript people into their war, demand soldiers from other nations under their dominion. Ferelden may not supply any troops but Orlais certainly would, The Free Marches, Nevarra would be obligated to do so as well.

[Sarah1281]

Why in the world would the Chantry even WANT to have an Exalted March against Orzammar? Yeah they consider it but I'm sure they ALWAYS consider one whenever anyone does anything even remotely offensive (and it's notable that the Tevinter and their mages managed to hold off an Exalted March just fine) but is one little apostate circle really worth a war and jeopardizing their monopoly on lyrium? Not to mention that they have no idea how to mine it safely and dwarves are the only ones who can actually hear the lyrium thus making it easier to find.

[Graspiloot]

XxDeonxX wrote...

their Mages will do little help against an enemy that can dispell magic and make it useless. The Qunari dont have Templars and thats why they had so much trouble against the mages. If they were trained to dispell their magic the way Templars are they would have faired much much better. That Exalted March also consisted of many more mages then this possible one. The Ratio would be something like 1:30 or 1:20.

It doesn't change the fact that 1. they will not just be able to dispell all the mages, they will have trouble with them. And 2. there aren't that many templars 

Golems are said to be equal to about 10 dwarven men. So lets say that they have about 15 golems.. The Chantry still outnumbers them, and has a choking point, and has higher ground. The Only disadvantage is the lyrium. But then they have a moderate supply already and once withdrawl comes into effect they have the seekers to keep them in line.

Military tactics: 0/10
For reasons stated above about being in an underground fortress with two exits, one in the deep roads and one to the topside. Also good luck besieging a mountain and getting food there.

And Failing that, They have influence in nearly every nation in Thedas save 3. They can conscript people into their war, demand soldiers from other nations under their dominion. Ferelden may not supply any troops but Orlais certainly would, The Free Marches, Nevarra would be obligated to do so as well.

You just said they wouldnt need them, what changed? Realised the flaw in your logic huh?

Modifié par Graspiloot, 26 janvier 2011 - 11:16 .

[LobselVith8]

XxDeonxX wrote...

their Mages will do little help against an enemy that can dispell magic and make it useless.

If that was the case, why couldn't the Chantry defeat the Tevinter Imperium (the Imperial Chantry)?

XxDeonxX wrote...

The Qunari dont have Templars and thats why they had so much trouble against the mages.

Actually, the Qunari had trouble because they treat their mages like animals. 

XxDeonxX wrote...

If they were trained to dispell their magic the way Templars are they would have faired much much better. That Exalted March also consisted of many more mages then this possible one. The Ratio would be something like 1:30 or 1:20. 

Where are you getting these numbers from? There are no numbers provided for the independent Circle of Orzammar. Furthermore, it's been made clear that a mage can be a real threat even to trained templars, as Duncan reveals when he discusses the story of how a blood mage was handling a group of templars and only lost because of one reckless moment.

XxDeonxX wrote...

Golems are said to be equal to about 10 dwarven men. So lets say that they have about 15 golems.. The Chantry still outnumbers them, and has a choking point, and has higher ground. The Only disadvantage is the lyrium. But then they have a moderate supply already and once withdrawl comes into effect they have the seekers to keep them in line.

Again, you're speculating on numbers. We have no idea how many golems Branka would have come up with in the months she spent using the Anvil to prepare for the battle against the darkspawn. Considering that templars are trained to dispel magic and not virtually impenetrable stone soldiers, I don't see how their tactics would be superior to dwarven technology, especially when you factor in how the golems are made to withstand attacks against the darkspawn.

In addition, you're also treating their lyrium addiction like it's something that's not going to completely ravage them - did you even remember how bad it was for the templar in Howe's dungeon? And the dwarves live inside of the dwarven kingdom - the Chantry is going to have to either get inside through a potentially impenetrable fortress or through the Deep Roads, having to deal with not only the coalition of dwarves, mages, and golems, but also the darkspawn as well.

XxDeonxX wrote...

And Failing that, They have influence in nearly every nation in Thedas save 3. They can conscript people into their war, demand soldiers from other nations under their dominion.

I don't see the leaders of the Andrastian nations surrendering all of their soldiers for a fool's errand. 

XxDeonxX wrote...

Ferelden may not supply any troops but Orlais certainly would, The Free Marches, Nevarra would be obligated to do so as well.

You realize that Nevarra and Orlais don't like each other, right? And while the templars of the Free Marches would certainly obey their call, we have no idea what the nation-states of the Free Marches would do.

[Augustei]

LobselVith8 wrote...

XxDeonxX wrote...

their Mages will do little help against an enemy that can dispell magic and make it useless.

If that was the case, why couldn't the Chantry defeat the Tevinter Imperium (the Imperial Chantry)?

XxDeonxX wrote...

The Qunari dont have Templars and thats why they had so much trouble against the mages.

Actually, the Qunari had trouble because they treat their mages like animals. 

XxDeonxX wrote...

If they were trained to dispell their magic the way Templars are they would have faired much much better. That Exalted March also consisted of many more mages then this possible one. The Ratio would be something like 1:30 or 1:20. 

Where are you getting these numbers from? There are no numbers provided for the independent Circle of Orzammar. Furthermore, it's been made clear that a mage can be a real threat even to trained templars, as Duncan reveals when he discusses the story of how a blood mage was handling a group of templars and only lost because of one reckless moment.

