206 réponses à ce sujet

[Atakuma]

Brockololly wrote...

Lukas Kristjanson wrote...
Band of Brothers in DA setting? Man, I so wanted to write that.

That sounds like about a dozen different kinds of awesome:O

It was just going to be 45 minutes of reused environments with half your time spent fighting mooks.
Yes, I'm a bitter person.

[aries1001]

Return to Ostager (Rto) was the weakest dlc, imo. But I found the story to be quite good, though. And then Warden's Keep was a way better dlc. And it also tied neatly into the story as did The Stone Prisoner. For those of you who haven't played this especially wonderfull dlc, do it ! You'll be surprised at what you'll learn by playing it.



And I'll still maintain that Leliana's Song was one of the better dlcs, then again, I liked Leliana. And was (were?) intrigued to find out what her backstory is (was). I agree, though, that the presentation of the story could be seen as retconning, though it really isn't. She's just telling the story with -ahem- a little overgloss or underemphasis on certain -ahem- events. Much like Varric apparently is...

[Trintrin86]

Lukas Kristjanson wrote...
....playing as rookie warden Alistair. Band of Brothers in DA setting? Man, I so wanted to write that.

Awww....you have no idea how much I want to play that! ::sniffles::

[Blessed Silence]

HolyAvenger wrote...

DSC was the worst DLC for me, I've got the UE of the game and that's the only one I can't bring myself to finish.

I enjoyed LS, despite the massive retcon. Provided a little preview of what DA2 will be like with VA'd protagonist.

What?  You can't relish in the glory of shoving your sword through Alistair?  ... It kind of reminded me of the Lord of the Rings RTS game where you could play as Sauron's army and kill Gandalf and company.  Pretty fun.

Ailith430 wrote...

I think Lelianas song was sort of practice for Bioware to try out that framed narrative idea they're using in DA2, since I seem to recall it being stated that certain things in Leliana's Song were not necessarily 100% truthful of what actually happened, since shes a bard and was telling it as a story with a little extra embellishment.

Really?  Well damn serves me right for not taking her as a companion and talking about her background!  ... seriously didn't know this heh.

Il Divo wrote...

I don't see anything wrong with a new PC being an option for a dlc, but I think the problem with not letting us play the Warden is that it's difficult to become attached to this new character that we are using for a few hours at best. The Warden has history, we played him/her back when they were a fledgling up until they killed the archdemon so we typically have a deeper attachment to the character. It's the same reason why people liked the companion characters in Golems/Witch Hunt far less; we didn't really get to know the.

I didn't really have a problem getting into the character of Leliana in her DLC.  I have yet to try out the Golem or Witch Hunt DLC with the Warden, but I can see how people felt less attached to the Orlesian Warden in Awakenings than if they brought their Warden over.

[Malanek]

I didn't rate any of the origins DLC that I got with the exception of Shale if you count that. I only got Shale, RtO and Witch Hunt. Quite disapointed with Witch Hunt. Also RTO played OK but had very little story and no proper hook to get you to go there in the first place. Lelianas song sounds like something I would have liked more (outside the actual game) except Leliana and Wynne were my least favourite characters. I remain hopeful for DA2 DLC though. The ME1 DLC was garbage but the two story DLCs for ME2 (overlord, LotSB) were both great.



Alternatively stick to expansions. Awakening was pretty good other than the completely unbalanced combat. The enviroments were really well designed, the characters were interesting and the overall story was pretty good as well.

[Maria Caliban]

Brockololly wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

filaminstrel wrote...

David did work on Witch Hunt. Other lead writers have worked on the other DLCs as well, like Sheryl Chee on RtO.

She did codex entries for RtO.

I'm pretty sure Sheryl wrote most of Witch Hunt (Ariane, Finn and Dog) and David wrote Morrigan's part in Witch Hunt.

That's interesting.

Do you know if they did any work on the other DLC?

