1) It's extremely lame/unbelievable that Alistar would 'dump' you because you are an 'elf' as Queen. You are the love of his life and you think he wouldn't try to rock the tradition to keep that? I wanted to see him dead after that. That he bow to the racism of the people that, before that, he didn't even want to be king of before that is not very believable. He wasn't a political animal.
1b) You are the 'savior' of the kingdom -- does anyone really think the people wouldn't accept you as queen of the traditiona king? That's completely ridiculous. Who came up with such lame reasoning?
1c) You are given 'any' boon -- being w/him as queen isn't an option -- you just saved the day -- talk about limited choices.
1d) What's this lameness about not being able to have children if you are tainted. The WORST that would happen is the child would grow up with tainted blood as well and automatically be a 'warden' @ birth. It's a taint of the blood not a genetic condition.
1e) Ok, if you want to make up your mind later -- then you should be able to call in a favor later -- ex: getting Alistar to come along w/you on on 'Awakening'....
2) If you are in a relationship w/lelianna @ the end w/10 -- it doesn't make sense that she would take a position 'away' from you without even consulting you. More so than the Alistar thing -- this really bother me -- showed me that this part was written by a man. It's extremely unlikely that a women in a 100% love relation w/another would simply do such a thing, at all, let alone without a long discussion about it first where the two of them discuss their future plans together. I found this much more irritating than the alistar thing.
I also found it VERY annoying that she wasn't at all a part of the Awakening part.
3) A minor 'nit', maybe, was my answer to Morganna that I would find her -- she seemed to take that as a 'threat' -- but we were 100% friends and I had saved her from her mom (at least for the time). It wasn't meant as a threat but as a friend to a friend. I wasn't upset/concerned that she wanted Alister's baby but only wanted to see how she was doing.
LAME origin's ending issues:Alistar & Lelianna, et al
Débuté par
_Astara
, janv. 19 2011 10:03
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#2
Posté 19 janvier 2011 - 10:38
thesuperdarkone
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1) Alistair, regardless of whether he loves you or not, is still a person who values duty if he is unhardened. No matter what, his character is about doing what is right, regardless of how you might feel as he constantly suggests doing the right thing in various choices. Thus, Alistair will do what a king must do and that is have an heir with a queen. Of course, this is a bit null if you actually hardened him.
1b) The nobles are a bunch of idiotic racists. They don't care if you are the Maker himself, all they see is "NOT HUMAN" written on you. If you talk to various people, you see that they still consider Anora a commoner. She is the freaking QUEEN and the daughter of the man who basically liberated them yet they still see them as commoners since they weren't born as nobles. That should tell you how racist these morons are. If you became queen, I'm guessing there would be conflicts, battles, and some attempted assassinations. For example, in a cut ending slide, Shianni is assassinated simply because she was the Bann of the Alienage. Heck, when Alistair puts an elf in his court, the nobles basically freak out. The nobles WILL NOT accept someone who isn't human AT ALL regardless of how they might be.
1c) The boon is simply what the ruler can possibly do and read the above reason for why you can't be queen.
1d) I'm guessing the taint basically poisons most of your reproductive cells, leaving behind only a few that are capable of reproduction and thus lowered fertility. P.S. If the child is tainted, whose to say they won't be ghoul-like?
1e) Alistair can't come since he's the king. Yes, put the king in a life threatining situation without an heir and let him leave court for months. That won't have any consequences
I'm guessing that Ferelden is still in a fragile state when you are first ask for the boon and thus can immediately have an effect rather that difficulties like becoming Teryn of Gwaren 6 months later.
2) If you do her quest, then she says that she'll be staying with you unless you don't want her too. If she wants to leave, it's because Marjolaine is still alive and will no doubt cause more trouble in the future for her and you. It is best to kill her then to stop these problems and get payback for what Leliana had to go through. If anything, it's your fault for why she wants to leave.
3) Morrigan said she doesn't want you to follow, so naturally she would be a tad suspicious on why you followed her when she didn't want you too
1b) The nobles are a bunch of idiotic racists. They don't care if you are the Maker himself, all they see is "NOT HUMAN" written on you. If you talk to various people, you see that they still consider Anora a commoner. She is the freaking QUEEN and the daughter of the man who basically liberated them yet they still see them as commoners since they weren't born as nobles. That should tell you how racist these morons are. If you became queen, I'm guessing there would be conflicts, battles, and some attempted assassinations. For example, in a cut ending slide, Shianni is assassinated simply because she was the Bann of the Alienage. Heck, when Alistair puts an elf in his court, the nobles basically freak out. The nobles WILL NOT accept someone who isn't human AT ALL regardless of how they might be.
