206 réponses à ce sujet

[Ninotchka]

Addai67 wrote...

@Ninotchka, I meant to say, don't be too discouraged by the reviews. If a DLC looks intriguing to you, buy it and you'll probably enjoy it just by virtue of it being DA. But I don't consider any of them a must-have, either.

Thanks Addai. You're right, I probably will enjoy it just for being part of DA. That and so I can jump in on the ****in' bandwagon about DA:O DLC

[Maria13]

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

FieryDove wrote...

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

 Until female players turn to represent a "bigger slize" of the "cake", they wont be acnoknowledged in the marketing campaigns in that level of detail. 

In 2010 female gamers were 40% of the pie, and 46% of the household game purchasers. That's close enough for something...anything? Maybe yes?

Perhaps you are forgetting that the vast majority of that 40 % play casual games like tetris or some "family friendly" game, not RPGs or any type of story-driven game... Those are the facts.

You dont need to argue with me,  I'm totally on your side, Id love to see a Bioware campaign addressing women. But Im not the one calling the shots...

Oh, so when us ladies come up with cold hard figures you just shift the goalposts/parameters. So games are now divided into casual (definition: "mostly played by women") and real games ("mostly played by men") and these are the new hard facts that perpetuate the status quo... Surprised me? Not.

[Addai]

Ninotchka wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

@Ninotchka, I meant to say, don't be too discouraged by the reviews. If a DLC looks intriguing to you, buy it and you'll probably enjoy it just by virtue of it being DA. But I don't consider any of them a must-have, either.

Thanks Addai. You're right, I probably will enjoy it just for being part of DA. That and so I can jump in on the ****in' bandwagon about DA:O DLC

Like I said elsethread, the peer pressure is like high school here at BSN.

All the cool kids are doing it!

[The Gentle Ben]

My apologies Lilacs, but this conversation has become incomprehensible. I'm not even sure what you are claiming to believe anymore.

I'm going to make what I hope is not an offensive supposition and assume that English is not your primary language. What we have here is a failure to communicate. I leave it at that.

Modifié par The Gentle Ben, 19 janvier 2011 - 11:46 .

[Drizzt ORierdan]

Maria13 wrote...

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

FieryDove wrote...

Drizzt ORierdan wrote...

 Until female players turn to represent a "bigger slize" of the "cake", they wont be acnoknowledged in the marketing campaigns in that level of detail. 

In 2010 female gamers were 40% of the pie, and 46% of the household game purchasers. That's close enough for something...anything? Maybe yes?

Perhaps you are forgetting that the vast majority of that 40 % play casual games like tetris or some "family friendly" game, not RPGs or any type of story-driven game... Those are the facts.

You dont need to argue with me,  I'm totally on your side, Id love to see a Bioware campaign addressing women. But Im not the one calling the shots...

Oh, so when us ladies come up with cold hard figures you just shift the goalposts/parameters. So games are now divided into casual (definition: "mostly played by women") and real games ("mostly played by men") and these are the new hard facts that perpetuate the status quo... Surprised me? Not.

Im just telling you how marketing for big companies go... They go for "segmented"  markets.., and they wont spend a lot of money in advertising that its guarateed they wont recover in the short term. And that is what they are looking for: short term revenues. Why? Because its easier and cheapier. And with an overexpanded offer of games and a shrinking economy (at least in the US), that goes a long way...

To change that you'll need a change in marketing policy, addressed by the big companies (they like to call themselves, "the industry"), and keep it up until you change the "culture" of gamers. Not  impossible, but difficult.

Could we drop the whole gender innuendo? Really I am not defending what they are doing, Im just trying to explain their logic. I dont have a horse in this race, I only care of games as an art-form, not how much money they make...

Modifié par Drizzt ORierdan, 19 janvier 2011 - 11:51 .

[Zjarcal]

Drizzt is absolutely right, and I'm a female gamer so don't accuse me of being biased. It's just a fact that the target demographic of a game like Dragon Age remains predominantly male. The numbers may be much closer for other games, but that's still not the case here.

Again, we would all love for ALL gamers to be satisfied with the released content, but that's easier said than done.

Modifié par Zjarcal, 20 janvier 2011 - 12:12 .

[tishyw]

Zjarcal wrote...

Drizzt is absolutely right, and I'm a female gamer so don't accuse me of being biased. It's just a fact that the target demographic of a game like Dragon Age remains predominantly male. The numbers may be much closer for other games, but that's still not the case here.

Again, we would all love for ALL gamers to be satisfied with the released content, but that's easier said than done.

And that's why I don't understand them not marketing DA:2 to women more.  RPG's have traditionally been one of the popular game types among women, and we are a vastly undertapped market, so it makes sense to me for them to try and lure more of us in.  Instead they keep marketing to 14 year old boys, a vastly overtapped market that is completely saturated with games.