[Drizzt ORierdan]

I too enjoyed Lelianas Song a great deal... I guess because it was a more personal and engaging story...

Finding out about Alistair's lost DLC is really a shame... with the money Bioware spent in Golem's + Darkspawn Chronicles they could ve made a great DLC about him instead... really a shame.

Boy, the more I read about Witch Hunt, the more worked up I get. With so little work they could ve made it sooo much better...
I remember now, some months ago the "Unofficial" Dragon Age Podcast was giving some Witch Hunt codes in a contest, were you had to "sketch" an alternative design for a WH DLC... Being the Morrigan **** that I am, I tended to it. But just before sending the file, I went to check "the real thing" at a friend's house... I got so mad and dissapointed that I didnt apply to the contest at all.

And let me tell you, my design was not that bad; it had a huge dramatic battle at the end, with Morrigan and Flemeth going through various levels of shapeshifting. If you had romanced her, you sacrificed and let Flemeth kill you, giving the opportunity for Morri to escape... lol I wish I had seen that in the real thing.

Modifié par Drizzt ORierdan, 19 janvier 2011 - 09:00 .

[Merci357]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

filaminstrel wrote...

David did work on Witch Hunt. Other lead writers have worked on the other DLCs as well, like Sheryl Chee on RtO.

She did codex entries for RtO.

I'm pretty sure Sheryl wrote most of Witch Hunt (Ariane, Finn and Dog) and David wrote Morrigan's part in Witch Hunt.

That's interesting.

Do you know if they did any work on the other DLC?

Sheryl is mentioned as (the only) writer for GoA in the credits.

[Maria13]

Addai67 wrote...

Weltenschlange wrote...
I can understand why some people would criticize Leliana's Song, but in contrast to DC it was actually part of DAO's narrative.

I'm starting to feel like a bit of a crank, but no it wasn't.  At least, it wasn't anything new.  You had already heard Leliana's story, or what we thought was her story, and with the DLC version we're not sure it's part of the DAO story either, except to convince you that Leliana either doesn't know the truth herself (cue Twilight Zone music) or she's a compulsive liar.  This is all beside the fact that it was about a character who wasn't even necessarily central to the main plot.  Leliana sat in camp for me, so she wasn't part of my DAO story at all really.  It also added little to nothing of color to Ferelden.  Maybe if it had actually been set in Orlais, that would have at least been an expansion on the story.

It has been pointed out before by better heads than mine but it is extrordinarily suspicious that the only two character centric DLCs centre around romanceable female characters...

[upsettingshorts]

Suspicious of what?

I'd throw in LOTSB, too.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 19 janvier 2011 - 08:35 .

[Merci357]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Suspicious of what?

I'd throw in LOTSB, too.

Suspicious of fan service, I'd guess. But that isn't a bad thing?

[nightcobra]

scyphozoa wrote...

scyphozoa wrote...
I was hoping to play as Alistair when he gets recruited by Duncan

Lukas Kristjanson wrote...
playing as rookie warden Alistair.

gahhhhhh i will never be at rest knowing what could have been. /torment

i can imagine, maybe the drinking party alistair talked about was going to be in it:crying:

[Mr Plow]

I liked Leiliana's Song - it was nice to have a spin-off as it were with a likeable character. The only thing I didn't like was just as I was really getting into the story it abruptly ended

[TheRevanchist]

Mr Plow wrote...

I liked Leiliana's Song - it was nice to have a spin-off as it were with a likeable character. The only thing I didn't like was just as I was really getting into the story it abruptly ended

Honestly I was so immursed in that DLC that the first time I played it...I got to Marjolaine and was like "WTF!?!" when I found out I couldn't kill her...completely oblivious to the fact it didn't occure then...that was me though.