1c) The boon is simply what the ruler can possibly do and read the above reason for why you can't be queen.
1d) I'm guessing the taint basically poisons most of your reproductive cells, leaving behind only a few that are capable of reproduction and thus lowered fertility. P.S. If the child is tainted, whose to say they won't be ghoul-like?
1e) Alistair can't come since he's the king. Yes, put the king in a life threatining situation without an heir and let him leave court for months. That won't have any consequences
I'm guessing that Ferelden is still in a fragile state when you are first ask for the boon and thus can immediately have an effect rather that difficulties like becoming Teryn of Gwaren 6 months later.2) If you do her quest, then she says that she'll be staying with you unless you don't want her too. If she wants to leave, it's because Marjolaine is still alive and will no doubt cause more trouble in the future for her and you. It is best to kill her then to stop these problems and get payback for what Leliana had to go through. If anything, it's your fault for why she wants to leave.
3) Morrigan said she doesn't want you to follow, so naturally she would be a tad suspicious on why you followed her when she didn't want you too
#3
Posté 20 janvier 2011 - 01:13
_Astara
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re: 2) Marjolaine wasn't alive and I never told her I didn't want her. I did sleep w/Alister as was under the impression it would be easier to get him to take the thrown and sleep w/Morrigan. A hardened Lelianna would have easily understood that, so they choice wasn't mine. Are you saying if I go back and redo things she'll follow me into the 'awakening' part'? I didn't trust Marjolaine to be alive in any version.
I was annoyed that almost all of the 'add-on' content that I enabled in 'origins' was deleted off my character in 'awakenings'. Some items I needed for quests in 'awakenings' were with my equipment in origins.
It's certainly true that by the end of awakenings nearly all of the equipment one has is better than the premium, but it's disconcerting and annoying to have it ripped off you.
Of course, this assumes -- and this is a very LAME part. After the main battle, of course you've normally equipped your party w/the best items. But after that battle, you have no chance to reclaim items and rebalance the equipment. The only way I was able to reclaim all of the equipment is to go back to the beginning of the battle with the final dragon, fight the whole battle (AGAIN), then just before the dragon is dead (i.e. 1 staff-missile short of death), strip your party down to their undies. Then pop back, shoot off the missile & play the cut-scene.
A bit 'dicey', but doable. I had ALL of my party's equipment of any consequence on me post-battle. Thought I needed the mana or healing potions before the final battle as well, so knowing I'd have no more opportunities w/Morrigan in the group, I stripped her B4 that battle, in that play-through as well.
As for Morrigan being 'suspicious'...after all her talk about never having had a friend but having had me come through for her -- and if she saw my indifference about her sleeping w/Alister, she'd have seen she had no reason to be suspicious. It was played ignoring the dynamic that had been created/nurtured over time -- as was her constant decision to never share her shape change ability right through to the very end (though I got it, somehow through other means...not sure how that happened, but even when I had it, she was still all stuffy about sharing "mother's gifts", even though, obviously, shape-changing existed aside and apart from her mother.
As for #1 -- Alister was hardened; so I don't think he'd have as many issues. As for 1b), who said anything about giving them a choice. With Loghain dead by my hand who among them would try to say otherwise. Just because they aren't used to a white president with a black wife is no reason they shouldn't start getting used to it. The status of elves cf. blacks in US history is quite comparable, so I don't think the comparison is strained.
After Alister's betrayal, I was wondering -- is it possible to give him up as the sacrifice to kill the arch-demon, or is the cut-scene w/me killing it the only one that plays -- with the aftermath of me surviving or not being dependent on the scene w/Morrigan?
----
Another minor point not that was restricted...inviting the desire daemon that was in the boy into myself to cohabit and form a joint character with deficits+benefits based on my character's choices & willpower. The daemon wants to live in the mortal world and who better to show it the ropes & sights that another mortal. The concept that I have a taint might be the swing point for maintaining myself as well as her in a joint consciousness.
That's one of the problems with the bioware/ea games of this type -- too little allowance for imagination and alternatives. It's mostly playing out a predefined story with small choices made along the way to influence minor bits here and there. But if it comes to anything 'big'...oh no, that goes against the designers' self-limited concepts -- can't do that.
I **didn't** like the killing off of my initial companion in Awakening. You can use the excuse that it is 'random', but it's not. The initial chars in Origins were killed and no more, and the same in awakening -- every companion I invited to become a warden after that survived. If anything, the game could have made her survival contingent upon whether or not I chose the dwarf to stay in the group (as a fighter). If not, they she would have survived and stayed on.
Since the story line is arbitrary -- it would be *better* if it tailored itself to the user's choices in such cases.