To keep this on topic, Leliana was my least favourite character in DA:O, Maker this, Maker that, it drove me nuts, but I really enjoyed the Leliana Song DLC, I found it really engaging and the framing of it drew me in.

Modifié par tishyw, 20 janvier 2011 - 01:50 .

[Maria Caliban]

Right, the DLC is biased to female love interests.

Then again, who showed up in Awakenings if you made him king? Alistiar. Who is the only Origins companion that Mike has said will make a cameo in DA II? Alistiar.

[Firky]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Right, the DLC is biased to female love interests.

Then again, who showed up in Awakenings if you made him king? Alistiar. Who is the only Origins companion that Mike has said will make a cameo in DA II? Alistiar.

He did? Only as King?

[Reaverwind]

Firky wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Right, the DLC is biased to female love interests.

Then again, who showed up in Awakenings if you made him king? Alistiar. Who is the only Origins companion that Mike has said will make a cameo in DA II? Alistiar.

He did? Only as King?

He's the default monarch who shows up to greet the Warden-Commander. Considering how poorly the dialogue was done, I wouldn't get exited about any DA 2 cameo.

[Orian Tabris]

Cuthlan wrote...

I didn't give Leliana's Song a chance at first because it wasn't my character, and because of the new paraphrasing dialog system. I did, however, finally play it recently...

Leliana's Song was the best DLC made for DA:O. The writing/storytelling, the music, the atmosphere... it was great.

There, I said it.

It was fun to play the first time, but I hate LS because practically the only things that were acurate to what Leliana and Marjolaine say to each other and acurate to the truth of her leaving Orlais was their names. Leliana and Marjolaine. Like, she left Orlais to get away from Marjolaine.

[Naitaka]

Orian Tabris wrote...

Cuthlan wrote...

I didn't give Leliana's Song a chance at first because it wasn't my character, and because of the new paraphrasing dialog system. I did, however, finally play it recently...

Leliana's Song was the best DLC made for DA:O. The writing/storytelling, the music, the atmosphere... it was great.

There, I said it.

It was fun to play the first time, but I hate LS because practically the only things that were acurate to what Leliana and Marjolaine say to each other and acurate to the truth of her leaving Orlais was their names. Leliana and Marjolaine. Like, she left Orlais to get away from Marjolaine.

What's to say they weren't lying to the Warden in the first place or then events in LS is what exactly what occured in the past? Because we all know that bards are such honest folk to begin with? I rather like the fact that it doesn't match up to Leliana's story in every detail, it's sort of like the whole Varric framed narrative thing in DAII, for all we know LS could just be a version of that story that Leliana told.

EDIT: Also I'd like to point out that LS is imo the best DLC if we don't count Awakening. The Witch Hunt was such a horrible way to wrap up Morrigan's story for DA:O I'm prone to imagine that it never happened.

Modifié par Naitaka, 20 janvier 2011 - 03:08 .

[Triple Zero]

Mike Laidlaw said...



I think for downloadable content for Dragon Age II, we actually are looking more at keeping the core team in there, not doing any kind of separate. To be fair, almost everyone on Dragon Age ended up on working on various parts of DLC. We’ve got some early thinkers, some people who are like Fernando Melo - one of our online producers - that certainly are laying the groundwork, “okay structurally, how does this work. How does this work in terms of integration,” etc. For Dragon Age II, we don’t want to tackle larger packs this time around. We want to do some stuff that’s a little more specific to Hawke, and that really includes your character. It’s important that we keep mostly the same core team on there, and, if anything, keeping our eyes to the future beyond that.



...



What I’d like to do is add into the story that you have, rather than adding on. It’s not like an adjunct, it’s more of an expansion of the experience.

So I interpret this to mean that DA 2 DLC will be more along the lines of Warden's Keep, Return to Ostagar, The Stone Prisoner, and possibly Witch Hunt and Golems of Amgarrak. While I'm not necessarily anti-DLC I much prefer to play a "content complete" game. On my first play through of DA:O I only had Stone Prisoner and Warden's Keep. Return to Ostagar didn't become available until well after I had completed my first play through and I didn't even try to load up my first character to see if I could play RtO.



Witch Hunt, Golems of Amgarrak, and even Awakening worked much better for me in terms of allowing my Warden to continue his/her experience. These DLC/expansion packs allowed import of my original character and obviously occurred after the events of DA:O as opposed to being made a part of the original game.



After reading through much of this thread it seems that many of you do not share my view and IMHO that only reinforces what Lukas Kristjanson said about successful DLC being a bit of a moving target. All I know is at this point I'm thinking I'll play DA 2 once with whatever DLC is available on day one. After that I'll probably just wait until all DLC for DA 2 is released or preferably for DA 2's Ultimate Edition before I play the game again.

[Aetheria]

Leliana's Song was my favorite DLC, actually - I rather liked playing as a different, more pre-defined character as a change from the Warden, and the whole feel of the adventure was fun and different, although it was a bit too short.