[The Gentle Ben]

I never bought LS or DSC as they seemed irrelevant. As for the others, Stone Prisoner was the only one that didn't leave me cold (and it was repurposed original content). I don't begrudge Bioware my money, I resent their failure to live up to my expectations for their quality (A purely personal perspective and therefore of limited resonance, I'm aware). DA:O slightly underwhelmed me, while still being thoroughly enjoyable. Awakening and the DLC damaged my faith as it were. Not to the extent that they are at risk for my dollars, but my complete confidence was shaken.

I find it hard to assess Awakening (It never quite worked for me, but why is problematic). It felt short (really short) for what I expect from an expansion. I think the extremely limited character interactions and situational aspect of the dialogue system made the companions seem shallow and uninteresting in comparison to Origins (I realize budget was a factor here, but quality isn't impacted by allowances). I think it tried to do too much as well (Multi-pronged plot, keep upgrades, noble conspiracies, craftable items, side quests, etc...). I remember finishing the smugglers quest for the guards and thinking: "That was it?". A narrower mandate might have given the content more depth. Mostly, I think it was just too easy. With the added levels and abilities, outside of avoiding chain overwhelms by the "Children", I found I could essentially sleepwalk through the game on Nightmare, which made it play ridiculously fast.

To oversimplify, that was largely my problem with all of the DLC. Too short and too easy. It really suffered in comparison to ME2's offerings (Lair of the Shadowbroker was amazing), or Bring Down the Sky. Not only that, but nothing of weight ever seemed to happen.

A few quick specifics:
Return to Ostagar & Wardens Keep: Aside from the above, both seemed more tacked on than seamless. Also, it just felt as if the grandness of the settings and story that were being conveyed were done a disservice by the shortage of content. And it may be a quibble, but I found myself holding off on completing them simply because the material of the unique items was scaled to level (I really disliked this feature. I much prefer restrictions on their use to scaling their quality). I don't want (steel) Warden Commander Armor, I want Silverite or Dragonbone.

Golems: was probably my favorite (At least it wasn't a breeze), but I felt it really suffered from a lack of introduction and presentation. Something was there if the story had been built at least a little.

Witch Hunt: had the misfortune to be played in concert with Lair of the Shadowbroker (which is how DLC should be done). I'm not trying to be unpleasant, but I just felt it was meaningless. We learned nothing, not what Morrigan was planning, not what she'd been doing, not even what she'd discovered about Flemeth. The final encounter in the Elluvian room (Mother's Lair) could have simply followed the epilogue of Origins/Awakening with a 20 second VO presentation and satisfied just as much (probably more due to lack of a buildup to raise expectations).

I realize it may seem that I'm simply asking for more content, but (everything just felt rushed and not given its due) it's my feeling that if Bioware decides to do something, they should really do it. I (at least) am prepared to pay whatever elevated prices are set as a result.

Modifié par The Gentle Ben, 19 janvier 2011 - 08:58 .

[Zjarcal]

Merci357 wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Suspicious of what?

I'd throw in LOTSB, too.

Suspicious of fan service, I'd guess. But that isn't a bad thing?

I can understand why they do it; whatever will sell better is what's eventually done. I'm not saying for sure that a male LI centered DLC wouldn't sell just as well, but Bioware probably did enough research to suggest otherwise.

It sucks for those who prefer the male LIs, but c'est la vie. At any rate, it's not just guys who like the female LIs... :happy:

[Brockololly]

Maria Caliban wrote...
That's interesting.

Do you know if they did any work on the other DLC?

I'm not sure- I only know that about Witch Hunt because I PM'd Gaider back when they announced WH, since I was nervous we'd end up with more out of character 'Wynne flirting with Alistair' in Return to Ostagar type moments if somebody else wrote Morrigan. But David wrote Morrigan there and Sheryl wrote the rest.

I'm not sure on the rest of the DLC however. I don't know that anyone wrote Darkspawn Chronicles.

[errant_knight]

Lukas Kristjanson wrote...