-----
Regarding Wynn -- supposedly she was going to stay on as an advisor to the king, but then she's going off and doing mage things after wards. When I asked her about going w/me, she said she wanted to do something useful or meaningful -- like what I was doing wasn't!?!? Hello!?!? What was up w/that??
As for 'attempted assassinations'....bring em on! They wouldn't be likely to succeed -- BUT that's assuming they wouldn't see good reasons NOT to try such things.
It was lame for Logahnn's lackey's to try to 'off' me, w/o even seeing if they might end up with something 'better' under me. I tended toward being both generous and forgiving, never vengeful or tending toward unnecessary punishment -- as it's really just not "profitable" (socially, economically, or otherwise)....
Even w/Alister when Morrigan wanted to sleep w/him, I was honest about her having the child, it seemed to be the only right action and it worked out fine (read it took a high persuade check, but it shouldn't have been so hard given it was the best option and Morrigan was trustworthy, IMO).
I was annoyed that almost all of the 'add-on' content that I enabled in 'origins' was deleted off my character in 'awakenings'. Some items I needed for quests in 'awakenings' were with my equipment in origins.
It's certainly true that by the end of awakenings nearly all of the equipment one has is better than the premium, but it's disconcerting and annoying to have it ripped off you.
Of course, this assumes -- and this is a very LAME part. After the main battle, of course you've normally equipped your party w/the best items. But after that battle, you have no chance to reclaim items and rebalance the equipment. The only way I was able to reclaim all of the equipment is to go back to the beginning of the battle with the final dragon, fight the whole battle (AGAIN), then just before the dragon is dead (i.e. 1 staff-missile short of death), strip your party down to their undies. Then pop back, shoot off the missile & play the cut-scene.
A bit 'dicey', but doable. I had ALL of my party's equipment of any consequence on me post-battle. Thought I needed the mana or healing potions before the final battle as well, so knowing I'd have no more opportunities w/Morrigan in the group, I stripped her B4 that battle, in that play-through as well.
As for Morrigan being 'suspicious'...after all her talk about never having had a friend but having had me come through for her -- and if she saw my indifference about her sleeping w/Alister, she'd have seen she had no reason to be suspicious. It was played ignoring the dynamic that had been created/nurtured over time -- as was her constant decision to never share her shape change ability right through to the very end (though I got it, somehow through other means...not sure how that happened, but even when I had it, she was still all stuffy about sharing "mother's gifts", even though, obviously, shape-changing existed aside and apart from her mother.
As for #1 -- Alister was hardened; so I don't think he'd have as many issues. As for 1b), who said anything about giving them a choice. With Loghain dead by my hand who among them would try to say otherwise. Just because they aren't used to a white president with a black wife is no reason they shouldn't start getting used to it. The status of elves cf. blacks in US history is quite comparable, so I don't think the comparison is strained.
After Alister's betrayal, I was wondering -- is it possible to give him up as the sacrifice to kill the arch-demon, or is the cut-scene w/me killing it the only one that plays -- with the aftermath of me surviving or not being dependent on the scene w/Morrigan?
----
Another minor point not that was restricted...inviting the desire daemon that was in the boy into myself to cohabit and form a joint character with deficits+benefits based on my character's choices & willpower. The daemon wants to live in the mortal world and who better to show it the ropes & sights that another mortal. The concept that I have a taint might be the swing point for maintaining myself as well as her in a joint consciousness.
That's one of the problems with the bioware/ea games of this type -- too little allowance for imagination and alternatives. It's mostly playing out a predefined story with small choices made along the way to influence minor bits here and there. But if it comes to anything 'big'...oh no, that goes against the designers' self-limited concepts -- can't do that.
I **didn't** like the killing off of my initial companion in Awakening. You can use the excuse that it is 'random', but it's not. The initial chars in Origins were killed and no more, and the same in awakening -- every companion I invited to become a warden after that survived. If anything, the game could have made her survival contingent upon whether or not I chose the dwarf to stay in the group (as a fighter). If not, they she would have survived and stayed on.
Since the story line is arbitrary -- it would be *better* if it tailored itself to the user's choices in such cases.
-----
Regarding Wynn -- supposedly she was going to stay on as an advisor to the king, but then she's going off and doing mage things after wards. When I asked her about going w/me, she said she wanted to do something useful or meaningful -- like what I was doing wasn't!?!? Hello!?!? What was up w/that??
As for 'attempted assassinations'....bring em on! They wouldn't be likely to succeed -- BUT that's assuming they wouldn't see good reasons NOT to try such things.
It was lame for Logahnn's lackey's to try to 'off' me, w/o even seeing if they might end up with something 'better' under me. I tended toward being both generous and forgiving, never vengeful or tending toward unnecessary punishment -- as it's really just not "profitable" (socially, economically, or otherwise)....