XxDeonxX wrote...

Golems are said to be equal to about 10 dwarven men. So lets say that they have about 15 golems.. The Chantry still outnumbers them, and has a choking point, and has higher ground. The Only disadvantage is the lyrium. But then they have a moderate supply already and once withdrawl comes into effect they have the seekers to keep them in line.

Again, you're speculating on numbers. We have no idea how many golems Branka would have come up with in the months she spent using the Anvil to prepare for the battle against the darkspawn. Considering that templars are trained to dispel magic and not virtually impenetrable stone soldiers, I don't see how their tactics would be superior to dwarven technology, especially when you factor in how the golems are made to withstand attacks against the darkspawn.

In addition, you're also treating their lyrium addiction like it's something that's not going to completely ravage them - did you even remember how bad it was for the templar in Howe's dungeon? And the dwarves live inside of the dwarven kingdom - the Chantry is going to have to either get inside through a potentially impenetrable fortress or through the Deep Roads, having to deal with not only the coalition of dwarves, mages, and golems, but also the darkspawn as well.

XxDeonxX wrote...

And Failing that, They have influence in nearly every nation in Thedas save 3. They can conscript people into their war, demand soldiers from other nations under their dominion.

I don't see the leaders of the Andrastian nations surrendering all of their soldiers for a fool's errand. 

XxDeonxX wrote...

Ferelden may not supply any troops but Orlais certainly would, The Free Marches, Nevarra would be obligated to do so as well.

You realize that Nevarra and Orlais don't like each other, right? And while the templars of the Free Marches would certainly obey their call, we have no idea what the nation-states of the Free Marches would do.

They came extremely close to defeating the Tevinter Imperium only falling short by failing to conquer Minrathous. Teviniter's mages numbers are far more then Orzamaar's circle would be, Orzamaar is small and would only be able to house so many mages anyway.

Tevinter has soldiers as well, Of course so does Orzamaar but not equalling the numbers of Tevinter. Not even close

The Qunari have explosives, grenades, cannons and other advanced technologies.. Regardless of that however, a Templar would be far more valuable to fight a mage then another mage. So their lack of templars does them great disadvantage.

Most mages are not a real threat to Templars, because they study the schools of magic the chantry allows them to. Maleficar are dangerous to templars because they have a lack of knowledge of their specific magic.

Not all the mages in Orzamaar's circle would be maleficarum most would be simple apostates. And Im sure if there was a mass ammount of Maleficarum down there, one of them would be possessed, go insane and on some killing rampage throughout Orzamaar no doubt.. (Hey these things seem to be commonplace in Dragon age. everything goes to hell at the time you really dont want it to, Like during a blight or when your nations being invaded)

Yes I am Speculating Numbers, but it is an inevitability that the dwarves. A people with a low population anyway will be vastly outnumbered by the chantry. Who's influence spreads throughout all but 3 of theda's countries.

If the anvil wasn't saved, then they wont have many golems. The Shaperate only has a handful. And if you do save the anvil then Orzamaar will find itself lacking numbers even more as bhelen sends his men to claim the anvil from branka. If Harrowmont was chosen as king, Then the dwarves are even more screwed as the surface raids will have Ferelden join the exalted march as well. Regardless of their devistated country they will join it if their people are being kidnapped. The Epilogue even says theres a war with the surface.

Both Kings deny Branka her troops anyway, so her surface raids will be an inevitability regardless of which king you choose. She doesn't have to go to orzamaar to get to the surface. There is an exit right near West hill to the surface Which is quite closeby.

Nevarra and Orlais dont have a steaming hatred for each other, they just have a mistrust for each other due to struggling for control of the Southern Nevarran territories. The war hasn't continued however, and only seeds of mistrust have been planted by Orlais. And Regardless of them not liking each other, they would have to and probably more then willing to join the march.

The Chantrys greatest Eastern strength is in Kirkwall. This is the Orlesian chantry. Yet it is watched over by Nevarran seekers - Lead by Cassandra. And because two people have hostile tensions towards each other. Does not mean they will ignore their duty and their obligations. This is evident with The Dalish helping stop the blight alongside the humans.

[Augustei]

Graspiloot wrote...

Military tactics: 0/10
For reasons stated above about being in an underground fortress with two exits, one in the deep roads and one to the topside. Also good luck besieging a mountain and getting food there.

And Failing that, They have influence in nearly every nation in Thedas save 3. They can conscript people into their war, demand soldiers from other nations under their dominion. Ferelden may not supply any troops but Orlais certainly would, The Free Marches, Nevarra would be obligated to do so as well.


You just said they wouldnt need them, what changed? Realised the flaw in your logic huh?

An Underground Fortress with two exits? Thats a disadvantage. They have the templars, who have the higher ground and a choke point on one end. And they have the Darkspawn on the other. They have a disadvantgae here.

and they wouldn't need the other nations, But they can still get their support to help finish things quickly

Modifié par XxDeonxX, 26 janvier 2011 - 02:25 .

[ejoslin]

How exactly does the chantry get into Orzammar again? Even Harrowmont is able to seal it off if Ferelden attacks...