I think, though, that giving Hawke a voice, a family, and in general a stronger claim to being a real character rather than an avatar of the player, will bring in some of what made Leliana's Song fun to play. Still, I'd love the opportunity to play as a different character again.

[Fangirl17]

EDIT: *sigh* Nevermind.

Modifié par Fangirl17, 20 janvier 2011 - 04:38 .

[Morroian]

Triple Zero wrote...

So I interpret this to mean that DA 2 DLC will be more along the lines of Warden's Keep, Return to Ostagar, The Stone Prisoner, and possibly Witch Hunt and Golems of Amgarrak.

I interpret it to mean DLC like WK, RTO and Shale. Not WH or GOA though.

[Addai]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Right, the DLC is biased to female love interests.

Then again, who showed up in Awakenings if you made him king? Alistiar. Who is the only Origins companion that Mike has said will make a cameo in DA II? Alistiar.

30 seconds on screen compares to an entire DLC of Leliana's prattle?  The cameo was nice, but that's all it was.

Morrigan didn't get much in WH, granted.

[Naitaka]

Addai67 wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Right, the DLC is biased to female love interests.

Then again, who showed up in Awakenings if you made him king? Alistiar. Who is the only Origins companion that Mike has said will make a cameo in DA II? Alistiar.

30 seconds on screen compares to an entire DLC of Leliana's prattle?  The cameo was nice, but that's all it was.

Morrigan didn't get much in WH, granted.

30 seconds on screen WITH your Warden vs an entire DLC of Leliana with lots of stabbin' and implied rape with no Warden in it. Then again, Zev fan gets shafted out of the whole deal so I wouldn't say it's biased either way.

Modifié par Naitaka, 20 janvier 2011 - 04:28 .

[Fangirl17]

Er I think my post was editted by someone else O.o There are sentences missing? Woudnt it say if it was editted by a mod though? I am confused >.<

[Ensgnblack]

I really liked LS. I appreciate getting to know Leliana's backstory.



One bit of criticism I would offer however, is that some of the details in it not matching with DAO make it a bit less simply because, for me, its main appeal was story. I wish more of the DLC would be written at the same time as the game to keep continuity as intact as possible, but overall I have enjoyed most of the DLCs



DSC was probably my least favorite, it was utterly forgettable.

[craigdolphin]

LS was the DLC that most appealed to me. With Wardens keep and RTO following close behind. I did not buy Darkspawn Chronicles because it just held no appeal. And the bad reviews and reported lack of depth to Witch Hunt gave me sufficient pause so that I didn't get that one either. My DLC-buying behavior has evolved over time. I started out buying almost everything, and then I became more selective about DLC, now that I've tried a few and felt like maybe the value wasn't there for me.

I want good value for money. I want story. I want fun/compelling characters. And I want it to last considerably longer than a donut in a police station if I'm paying 5 bucks or more. Yes, duration matters to me :innocent: 

(Clearly, other people's mileage may vary.)

I am sad that Mike seems to have come a conclusion that LS was not a succesful experiment.

[Reaverwind]

Naitaka wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Right, the DLC is biased to female love interests.

Then again, who showed up in Awakenings if you made him king? Alistiar. Who is the only Origins companion that Mike has said will make a cameo in DA II? Alistiar.

30 seconds on screen compares to an entire DLC of Leliana's prattle?  The cameo was nice, but that's all it was.

Morrigan didn't get much in WH, granted.

30 seconds on screen WITH your Warden vs an entire DLC of Leliana with lots of stabbin' and implied rape with no Warden in it. Then again, Zev fan gets shafted out of the whole deal so I wouldn't say it's biased either way.

Alistair fans get shafted too. The cameo was pathetic for Wardens who did romance Alistair (I think there was one extra line - otherwise you might as well have been playing an Orlesian), and for those who didn't put him on the throne, Alistair was MIA.

Modifié par Reaverwind, 20 janvier 2011 - 04:59 .

[Addai]

Naitaka wrote...

30 seconds on screen WITH your Warden vs an entire DLC of Leliana with lots of stabbin' and implied rape with no Warden in it. Then again, Zev fan gets shafted out of the whole deal so I wouldn't say it's biased either way.

You're still trying to compare the two?

The Awakening cameo had, maybe, 3 dialogue interactions with Alistair, if you were in a romance with or married to him.  Nada zip zilich bupkus if he was Warden- not even an acknowledgement of his existence.  Warden Loghain got more than Warden Alistair.  Meanwhile just running around Denerim Market District doing random quests in LS, Leliana would not STFU.  I would pay a lot of cash to hear Steve Valentine in Alistair voice for that long.

Zevran/ Leliana fans had a letter added in an Awakening patch- not much, granted, but something.

Modifié par Addai67, 20 janvier 2011 - 05:04 .

[Reaverwind]

Addai67 wrote...

 Warden Loghain got more than Warden Alistair.  

That's one heck of an understatement. In fact, I'd argue Warden Loghain had more to say than romanced King Alistair.