A mix of opinion in the thread, as there always is. Makes successful DLC a bit of a moving target, but that’s the fun of it. Leliana’s Song was an odd duck, certainly. An experiment in a lot of ways, and you’ll see echoes of those efforts in DAII. For my nitpicky little ego I’d note that there was no retcon in the story—the high-level is narrator Leliana trying to suss out what purpose her story can have. The raw facts, what she honestly related to the Warden in the main game, can be inspirational or cautionary depending on how she presents it (how you play her in the DLC), and that act of searching for meaning says more about her character. So, you know, ppbbthhhth.

Anyway, we’re taking the lessons of all the DLC—company wide—into consideration for DAII. Player expectation and reviews are factors, but there’re also resource considerations and how and when the DLC was actually played/purchased, which has made for some interesting data.

And as a tease for those who did like LS, I did several treatments for companion DLCs. Two made it to the full design doc phase--the fast moving LS caper, and playing as rookie warden Alistair. Band of Brothers in DA setting? Man, I so wanted to write that.

I so wanted to play it! You have no idea how much sad that news just created, or...maybe you do. Actually, a lot of people were assuming that an Alistair DLC would immediately follow the Leliana one, and that it would follow Witch Hunt when word of that came out. I'm pretty sure that aded to the reaction when the DLC were cancelled.


PS. I know I speak for many when I say that we'd still like to read it. How about a short story? I'll illustrate it in the toolset for you, if you like. Pretty good at it after doing 50 or so for my own project, if I do say so myself.

Modifié par errant_knight, 19 janvier 2011 - 09:07 .

[Maria13]

Zjarcal wrote...

Merci357 wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Suspicious of what?

I'd throw in LOTSB, too.

Suspicious of fan service, I'd guess. But that isn't a bad thing?

I can understand why they do it; whatever will sell better is what's eventually done. I'm not saying for sure that a male LI centered DLC wouldn't sell just as well, but Bioware probably did enough research to suggest otherwise.

It sucks for those who prefer the male LIs, but c'est la vie. At any rate, it's not just guys who like the female LIs... :happy:

Yay, point taken about Leli, Zjarcal.

But if you only service the guys (and some of the female gamers) then it's only the guys that will ever get serviced... It's self-perpetuating and it's bad marketing because they're not up to the challenge of building new markets.  Bioware have done a lot but I find this chauvenism and the deprecatory attitude towards female gamers ('No squeeing please' as if guys didn't squee in a manly way) kind of disappointing.

[Sjofn]

Augh, I would've bought an Alistair DLC without thinking twice.



My only problem, my only REAL problem anyway, with Leliana's Song was that it took place in Fereldan. I didn't want more Fereldan, I wanted a taste of Orlais.

[Reaverwind]

Maria13 wrote...

It has been pointed out before by better heads than mine but it is extrordinarily suspicious that the only two character centric DLCs centre around romanceable female characters...

Suspicious? You'd have to be blind to miss that fans of the romanceable male characters were left in the cold.

Modifié par Reaverwind, 19 janvier 2011 - 09:24 .

[Funker Shepard]

David Gaider wrote...

He did not say it was the weakest DLC. He said we likely wouldn't do another DLC that doesn't involve your PC, as that weakens the experience for the player. That is not the same thing.

Glad to hear that, I personally thought that from a more "technical" point of view, Leliana's Song was by far the best DAO DLC put out. In fact, I'd be tempted to say that it was the only one that pushed boundaries in any way, and it had a lot of neat little touches (the splash screens!) that I really dug. Too bad a lot of people just couldn't get over the relocation of the story, or just fail to appreciate perfection when it hits them on the head.

[Melca36]

Count me as another who would have forked over the dough for the Alistair dlc. :-)

[Sylvius the Mad]

David Gaider wrote...

He did not say it was the weakest DLC. He said we likely wouldn't do another DLC that doesn't involve your PC, as that weakens the experience for the player. That is not the same thing.

This wouldn't be a problem if the game didnt try to convince the player that he is his character and his influence ends there.

If the DAO player were used to playing the entire party, Leliana's Song wouldn't have bothered him at all.