Even w/Alister when Morrigan wanted to sleep w/him, I was honest about her having the child, it seemed to be the only right action and it worked out fine (read it took a high persuade check, but it shouldn't have been so hard given it was the best option and Morrigan was trustworthy, IMO).
#4
Posté 21 janvier 2011 - 09:34
I Tsunayoshi I
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I think someone needs much less qq and hella more pewpew.
Most of the stuff you are complaining about is explained with game lore. Also if you lost everyone you left behind at the Vigil, then you didnt upgrade the keep enough. Outside of Justice, who always 'dies', everyone lives on my playthroughs when I dont fight at the keep to defend it.
Most of the stuff you are complaining about is explained with game lore. Also if you lost everyone you left behind at the Vigil, then you didnt upgrade the keep enough. Outside of Justice, who always 'dies', everyone lives on my playthroughs when I dont fight at the keep to defend it.
#5
Posté 21 janvier 2011 - 06:13
JosieJ
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_Astara wrote...
I was annoyed that almost all of the 'add-on' content that I enabled in 'origins' was deleted off my character in 'awakenings'. Some items I needed for quests in 'awakenings' were with my equipment in origins.
It's certainly true that by the end of awakenings nearly all of the equipment one has is better than the premium, but it's disconcerting and annoying to have it ripped off you.
Of course, this assumes -- and this is a very LAME part. After the main battle, of course you've normally equipped your party w/the best items. But after that battle, you have no chance to reclaim items and rebalance the equipment. The only way I was able to reclaim all of the equipment is to go back to the beginning of the battle with the final dragon, fight the whole battle (AGAIN), then just before the dragon is dead (i.e. 1 staff-missile short of death), strip your party down to their undies. Then pop back, shoot off the missile & play the cut-scene.
Why bother to strip your party's equipment pre-archdemon? The game makes a post-epilogue save, just load that, go to the party camp, and redistribute your equipment there. Just note that not all equipment will transfer over smoothly, whether it's Warden's Keep equipment or stuff you downloaded via mod, you may have to have a mod to get it to transfer.
For Awakening, I never bother to bring anything anymore except what my PC is wearing, some health items, and as much gold as possible. If you're transferring a fully-leveled Origins character, you're so overpowered you could fight naked and it wouldn't matter!
#6
Posté 21 janvier 2011 - 06:23
mousestalker
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JosieJ wrote...
Why bother to strip your party's equipment pre-archdemon? The game makes a post-epilogue save, just load that, go to the party camp, and redistribute your equipment there. Just note that not all equipment will transfer over smoothly, whether it's Warden's Keep equipment or stuff you downloaded via mod, you may have to have a mod to get it to transfer.
For Awakening, I never bother to bring anything anymore except what my PC is wearing, some health items, and as much gold as possible. If you're transferring a fully-leveled Origins character, you're so overpowered you could fight naked and it wouldn't matter!
My very first Awakening playthrough I did just that. I totally forgot that Warden Commander armour and Starfang do not carry forward. My Warden PC was standing there buck naked (and I mean totally naked thanks to a mod) in the rain with Mhairi standing next to her. We still kicked butt.
Every once in a while I toy with the idea of running 'strip Awakening', but I just don't like Awakening enough to replay it.
#7
Posté 21 janvier 2011 - 06:31
JosieJ
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mousestalker wrote...
My very first Awakening playthrough I did just that. I totally forgot that Warden Commander armour and Starfang do not carry forward. My Warden PC was standing there buck naked (and I mean totally naked thanks to a mod) in the rain with Mhairi standing next to her. We still kicked butt.
Every once in a while I toy with the idea of running 'strip Awakening', but I just don't like Awakening enough to replay it.
Heh--if I thought it'd be an actual challenge, I'd do it when I play through Awakening with my current PC!
#8
Posté 21 janvier 2011 - 10:38
ladydesire
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_Astara wrote...
2) If you are in a relationship w/lelianna @ the end w/10 -- it doesn't make sense that she would take a position 'away' from you without even consulting you. More so than the Alistar thing -- this really bother me -- showed me that this part was written by a man. It's extremely unlikely that a women in a 100% love relation w/another would simply do such a thing, at all, let alone without a long discussion about it first where the two of them discuss their future plans together. I found this much more irritating than the alistar thing.
It's not stated explicitly anywhere, but there is a time lapse between Origins and Awakening, so the discussion you say you want could have happened in between.
I also found it VERY annoying that she wasn't at all a part of the Awakening part.
Then check your Codex in Awakening; there should be a letter from her there, depending on what game patch you have.
